Help with Rejection for "Snuff" when I don't think there is any

kizkiz

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My first chapter is long clocking in at 15,356 words (~5 lit pages). No one dies or is physically hurt. Everyone consents (even if in the opening scene there is some initial reluctance).

I *think* I was rejected for how Laurel read the first page / opening scene.

I talk about "dropping a weight upon people", which I thought would be taken figuratively as a psychic/emotional heaviness or weight (ala mind control), but I *think* she took it as a literally dropping physical weights on people.

Anyway, I could really use a second or third set of eyes to tell me if I'm missing something right in front of my eyes.

I've read much worse in both fantasy/sci-fi and the mind control categories.

^m^ ___ ^m^

<i>Demon's punish the wicked;
Angel's protect the righteous.<i/>


"No," Gideon said, "You agreed to give me a kiss."

"Right, yeah, sure, but I'm not sucking your-"

Gideon smiled, stepped closer to Lucy, and raised a finger. He felt the weight of her promise inside of himself. A portion of that weight radiated outward from his finger. Lucy staggered and dropped to her knees. "The top definition for kiss on Google, and therefore the defacto definition of such an act in the eyes of humanity is as follows. A kiss as touch with the lips as a sign of love, sexual desire, reverence, or greeting."

Lucy's corn silk hair bobbed. Her eyes cast a furtive glance to either side, but there was no one around. The path where they were was empty in both direction. Kids rushing home from school were long gone, and the joggers had not yet arrived to take their place.

Gideon's dark eyes never left Lucy's baby blue's. He took another step forward; he placed that same long finger under her chin and tilted her head backwards. Her eyes were wide and terrified. More of the weight of her promise passed between them. Her shoulders slumped. He paused, not knowing why, and let the moment drag on between them. Lucy's pert lips made to open but never seemed able to muster up the courage.

"We aren't at school, Lucy." His voice was smooth as cream. "There are no football boys to interrupt us nor your clique of supposed friends to encircle you. It's just you and me." He removed his finger from under her chin, feeling that he had held it there as long as was required, although again not knowing why. As he did so, he felt the heaviness recede from Lucy. Her shoulder's and face lifted. A bit of her aura of superiority resurfaced.

"I don't care." She struggled to her feet, grabbing the ground and pushing until she was red faced and sweaty. She looked down at her hands caked in dirt; her bare knees stained green with chlorophyll. She tried to take a step backwards but instead crashed back to her hands and knees.

"You feel that don't you?"

She grunted. He liked that sound coming from her clenched lips. He wanted to hear it again.

"That's the weight of your promise. It was on my shoulders until I got you your A on the math mid-term." He paused, tapping his smooth upper lip. His lips twitched in a smile. "Until I let you copy my answers on the mid-term, and you didn't get caught."

She grunted, and his dick twitched in response. He was harder now than when he watched porn.

"That's quite a wicked thing, even more so since so many of our classmates look up to you as their role model."

He watched her struggle to speak. Her lips and jaw working to open an inch. Sweat matted her platinum bangs to her pale forehead. Red color blossomed along her cheeks and throat. Gideon's eyes wavered, drawn to watching the blush race down her chest. He could see the soft swell of her breasts with the first three buttons of her top open. He wanted to rip them from her shirt, liberate them from her bra, run his penis over their snow white expanses.

Lucy retook her feet but was bent over panting with her palms resting on her knees.

Gideon shook his head and searched for her eyes again.

Before he could find them, she got out, "A kiss on your lips as in-".

Gideon's eyes met hers. The words died on her tongue.

He raised his forefinger up again. "Ah yes, where was I until your cleavage interrupted me." Her eyes were a pure mountain stream blue. He wanted to swim in them. He wanted those eyes to wash over him, to worship his body as he did hers. "Ah, umm."

"In greeting," she spat out before sucking in a huge breath. "Can't. Can't. Breath."

He frowned. "Yes you look winded. More like a dog panting for breath." His lips twitched back into a smile. "Certainly greeting would be an option, but you see we already greeted each other didn't we. Just fifteen minutes ago. I walked up to you. You said 'Hey loser.' And slugged me in the arm. I blushed and stammered out a quick 'Hey'." All of that had happened. Fifteen minutes ago he'd been different. Fifteen minutes had been a different life, a different something. He couldn't finish the thought. It didn't matter.

"Yeah," Lucy said, more as a huff then an actual word.

"I imagine things felt much different fifteen minutes ago?"

She nodded. She was all red faced and sweaty like she'd just worked out or had the most amazing sex of her life. He wished it was the latter. His dick throbbed at the image.

"So greeting is out," he had four fingers up now and ticked one off. "Tell me Lucy, do you love me?"

Her eyes widened, and she managed to stand upright. "Hell no." Her voice was firm and cold.

"Ouch." Gideon's lips twitched, "But I never deluded myself into thinking you did." He ticked off a second finger. "So your choices are reverence or sexual desire." Now he let the full weight of her promise descend upon her. She plunged to her knees, hands ramming into the grass, head slumped, hair raining down upon the ground. "Do you honor and respect me? Do you wish to show me that?"

"No."

Gideon ticked off the third finger. "That leaves us with?"
 
Submitted to "Fantasy/Sci-Fi" as its about Angels and Demons and magic in a modern setting.
This was the specific rejection message:


However, we've found that we cannot post your submission in its current form. The checklist below may help you in re-examining your manuscript.

Is there excessive degradation, violence, snuff, or abuse of characters in your submission? If it is submitted as a Horror story, is it more snuff than actual horror?
 
I talk about "dropping a weight upon people", which I thought would be taken figuratively as a psychic/emotional heaviness or weight (ala mind control), but I *think* she took it as a literally dropping physical weights on people.

Just put "dropping an EMOTIONAL weight upon people," or something like that.

Then in the notes, point out the clarification.
 
I never write snuff yet Laurel finds it every time, tho it doesn't exist. What she really means is THE SCENE TRIGGERED HER ICK SWITCH. Bottom line, DONT BE GRAPHIC.
 
Emotional weight doesn't crush people to the ground. Something physical is happening to what's-her-name, and he's getting aroused by it. The excerpt stops with her still alive so there is no snuff (yet), but if that's how it continues then I agree with Laurel.

If he weren't getting aroused by what was happening then maybe it wouldn't trigger Laurel's response. Even without that, I would still walk away from your story.
 
Well it's magical/mind control so "psychic" "emotional" whatever words you want to use. It's just fueled as a function of the "weight" of either the sins or the promise given. Really it isn't that far from a "paralyze" spell from D&D as intended.

It doesn't continue that much further along those lines. No one dies or has any physical injuries during the course of the entire 16k words.

I've read a ton of stories on this site where people "wrestle" to the ground, and one participant is initially reticent or uncertain and ends up quite into it. So I thought it'd come across in that vein, but it doesn't seem like it has. This is probably a result of me being too close to my work.

Thanks for the advice and feedback. I re-edited the whole story to remove any indication he might enjoy any physical or emotional discomfort felt while she is reluctant.

I also snagged a VE, so they should help give me some more feedback as well.

It's entirely possible this scene doesn't work, but at least now I understand where Laurel was probably come from, which is what I was looking for. Thanks for all your help.
 
Submitted to "Fantasy/Sci-Fi" as its about Angels and Demons and magic in a modern setting.
This was the specific rejection message:


However, we've found that we cannot post your submission in its current form. The checklist below may help you in re-examining your manuscript.

Is there excessive degradation, violence, snuff, or abuse of characters in your submission? If it is submitted as a Horror story, is it more snuff than actual horror?

From the segment you posted I would say that looking for snuff is barking up the wrong tree. The keyword here is degradation. This, of course, is a relative term. Many stories deal with the degradation of both women and men, just look in BDSM, Non-Consent and loving wives.

Without more information from Laurel it is difficult to know what to advise. Some might see forcing the girl to grovel in the dirt as degrading. The same people might think that forcing her to give him a blowjob in front of all her friends, was erotic.
 
Thanks DYK and everyone else.

How does one go about getting specifics? Is PM to Laurel the best method?
 
What seems to trigger Laurel's red flag on this sort of scene is coming from the dominant character's POV. I've written a lot of scenes with similar levels of sexual degradation in Sci-Fi & Fantasy, but they've always been from the submissive character's POV, and they went through without a hitch.

It's also likely that the submissive getting free and the dominant getting comeuppance in the end has something to do with it as well.
 
I never write snuff yet Laurel finds it every time, tho it doesn't exist. What she really means is THE SCENE TRIGGERED HER ICK SWITCH. Bottom line, DONT BE GRAPHIC.

Weird. I've written scenes where I filled a dude's chest with surgical needles and half of my chapters are full of brutal, graphic bloodsucking. I even killed a bunch of people and beheaded a dude during sex in a single chapter. I've never gotten flagged. What do you mean by "ick switch"?
 
Weird. I've written scenes where I filled a dude's chest with surgical needles and half of my chapters are full of brutal, graphic bloodsucking. I even killed a bunch of people and beheaded a dude during sex in a single chapter. I've never gotten flagged. What do you mean by "ick switch"?

Yuck. Now I really don't care.
 
Yuck. Now I really don't care.

Apparently you care enough to track down all of my forum posts and respond to them. Not even I'm that obsessed over something.

Is this... A crush?

I'm inspired. I'll take the challenge and write the story immediately.
 
Well, no. I was reading in on the forum anyway. I just hadn't put you on ignore yet.

Babye.
 
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