Punk Rock: how much of it really was truly "Punk rock?"

Saiyaman

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You know I sometimes wonder how many of the original Punk Rock bands were really "Punk Rock" because there were a lot of rules put up on what is Punk Rock and what isn't and those original Punk Rock bands didn't always heed to those rules themselves.
So what are those rules about what is and what is not Punk Rock?

1. Lyric-wise Punk Rock should be about singing it like you lived it, songs about being angry with authoritative figures, boredom, being unemployed, being broke, being angry with the girlfriend. Ain't nothing but the truth, your honor, so help me god.

2. Punk Rock as music should be fast and loud, played by people who could barely play their instruments, the less proficient you were at playing your instrument the better.

3. Punk Rock should be played on cheap shitty instruments, you're on the dole, you simply can't afford better that's the cold truth here.

4. Punk is all about being the real deal, fakers will be found out right away.

5. Punk Rock bands will never help each other out, it's a dog-eat-dog world and a warzone at a punk rock concert.

6. Punk is all about rejecting what came before, Rock Dinosaurs were going to be extinct for a good reason.

So having mentioned all those rules, let's see which ones were followed to the letter and which ones were not by the original Punk Rock bands.

1. Lyric-wise Punk Rock should be about singing it like you lived it, songs about being angry with authoritative figures, boredom, being unemployed, being broke, being angry with the girlfriend. Ain't nothing but the truth, your honor, so help me god.
Very few Punk Rock bands actually sang it like they lived it. The Sex Pistols for example were art students, The Clash' Joe Strummer had his life in order, in fact the only Punk Rock song I can think off from the top of my head which told it like they lived it was "Boredom" by the Buzzcocks.

2. Punk Rock as music should be fast and loud, played by people who could barely play their instruments, the less proficient you were at playing your instrument the better.
Fast and loud was a rule that all Punk Rock bands gladly complied to. But Proficiency on their instrument was more important than they proclaimed it was. Listen to "Nevermind the bollocks" and hear how tight and well rehearsed Steve Jones and Paul Cook were. Or listen to "London Calling" and hear how the Clash were evolving musically with Paul Simonon and Mick Jones having mastered their instruments and bringing in self written songs.
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/e7/b4/34/e7b434ed23f5274610a866dcda660d58.jpg
And what about Nina Hagen, the princess of Punk Rock had a classical training as an Opera singer and her band consisted of seasoned professionals, also listen to a song like "Natur träne" and hear how intricate the music on that song was and that it is slow, dragging and intense. John Lydon (That's Johnny Rotten, mate) said that Punk Rock as the Pistols were playing it was in his opinion "Too Conventional" he envisioned Punk Rock to be dissonant, harsh, unlistenable. He manifested his true vision with PiL which again had very good musicians in their ranks.


3. Punk Rock should be played on cheap shitty instruments, you're on the dole, you simply can't afford better that's the cold truth here.

Steve Shelley of the Buzzcocks' best known instrument was a crappy Japanese made guitar with the top half broken off.
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/64/6f/10/646f10b6b7484f83a3b8a755f132efe1.jpg
But as soon as he could afford to buy himself a better guitar he did just that. Ditching that cracked guitar for a Gibson Marauder. It was the same with the other Punk Rock bands, Mick Jones of the Clash and Steve Jones (No relation) of the Sex Pistols both favored Gibson Les Paul Customs and even back then that was an expensive and fancy guitar, top of the range of Gibson electrics. Punk bass players favored the Rickenbacker 4001 Bass for its biting, rattling "Clank" sound and the Fender Precision bass for its deep "Punch" (Think J.J. Burnell on The Strangles' "No More Heroes") both those basses being proven workhorses and certainly not cheap. And look at the backlines: Fender and Marshall stacks, you couldn't buy those if you were on the dole...


4. Punk is all about being the real deal, fakers will be found out right away.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_400/MI0000/740/MI0000740362.jpg?partner=allrovi.com
Ask Plastic Bertrand what it was like being a fake punk. NOBODY took him seriously Certainly not when it came out that he never even sang on his songs. "Ca plan pour moi merde" But "White Punks on dope" by the Tubes was accepted as a punk rock anthem while the song itself was meant to be a spoof on Glam Rock, making fun of bands like T-Rex and Alice Cooper.

5. Punk Rock bands will never help each other out, it's a dog-eat-dog world and a warzone at a punk rock concert..
Just with any grassroots movement, where word of mouth is the way to spread the word around on where Punk Rock bands were playing, the bands would tell other bands what a good venue was, who they should check out and they would often lend backlines to the other bands, so they didn't need to sound check in between performances, it s a Dog-eat-dog world united they stood tall.


6. Punk is all about rejecting what came before, Rock Dinosaurs were going to be extinct for a good reason.

Pete Townshend once ran into John Lydon and Paul Cook and being totally into what Punk Rock was about apologized to them about having become a Rock Dinosaur. At which Lydon went "No, not at all, we really love the 'Oo." a Point proven by the fact that the Sex Pistols played "Substitute" live. Also old rockers such as "Summertime Blues" and "Come on everybody" by Eddie Cochran were firm live favorite shows that Punk not only accepted where the roots came from but also sang their praises. And I haven't even mentioned Sid Vicious' version of "My way..."

So was Punk Rock really all that it claimed it was?

The interesting part of the story was that the Post-punk era was much closer to what Punk Rock was setting itself up to be. I already mentioned Public Image Limited, but New wave bands like The Cure and Joy Division but also ska bands like The Specials adopted the "sing it like you live it" mantra."Message to you Rudy" and "Ghost Town" by the Specials accurately showed the bleak late seventies Britain.

In the USA, Hardcore bands took the mantra of no proficiency needed at playing your instrument to heart, bands like Fear, Big Black, The Germs and Shellac had no experience and didn't even bother to tune their guitars.

Again in Hardcore and new wave crappy instruments were used, Japanese made copy guitars bought in pawnshops were firm favorites because of them being affordable. Robert Smith of the Cure recorded "Three Imaginary boys" on a crappy plywood Woolworths top twenty guitar and didn't switch to playing Fender jazzmasters until the producer pushed a wad of cash in his hands and begged him to buy a better guitar. Pat Smear during the entire time that The Germs existed didn't even OWN a guitar, always relying on loaners to play shows. In true punk rock style, when Smear joined Nirvana, he sold his guitars to afford the plane ticket to Seattle, at which Kurt Cobain told him "Don't worry, we have a deal with Fender, I'll hook you up." and a few days after Joining Smear was given three brand new Fender guitars that he continues playing to this day.
http://www.alternativenation.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/patsmearguitar.jpg

But being completely disillusioned by what Punk Rock became in very little time, it became a fashion, corporate firms began to run with it, the whole "Voice of the angry young man" was taken out, Malcolm McLaren brought out "the Rock N Roll" swindle" movie, And letś not forget that THE punk rock club CBGBś is now a clothing store and a restaurant in JFK airport.

John Lydon made a statement at the Final Sex Pistols show which sums it all up...

"Ever get the feeling you've been cheated?"
 
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Most of the noted U.K. stuff was inflated pop.

It was uglier in the colonies.

Black Flag. Fear. Germs.

Of course, we had our poseurs too. I see you there X.
 
Most of the noted U.K. stuff was inflated pop.

It was uglier in the colonies.

Black Flag. Fear. Germs.

Of course, we had our poseurs too. I see you there X.

Well I named the Hardcore scene as being much more true to what Punk Rock stood for.

"RISE ABOVE WE'RE GONNA RISE ABOVE!"
 
West coaster here.

I attended those shows. It was always entertaining to see some punk get knocked senseless... Get dragged back by his buddies... Smoke a joint.... Then wade back in.
 
Dude, Nirvana is not punk!

Black Flag, DK, Gang Green, Circle Jerks....Nirvana? Hell No!

I never said that they were punk, I named them because of Pat Smear who was in the Germs and the way he joined Nirvana was a pretty punk rock move: By selling his guitars to even afford the plane ticket.

Also, grunge owed a lot to Punk and Hardcore. It was through Nirvana that I discovered Black Flag and Shellac.
 
I never said that they were punk, I named them because of Pat Smear who was in the Germs and the way he joined Nirvana was a pretty punk rock move: By selling his guitars to even afford the plane ticket.

Also, grunge owed a lot to Punk and Hardcore. It was through Nirvana that I discovered Black Flag and Shellac.

To me Punk had angst, grunge had a lot of whiny woe is us crap.
 
To me Punk had angst, grunge had a lot of whiny woe is us crap.

True! Punk was basically anti everything. Grunge was hair metal gone awry, if hair metal could have gone anymore awry. Plaid shirts replaced spandex and everyone was suicidal. I was glad that grind core and heavier shit came on the scene to fill the void left by the British metal bands. Let's face it, most LA acts were carbon copies of each other each becoming weaker as time wore on.
 
Decline was the best documentary of early American hardcore, but even Decline featured a couple of iffy bands.
 
I never said that they were punk, I named them because of Pat Smear who was in the Germs and the way he joined Nirvana was a pretty punk rock move: By selling his guitars to even afford the plane ticket.

Also, grunge owed a lot to Punk and Hardcore. It was through Nirvana that I discovered Black Flag and Shellac.

My bad! Misunderstood what you meant.

Punk influenced a lot of different kinds of music. Especially if you include all the sub genres- goth punk, bubblegum punk (shudder).
 
True! Punk was basically anti everything. Grunge was hair metal gone awry, if hair metal could have gone anymore awry. Plaid shirts replaced spandex and everyone was suicidal.

Errr. you have to explain that one to me. Grunge came up and became big when people were getting sick of hair metal bands singing about how big their dicks were and how many women they fucked.

And you claim that Grunge was a continuation of that?

That doesn't make sense at all.

I said it before, the rise of "Alternative Rock" and the notion of "Nirvana sweeped everybody away" wasn't as sudden as the media says it was. "Appetite for destruction" was the first million selling album which showed the shift from "Let's party" to "Party is over" Because although GnR is affiliated with hair metal their songs were about Alcoholism (Nighttrain), Heroin abuse (Mister Brownstone), Abusive relationships (Sweet Child of mine, You're crazy and Rocket Queen) and poverty ( Paradise city and Welcome to the jungle)

You only need to look at the album charts in the years 1988 to 1991 to see more and more albums emerging that abandoned that slick production, Synths, "Bad quack" guitar sound and cannon shot drums.

And not just in Punk, Rock and Metal, the Pop charts also began to show the shift.

"Document" was the album that broke REM big and it came out in the same year that Whitney Houston had her heyday with "I wanna dance with somebody"

And let's not forget the Red Hot Chili Peppers, Much like REM the RHCP had been around since the early eighties but their raw sound wasn't a seller, add to the fact that they were too "Funk" for the rock audience and too "Rock" for the funk audience meant that they struggled for several years until "Mother's Milk" finally made them big. The shift in the musical landscape caused largely by GNR paved the way for them.

Further albums like Metallica's "And justice for all" (want to talk abrasive production: that album hardly had any bass on it while eighties production the DX-7 was known for its BASS) and Pantera's "Cowboys from hell" did the same to the Hair metal as REM and the Red Hot Chili Peppers were doing for pop.

It might have been Axl Rose who started digging the grave but it was Kurt Cobain who put on the grave stone for hair metal and slick eighties pop productions. With people like Micheal Stipe, Anthony Kiedis and James Hetfield carrying the casket.
 
Q: Why punque roqueur cross road?
A: Was stapled to chicken.



Meanwhile, how about Max Headroom?
 
The only one of the first (or second) wave of Punk bands that still has anything interesting to say is Social Distortion.

All hail Mike Ness, for we are not worthy.
 
Creed was the worst band ever, a Pearl Jam sound alike who did nothing but whine. I remember an interview with the lead singer whose biggest complaint was his parents only bought him a used car to drive around college.

Grunge was whiny music from a generation with nothing to whine about:rolleyes:
 
Creed was the worst band ever, a Pearl Jam sound alike who did nothing but whine. I remember an interview with the lead singer whose biggest complaint was his parents only bought him a used car to drive around college.

Grunge was whiny music from a generation with nothing to whine about:rolleyes:

Creed is no Grunge band, they were Nu-metal.

Also Grunge came around during the late Reagan years with bands like the Pixies and Husker Du, look at what kind of climate they were living in: everything socially was based on sports and academics and if you didn't have either, bad luck on you you were born a loser anyway.

When Creed came around the political climate had changed considerably.
 
I only saw DOA the one time. They opened a show that featured the Minutemen and Black Flag.

Its been awhile, but I think it was at something called the Ukrainian Social Services Center, which was a dismal mausoleum of a hall.

There's a Ukranian Hall in Vancouver.
 
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