Disaster in the Making

[HisArpy]

Good points.
I'm no fan of Trump - because billionaires are now paying less tax than the working class.

Just an aside:

The rich are never going to pay what the less than rich deem "a fair share."
That's just a law of nature: with wealth comes power.
Consider their political donations as
part of their "tax."

The one thing I don't get in this line of thinking is this:

if the wealthy pay less in taxes, WHY THE FUCK DON'T YOU WANT TO BE ONE OF THEM instead of trying to make them just like you?

The adage of "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" seems to apply here.

[/threadjack]

 

[suurfer]

The one thing I don't get in this line of thinking is this:

if the wealthy pay less in taxes, WHY THE FUCK DON'T YOU WANT TO BE ONE OF THEM instead of trying to make them just like you?

The adage of "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" seems to apply here.

[/threadjack]

It's not socialist envy, to translate your words into BotanyBoy speak.
Nobody thinks like this, it's what you guys assume they think.
How my acquaintances think:

A country can't exist without collective subsidy of roads, defense and so on.

And if you decrease taxes from one part, the costs are passed onto the others in all sorts of ways.

 

[KeithD]

So, how many of our Kurdish allies did Trump help murder today? And how's business at the Istanbul Trump Towers?

I'm not sure this is a good way for Trump to get a Nobel Peace Prize.

 

[coati]

The one thing I don't get in this line of thinking is this:

if the wealthy pay less in taxes, WHY THE FUCK DON'T YOU WANT TO BE ONE OF THEM instead of trying to make them just like you?

The adage of "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" seems to apply here.

[/threadjack]

You sure are a simple-minded mofo.

Like, yeah, if you don't like how the rich have rigged the system, just WANT to become one of them. That will solve your problem.

 

[suurfer]

the middle east.
Most notably, I believe Iran will revolt if left alone and allowed to grow rich. Middle class prosperity is best antidote to religious extremism. Power hungry religious systems (including christianity and communism) require mass misery for validation.

We (the world) are in dire need for secular Islam.

Even more risky gambling bet is that reformed Iran could provide some such, but that's my hope.

But what westerners must know but seems to not understand is that emigration diaspora can't create one, even despite the exposure to different lifestyles. Emigration always have conservative doctrine by default, even if only unconsciously.

Your "unorthodox personal opinion" is completely validated by history.

Support for Iranian Mullahs plummeted in the period 1996-2001 as the growing Iranian middle class clamored for American jeans, mp3 players and action movies.

Then came 9/11, and Bush's disastrous branding of Iran as part of the "Axis of Evil". Iranians, fearing annihilation, flocked back to their religion, as people do in times of duress.

The mullahs, recognizing a gift handed to them, used their newfound popularity to install more and more components of Botany Boy's favorite legal system, sharia law.

Wow, nice assessments.

Fucking Bush.
He disregarded warnings from FBI, Interpol, even PUTIN! called him on the red line two days before 9.11, to warn him of an imminent attack.
After which he did all this.
His incompetence bordered on criminal, he threw the entire world in disarray.

 

[butters]

You sure are a simple-minded mofo.

Like, yeah, if you don't like how the rich have rigged the system, just WANT to become one of them. That will solve your problem.

also speaks to the morality; if i were rich, i'd see it as part of my moral responsibility to pay due-taxes and not attempt to hire 'experts' to allow me to pay an obscenely small amount whilst others, far less fortunate, are having to pay proportionately way higher.

typical of the rethugs, though... 'i gots mine'; especially pertinent to those whose money comes not from their own hard work but from the handing down of family money to keep them afloat.

 

[HisArpy]

It's not socialist envy, to translate your words into BotanyBoy speak.
Nobody thinks like this, it's what you guys assume they think.
How my acquaintances think:

A country can't exist without collective subsidy of roads, defense and so on.

And if you decrease taxes from one part, the costs are passed onto the others in all sorts of ways.

Where you go wrong is that I actually DO think like that. So does everyone I know who isn't barely making it from paycheck to paycheck.

And, before someone goes off on how I was privileged, I used to glean fields for vegetables after harvest with the rest of my family. I was 10 years old working in farm fields picking veggies so I'd have something to eat. I used to raise rabbits and chickens so we'd have meat and eggs.

What changed is that I got tired of "being poor". Instead of hanging out at the bar every night drinking my paycheck, I invested it. I made some small gains that I lost more often that not and eventually learned how to manage my money. Just like everyone else who learns these lessons.

I read a book called "The Richest Man in Babylon". It's a stupid book with lots of stupid stories but the lessons in those stories stuck because they're all applicable.

Do you know who "the rich" are? They're people who work for themselves instead of "working for the man".

Guess what - I work for myself. I pay my taxes on a quarterly basis. I don't lie on my returns and I don't overstate my expenses. Yet, I don't pay what your average wage slave pays. Why? Because I understand how to use the tax code to help me reduce my tax burden. The difference between me and you in that regard is that most of you don't.

Most people have no clue what they're doing financially and yet their income is the most vulnerable thing in their lives. Bitching that they are being taken advantage of is STUPID because everyone can take reasonable steps to minimize it.

3 things anyone can do:

Get the fuck out of credit debt.
Start a legitimate home based small business.
Hire an accountant to keep your books and LISTEN to what he tells you about business expenses.


From there, invest your money instead of smoking or drinking it. And then don't smoke or drink the profits.

 

[coati]

That's what I love about this issue...

All those people who used to say
"those people hate each other,
just let them kill each other,"
are now appalled that Trump
shares their exact attitude.

He did what Obama did and now
those who supported what Obama did
suddenly don't support what Trump has done.

So will they now finally admit that Obama was wrong
in order to impeach Trump's foreign policy?

Or was it the right move when Obama did it
but now circumstances are different?

Something has changed in the Middle East?

Sounds like you are still hung up on what posters said then and now on the porn board. Such a small world you live in.

Obama had the sense to consult with the leaders in his own party before he made a decision of this magnitude. Trump blew off key leaders in his own party and just did his own thing following another one of his infamous phone calls.

Neither President bothered to take a poll on Lit, but one considered the input of his own party leaders.

Trump suffers from the delusion that he knows more than anyone in the world. Instead of working out an exit strategy with others, he just popped off, like he does every time he picks up his phone. He is trashing our relationships with allies and making our lives as chaotic as his.

 

[HisArpy]

I want to add to the above a bit.

100 saved per month is 1200/year. Over 40 years that's 48,000. Not much but that's just principle. Add in the magic of compounding interest and the total changes. By a lot. CD's are paying 2.25%. T Bills are paying nearly 3% (Hint: AND the interest is TAX FUCKING FREE!!).

100/month even at a noncompounding 3% over 40 years is $165,000. (It's TAX FUCKING FREE TOO if you choose an extremely safe investment strategy and only invest in T Bills. Higher risk gets you higher returns but those aren't tax free and you can lose your ass.)

Even at $165K we're starting to talk real savings. And, as you get older, you earn more and should increase your monthly savings contribution accordingly.

Now let's talk retirement. The savings you have belong to you. It's not a 401K or IRA for which you will pay taxes on the amounts you withdraw, it's YOURS and the taxes have already been paid on it. After you retire, you can draw from that savings and there won't be any offset to your SSI reducing your SSI income. Nor do you have to report it to the IRS.

This is something just about anyone can do if they really want to. You don't have to have a big income or be well off or be a silver spoon to do it either. All it takes is deciding that you're not going to be poor any longer.

 

[Aglaopheme]

Meanwhile, back in the reality-based world...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/resizer/DIki-_O9ljq_nH13XWkQemgLr3c=/1440x0/smart/arc-anglerfish-washpost-prod-washpost.s3.amazonaws.com/public/JA2PZ6DJBFC57D5HWYGFCIA57Q.png

The NYT opinion piece from a few days ago had the best animated graph.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive...l?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage


And for good measure:

Trump Weighs Weakening Obama Rules to Curb Corporate Inversions

Treasury Department officials are considering rolling back a tax rule aimed at preventing American companies from moving money offshore to avoid U.S. taxes, according to several people familiar with discussions.

The Treasury is looking at regulations intended to prevent American firms from lowering their U.S. tax bills by shifting income to their offshore branches that they can loan to their domestic branches and deduct the interest off their Internal Revenue Service bills. The department is also contemplating repealing them entirely to replace them with something more business-friendly.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ning-obama-rules-to-curb-corporate-inversions

 

[BotanyBoy]

I see Trump for USA what Nero was for Rome, a disgrace and low point in history, and in many ways a survival test of an empire.

I think you've been feed a far left, pro-globalist anti-nationalist perspective that is wildly hyperbolic. Right in there with "He's literally HITLER!! ORANGE HITLER!!!" it's just silly.

I have perhaps rather unorthodox personal opinions about the middle east. Most notably, I believe Iran will revolt if left alone and allowed to grow rich. Middle class prosperity is best antidote to religious extremism. Power hungry religious systems (including christianity and communism) require mass misery for validation.

We (the world) are in dire need for secular Islam. I know, I know, it's very nearly an oxymoron. Even more risky gambling bet is that reformed Iran could provide some such, but that's my hope. But what westerners must know but seems to not understand is that emigration diaspora can't create one, even despite the exposure to different lifestyles. Emigration always have conservative doctrine by default, even if only unconsciously. Global communication and filter bubbling also means there's easily little difference in practical exposure. Neither Egypt nor Turkey can really provide such, reliably. Turkey is a difficult ally, in many ways kept as ally primarily to subdue, and the current regime is just awful.

I agree with you on most of this. Especially the part about secular Islam.

Meanwhile, it is Kurds who are most level headed and reasonable, and prioritize practical secularism (at least in comparison, as far it's possible to judge across distance; it's always possible they just have better propaganda). Granted, in part it's forced by survival, but such petty difficulties never really concerns true zealots. So I see the chance of independent Kurdistan was the silver lining of the second invasion in Iraq and removal of Saddam Hussein, with I personally think was an error. As was the ultimate removal of Gaddafi (whatever crazy scum he was), if not for other reasons than for it indirectly leading to the collapse of Syria, what was immeasurably tragic misunderstanding with eventually global consequences. Again, the positive fallout of the whole ISIS debacle is strengthened Kurdistan, for better or worse.

Nah, Saddam and his psycho kids were real scum, real evil. They were 100% on the list of people who really should and deserved to be taken out.

Even though the WMD threat was later found to be bunk, cleansing the Earth of that regime, especially the boys, was imo a good thing for the planet and humanity at large.

I do however think we should have handed Iraq back to it's people and left after their elections.

In short, I would choose Kurds over Turkey anyday. But of course, that's just a private opinion from northern European forest.

I would too, but at the same time we can't fight everyone's fight for them forever.

So we need to either commit to the extermination of Islamofascism everywhere. Which means several decades of military action and trillions of dollars. Which I think would be a huge mistake we're in no position to make.

Or let Europe and Russia police their back yard and take the opportunity and money to un-fuck ourselves a bit.

I've been in favor of the latter idea since 2006 ish and 100% support Trump further reducing our military presence/expenditures on conflict in the ME just like I supported Obama pulling out of Iraq.

IMO we the US of A, need to do some nation building and national security here at home and get ourselves straightened out before we think about doing it in the middle east.

 

[coati]

Where you go wrong is that I actually DO think like that. So does everyone I know who isn't barely making it from paycheck to paycheck.

And, before someone goes off on how I was privileged, I used to glean fields for vegetables after harvest with the rest of my family. I was 10 years old working in farm fields picking veggies so I'd have something to eat. I used to raise rabbits and chickens so we'd have meat and eggs.

What changed is that I got tired of "being poor". Instead of hanging out at the bar every night drinking my paycheck, I invested it. I made some small gains that I lost more often that not and eventually learned how to manage my money. Just like everyone else who learns these lessons.

I read a book called "The Richest Man in Babylon". It's a stupid book with lots of stupid stories but the lessons in those stories stuck because they're all applicable.

Do you know who "the rich" are? They're people who work for themselves instead of "working for the man".

Guess what - I work for myself. I pay my taxes on a quarterly basis. I don't lie on my returns and I don't overstate my expenses. Yet, I don't pay what your average wage slave pays. Why? Because I understand how to use the tax code to help me reduce my tax burden. The difference between me and you in that regard is that most of you don't.

Most people have no clue what they're doing financially and yet their income is the most vulnerable thing in their lives. Bitching that they are being taken advantage of is STUPID because everyone can take reasonable steps to minimize it.

3 things anyone can do:

Get the fuck out of credit debt.
Start a legitimate home based small business.
Hire an accountant to keep your books and LISTEN to what he tells you about business expenses.


From there, invest your money instead of smoking or drinking it. And then don't smoke or drink the profits.

Thanks for all your inspirational lessons, Horatio Alger. Now everyone in the United States can join the tax dodgers in the top 2% income bracket. None of us will work for the man.

 

[HisArpy]

Thanks for all your inspirational lessons, Horatio Alger. Now everyone in the United States can join the tax dodgers in the top 2% income bracket. None of us will work for the man.

You're welcome.

Now, why don't you call a few friends over and have a party where you can all bitch about how you're so poor and can barely afford to buy food while you drink $200 worth of beer.

 

[Aglaopheme]

And here you have it:



Selling out our allies is less important than upsetting liberals/democrats to these morons.

You called it. It’s pretty pathetic how petty some folks are when facing a real crisis.

 

[icanhelp1]

Sounds like you are still hung up on what posters said then and now on the porn board. Such a small world you live in.

Obama had the sense to consult with the leaders in his own party before he made a decision of this magnitude. Trump blew off key leaders in his own party and just did his own thing following another one of his infamous phone calls.

Neither President bothered to take a poll on Lit, but one considered the input of his own party leaders.

Trump suffers from the delusion that he knows more than anyone in the world. Instead of working out an exit strategy with others, he just popped off, like he does every time he picks up his phone. He is trashing our relationships with allies and making our lives as chaotic as his.

YEAH! Obama listened to his generals We had peace in Iraq won and Obama pulled our troops out. ISIS is the brainchild of Obama's listening to his generals. Revisionist history.

Trump had to clean Obama's mess.

 

[coati]

YEAH! Obama listened to his generals We had peace in Iraq won and Obama pulled our troops out. ISIS is the brainchild of Obama's listening to his generals. Revisionist history.

Trump had to clean Obama's mess.

Trump's own party leaders don't think what he just precipitously pulled qualifies as "cleaning a mess".

Good luck supporting your King of Chaos until your ship finally sinks to the bottom of the ocean.

 

[jaF0]

BotFlyToi .... Ground Troop




Ain' no freakin' way.

 

[RobDownSouth]

<snip>
Even though the WMD threat was later found to be bunk...
<snip>

Fair warning, Ishmael disagrees vehemently with the above statement and is not above siccing his Ninja Hacker SEAL team on people who post statements like you just did.

Isn't it a gosh-darned shame how many good people died for that lie?

 

[Aglaopheme]

Kentucky senator Rand Paul, perhaps the most prominent non-interventionist in Congress, said in 2015 that the United States should defeat ISIS by arming the Kurds and promising the Kurds their own country: “I think they would fight like hell if we promised them a country.”

It’s an odd day when I am quoting the National Review

https://www.nationalreview.com/corn...s-then-and-now/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

 

[suurfer]

I'll probably look illiterate or I might have not understood the picture,
but I'm sorry, I totally understand where Turkey is coming from.

I mean, the EU dumped on Turkey millions of refugees (from Greece included), and more are coming,
but neither US, nor the EU helped them to create a safe zone for the re-settlement of refugees in Syria.

And now they're playing the moral card in this clusterfuck and calling them invaders?

Turkey's primary aim is to protect it's borders (both from kurdish insurgents, and from further influx of more desperate refugees).
That they're taking advantage of this opportunity for their other aim re kurds, is another issue.

 

[suurfer]

That Turkey's ruthlessness and imperialism are posing a danger to kurds and Europe is undisputable.

But as much as this will negatively impact other countries, this is NOT an invasion.
It's a national defense issue.

 

[bigsly]

And here you have it:



Selling out our allies is less important than upsetting liberals/democrats to these morons.

You called it. It’s pretty pathetic how petty some folks are when facing a real crisis.

The above two warmongering cunts whine that partisan politics is more important to their political opposites than the lives of their dear Kurd friends, who they care soooo very, very much about.

The Lit RWCJ vs. the majority of congressional Republicans + Benjamin Netanyahu is the only war I want to watch right now.

Yet when one of their own progressive blowhards spews the same sentiment they attack others for, they remain chickenshit silent. Naturally.

What a gaggle of phony, two-faced bitches.

Squeal more and louder, pigs!

 

[DeluxAuto]

^^^^disaster already made

 

[RobDownSouth]

That Turkey's ruthlessness and imperialism are posing a danger to kurds and Europe is undisputable.

But as much as this will negatively impact other countries, this is NOT an invasion.
It's a national defense issue.

Turkey is aiming airstrikes at Kurdish encampments in Syria.
That's akin to the US Air Force dropping bombs on Hispanics in Mexico clustered at the border.

It is NOT a "national defense issue".

It's quite simply "ethnic cleansing", orchestrated by Edrogan and greenlighted by President Donald J. Trump.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Fair warning, Ishmael disagrees

I don't care.....certainly not as much as you do.