Religion and Government

[gotsnowgotslush]

The main differences between Catholics and Protestants (according to author Klaus Krämer 10.03.2017)

Here are the eight main differences:


1. Understanding of the Bible

Catholicism and Protestantism have distinct views on the meaning and the authority of the Bible. For Protestant Christians, Luther made clear that the Bible is the "Sola Skriptura," God's only book, in which He provided His revelations to the people and which allows them to enter in communion with Him.

Catholics, on the other hand, do not base their beliefs on the Bible alone. Along with the Holy Scripture, they are additionally bound by the traditions of the Roman Catholic Church.

2. Understanding the church

Catholics and Protestants have a different view on the nature of the church. The word "catholic" means "all-embracing," and the Catholic Church sees itself as the only true church worldwide, under the leadership of the pope.

In contrast, the Protestant Churches which have emerged from Reformation, also called "Evangelical," which means "according to the Gospel," do not make up one united Church. There are rather several tens of thousands of different denominations around the world. Officially, all of these many churches are considered equal.

3. The pope

Protestants are not open at all to papal primacy. According to the Evangelical view, this dogma contradicts statements in the Bible.
Catholics see in the pope the successor of the Apostle Peter, the first head of their Church, who was appointed by Jesus. The papal office is justified by an allegedly unbroken chain of consecrations, ranging from the first century to the present.

4. Understanding of the office

This continuous chain, known as the apostolic succession, is overall significant for different spiritual offices in the Catholic Church. With the Sacrament of Holy Orders, bishops, priests and deacons receive a lifelong seal of God giving them sacramental authority over Catholic laypeople. This consecration can only be given to men.
Protestants do not consecrate specific persons into office, but rather accept the principle that priesthood can be transferred to every believer - even to women.

5. Eucharist or Lord's Supper

The Catholics' views on the spiritual office are reflected in the Eucharist, or Holy Communion, a rite commemorating the Last Supper of Jesus with his disciples before his crucifixion. Once consecrated by a priest in the name of Jesus, bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ. Non-Catholics may not participate in Communion.

In the Protest Church, every baptized person is invited to share and is allowed to lead the Lord's Supper. This approach is not accepted by Catholics.
Additionally, Eucharist has a different meaning for Catholics and Protestants. The bread, known as the Host, embodies Jesus and can therefore be prayed to. For Protestants, the ritual only serves to commemorate Jesus' death and resurrection.

6. Sacraments

In the Roman Catholic Church, there are seven solemn rites, called sacraments: baptism, confirmation, the Eucharist, matrimony, penance, holy orders and extreme unction. The church believes these sacraments were instituted by Jesus and that they confer God's grace.

Most Protestant churches only practice two of these sacraments: baptism and the Eucharist (called Lord's Supper. They are perceived as symbolic rituals through which God delivers the Gospel. They are accepted through faith.

7. Marian dogmas and the worship of Saints

The Roman Catholic Church reveres Mary, the mother of Jesus, as "Queen of Heaven." However, there are few biblical references to support the Catholic Marian dogmas - which include the Immaculate Conception, her perpetual virginity and her Assumption into heaven. This is why they are rejected by Protestants.

The Catholic Church also practices the veneration of saints. Dead models of faith, recognized as "saint" by the church through canonization, can be prayed to for help in maintaining faith in God. There are over 4,000 saints. Their remains are considered holy relics which are venerated.

This veneration is also categorically by the Protestant Church as unbiblical. According to Reformation views, every person may and should pray directly to God.

8. Celibacy

All main world religions integrate in some way the concept of celibacy, the vow of abstaining from marriage and sexual relations, and the Catholic and Protestant churches are no exception. In the Catholic Church, celibacy is obligatory for priests. It is seen as a symbol of the undivided succession of Christ.

The Protestant Church rejects this obligation for priests. Martin Luther already demanded its abolition as early as 1520. He made a decisive personal contribution to this end in 1525: The former monk married the former nun Katharina von Bora. Initially unsure of whether he should marry, Luther finally determined that "his marriage would please his father, rile the pope, cause the angels to laugh, and the devils to weep."


http://www.dw.com/en/the-main-differences-between-catholics-and-protestants/a-37888597

 

[oggbashan]

Point 5 is more complex than that.

Catholics believe in transubstantiation during Mass - the Eucharist BECOMES the Blood and Body of Jesus. Protestants believe that it is a symbol of the Blood and Body of Jesus.

For Catholics the bread and wine once part of a mass have to be treated with extreme veneration and care; for Protestants the remains are just leftovers but some High Church pastors treat them as Catholics would.

 

[gotsnowgotslush]

Martin Luther, according to author Volker Wagener, 11.03.2017


Luther 2017 in Germany

In 1517 Martin Luther penned a document attacking the selling of indulgences. His 95 Theses were to spark the Reformation and the split with the Catholic Church. Germany is celebrating the 500th anniversary of this act.


http://www.dw.com/en/luther-2017-in-germany/a-36948230

Martin Luther

Celibacy and sexuality

Long before he married Katharina von Bora, Luther had a clear opinion about the sexuality of monks and nuns. He believed that celibacy demanded superhuman powers and that only a very few among thousands would be able to be abstain from sex, even with the help of God.

In short, sexuality and marriage were part of the divine order, in Luther's opinion. Although he was sexually abstinent as a young man, just before his wedding he spoke of the "hell of celibacy" that ruined Christians. Ever since, the image of the Protestant vicarage with children running around has been a symbol of Protestantism. It was the basis for the broadening of academic education and the pastor's children were the first beneficiaries. Even in the 16th century, it was said that pastors had many books and many children.

Anti-Judaism

Should a man who spoke and wrote so mercilessly about Jews be celebrated? In light of the Holocaust centuries later, the Protestant Church has a problem, especially in the anniversary year. Luther's polemic against the Jewish people reveals unbridled aggression combined with dreams of annihilation. Luther himself had little contact with Jews. His ideas about Jews and Muslims stemmed from the notion that Christian truth is absolute. His anti-Judaism, however, had nothing to do with the much later anti-Semitism of the Nazis. But the National Socialists made ample use of Luther's aggressive tirades. Only in the 1950s did the Protestant Church gradually distance itself from Luther's image of Jews. And what about today? His anti-Semitism would probably discredit him, the president of the German Protestant Church Congress, Christina Aus der Au, said in an interview with DW.

"He would probably not have been invited to the German Protestant Church Congress today."


http://www.dw.com/en/luther-is-famous-but-we-know-little-about-him/a-37907857

 

[phrodeau]

Jews sacrifice their livestock and produce. Christians sacrifice a human being.

Oh, but it's not really a human being. It's just a cracker and juice.

Oh, but it is the actual flesh and blood of Jesus Christ. Don't forget that.

Still, it's morally acceptable because we only pretend it's really flesh and blood.

It's real flesh and blood, though.

 

[gotsnowgotslush]

Oggbashan, the Huguenots certainly learned how insistent the ruling Catholics were about these points of religion.

(I happened upon this, and it served as a convenient starting point. I feel badly for Martin Luther.I read a book about his life. The book that I had read, do not make his anti- Jewish focus a sharp point. Not surprising, considering the the time span, and the pratices toward Jewish communities.)

There were many books written about the suppression, oppression, and ultimately the slaughter of members of religions that did not strictly conform to the Roman Catholic forms.


I wish I knew what Martin Luther's attitude was, concering Royal Blood and religion. Kings and Princes were faced with matters of the realm, which required bloodshed.This is where indulgences had a useful place.Let a ruler die in relative peace, despite being in a position where it requires him (or her) to murder.


I have pity for poor Henry VII. He had his hands full.

Religion goes hand in hand with politics, today, just as politics and religion were hand in hand, in ages past. America has found their own unique manner of twisting them together.

 

[Hard_Rom]

A politician up here who brings up religion is done! Say bye bye to your political career. You can talk family values but better not mention what church you attend. Usually find out their religion when they die and their funeral gets a mention in the news. Pretty sure Justin is Catholic but would have to check Wiki as he has never said.

 

[adrina]

I'm more of the Jeffersonian bent with the impenetrable wall between government and religious institutions. Unfortunately we don't have that.

Freedom of religion necessitates freedom from religion. We don't have that either.

I don't know if we ever have really. Not on the cultural level at least.

There aren't too many religious folks that like having their faith called an "Abrahamic cult". Regardless of how true it may be. And there are many many that if you even call their God an "it" develop the vapors.

I would like government based on things like pragmatism and science. Instead we get knee jerk reactionary emotion (which is hilarious considering how much of government is composed of men - as a woman, that has a particular bit of irony to be, shall we say, appreciated) and religious fervor.

At this rate, and with a nod to a bad ironic pun, we're going to hell in a hand basket with the way that religion, government, law and money have been intertwined.

 

[Hard_Rom]

Early Canada had a definite Catholic/Protestant divide what with the French in Lower Canada (Quebec). A successful politician had to be able to garner the French vote. Best way was to avoid any mention of religion. Best way to rile up either side. Quebec is still heavily Catholic and very traditional in many respects. Catholicism plays a big part of their national myth. They have over 9 million folk out of 35 million. Can't afford to rile up that large a percentage of the countries population.

So it has evolved into no mention of religion at all.

Ontario's catholic school system is publically funded. A hold over from early times when Canada was first the united provinces of Upper and Lower Canada.

 

[someoneyouknow]

In re: adrina's comments above:

Religion flourishes in greater purity, without than with the aid of Government - James Madison

And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in showing that religion and Government will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together. - James Madison

 

[adrina]

In re: adrina's comments above:

Religion flourishes in greater purity, without than with the aid of Government - James Madison

And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in showing that religion and Government will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together. - James Madison

To be honest I also think there is something at play with human overpopulation. Not just the competition for resources that makes the us vs them mentality flourish. But also the mob mentality. Get more people together and the more idiotic and basic they become.

 

[Comshaw]

To be honest I also think there is something at play with human overpopulation. Not just the competition for resources that makes the us vs them mentality flourish. But also the mob mentality. Get more people together and the more idiotic and basic they become.

http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/

World population clock....7.5 BILLION and climbing. ANYONE with a stupid ass religious dogma that demands no birth control needs to stop and consider when we will reach the maximum carrying capacity of this globe. Will your descendants be part of the survivors or part of the food chain? Soylent Green was a far fetched science fiction movie when it came out. How long before it's reality???? Religion is responsible for some of the dumbest, most damaging ideas ever propagated.




Comshaw

 

[adrina]

http://www.worldometers.info/world-population/

World population clock....7.5 BILLION and climbing. ANYONE with a stupid ass religious dogma that demands no birth control needs to stop and consider when we will reach the maximum carrying capacity of this globe. Will your descendants be part of the survivors or part of the food chain? Soylent Green was a far fetched science fiction movie when it came out. How long before it's reality???? Religion is responsible for some of the dumbest, most damaging ideas ever propagated.




Comshaw

Yup. Singing to the choir here. As far as I'm concerned birth control, abortions and voluntary sterilizations should be government funded. It's an investment into society and our planet.

 

[gotsnowgotslush]

Neci spoke up for her region of the country, in the United States, around the time of Emperor Caligula Carrot's coronation. I cannot quote her directly. The general gist was that her region was forgotten, neglected, ignored and abandoned.She has a point.

The cities receive the lion's share of funds, resources, and attention. It works the same way in Massachusetts.Boston is the forge, when everything is hammered into shape.The richer regions get what they pay for.The poorer regions get what the state can afford to give them.

The cities are concentrated centers, and there tends to be more order, because the cities can afford the networks that take care of trouble.

The population of Washington DC does not see much of their share of the money poured in Washington DC.It goes into pockets, wallets, and "funding."


The new kink is that Republicans exhibit naked self interest, and do not hide their selfishness when push comes to shove.

The extraorinarily rich get what they want, and the weasle runs off with a prize.

This link provides a good eyeful about what is real about Washington DC.


http://dcist.com

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Christian fundies CANNOT keep their stinkin' religion to themselves. They want a Christian state.

 

[gotsnowgotslush]

With all of the money and networks that the fundies provide for GOP candidates, you would think that they would buy a piece of Mexico and start their own country.

(*shudder* This did not work out very well in Guyana.



1978

"Jim Jones was best known as the cult leader of the Peoples Temple who led more than 900 followers in a mass suicide via cyanide-laced punch known as the Jonestown Massacre.")

We have a "Jim Jones" in the White House, thanks to the greed for control and power in the G.O.P.?

 

[5PointedStar]

In my opinion, religion and politics should be strictly separated. There's no need for church to interfere with state business.

 

[Chris_Michael]

You guys want to shit on religion until it's Islam. Makes sense.

 

[KingOrfeo]

Point 5 is more complex than that.

Catholics believe in transubstantiation during Mass - the Eucharist BECOMES the Blood and Body of Jesus. Protestants believe that it is a symbol of the Blood and Body of Jesus.

Depends on the church. I think Lutherans believe in transubstantiation, because Luther read the words "this is my body" literally.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Not true. I want all religions private and out of Gov't

You guys want to shit on religion until it's Islam. Makes sense.

 

[phrodeau]

You guys want to shit on religion until it's Islam. Makes sense.

Have you figured out yet that repealing the Johnson Amendment will lead to mosques becoming PAC's?