How To Get To Heaven When You Die

[colddiesel]

. I don't care about being in tune with my Church, I want to follow the Bible.

And your uncaring is where you are totally different to Tryharder, she understands, perhaps emotionally rather than intellectually the need to 'love her neighbour as herself.'

You just quote a book and 'believe' your religion. She has the element that JC taught and you miss entirely. Compassion.

 

[Tryharder62]

Man I had a bad night sleeping. Couldn't get to sleep, up off and on. I must have slept good at times thouh because I guess I missed thunder snow. Crazy weather here.

Just popping in here, in all fairness, to put my two cents in about compassion. The ultimate compassion for a Christian is to care about where a person will spend eternity.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

'I Can Only Imagine' Christian Movie Tops At Box Office


http://www.wnd.com/2018/03/mercyme-faith-based-film-wins-weekend-box-office/

 

[KarenB59]

Walking in quietly and leaving this here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXXxLwxfo0U

 

[Tryharder62]

Walking in quietly and leaving this here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXXxLwxfo0U

So glad you did. Please Stay!

 

[Tryharder62]

'I Can Only Imagine' Christian Movie Tops At Box Office


http://www.wnd.com/2018/03/mercyme-faith-based-film-wins-weekend-box-office/

(it is so good!)

 

[Antryg_Windrose]

I don't know who that is, so I guess not.

Not a Heinlein fan, then.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Not a Heinlein fan, then.

I have heard of Heineken but never heard of Heinlein.

 

[colddiesel]

. The ultimate compassion for a Christian is to care about where a person will spend eternity.

Fine words TH, Difficult to argue with as a precept. What struck me, however, is that it makes just as much sense if you substitute Buddhist or Muslim or Hindu or Parsee or Confucian for Christian.

Then thinking a little further, what might be JC's response have been. He much preferred examples to precepts, and expressed them in Parables. He did not say you will win a ticket to heaven if you have faith that the guy lying injured in the road will be ok. He praised the guy that actually helped - the Samaratan. JC did not say we should be nice to our brothers even if they are useless ratbags. He grounded the lesson in a real example, a parable in real life - the Prodigal son.

This is why I find Xfrodos 'preaching' inadequate. It is not enough just to have faith, Jesus expected his followers to live and act their faith, not merely to think and pray it.

Some theologians came up with the pernicious nonsense that faith alone is enough. It isn't: your actions and omissions are just as important.

Real compassion in small everyday life outweighs even the most grandioquent of gestures and fine words - every time.

 

[BobBalouski]

How To Get To Heaven When You Die

No one goes to "Heaven When" they "Die", according to the Bible.

So, how come you're preaching your own word, JoelJr?

Do not add to His words
Or He will reprove you, and you will be proved a liar.

Proverbs 30:5-6 (NASB)

 

[BobBalouski]

Fine words TH, Difficult to argue with as a precept. What struck me, however, is that it makes just as much sense if you substitute Buddhist or Muslim or Hindu or Parsee or Confucian for Christian.

Then thinking a little further, what might be JC's response have been. He much preferred examples to precepts, and expressed them in Parables. He did not say you will win a ticket to heaven if you have faith that the guy lying injured in the road will be ok. He praised the guy that actually helped - the Samaratan. JC did not say we should be nice to our brothers even if they are useless ratbags. He grounded the lesson in a real example, a parable in real life - the Prodigal son.

This is why I find Xfrodos 'preaching' inadequate. It is not enough just to have faith, Jesus expected his followers to live and act their faith, not merely to think and pray it.

Some theologians came up with the pernicious nonsense that faith alone is enough. It isn't: your actions and omissions are just as important.

Real compassion in small everyday life outweighs even the most grandioquent of gestures and fine words - every time.

There you go, JoelJr: here's obviously a fellow wannabe who reckons he speaks for "JC" just as well as you can.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

No one goes to "Heaven When" they "Die", according to the Bible.

So, how come you're preaching your own word, JoelJr?

Christians Do go to heaven:
Mr 16:19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.
2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
(KJV)
Php 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
22 But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labour: yet what I shall choose I wot not.
23 For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:
24 Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you.
People in heaven:
Re 19:1 And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:
(KJV)
Jesus Christ is going to rule and reign on the earth. The believers will be with Him on the earth at that time. Right now believer's go to heaven to be with the Lord Jesus Christ because that is where He is.

 

[BobBalouski]

Christians Do go to heaven:
Mr 16:19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

So, when "Christians" physically die, they not only instantly go to heaven, but also sit at the right hand of God, too, just like the Christ?

Why do enjoy blaspheming the Word of God so much?

Right now believer's go to heaven to be with the Lord Jesus Christ because that is where He is.

No doubt that pimp sells in your kindergarten Sunday school class, but here's what the Word of God says that totally proves you a flat-out liar:

For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. - 1 Thessalonians 4:14 (KJV)


For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. - 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 (KJV)

So learn us, JoelJr: if the dead are already in heaven with the Christ - as you so blasphemingly pontificate - why does the Word say they will rise up first to be with the Lord who descends from heaven to retrieve them, and then living believers will be caught up together with them in the clouds to then proceed to heaven?

Come on, wannabe: how's the Rapture supposed to happen the way the Bible instructs if the dead go to heaven to be with Jesus the instant they die - as you lie?

 

[Tryharder62]

Fine words TH, Difficult to argue with as a precept. What struck me, however, is that it makes just as much sense if you substitute Buddhist or Muslim or Hindu or Parsee or Confucian for Christian.

I would hope people would go towards a faith that teaches compassion. Unfortunately some don't. I do think what you do in life is a reflection of your faith.

I just think that we need all kinds of people as Christians. I'll tell you a story, since Billy Graham has been in the news. I grew up in a situation where yelling was the norm. I had a little black and white TV in my room before that was a norm. The Billy Graham Crusades would come on and I'd watch a little but I couldn't continue. It felt like he was yelling. I didn't like it. Now 30 years later I see his passion. I've enjoyed learning more about him. They're probably millions of people that can trace their salvation back to him. I'm not one of them. God used a couple friends and a quiet country preacher to bring me to salvation. The world would be a different place without those two gentlemen. I am grateful for them both.

how's the Rapture supposed to happen the way the Bible instructs if the dead go to heaven to be with Jesus the instant they die - as you lie?

At death, the body stays awaiting the resurrection of the last day, but the soul goes to be at home with the Lord.

 

[phrodeau]

There you all go again, trying to find consistency in a series of stories with no consistency between them.

 

[Tryharder62]

There you all go again, trying to find consistency in a series of stories with no consistency between them.

Remember that the Bible was written by approximately 40 different authors over a period of around 1500 years. Each writer wrote with a different style, from a different perspective, to a different audience, for a different purpose.

Pretty amazing!

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

So, when "Christians" physically die, they not only instantly go to heaven, but also sit at the right hand of God, too, just like the Christ?

Why do enjoy blaspheming the Word of God so much?



No doubt that pimp sells in your kindergarten Sunday school class, but here's what the Word of God says that totally proves you a flat-out liar:



So learn us, JoelJr: if the dead are already in heaven with the Christ - as you so blasphemingly pontificate - why does the Word say they will rise up first to be with the Lord who descends from heaven to retrieve them, and then living believers will be caught up together with them in the clouds to then proceed to heaven?

Come on, wannabe: how's the Rapture supposed to happen the way the Bible instructs if the dead go to heaven to be with Jesus the instant they die - as you lie?

Is Jesus in heaven or not? Yes or no? Yes He is. Paul said that he was in a straight between remaining here or departing and being with Christ which is far greater. Paul also described being in heaven in an earlier passage. So where do you think Paul was referring to when he said that he wanted to depart and be with Christ, which is far greater?

As far as the rapture which you are referring to, the souls of those in heaven will return to the earth with Christ at that time and go back into their physical body. The body will be resurrected and raptured, being transformed into a spiritual body like Christ's glorious body, then those who are alive and remain will also be caught up and their body transformed into a body like Christ's.

 

[BobBalouski]

Is Jesus in heaven or not? Yes or no? Yes He is.

That's nice. Is that your guilty conscience you're asking there, because I surely don't recall asking you where Jesus is, wannabe.

Paul said that he was in a straight between remaining here or departing and being with Christ which is far greater. Paul also described being in heaven in an earlier passage. So where do you think Paul was referring to when he said that he wanted to depart and be with Christ, which is far greater?

What is it about "sleep in Jesus" that your puny little JoelJr swindler mind finds impossible to comprehend? Does it fantasize that "sleep in Jesus" excludes being with Jesus somehow? How is that even possible, wannabe?

You should really consider just holding fast to what the Word exactly says instead of imagining your little pea brain has any credible chance of interpreting otherwise with its incredibly limited capacity.

As far as the rapture which you are referring to, the souls of those in heaven will return to the earth with Christ at that time and go back into their physical body.

Really? Where in the Word does it state exactly that as you pontificate?

The body will be resurrected and raptured, being transformed into a spiritual body like Christ's glorious body, then those who are alive and remain will also be caught up and their body transformed into a body like Christ's.

Really? Again, where in the Word does it state exactly that as you pontificate?

I'm not interested in just more of your kindergarten Sunday school offerings, bozo: just quote the Word that says exactly what you're trying to pimp.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

That's nice. Is that your guilty conscience you're asking there, because I surely don't recall asking you where Jesus is, wannabe.



What is it about "sleep in Jesus" that your puny little JoelJr swindler mind finds impossible to comprehend? Does it fantasize that "sleep in Jesus" excludes being with Jesus somehow? How is that even possible, wannabe?

You should really consider just holding fast to what the Word exactly says instead of imagining your little pea brain has any credible chance of interpreting otherwise with its incredibly limited capacity.



Really? Where in the Word does it state exactly that as you pontificate?



Really? Again, where in the Word does it state exactly that as you pontificate?

I'm not interested in just more of your kindergarten Sunday school offerings, bozo: just quote the Word that says exactly what you're trying to pimp.

Honestly, you just want to argue. I showed you what the Bible says. You can't believe the Bible or not. Show me Biblically where I am wrong or I am not gonna respond to your antagonism and your sarcasm.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Well, since there is no such place......

Is Jesus a liar?

 

[phrodeau]

Is Jesus a liar?

We covered that. Jesus said that nobody was good, even though Noah and Abram are described as perfect, and you maintain that Adam was perfect. Sounds like a liar to me.

 

[BobBalouski]

Honestly, you just want to argue. I showed you what the Bible says. You can't believe the Bible or not. Show me Biblically where I am wrong or I am not gonna respond to your antagonism and your sarcasm.

http://media.giphy.com/media/wIhfELB4LvDhe/giphy.gif

You're a fucking fraud, JoelJr.

 

[ishtat]

Billy Graham a cult leader? Now I have heard it all.

Took me a month but I did not forget! Tryharder: the history of Christianity is the history of cults. Look at this wiki list there are hundreds new ones every year.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations

In the modern era the Evangelical and Presbyterian protestants have been the most productive. They all develop the same way, some guy has a new way of looking at things, he establishes a new 'church' they grow a while, some get absorbed into others, most whither away.

Graham is a perfect cult because he had great charisma (he was a great salesman for JC) and undoubtably influenced a pile of people. But he had no new spiritual or theological insights. His sucessors will live on his work for mebbe a couple of generations but then he like all charismatics will recede to a footnote to history. Then there will be a new one - or two - or three.

Cults are what brings change, few survive, very few but new ones come along all the time.

The most interesting cult of all was the Ebionites. They were the heirs of James the brother of Jesus who led the earliest Christians in Jerusalem. They were essential to the development of Islam because it was from these Jewish Christians in Medina that Mohammed learned the concept of monotheism. He adopted their God and gave him an Arabic name, Allah.

 

[Tryharder62]

Took me a month but I did not forget!f

Graham is a perfect cult because he had great charisma (he was a great salesman for JC) and undoubtably influenced a pile of people. But he had no new spiritual or theological insights. His sucessors will live on his work for mebbe a couple of generations but then he like all charismatics will recede to a footnote to history. Then there will be a new one - or two - or three.

Well I hope all was OK this last month. Glad you are back!

Cults have a strong leader that most often demand their members give their allegiance to them (even to the point of rejecting family members). Billy Graham pointed the way to Christ. Your quote said "he had no new spiritual or theological insights." And then it said cults develop because "some guy has a new way of looking at things." Honestly, from the story I told above, I am not a Billy Graham authority. I have enjoyed learning about him since his passing.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

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