Where does incest begin, or end?

[MiddleAgedMan]

I am looking at various ways my planned story could twist and turn, and while it will be in the Mind Control category, I stop by lots of other topics of interest. I think it only fair that I note at the beginning if any particular topic is broached more than in passing, simply to alert readers beforehand.

For example, going into BDSM and noncon would be worthy of a note in my book.

So, my question:
Where does the border between incest and group sex go? My main and his uncle are in a situation where it will, at some point, be natural for them to be engaged in sexual activity in a group sex setting. So long as they are not actively sexual towards each other, I have a hard time seeing this as incest.

But what if they are in a sofa, getting dual blow jobs next to each other?
Or maybe they spit-roast or DP a girl, is that incest?

I have absolutely no intention of broaching the gay/incest sphere as it's not my cup of tea, but in DP, balls will be touching... I have no problem writing it into the story, it has a natural place, so that is not the issue, I merely wonder if others will be annoyed by reading it and comment with a 'you should have warned us of the incest! Ruined my day! 1 star!!!'

So, does my proposed scene merit a warning of incest?

 

[jaF0]

In Mother Knows Best, a mother and daughter go on a double date. They engage their partners separately at first but eventually end up on the same bed, side by side. I put it in E/V. The follow on parts got split between I/T and EC.

I don't do 'warnings'.

 

[AlinaX]

I guess inadvertent touching is fine. It's an odd one because sex with someone you later discover to be a close relative is incest even if you don't know it at the time, and desiring someone you never actually touch is still incest.

But if the focus of the story is elsewhere and the incest is tangential, you can get away with a disclaimer.

Of course, in Mind Control, half the stories cross over into non-con and incest anyway so I don't think you really need a disclaimer.

 

[CyranoJ]

But what if they are in a sofa, getting dual blow jobs next to each other?
Or maybe they spit-roast or DP a girl, is that incest?

Y'know, I feel like you're really kind of asking: "Is that gay?"

No. Incest is about fucking your family members. Gay people fuck each other.

"We were engaged in sexual activity near each other" doesn't remotely qualify in either case. Yes, even if their balls brush each other. Even if they do double-vag or double-anal. You could convey hints of incestuous or gay desire in these situation if you really wanted to, but if you don't, then no, don't worry about it. Pretty much nobody actually wonders if the dudes in gangbang pornos are secretly gay.

 

[AlinaX]

Pretty much nobody actually wonders if the dudes in gangbang pornos are secretly gay.

They totally are. (The men are the uranium fuel rods and the women are just heavy water to slow the neutrons down and enable the reaction. Somebody fetch me some coolant...)

 

[MiddleAgedMan]

Y'know, I feel like you're really kind of asking: "Is that gay?"

No. Incest is about fucking your family members. Gay people fuck each other.

"We were engaged in sexual activity near each other" doesn't remotely qualify in either case. Yes, even if their balls brush each other. Even if they do double-vag or double-anal. You could convey hints of incestuous or gay desire in these situation if you really wanted to, but if you don't, then no, don't worry about it. Pretty much nobody actually wonders if the dudes in gangbang pornos are secretly gay.

Gay does not really come into it, and I have no problems with it, it's just not part of my story. And I see your point about two guys banging the same girl not even being considered potentially gay, but then again, incest is a much more controversial theme than anything LGBT in my experience.

But I think I will let it slide into the general backdrop of the scene; if someone wants to scream incest over it, they probably would have even with a warning...

 

[MiddleAgedMan]

I guess inadvertent touching is fine. It's an odd one because sex with someone you later discover to be a close relative is incest even if you don't know it at the time, and desiring someone you never actually touch is still incest.

But if the focus of the story is elsewhere and the incest is tangential, you can get away with a disclaimer.

Of course, in Mind Control, half the stories cross over into non-con and incest anyway so I don't think you really need a disclaimer.

The most gay/incestuous thing I'm considering is the main looking over and noticing the size of his uncle's schlong, though I can just as easily not have that in and the scene will be no worse for wear. And the DP-part is still only an idea I'm playing with, the original plan was a double blowjob on the couch, though fist bumps could happen...

Like I commented above, and as you point out, the MC crowd should be used to things going well into other categories, which again could be said of most stories I think.

 

[NotWise]

You can use the tag cloud to tell what other authors put into a category. If you wonder how acceptable they are, then you can search for stories using the tags and see how the readers reacted.

The tag cloud for mind control includes "mom," "son," "sister," and "taboo." Those tags are all at the least-common end of the range, but they're there. "Gay" is a fairly common tag. "threesomes" and "mmf" are there but not real common. "mff" is more common.

 

[SimonDoom]

Nothing you described sounds at all like incest to me.

If balls touch, you may squick a few people who cannot stand any gay male activity, but probably not many, and it's probably not something to worry about.

Somebody out there is always going to be unhappy. Don't write to accommodate those people.

 

[TadOverdon]

Tell me Isiah Maxwell is gay and break my poor heart.


I don't think many readers are going to get too wrapped up in the details of who might inadvertently touch whom. Modern porn is full of guys who are supposedly uninterested in other guys climbing into beds and showers onto couches with women in anatomically unlikely combinations. If you don't make a point of the guys touching each other sexually your readers will happily assume that they just don't.

If it were your intention to service the incest kink here I'd say that to satisfy the core readership it ought to be sexual activity between two or more people who are closely related by blood. The main reason commercial porn is full of stepfamilies is to avoid offending Visa and Mastercard.

Incest and marriage between cousins is surprisingly more widely legal and probably more common than most people assume, which IMHO takes some of the wicked edge off of it for purposes of titillation.

 

[8letters]

I am looking at various ways my planned story could twist and turn, and while it will be in the Mind Control category, I stop by lots of other topics of interest. I think it only fair that I note at the beginning if any particular topic is broached more than in passing, simply to alert readers beforehand.

For example, going into BDSM and noncon would be worthy of a note in my book.

So, my question:
Where does the border between incest and group sex go? My main and his uncle are in a situation where it will, at some point, be natural for them to be engaged in sexual activity in a group sex setting. So long as they are not actively sexual towards each other, I have a hard time seeing this as incest.

But what if they are in a sofa, getting dual blow jobs next to each other?
Or maybe they spit-roast or DP a girl, is that incest?

I have absolutely no intention of broaching the gay/incest sphere as it's not my cup of tea, but in DP, balls will be touching... I have no problem writing it into the story, it has a natural place, so that is not the issue, I merely wonder if others will be annoyed by reading it and comment with a 'you should have warned us of the incest! Ruined my day! 1 star!!!'

So, does my proposed scene merit a warning of incest?

From a prior similar thread, I think most people won't consider incest unless they engage in sexual activity directly with each other. Incidental contact and having sex with the same person isn't incest. That being said, I think as you get closer and closer to crossing the line into incest, more and more people are going to get uncomfortable.

 

[MissMandy86]

It begins in the mind .. as aoon as you stare at her ass .. the first time you think about her in a sexual way ... it has started

 

[KeithD]

Where does the border between incest and group sex go?

Sorry, I think you're off in lalaland on this. Incest is defined by familial relationship (which is applied more broadly in erotica than in science/law). It has nothing to do with group sex. In erotica, your uncle's wife can be considered incest as can an adopted sister you've shared parents with, but not biologically, through your childhood. That's not how science/law defines it, but if you're writing erotica, the erotica world standards apply.

What this has to do with group sex is completely beyond me, so I'll just let that hang there.

Here it will be put to the erotica incest test first and where it will be categorized will be trumped by that determination. Somewhat like not being able to be sort of pregnant, it's either incest by the standards here or it isn't.

 

[HeyAll]

If they touch, it goes to incest. If not, it doesn't.

Keep in mind, if they touch and you submit it to Group Sex or something, there's a chance that the moderator will put it in Incest.

I've had stories changed before, where a mom/son story (that involved the mom being in the mafia) was switched to noncon upon approval.

 

[jaF0]

It has nothing to do with group sex.

Unless the group is all family.

If they touch, it goes to incest. If not, it doesn't.

If they High Five, no.

If those hands shake something lower, well .....

 

[KeithD]

Unless the group is all family.

It still is going to be put in Incest/Taboo at Literotica.

 

[lovecraft68]

Like everything else this has come up before, and people will argue on either side.

My personal take is this is where the word taboo defaults to its original meaning of something society would see as wrong...and incest.

If you're not getting what I mean the word taboo has becomes close to synonymous with incest in the world of erotica, look up taboo on a porn site and all you'll get is step or family material

But in this case family members watching each other have sex, or as you said perhaps involved in a threesome is taboo as in there is something disturbing to it in real life, but not incest as in sexual conduct.

The example I use to turn the argument to those who disagree is to do it this way.

If two brothers share a woman, is it incest?

"yeah, of course.

"But there's no sexual contact"

"Still its a sexual act."

"Okay, so when two guys share a woman they're gay?"

"Hell no! Of course not!"

"But...its a sexual act, right?" Thanks for playing.

But regardless of whether it is or is not its close enough that for people who are squicked by family involved in even a non direct sexual way, you'll probably get some flack...buit if you tried that chapter in incest they would give you flack for it not being enough.

Sometimes there's just no perfect place for crossover ideas.
Okay so if

 

[jaF0]

Like everything else this has come up before, and people will argue on either side.

My personal take is this is where the word taboo defaults to its original meaning of something society would see as wrong...

Like so many other words, Taboo has morphed both ways, many times.

Tattoos used to be taboo. Only circus freaks and longshoremen had them. Now high fashion models and main stream celebrities have them and they're considered 'art'.

Smoking used to be mainstream, but has now become taboo.

Bikinis used to be taboo.

Head to toe swimwear is now all but taboo.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Where does incest begin, or end?

Incest begins with kissing your sister. It ends when dad finds out you're fucking his little girl and beats the shit out you for sullying his fuck toy.