A harmless question

[JuanSeiszFitzHall]

I haven’t caused much trouble lately, so prepare to grit your teeth. Let’s say that a reader reads a story you wrote, and enjoys it. Let’s say further that this reader thinks that the story deserves a 4*, as the proper indication of this reader’s enjoyment. Which would you prefer: For this reader to vote 4*, or to not vote at all?

 

[oggbashan]

I haven’t caused much trouble lately, so prepare to grit your teeth. Let’s say that a reader reads a story you wrote, and enjoys it. Let’s say further that this reader thinks that the story deserves a 4*, as the proper indication of this reader’s enjoyment. Which would you prefer: For this reader to vote 4*, or to not vote at all?

Since a 4 vote means that an H for hot rating becomes more difficult, probably not vote at all.

Given the setting of Hot at 4.5, if you enjoyed a story you really ought to vote 5 or nothing.

Anything lower than a 4 seriously damages the rating.

Having said that, personally I don't care what rating my stories have. I liked writing them, Now they are posted I can forget them and move on.

 

[LexxRuthless]

I would prefer that the reader votes, even if they give my story a 2*. If they actually read the story in its entirety and they feel compelled to vote, I will take whatever score they feel is fair. I understand that a 4* rating will often be a down-vote, making it harder to get that coveted "Hot" rating. However, if I get a really high rating from a couple hundred votes it may not reveal what most readers actually thought of my story. It doesn't make me a better writer going forward.

All that said, I would take a thoughtful critical comment or e-mail over a 5* vote any day.

 

[Salacious_Scribe]

I like votes, especially if I get that coveted hot.

But comments truly make my day. I read every one and if someone is particularly nice or offers helpful constructive criticism I will send them an email.

 

[SimonDoom]

Note vote, but also leave a comment telling me exactly what they think.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Why shouldn't they leave a 4? It's a legit vote, the reader has their own scale and is entitled to use it. I'd want them to vote, I'd also like them to comment.

It's every reader having their own scoring criteria, working en masse, that makes the Lit scoring system what it is. A Red H is possible with 50% posting 4s and 50% posting 5s (and many other combinations) - if everybody voted 5 or didn't vote at all, it would be no kind of scoring system at all. The scale is what makes it work.

If/when I vote, I'll generally give 4s or 5s. If it's worth less than that I'm usually long gone and don't bother. But I don't vote on everything I read, maybe twenty percent - I couldn't say what my voting criteria is, though, if you asked me. It depends on the day, usually.

 

[SimonDoom]

Why shouldn't they leave a 4? It's a legit vote, the reader has their own scale and is entitled to use it. I'd want them to vote, I'd also like them to comment.
.

I'm not saying the reader should feel obligated not to vote. They should feel perfectly free to vote. But if I have my druthers about what they're doing with MY story, I'd rather get no vote than a 4, because the 4 might knock it out of the red H territory, which I think is useful for maximizing visibility. But no one should feel shy about giving a story a 4 if that's what they think it deserves.

 

[GroverLang]

4 or 5 nothing less

I vote a 4 if I enjoyed the story but thought it nothing special. For a 5 there has to be something different about it either in the storyline or the writing or simply the writer’s imagination.

I never vote less than 4 because although the story might not warrant a 4 or 5 the writer has put a lot of time and effort into their story and shouldn’t be penalised because it could have been better written. In that case I don’t vote although I may leave a constructive comment.

Everyone wants a red H but people should realise a score over 4 is good. In fact I’ve read stories of less than 4.5 that have been a damn sight better than some red H’s.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I'm not saying the reader should feel obligated not to vote. They should feel perfectly free to vote. But if I have my druthers about what they're doing with MY story, I'd rather get no vote than a 4, because the 4 might knock it out of the red H territory, which I think is useful for maximizing visibility. But no one should feel shy about giving a story a 4 if that's what they think it deserves.

If you follow that to its logical extreme, you end up with a thumbs up thumbs down system, which is the last thing Lit needs. All fives or nothing just gives you false delusions and zero idea of a story's "true" worth.

You have to have the 3s, 4s, and 5s (and readers willing to use them) to make the range between 4 and 5 mean anything - which I think it does, by the way.

 

[SimonDoom]

If you follow that to its logical extreme, you end up with a thumbs up thumbs down system, which is the last thing Lit needs. All fives or nothing just gives you false delusions and zero idea of a story's "true" worth.

You have to have the 3s, 4s, and 5s (and readers willing to use them) to make the range between 4 and 5 mean anything - which I think it does, by the way.

But I don't have to follow it to the logical extreme. My advice to readers is: vote, and vote how you want, so long as you're not an asshole and you don't vote without finishing the story.

My personal, selfish interest as an author is to have a high score, and in particular a score over 4.5. I am not interested in fairness or logic. I want the highest score possible so I get the highest number of views possible. Some anonymous reader's "4" vote tells me nothing useful to me. I would just as soon they withhold the "4" or less vote and instead submit a comment that I suck.

This isn't advice I would give a reader. It's just what I personally would like to happen, for my stories. After having published 31 stories over three and a half, I can honestly say that the scores my stories get give me no useful information. I see no difference in quality between the highly rated stories and the poorly rated ones. I do, however, think that reader comments and feedback can be useful.

 

[ElectricBlue]

My personal, selfish interest as an author is to have a high score, and in particular a score over 4.5. I am not interested in fairness or logic. I want the highest score possible so I get the highest number of views possible. Some anonymous reader's "4" vote tells me nothing useful to me. I would just as soon they withhold the "4" or less vote and instead submit a comment that I suck.

This isn't advice I would give a reader. It's just what I personally would like to happen, for my stories. After having published 31 stories over three and a half, I can honestly say that the scores my stories get give me no useful information. I see no difference in quality between the highly rated stories and the poorly rated ones. I do, however, think that reader comments and feedback can be useful.

"Gosh," said Suzie, polishing Simon's sword. "Careful with your jugular, EB, King Penguin's out to trample down the masses."

"He always did like those big numbers," EB said, stirring his coffee whilst watching Mrs Doom sashay up the stairs to her wayward son who was, no doubt, not finishing his twenty-ninth story for the year. "I'll give him a four on his next story, just so he goes insane with that 4.99."

"When he finishes one," said Suzie. "But isn't that cruel?"

"It's to teach him humility."

Suzie sang a little song as she showed EB her latest tee-shirt: "I'm stuck inside with Papa Bear."

Carry on .

 

[Zeb_Carter]

For any story that is already over 4.5 and has more than a thousand votes, or even over a hundred votes, one 4 vote won't change the average that much.

Now if they have say just over ten votes and it is at 4.5 then a 4 vote would diminish the average.

 

[yukonnights]

Can't change what other readers do, but I either give a 5 for a story I enjoyed enough to finish, or no vote at all. But I don't give a 5 unless I really did enjoy the story. I tend to align my reasoning to what Simon said about the stupid red H — but that's another discussion we've all had. A 4.49 in a world without any red H's would be a lot different than it is in the world with the H.

The red H is like the first billion dollars I made, after that the money just keeps on growing of it's own magic power.

 

[SimonDoom]

"Gosh," said Suzie, polishing Simon's sword. "Careful with your jugular, EB, King Penguin's out to trample down the masses."

"He always did like those big numbers," EB said, stirring his coffee whilst watching Mrs Doom sashay up the stairs to her wayward son who was, no doubt, not finishing his twenty-ninth story for the year. "I'll give him a four on his next story, just so he goes insane with that 4.99."

"When he finishes one," said Suzie. "But isn't that cruel?"

"It's to teach him humility."

Suzie sang a little song as she showed EB her latest tee-shirt: "I'm stuck inside with Papa Bear."

Carry on .

Damn you. You're giving me more story ideas than I can keep up with.

 

[lovecraft68]

4 stars....I really liked it, good read.

What's wrong with that?

To answer the question I want people to vote the way they want to vote.

If that means a legit one, like they thought the story was terrible, then so be it.

Obviously like everyone else I don't like the idea of a one vote just to troll, but otherwise I'm not a five or nothing sort.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Damn you. You're giving me more story ideas than I can keep up with.

Good man. We expect results. Suzie will be up shortly to make sure you're typing. Send your mom downstairs to iron EB's shirt, he needs to look his best .

 

[RejectReality]

If you look at it from a purely mercenary point of view, if everyone who enjoyed it either votes 5 or not at all, ( at your request, I'm assuming for this hypothetical ) you're setting yourself up for increased troll activity that will probably end up resulting in a lower score.

The higher the score, and the higher it is on the toplist, the more likely it is that assholes are going to see it.

That visibility will also attract more of the voters who aren't your regular readers and are inclined to utilize the voting range as intended, rather than the reality created by the H. So it's going to attract more 4s that way anyhow. At least until the trolls have their way with it, because the listings lag behind the actual votes, and they don't know the score is lower for a bit.

Without the vote total buffer of those fans who would have voted a 4, those bombs hit harder. Your most devoted readers are the people who tend to vote out of the gate, determining your initial score.

All in all, a bad idea.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Personally, I have started reading a lot... again. Usually, I really don't vote unless the story really rocks, then it gets a 5. Then again, if it really sucked and I mean really, really sucked... horrible spelling, grammar, sentence structure, etc. it's gets a 1 only because I cringed as I read it.

Now I know I'm not the best writer and I do try to be better, but if I cringe and notice things like grammar and spelling, it must be really bad.

If it doesn't make weep or laugh or smile and it doesn't make be cringe, I just go on to the next one.

 

[lovecraft68]

Personally, I have started reading a lot... again. Usually, I really don't vote unless the story really rocks, then it gets a 5. Then again, if it really sucked and I mean really, really sucked... horrible spelling, grammar, sentence structure, etc. it's gets a 1 only because I cringed as I read it.

Now I know I'm not the best writer and I do try to be better, but if I cringe and notice things like grammar and spelling, it must be really bad.

If it doesn't make weep or laugh or smile and it doesn't make be cringe, I just go on to the next one.

Same here, I'm pretty forgiving with grammar if the story is interesting, so for me to get put off it has to be pretty bad.

 

[bushyTrail]

I haven’t caused much trouble lately, so prepare to grit your teeth. Let’s say that a reader reads a story you wrote, and enjoys it. Let’s say further that this reader thinks that the story deserves a 4*, as the proper indication of this reader’s enjoyment. Which would you prefer: For this reader to vote 4*, or to not vote at all?

I'd like a vote. It's important to me that what I write is read. Otherwise... Why write at all? And 4 is ok. Unless I'm too strict, I give fours if the story is good but doesn't have that je ne sais quoi. Good is still good.

 

[SimonDoom]

Same here, I'm pretty forgiving with grammar if the story is interesting, so for me to get put off it has to be pretty bad.

It's a sliding scale for me. I notice grammar, spelling, and punctuation, and if they're bad my enjoyment of the story is likely to be affected a lot. But if it's a great story I can overlook technical deficiencies. I've read quite a few stories here that I would characterize as falling in that category and enjoyed them despite technical slip-ups.

 

[lovecraft68]

It's a sliding scale for me. I notice grammar, spelling, and punctuation, and if they're bad my enjoyment of the story is likely to be affected a lot. But if it's a great story I can overlook technical deficiencies. I've read quite a few stories here that I would characterize as falling in that category and enjoyed them despite technical slip-ups.

my average comment that's more than "die already" or "That was awesome" is good story, characters but you need to watch the typos.

Somewhere my mother has a story I wrote in High school that the teacher graded and commented.

A for creativity, story telling and effort

C for punctuation and grammar.

35 year later I am still consistent.

 

[sbrooks103]

I'm not saying the reader should feel obligated not to vote. They should feel perfectly free to vote. But if I have my druthers about what they're doing with MY story, I'd rather get no vote than a 4, because the 4 might knock it out of the red H territory, which I think is useful for maximizing visibility. But no one should feel shy about giving a story a 4 if that's what they think it deserves.

If I feel the story is a 4, I'll give it a 4, but if I feel it's a 4+. I'll give it a 5, because a 4 will drag it down.

 

[SimonDoom]

my average comment that's more than "die already" or "That was awesome" is good story, characters but you need to watch the typos.

Somewhere my mother has a story I wrote in High school that the teacher graded and commented.

A for creativity, story telling and effort

C for punctuation and grammar.

35 year later I am still consistent.

If you have any sense as a writer, you would never, ever trade the one for the other. Good grammar and punctuation make a good story better. But the best grammar in the world won't turn a bad story into a good one. Great storytelling, on the other hand, will make many, if not most, readers overlook technical errors.

 

[JamesMiehoff]

I would rather get an honest vote and a comment then the thousands of silent reads. Apparently the story did not touch them enough to either favorite it, vote on it or leave a comment.

I would like to know that there is a real person on the end of that view count and not just some damn robot scarfing up my story to be posted in some shitwad's wannabe semi-literary porn archive.

James