Changing POV During A Sex Scene

[Tarakan]

Head hopping/changing POV during a sex scene. Do you have any particular techniques on doing this successfully? Using line breaks between the different characters thoughts/experiences for example.

I do a lot of this, so it would be good to clear up the best way!

Tarakan

 

[KeithD]

I haven't purposely done it in my one-author works, but it's been done successfully before. What I think is important is to keep it clear to the reader. Sectionalize it obviously or at least put it into a pattern that the reader can quickly grasp and follow (like the perspective of the same action by the two in alternating paragraphs).

My coauthor and I do it in our Shabbu stories, but each change of perspective/voice is marked by a section change and, usually, a subhead identifying who's perspective the section is in.

 

[NotWise]

Head hopping/changing POV during a sex scene. Do you have any particular techniques on doing this successfully? Using line breaks between the different characters thoughts/experiences for example.

I do a lot of this, so it would be good to clear up the best way!

Tarakan

I've done that in my Pixie stories, which are mostly written in third person limited from her point of view. During sex scenes I sometimes switch to the point of view of whoever is most active. I originally did it without thinking about it. It seems completely innocuous, and no one's ever commented or complained.

That would probably be more of a problem if you write in first person.

 

[SimonDoom]

I don't usually do this, but I did do it conspicuously in one story, and it ended up being my most popular (most read) story by far. The key is to just be clear which head you are in, and also to establish early on that you are telling the story from two points of view. What's jarring is when you start a story from one POV and then suddenly switch to another in the same scene. If you get the reader accustomed to two POVs and are clear throughout then it makes it easier for the reader.

My general rule (not followed in the story referenced above) is to switch POVs after the end of a scene.

I should add that I do NOT switch first person POVs. I don't like stories that do that. I prefer third person omniscient POV.

 

[yukonnights]

Head hopping/changing POV during a sex scene. Do you have any particular techniques on doing this successfully? Using line breaks between the different characters thoughts/experiences for example.

I do a lot of this, so it would be good to clear up the best way!

Tarakan

I've been intrigued by this style/approach for some time now. In my most recent two stories I have played with it. My first attempt was Our Femdom Valentine. There is a discussion of this story on AMD's Review thread in Story Feedback.

My recently publish story, Lumberyard Miracle is my second try. I took the advice offered in the public review of the first one to try to address some of the problems mentioned on the first one.

Looking back farther; I became intrigued by all of this with the "Deep Point of View" technique/style for fiction writing. I still haven't been very successful in this even more immediate style/approach. But it is interesting.

Bottom line; the only reason I'm trying to get better at this is an attempt at crafting a more immediate experience for the readers. I liken it to the difference in a script for a play where there is a real time back and forth by the actors. I'll forewarn you; You'll get mixed reviews in the comments.

You mention that you only want to do this in the 'sex scenes'; I might question this. From the feedback I've received, the reader is a bit thrown-off at first — this is a new experience, etc. But, after reading more they get the idea and after that the story clips along. To do one part in style/pov A, then shift to style/mixed pov B … that may be too much to ask of the reader. I don't know, you'll have to decide on that.

Anyway, if you want to sample the stories I mentioned — there's some links down below in my signature block. Good luck!!!

 

[MelissaBaby]

I've done it many times, always in third person, and it never seems to have been a problem. (Although, frankly, it's a lot harder with same sex scenes)

One thing I have always tried to do is to tailor my language when I shift POV. For instance, in my Mary and Alvin series, I frequently headship. When its Mary's POV I use the words she would use, when it's Alvin's POV, I use his. So in her POV, for example it's usually his penis/her vagina and in his it's her pussy/his cock.

I think it's just a matter of being careful and maintaining clarity in your narrative.

 

[yukonnights]

I don't usually do this, but I did do it conspicuously in one story, and it ended up being my most popular (most read) story by far. The key is to just be clear which head you are in, and also to establish early on that you are telling the story from two points of view. What's jarring is when you start a story from one POV and then suddenly switch to another in the same scene. If you get the reader accustomed to two POVs and are clear throughout then it makes it easier for the reader.

My general rule (not followed in the story referenced above) is to switch POVs after the end of a scene.

I should add that I do NOT switch first person POVs. I don't like stories that do that. I prefer third person omniscient POV.

Great points. I'll add; it can't hurt to even put a mention of this pov play in an Author's Introduction.

I didn't mention it before, but like SimonDoom, both of the stories I mentioned have been well received so far.

 

[yukonnights]

I've done it many times, always in third person, and it never seems to have been a problem. (Although, frankly, it's a lot harder with same sex scenes)

One thing I have always tried to do is to tailor my language when I shift POV. For instance, in my Mary and Alvin series, I frequently headship. When its Mary's POV I use the words she would use, when it's Alvin's POV, I use his. So in her POV, for example it's usually his penis/her vagina and in his it's her pussy/his cock.

I think it's just a matter of being careful and maintaining clarity in your narrative.

I'm loving this discussion. I discovered the same thing in regard to it being much easier if there is a 'he' and a 'she' in the story. The head thoughts of the "thinking character" can easily incorporate the clarifying 'he' or 'she'. My first one was two 'she's' — Yikes - I had to use proper names too much, much more than in normal conversation or thoughts.

 

[KeithD]

If you're going to do it at all, I can't see why you wouldn't do it in first person if that's coming naturally in the conceiving/writing--the separate response directly from those involved in the sex scene. It might be very effective if one of them is just pretending--and even more effective if that one was turned to passion during the scene. Engage your imagination on possibilities.

 

[KeithD]

I'm loving this discussion. I discovered the same thing in regard to it being much easier if there is a 'he' and a 'she' in the story. The head thoughts of the "thinking character" can easily incorporate the clarifying 'he' or 'she'. My first one was two 'she's' — Yikes - I had to use proper names too much, much more than in normal conversation or thoughts.

That's often why I embed an age difference in same-sex stories. You can utilize "older" and "younger" then. Often "larger" and "smaller" as well if you establish size difference.

 

[SimonDoom]

If you're going to do it at all, I can't see why you wouldn't do it in first person if that's coming naturally in the conceiving/writing--the separate response directly from those involved in the sex scene. It might be very effective if one of them is just pretending--and even more effective if that one was turned to passion during the scene. Engage your imagination on possibilities.

How in the world would you do this in one scene? I can imagine if you have alternating scenes, although I'm not fond of that format as a reader. But I can't imagine how you would do this in one scene.

In my story, for example, I moved via third person omniscient from one person's POV to the other's from one paragraph to the next. I cannot imagine doing it via 1st person.

I agree with your general point that the only REAL limit for any of this is one's imagination. But my imagination can't figure out how this would work within a scene.

 

[KeithD]

How in the world would you do this in one scene? I can imagine if you have alternating scenes, although I'm not fond of that format as a reader. But I can't imagine how you would do this in one scene.

In my story, for example, I moved via third person omniscient from one person's POV to the other's from one paragraph to the next. I cannot imagine doing it via 1st person.

I agree with your general point that the only REAL limit for any of this is one's imagination. But my imagination can't figure out how this would work within a scene.

You could alternate sections, with section markers, for one. You could slug the beginning of each change in perspective with a name, e.g. Mary: and Todd: The limit is what a reader could understand. I wouldn't close down on some other way to do it either. This discussion board has a propensity to try to limit creativity and what can be done with fiction. There are more imaginations floating around Literotica than yours or mine, unless folks are sold a bill of goods about what "can't be done" with fiction.

-----

Todd: "Oh, fuck, Mary, you're so tight, so sweet." Is her father going to come across with the fucking check for marrying her?

Mary: "Oh, shit, Todd! Fuck me. Screw me to the bed!" I wonder if I took the chicken out of the freezer to thaw for dinner.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

I tried this as an experiment in House of Feathers Ch 3 - A Contest. It was interesting trying to shift FP POV back and forth between him and her without announcing it. On the whole, I think it worked, even if I did get some grumbly feedback. Fun to try, but I don’t think I’d do again unless really pressed.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I do it a lot with my close third person narratives; the key I find is to be very clear whose head you are in and, generally, stay there a while. But I do have stories where I shift quite rapidly. I must be doing something right, as I've not had a single complaint. Shifting tenses, on the other hand...

Since Doom came along, however, I don't do that anymore. But curiously, he's the only person who's ever commented. So maybe he's just a fussy bugger and I can go back to being lackadaisical .

 

[eroticstoryspinner]

Really enjoying this thread

 

[JuanSeiszFitzHall]

Head hopping/changing POV during a sex scene. Do you have any particular techniques on doing this successfully? Using line breaks between the different characters thoughts/experiences for example.

I do a lot of this, so it would be good to clear up the best way!

Tarakan

I did that in “There’s Nude, & Then There’s Naked,” by setting up the whole story as alternating recollections subtitled “From Fred” and “From Rachel.” By the time the sex began, each person’s perspective and speech/prose pattern were established. It allowed each person to describe the sensual giving and receiving, in sequential passages. Clearly, this kind of bludgeoning worked only because the format made it clear to the reader that there were two first-person narrators all the way through.

Irrelevantly, I’ll now answer a burning question that none of the 20k+ viewers of that story asked: Why is there an ampersand in the title? Because with ‘and,’ the title exceeded the 35-character limit for a story title, which I had not previously known existed.

https://www.literotica.com/stories/memberpage.php?uid=5116173&page=submissions

 

[ElectricBlue]

I'm loving this discussion. I discovered the same thing in regard to it being much easier if there is a 'he' and a 'she' in the story. The head thoughts of the "thinking character" can easily incorporate the clarifying 'he' or 'she'. My first one was two 'she's' — Yikes - I had to use proper names too much, much more than in normal conversation or thoughts.

Yes, that does get trickier; and one thing that gets more of an airing in that context is dropping in their names - not as manically as you did in the story MD commented on - but more so than usual.

I mix up that approach a bit by establishing a range of names - Mads, Maddy, Madeleine; Jills, Jilly, Jillian. Once you've established which character uses which name, and when a pet name is used, that can make clarity of who's who easier to navigate. Adam, of course, is the singular "he," so that's easy.

 

[Vix_Giovanni]

How in the world would you do this in one scene? I can imagine if you have alternating scenes, although I'm not fond of that format as a reader. But I can't imagine how you would do this in one scene.

In my story, for example, I moved via third person omniscient from one person's POV to the other's from one paragraph to the next. I cannot imagine doing it via 1st person.

I agree with your general point that the only REAL limit for any of this is one's imagination. But my imagination can't figure out how this would work within a scene.

Agreed. This is very easy and quite common in third person omniscient.

One well-handled example I can recall with 1st person narrative alternating between characters during a sex scene is Valentine’s Surprise by TxnPrd.

 

[SimonDoom]

Agreed. This is very easy and quite common in third person omniscient.

One well-handled example I can recall with 1st person narrative alternating between characters during a sex scene is Valentine’s Surprise by TxnPrd.

That's a very good example. It's written in alternating scenes, one from the brother's POV and the other from the sister's. It may just be me, however, but I don't care for bouncing back between narrators in first person. If one is going to do it that way, then one should try to take care to give each character a distinctive narrative voice. One doesn't have to do that when one writes in the third person omniscient.

I'm in the process of writing a brother-sister-father-mother incest story that will be told from all four points of view, in alternating scenes, but it's going to be in the third person omniscient. To do it well is a challenge, because as an author I want to make sure I match up the best point of view with whatever is happening in a given scene.

I may overthink things, but to me jumping between first person POVs makes me wonder how a story could come to be told like that. It's like I, the reader, stumbled across two people's diaries at the same time. It's distancing for me.

 

[Maeven_quinn]

Head hopping/changing POV during a sex scene. Do you have any particular techniques on doing this successfully? Using line breaks between the different characters thoughts/experiences for example.

I do a lot of this, so it would be good to clear up the best way!

Tarakan

In my humble opinion, I've never seen this done successfully. Sex scenes are action scenes. It doesn't work to change perspective in a action scene. Scene breaks and chapter breaks maybe.

There might be something that could be accomplished by switching character head-spaces during sex. I'm curious as to what that might be.

 

[SimonDoom]

There might be something that could be accomplished by switching character head-spaces during sex. I'm curious as to what that might be.

Here's why I did it in one story. The story was a mom-son incest story, based on the well-worn (but very popular) cliche situation where mom and son are pressed together on a seat and stuff happens. It's a "caught up in the heat of the moment" story, and I wanted to convey how both characters were swept up by events and desire and found themselves in what they would have regarded as an unthinkable situation minutes earlier. I wanted the reader to experience both of their perspectives. I told the story from a third person omniscient point of view. The clueless/drunk husband/dad was sitting nearby, and I also wanted to convey both son's and mom's perspective of dad, because it was a motivating factor.

To respond to one of your points: sometimes sex scenes are action scenes, and sometimes they are something else. The erotic focus of my story was to try to convey not action but how the characters felt about what was happening to them together. To do that, I needed to get inside both of their heads.

Although I steer clear of narrating stories this way now, preferring to focus on one point of view per scene, I felt like it was a justifiable way of doing things for this particular story. The story did well, too, so readers didn't seem to mind.

 

[NotWise]

In my humble opinion, I've never seen this done successfully. Sex scenes are action scenes. It doesn't work to change perspective in a action scene. Scene breaks and chapter breaks maybe.

There might be something that could be accomplished by switching character head-spaces during sex. I'm curious as to what that might be.

When I found myself doing it it was unintended, but it had the effect of keeping the narrative in an active voice. I didn't do anything to call attention to it, and it's hardly noticeable.

I'm not sure, but I may have stopped doing that once I realized it.

 

[Vix_Giovanni]

That's a very good example. It's written in alternating scenes, one from the brother's POV and the other from the sister's. It may just be me, however, but I don't care for bouncing back between narrators in first person. If one is going to do it that way, then one should try to take care to give each character a distinctive narrative voice. One doesn't have to do that when one writes in the third person omniscient.

I'm in the process of writing a brother-sister-father-mother incest story that will be told from all four points of view, in alternating scenes, but it's going to be in the third person omniscient. To do it well is a challenge, because as an author I want to make sure I match up the best point of view with whatever is happening in a given scene.

I may overthink things, but to me jumping between first person POVs makes me wonder how a story could come to be told like that. It's like I, the reader, stumbled across two people's diaries at the same time. It's distancing for me.

It’s not just you.

Switching POVs is “headhopping”. It can work, like in Joyce’s Ulysses for example. But even in its best literary examples, it’s just jarring and confusing.

Sometimes, it’s subtle but frustrating. Here’s an example in third person:

Suzie thought how sad it was that her story was rejected. She cried. Simon saw her crying and thought how happy he would make her if he got her story published.

Those two sentences should trip the reader up because they should feel like a mistake, even if the reader can’t put a finger on exactly why it’s wrong.

On the other hand, omniscient voice gives the narrative scope to handle multiple POVs:

It was now lunchtime, and Suzie and Simon were sitting at their table. They both opened their lunchboxes. Suzie noticed, delighted, that Simon had brought a bunch of carrots and laughed out loud. Almost immediately the smell of carrots attracted shy little plot bunnies which hopped slowly to the table in their curiosity. Simon beamed, thrilled that he’d cheered Suzie.

But it’s extraordinarily difficult to do omniscient first person POV.

I think that many amateur writers assume first person POV is going to be easier to write, and first person is better for writing sex scenes, and that first person will feel more “authentic” for storytelling. But in first person, your plot is limited by the narrating character’s knowledge and thoughts/actions. And the biggest irony: you can only get half (or some other fraction) of the sex scenes because in first person, you can only know what’s happening in the narrating character’s head.

So I think as a result, many writers try to jump from first person POV to omniscient or to headhopping to compensate for those frustrating limitations. But POV shifting is a very poor storytelling trick. And usually, the approach is quite lazy (asterisk breakups, and clunky headers to identify which character is now in 1st person, and ultimately, the plot and context usually don’t really warrant a change in POV anyways). In some cases, the story still works, like in TxnPrd’s story, but IMHO, I think that when it works, it’s more a testament to the writer’s general storytelling skills than an endorsement for using shifting POVs in first person.

 

[Maeven_quinn]

Here's why I did it in one story. The story was a mom-son incest story, based on the well-worn (but very popular) cliche situation where mom and son are pressed together on a seat and stuff happens. It's a "caught up in the heat of the moment" story, and I wanted to convey how both characters were swept up by events and desire and found themselves in what they would have regarded as an unthinkable situation minutes earlier. I wanted the reader to experience both of their perspectives. I told the story from a third person omniscient point of view. The clueless/drunk husband/dad was sitting nearby, and I also wanted to convey both son's and mom's perspective of dad, because it was a motivating factor.

To respond to one of your points: sometimes sex scenes are action scenes, and sometimes they are something else. The erotic focus of my story was to try to convey not action but how the characters felt about what was happening to them together. To do that, I needed to get inside both of their heads.

Although I steer clear of narrating stories this way now, preferring to focus on one point of view per scene, I felt like it was a justifiable way of doing things for this particular story. The story did well, too, so readers didn't seem to mind.

I could see how that might work, regarding the emotions of both partners. It could create some tension. One person is super into the sex, another person isn’t. Sex means something different to the two people involved.

 

[SimonDoom]

But it’s extraordinarily difficult to do omniscient first person POV.

.

I'm not sure what this is. This would be a truly odd POV. I think it would be something like this:

"Mom sat next to me on the sofa. I reached into her mind and found her fantasizing about me."

I have yet to read a story with this POV.