Politicians in stories

[SisterJezabel]

Hello lazyweb,

What's the deal again with using politicians in stories? I read what would otherwise have been a solid story, but actually slagging off at an actual living and working Aussie Premier (similar to Governor I assume), really put me off.

Is this the risk you take when naming current serving politicians, or are they actually off limits?

 

[KeithD]

I put politicians in my stories. Some can be easily matched with a real politician, but none are actually real people (except for some historical figures). I don't see why it's difficult to handle it this way.

 

[SisterJezabel]

I put politicians in my stories. Some can be easily matched with a real politician, but none are actually real people (except for some historical figures). I don't see why it's difficult to handle it this way.

That's how I would have done it, but someone has used a real living breathing politician and done it in a way to make sure we all know the author would not be voting for him or his party!

 

[KeithD]

Ah, I don't spend much time checking up on what other writers are doing with stories here.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Hello lazyweb,

What's the deal again with using politicians in stories? I read what would otherwise have been a solid story, but actually slagging off at an actual living and working Aussie Premier (similar to Governor I assume), really put me off.

Is this the risk you take when naming current serving politicians, or are they actually off limits?

IIRC, around the end of 2016 US Laurel mentioned that stories about current politicians would be off limits - can't remember if it was announced on the forum, or if it was one of those policy changes we only find out about via rejection notices. But if that was a rule as I remember, it seems to have been abandoned. I mean this one isn't exactly subtle.

Earlier in 2016 I got a story through that slagged off Cory Bernardi in passing, but he's probably not recognisable outside Australia, and anybody who'd be bothered by that aspect of the story would probably have already switched off at the "lesbian romance with a Muslim protagonist" aspect.

 

[Thefireflies]

Hello lazyweb,

What's the deal again with using politicians in stories? I read what would otherwise have been a solid story, but actually slagging off at an actual living and working Aussie Premier (similar to Governor I assume), really put me off.

Is this the risk you take when naming current serving politicians, or are they actually off limits?

It wasn’t hard to find the story you’re talking about with a quick search. Interesting approach by the author, using the first few paragraphs of an erotic story to vent what appear to be personal issues with the aforementioned and explicitly named premier, rather than set the story’s scene, all before introducing the main character. A several paragraph rant about a specific political response to the pandemic is probably not the best hook to a story.
Perhaps a better way of bringing some issue to the attention of the reader would be to have characters discussing or debating the issue. But then again, introducing political opinion is likely to be one of the quickest ways to divide readers.

 

[AvroAnson]

Full disclosure: my personal idea of paradise is a Pythonesque Whicker's Island. "They" live on the island and make their imbecile rules in order to line their pockets while leaving the rest of us alone.

You just have to be subtle. That way people who appreciate your "death by a thousand paper cuts" are amused and those who don't or wouldn't are none the wiser.

There is a story here in the "true-crime genre" where "Too-tall Johnny" part of the Russel Rayburn crime family, in an arrangement with "Silent George," pays "Sparky" and "Left-Handed Lee" to 'whack' his boss "Smiling John." The hit takes place in John's Lincoln Town Car in front of his wife (not John's blonde movie star goomah).

(Don't cry too much for John, previously he and his brother Bob paid some crooked cops to whack brothers Dee and Iam. That hit took place in the back of paddy wagon, after they had been arrested and were in custody just south of Chinatown.)

Don Lang Johnson takes over the syndicate (bribery, contract killing, drugs, extortion, protection, racketeering, theft) only to later fall victim to a competing family run by "Slick Richard." Richard Emm, at times called "Slimy Dick," was previously part of "Tailgunner Joe's" gang whose consigliere "Edgar the Filekeeper," was a reputed cross-dresser.

Some folks get it, most probably don't.

 

[Privates1stClass]

SisterJezabel wrote:

Hello lazyweb,

What's the deal again with using politicians in stories? I read what would otherwise have been a solid story, but actually slagging off at an actual living and working Aussie Premier (similar to Governor I assume), really put me off.

Is this the risk you take when naming current serving politicians, or are they actually off limits?

Probably not a good idea to write about a currently serving politician, but there have been enough sleazy politicians whose sexual affairs probably make many stories posted here look tame. I'd say you could post a story about an unnamed politician without repercussion. They've shafted us enough over the years--it's time they get a taste of their own medicine.

 

[oggbashan]

The simple answer should be: Don't put ANY real people in your stories. Even fan fiction is dubious.

Dead ones? Possibly.

 

[SimonDoom]

The simple answer should be: Don't put ANY real people in your stories. Even fan fiction is dubious.

Dead ones? Possibly.

But what's confusing is that Literotica DOES allow celebrity stories. It has a whole section for them.

I can't understand why the Site would allow stories about singers and actors, but not politicians. That makes no sense at all to me. A politician enjoys LESS protection under the law in the US from defamation than does a non-political celebrity.

 

[oggbashan]

I have always thought that the fan fiction category is a mistake.

Real people can sue. They might not sue Lit, but the author.

 

[SimonDoom]

I have always thought that the fan fiction category is a mistake.

Real people can sue. They might not sue Lit, but the author.

I think it's extremely unlikely they would sue. They would probably send a demand to take down the story. I've published one fan fiction story at Literotica and feel I have a somewhat plausible case that's it's allowable as parody, but if I received a demand from the copyright owner I would remove it out of respect and caution.

Fan fiction and celebrity stories are completely different animals even though they are lumped in the same category. Fan fiction involves potential claims of copyright infringement. Celebrity fiction does not, because no one has a copyright in their persons. The applicable laws with respect to celebrities are a) defamation, and b) commercial appropriation of a person's likeness. It's unlikely that a politician would have a valid claim of either kind against a person who publishes a fictional sex story about them on Literotica, because 1) there's no commercial gain, and 2) nobody believes these stories are true, so there's no way to prove one has been defamed.

To put oneself in a better position one would be well advised to precede any celebrity story with a disclaimer that makes clear that the story is a work of fiction.

 

[KeithD]

I can't understand why the Site would allow stories about singers and actors, but not politicians. That makes no sense at all to me.

Having been on Lit. through three highly contentious national elections, I can understand why Laurel wants to keep political yammering out of the main story file and most areas of the discussion board more than any argumentation that arises over singers and actors.

 

[GinnyPPC]

Having been on Lit. through three highly contentious national elections, I can understand why Laurel wants to keep political yammering out of the main story file and most areas of the discussion board more than any argumentation that arises over singers and actors.

I write with the assumption that half my readers vote differently than I do. Why piss off half the possible readership? Does including current politicians make your story that much better?

 

[BobbyBrandt]

In one of my stories, the plot takes place a few years in the future, so I had fun insinuating some potential political events and persons into it just to get a rise out of the readers. Things like having the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court at the time be Brett Kavenaugh.

It was also a good test of the readers' comprehension since some of course didn't grasp the whole "in the future" concept and corrected me on who the true Chief Justice is.

 

[KeithD]

I write with the assumption that half my readers vote differently than I do. Why piss off half the possible readership? Does including current politicians make your story that much better?

Sorry, I have no idea why this is posted to me.

 

[SimonDoom]

I write with the assumption that half my readers vote differently than I do. Why piss off half the possible readership? Does including current politicians make your story that much better?

If your story is a piece of satire then writing about a politician may serve the purpose of conveying a message you want to convey with your art. You may piss half off the readership, but so what? Art has always been used to convey political messages. It's a legitimate purpose of art even when it's controversial and even when it may antagonize many readers.

 

[SevMax2]

Speaking from personal experience, putting real people in stories causes more grief than pleasure, at least on a "high brow" type site like Lit. People are far more apt to be PC or whatever about it. You get trolled far more than it's worth.

Short answer: it's just far safer and more practical to use fake names and loosely model the character on a real person. Total deniability that way.

My own ethical stance is that even a character sharing a name with a celebrity isn't really that celebrity at all, nor even property of that celebrity. It's more like a literary or spiritual doppelganger or clone of said celebrity. As such, it's never quite a carbon copy now, is it? You don't own the celebrity, nor do they own even a character based upon themselves. That character diverges from the actual person the moment that they start making choices for themselves independently of the real life person.

I somehow doubt that is a majority opinion, but I'm quite content to be a heretic in this matter. Even so, as noted, it's far safer to simply use that RL person as a base, but change the names to protect the entitled. I tend to be suspicious of public opinion consensus, anyway. This is a species of shit-flinging primates whose closest kin is the chimpanzee, one that once believed that the Earth was flat.

I rest my case.

It's a basic rule of the market economy, my friend.

CYA.

Cover Your Ass.

 

[eroticstoryspinner]

I line up on the side of never writing real people into stories unless they are safely dead. I say that as someone who in real life got their law degree from an accredited institution and not Facebook. I particularly agree with Ogg that fan fiction, particularly based on marketable intellectual property (cough, cough MCU) is increasingly problematic. Companies like the House of Maus, are increasingly aggressive in policing their IP. Why make trouble for Laurel and especially yourself. Rubbing the serial numbers off enough to meet legal standards is fine. As one of my writing heroes said, " Good writers borrow. Great writers steal," during a talk illustrating that pretty much every story has been told. The challenge is making the story fresh, new and interesting.

Most people read fiction to be entertained and escape their reality for a while. Not that many people find political screeching entertaining.

 

[Bramblethorn]

But what's confusing is that Literotica DOES allow celebrity stories. It has a whole section for them.

I can't understand why the Site would allow stories about singers and actors, but not politicians. That makes no sense at all to me. A politician enjoys LESS protection under the law in the US from defamation than does a non-political celebrity.

OTOH, singers and actors don't have the power to pass legislation that would destroy or seriously harm sites like this, or to press for harsher prosecution of minor violations that are currently ignored (e.g. all those dick-pick user icons).

Working on my current series, I realised that the timeline for my latest chapter coincides with the marriage equality vote here. Every LGBTI person I know in Australia was deeply affected by that when it happened - it would feel bizarre writing a story set in that time and place without acknowledging that impact, and happily readers in Lesbian Sex seem to understand that some people don't have the luxury of ignoring politics.

 

[RetroFan]

I'll reference real people including politicians to set the scene in stories set in the past. For example, in my story 'Grumpy Humphrey's Easy Wife' which takes place in San Francisco in November 1960, I mention that Dwight Eisenhower is the current President and that the US Presidential Election between John F Kennedy and Richard Nixon is to take place the next week.

In my story 'Leanne the Lusty Lifeguard' which is set in Sydney Australia in 1980, a dotty old lady thinks Sir Robert Menzies is still the Australian Prime Minister (left office 1966) and argues with her adult daughters about this. She then thinks it is Gough Whitlam (government dismissed in 1975), but cannot be convinced that Malcolm Fraser is the Prime Minister, saying that he had vanished years ago, confusing him with Harold Holt (disappeared in 1967 and never found again).

But I stay clear of writing fiction about real people living or dead or fan fiction about other people's fictional creations. A lawsuit possibly is unlikely, but there's always that very real possibility.

 

[PennameWombat]

I'll reference real people including politicians to set the scene in stories set in the past. For example, in my story 'Grumpy Humphrey's Easy Wife' which takes place in San Francisco in November 1960, I mention that Dwight Eisenhower is the current President and that the US Presidential Election between John F Kennedy and Richard Nixon is to take place the next week.
<snip>

But I stay clear of writing fiction about real people living or dead or fan fiction about other people's fictional creations. A lawsuit possibly is unlikely, but there's always that very real possibility.

I have a story set in 1960s America where a character's inner thoughts touched on the (to her) recent assassination of JFK and civil rights unrest she was seeing (she's an alien and she and her mate have been living disguised as humans and to her "all humans taste the same" so she's always been confused by race).

Another is set in 1980 where the characters are asked by a foreign tourist their thoughts on the upcoming 1980 US presidential election. They simply say the state they live in will vote heavily for Reagan (the state isn't named but those familiar with the setting will know it's Utah) so it's useless to do anything else and muse they should write in their friend. He says "if I win, I'll have everyone who voted for me arrested, can't have your kind running loose!"

These were to set the story timelines or to reflect on happenings and the politicians had no further nor direct roles. I've resolutely avoided current politicians in both my native and adopted homelands.

 

[SisterJezabel]

IIRC, around the end of 2016 US Laurel mentioned that stories about current politicians would be off limits - can't remember if it was announced on the forum, or if it was one of those policy changes we only find out about via rejection notices. But if that was a rule as I remember, it seems to have been abandoned. I mean this one isn't exactly subtle.

Earlier in 2016 I got a story through that slagged off Cory Bernardi in passing, but he's probably not recognisable outside Australia, and anybody who'd be bothered by that aspect of the story would probably have already switched off at the "lesbian romance with a Muslim protagonist" aspect.

Well, let's just say they didn't want to get on the beers! Except in the story they did which was confusing!

 

[HeyAll]

Don't do it. It could get rejected.

I wrote a mom/son story in November about a mom who is a presidential candidate in the midst of a tight recount. She's approached by intel people who want her to fuck her son/daughter on camera in exchange for helping her (they want to know if she can be trusted, and they'd have dirt over her).

The story was rejected because Lit doesn't accept current political stories at the moment, even though it was all fictional. (there were current issues about recounts and fraudulent voting in the news at the time).

So I spent two days re-writing parts of it so that it would be a corporate election instead.

 

[AvroAnson]

I wrote a mom/son story in November about a mom who is a presidential candidate in the midst of a tight recount. She's approached by ...

There is a cute one about a very tight race in an ambiguous election where a kinkier version of James Carville and Mary Matalin advise their clients that the key to winning the election is motivating people with kinkier lifestyles.

He, a divorced guy, courts the consanguine vote by publicly "dating" his daughter. Getting great sound-bites in the process: "As usual my opponent shows her complete lack of knowledge by calling me a 'motherfucker.'"

Meanwhile she appears on camera with a bull whip and in a leather dominatrix outfit, capturing free TV air time as well. "On your knees worms, crawl to the polls and vote for me!"