A Tale of Two Cultures

[SpeareChucker]

This is a thought sparked by a recent WSJ article and yesterday's history channel.

The kids are so over driving verses the kids all want more power, speed and styling.

I was also reading some Eric Hoffer last night, and I somewhat wonder, were cars independence for the sons and daughters of skin in the game parents (many of whom drove the racing scene) whereas the new independence is an electronic bubble of those whom generally live at home, are accruing lots of education debt and short of the latter, have no real skin in the game. Both cultures driven by frustration, but frustrations of a different measure. (The frustration of Korea and Vietnam contrasted with the frustration over symbols, like statues, comes to mind.)

One culture was auto-centric, almost worshipful and now the auto is anti-cultural.
What was once good and central to life is now regarded as a bane to life.

Or maybe, the standard of living has fallen so far that we have learned to be placated by a phone and faux independence?
A fantasy world replacing a real world?

 

[bellisarius]

But that world is all to real for them. They've been indoctrinated into that thought stream since the day they entered first grade. And with the advent of the iPhone they can live in their own little echo chamber what with their 'likes', 'friend', and 'unfriend.'

While once we wanted the best for ourselves and our neighbors we see a generation that wants to deprive anyone of anything that they don't approve of, up to and including free speech.

But the real problem is that they are a minority, a very vocal (typing) minority, but a minority none-the-less. And for some reason the press is going right along with them, and in some cases leading them on.

We have allowed a situation to mature where we, the local citizens, are no longer in charge of our children's education. We have abdicated our responsibility there to a large and generally unaccountable machine. A machine that has the lowest of intellects teaching our children and it seems that as long as they seem to care about our children that's quite alright with us.

And we are not blameless in this tragedy. By restricting ourselves to small families the one or two children we allowed ourselves are of ever increasing importance, genetic value as it were. So we coddle, cater to, and overly protect. Large families can't afford that silliness. In far too many cases we raised a generation of self-entitled brats. And the fact that so many of them are from single parent households hasn't helped at all.

All we can do now is hope that the worm will turn before it's too late.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Two cultures indeed...
https://bigmemes.funnyjunk.com/pictures/New+memes+baby+boomers_0d495c_6014110.jpg

 

[RobDownSouth]

RWCJ Magazine
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/224/512/ae5.jpg

 

[InsightRiot]

Here's a copypasta from the most hated website in the world:

What have boomers done?

Boomers were born into the greatest economy in all of human history.
Boomers used that economy to enrich themselves personally by sucking everything out of it and putting it in their bank accounts.
In order to keep the scam going, boomers flooded the country with nonwhite hordes to work for cheap.
Boomers did all of the drugs and fucked each other like dogs, destroying the institution of marriage forever.
Boomers liberated women and black people.
Boomers divorced because they were too selfish to keep their marriages together for the sake of their kids.
Boomers even created a meme about how it was wrong to “stay together for the kids”.
Boomers created a generation of young people who can’t maintain relationships because they watched their parents destroy each other in the pursuit of personal happiness.
Boomers destroyed Christianity and replaced it with a new religion based on hoarding money and worshiping the Jews.
Boomers sided with Israel over America and sent a bunch of millennials to fight wars for Jews and spent trillions of money that should have been used for Americans on these wars.
Boomers let the faggots run wild and said it was “their own personal choice” to turn everything queer.
Boomers decided that “racism” is the worst possible sin in all of the universe, and proved they didn’t commit that sin by handing over the entire country to nonwhites, thus stealing it from all future generations so they could feel good about themselves.
Boomers proceeded to blame all of the problems they created on the broken young people that they raised in the dystopian hellscape they created.

These boomers must be made to pay back all of the money they stole, and they must be made to pay for destroying all of society with their hedonism and heathenism.

And it is all hedonism:

Sexual liberation.
Doing all those drugs.
Stealing all of that money.
Making Christianity – a religion about suffering to attain enlightenment – about “personal happiness”.
Letting faggots run wild.
Getting divorces to go out in their 40s, 50s and 60s to “date” like they are teenagers.
Feeling a warm heart when they see brown people getting free things stolen from their own children and grandchildren and every future generation.

They have framed their own hedonism as morally good:

Abortion = “woman’s right to choose”.
Doing drugs = “living free”.
Stealing money = “fiscal responsibility to increase the GDP”.
Loving Jews and fighting their wars = “fulfilling Biblical prophecy”.
Faggots on the loose molesting children = “personal freedom”.
Getting a divorce and destroying families = “taking care of my self, I deserve to be happy”.
Giving away everything to brown people = “we are a nation of immigrants, Statue of Liberty poem, our values”.

They’re going to have to give back the stolen money and more.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Here's a copypasta from the most hated website in the world:

Que's alt is copy and pasting from a neo-Nazi website The Daily Stormer.
Anyone truly surprised?

 

[SpeareChucker]

One thing that strikes me is in the discussion of who joins a mass movement, it is the frustrated, but what are the frustrated by? Anatomy of Revolution teaches us that the rich don't engage in revolution, but Hoffer gives examples of when they do, but it's not a result of a Mass Movement. Where poverty is brutal, no amount of frustration can interrupt the daily struggle just to save a life, but when you give people a little hope of something better just over the horizon, then you get the religiosity that drives a movement of change.

Where does this frustration come from?
Some of it from those who have no sense of self-worth.
Among other sources, and an important one I think, is from those with leisure, but who desire more; the children of those who sacrificed pretty much everything to give them everything they could (as pointed out, easier with a smaller family once you've left the farm) but that is just not enough to sate those whom feel entitled to more.
I think that this type of frustration is the driving force behind the young (and successful) politician who proclaims that her generation has never known 'opportunity' or the older (again, successful) politician who has become a millionaire lamenting the unfair distribution of income/wealth.

Yesterday's right of passage, the driver's license is now a meaningless metric compared to the number of 'likes' and the automobile is viewed as an ecological disaster and as the population of rural America shrinks and retreats into the cities, the car really does diminish in importance as a tool and an expression of independence when you begin to rely upon public transportation, Uber and Lyft (not to mention the associated physical shrinkage of the car from a luxurious personal space to a small box to get you from point-to-point with economy at the forefront of design, e.g., the car no longer needs that killer sound system, you just use your phone and earbuds.).

Of course, as a member of this new culture, you are almost required to worry about the effects of cars and increasing population on the environment and the spread of the cities, even as there are fewer rural people and fewer vehicles just because of the changing nature of technology. There's a lot to ponder as we pursue change.

 

[InsightRiot]

Que's alt is copy and pasting from a neo-Nazi website The Daily Stormer.
Anyone truly surprised?

I'm watching Jimmy Dore interview Tulsi Gabbard right now.

Tulsi’s Bold Marijuana Bill Helps Veterans w/Tulsi Gabbard

 

[SpeareChucker]

Clearly, the proponents of this new culture preclude thought, but rather demand action, even if only rhetorical, as they pursue the goals of the mass movement.
Robert, over half of the first part of Hoffer's work describes and should probably be dedicated to you, at least half as dedicated as you are to grinding personal political axes...

Venom and hatred are the clear hallmarks of The True Believer.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Clearly, the proponents of this new culture preclude thought, but rather demand action, even if only rhetorical, as they pursue the goals of the mass movement.
Robert, over half of the first part of Hoffer's work describes and should probably be dedicated to you, at least half as dedicated as you are to grinding personal political axes...

Venom and hatred are the clear hallmarks of The True Believer.

You forfeited the right to civil discussion several years and userids ago, housesquaw.

Speakin' of "venom and hatred"...do you remember the post that got you banhammered last time? Hint: you made unfounded accusations against me.

 

[Shelly2inme]

Fantasy world taking over

Early in this thread you said: "Or maybe, the standard of living has fallen so far that we have learned to be placated by a phone and faux independence? A fantasy world replacing a real world?"

I think the standard has fallen and people are living in a fantasy world more than the real world. And the expression: "faux independence," is an excellent way of describing one aspect of the fantasy.

I am increasingly alarmed by the anger of the mindless masses. They are upset about fantasy issues that have been planted in their manipulated minds.

It would be wise for people to take a deep breath and do some critical thinking about what is going on in fantasy land.

 

[SpeareChucker]

Early in this thread you said: "Or maybe, the standard of living has fallen so far that we have learned to be placated by a phone and faux independence? A fantasy world replacing a real world?"

I think the standard has fallen and people are living in a fantasy world more than the real world. And the expression: "faux independence," is an excellent way of describing one aspect of the fantasy.

I am increasingly alarmed by the anger of the mindless masses. They are upset about fantasy issues that have been planted in their manipulated minds.

It would be wise for people to take a deep breath and do some critical thinking about what is going on in fantasy land.

I don't know as if the standard of living has fallen as much as the way of (possibly passive due to lack of incentive to struggle and fight against odds not present) living, but that there is an artificial consternation that it has. We still have everything our parents did (and more) and while there are brief periods of economic lull, there is no lack of opportunity, otherwise we would not be such an immigration magnet.

 

[von_Bismarck]

... And get off my lawn!!

 

[BotanyBoy]

This is a thought sparked by a recent WSJ article and yesterday's history channel.

One culture was auto-centric, almost worshipful and now the auto is anti-cultural.
What was once good and central to life is now regarded as a bane to life.

Or maybe, the standard of living has fallen so far that we have learned to be placated by a phone and faux independence?
A fantasy world replacing a real world?

It's not faux independence....quite the opposite.

What was once good and central to life simple and cost/time effective is now an unaffordable expense and luxury. When I started driving I bought my first and still to this day only new car. My Honda Civic cost 9,499.99....99. I put six down and my monthly payment was like 120/mo for 3 years.

I could afford that as a working teen. 22 years later.....working teens make the same money I did, and a Honda civic or other entry level econo box is now a 30-50,000 dollar car with 300 bucks a month in insurance and gas is so expensive it cost 50 bucks to fill the sum'bitch up.

Pray to gawd you never have a problem with it. You'll have to pay an electrical engineer to un-fuck it.

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/284/529/e65.gif

Now let's factor in the migration to and concentration around metro areas, where having your own car means sitting on the highway (parking lot) for 6 hrs a day to commute something you could bike faster and get your PT in if you weren't so lazy.

If you get a used/cash car your insurance and fuel are still going to cost you 1/3 your income and fixing the old piece of shit all the time will cost you everything else.

Reality is if you're a kid and you don't already have a solid middle class income, and most don't, or just a resident of an urban/metro area then a car is almost certainly a terrible economic decision and time pit most just can't afford especially with more affordable and faster options available.

Like a bus, subway or bike.

If I had stayed in SF, NYC or other insano-plex uber city I'd have zero vehicles....because why? It's the least cost/time effective way to get around.

 

[von_Bismarck]

Can confirm vehicle ownership is a terrible economic decision if living in an urban/metro area. Why shell out ~500 dollars a month, when all the necessities are in immediate walking distance? More of the younger generation are living in higher density areas. For many, vehicle ownership is a thing of the past. Future is autonomous services - Uber without the driver. I've owned vehicles when it made sense to. In my case, it may never again make sense to.

 

[SpeareChucker]

I can get a drivable car for around $2K. It depends on what your standards/expectations are. I think that this state of affairs is a constant. It was just as expensive to maintain a car then as it is now when viewed as a ration (and perhaps excluding mandatory insurance, a cost of government 'protecting' us.
Then again, maybe you are saying that they've accumulated too much school debt to afford much of anything at entry-level wages? One would think the ability to get into college would imply the reasoning and intuition to see that one coming.

Is what you are saying is that the flight from the cities did not include enough infrastructure spending?

I don't know what you were paid as a teen, but for those who will work, the pay is good, especially these last few years. We are incessantly told how vastly underpaid they are though by the same voices awarding newly-minted and undocumented citizens sanctuary status and the right to work at under-the-table rates...


But clearly, for the young, the love and infatuation with the automobile is over.
Maybe they don't feel the need for speed and excitement unless its in their phone.

 

[von_Bismarck]

But clearly, for the young, the love and infatuation with the automobile is over.

By and large, yes. Get over it, Gramps.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I can get a drivable car for around $2K.

Yea and you'll be working on that pile of shit more than' you'll be driving the sum' bitch LOL

Then again, maybe you are saying that they've accumulated too much school debt to afford much of anything at entry-level wages?

No....I'm saying entry-level wages aren't enough to afford much of anything and young people would rather spend their money doing something other than maintaining/operating a 2000 dollar piece of shit when they can get where they need to go faster on a 200 dollar Huffy or a few bucks on a subway.

I don't know what you were paid as a teen, but for those who will work, the pay is good, especially these last few years.

10.50/hr....I did flooring, hard fuckin' work barely making it then and sure as shit not going very far today.

We are incessantly told how vastly underpaid they are though by the same voices awarding newly-minted and undocumented citizens sanctuary status and the right to work at under-the-table rates...

Yea.

But clearly, for the young, the love and infatuation with the automobile is over.
Maybe they don't feel the need for speed and excitement unless its in their phone.

Nah, the car scene is still alive, it's just not affordable for most kids.

 

[SpeareChucker]

Your fragmented post is a perfect example of why personal anecdote is a poor, and often fallacious, form of argument. Maybe today's young person cannot keep a car running because of its complexity, but with the change in culture, they also lack any incentive to even try. I don't know of, then or now, many part-time, well-paying construction jobs for teens. Especially on the entry level. Better to hire an undocumented citizen driven by the fear of losing his job than a teenager inculcated in the 'sharing and fairness' school of economics where their contribution is as highly valued as it was in the classroom where an 'A' was your participation award.

I have 100K in debt and a Master's and you're not going to at least start me as a Veep?


When it comes to a ride for the modern teen, just harass mom and dad (sorry, I mean the single parent ) to "borrow" the car.
Or use sexting to get ride shares...



You mean you have to bribe your friends to get a ride?
Well, yeah...
Don't tell Mom the Babysitter is Dead

 

[SpeareChucker]

And yes, the car scene is now the purview of middle-age and older men, but its not due to cost, it's due to cultural inclination.

To some of us, the muscle car still rules the road (as does a Harley).
For the new generation, not so much.

How green is it?

Not saying that's right or wrong, just saying that things have changed, for better, or worse. It really depends on your point of view. If I lived in an urban hamster cage, I probably would not have a vehicle either. I don't think that I could live in the suburbs, that seems to be a poor trade-off all the way 'round.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Your fragmented post is a perfect example of why personal anecdote is a poor, and often fallacious, form of argument.

How so?

Maybe today's young person cannot keep a car running because of its complexity, but with the change in culture, they also lack any incentive to even try.

Exactly...why would they pay all that money for less effective means of transportation??

And yes, the car scene is now the purview of middle-age and older men, but its not due to cost, it's due to cultural inclination.

I think not accounting for both is putting blinders on.

But if folks want to pretend market forces aren't real it's no skin off my dick.

To some of us, the muscle car still rules the road (as does a Harley).
For the new generation, not so much.

The muscle car is trying to make a comeback....the Hellcat/Demon are decent offerings and the new Vette might finally do it.

I know it's mid engine, but I don't think it's AWD, so probably a fail, Chevy is big on half assing shit in the performance department.

We'll see.

I'm hoping for AWD muscle.

Not saying that's right or wrong, just saying that things have changed, for better, or worse. It really depends on your point of view. If I lived in an urban hamster cage, I probably would not have a vehicle either. I don't think that I could live in the suburbs, that seems to be a poor trade-off all the way 'round.

Oh they have changed 100%.

Yea....I'm anti-urban, heavy preference for the sticks but put up with outer burbs at the densest.

 

[SpeareChucker]

It's like picking shotgun pellets out of a fresh goose...


Oy vey!

 

[bellisarius]

Out here the car scene comes in 3 flavors. Old school hot rods, low riders, and 4WD. Harley is still the scooter of choice with the new Indian running a close second.

The new cars will last damn near forever (particularly the drive train) with proper maintenance, 300-400K isn't unreasonable. And therein lies the rub. 'Proper' maintenance virtually demands dealer intervention. The parts are over priced and many replacements now require special tooling. It's borderline impossible for the owner to do their own maintenance anymore.

And why is it that the Japanese, Germans, and others can manufacture autos in the US profitably and US manufacturers can't?

 

[SpeareChucker]

Talking about cars is fun, but this is more about societal paradigm shifts.

 

[AngusBridie]

Most kids in their twenties or I’ll go as far as the 30 year old mark can’t change a Tire

We owned tool sets and we’re changing out transmissions in every model of the 70s Chevy Monte Carlo and basically keeping scrap cars because the parts were so interchangeable

Vehicle technology certainly has changed but that being said I read an article somewhere that dealerships are screaming for mechanics.. demand is high availability is low

I’m not gonna go our generation is better but my experience has been. With all the technology available why can they not get a lawnmower started or maintained

I say they are lazy whiny little fucks that take no responsibility nor will they even try to learn anything

It’s always some other generations fault or nobody taught me or a myriad of excuses when they could have got on the internet. Got an entire service manual and watched a video how to repair something

Of course you have to own tools. I suppose I’ll give credit there. Why purchase something you never plan to use or have any idea what it’s for


Also. I concur. Get off my lawn