Civil War

[Ishmael]

I brought up the notion of the occurrence of the US devolving into a true Civil War some years ago. I was panned on the subject then, as I will be now. But one would be foolish to discount the possibility.

Now, some years later, the odds in favor of that possibility has increased. I don't think that the 'Coastal Crowd' is fully aware of the discontent fomenting in the rest of the nation. How deep and growing the irritation is growing over the top down 'Command and Control' mentality accelerating out of DC is becoming. A mentality that is being practiced by BOTH parties.

There are a great many people, both left and right, that proclaim that the military will never allow that to happen. They presume that the military will actively participate on the side of the government. History has shown that to be an iffy proposition at best. They fail to take into consideration that the military has other options. Options that range from taking the side of the Rebels ( a military coup), sitting it out entirely, or splitting themselves into opposing groups. All of those alternative options are on the table.

Firearms and ammunition are flying out of the stores at record rates. So is powder, primers, and bullets/shot (items that are NOT tracked). The press attributes this to the notion that people are afraid of the government outlawing firearms. While in some cases that is true, that does not account for what is taking place in the ammunition and components marketplace. Something much deeper and broader is occurring. The operative notion is that the press is accidentally hitting the truth of is the fear of government. And quite frankly the government, especially officials of certain convictions, are fearful of the citizenry. And those mutually held fears of one another are a prescription for disaster.

"May you live in interesting times."

Ishmael

 

[Adre]

You think this is new?

 

[OjosMojo]

If war does arise between these former united States, there will be absolutely nothing civil about it.

The last War Between the States ushered in the current air of progressivism which has completely subjected all today to the mercy of the federal government.

The next War will either finally cement that collective trend or it will rip apart the nation into parts which will never be put back together again.

America is gone, the USSA lives. What comes next will be what the world has never seen before on these shores.

But, make no mistake: it is indeed coming.

 

[Ishmael]

If war does arise between these former united States, there will be absolutely nothing civil about it.

The last War Between the States ushered in the current air of progressivism which has completely subjected all today to the mercy of the federal government.

The next War will either finally cement that collective trend or it will rip apart the nation into parts which will never be put back together again.

America is gone, the USSA lives. What comes next will be what the world has never seen before on these shores.

But, make no mistake: it is indeed coming.

Have to agree with that with the exception that sundering is the only option. There are other alternatives.

Ishmael

 

[Hard_Rom]

Not going to happen. The moneyed interests will put a stop to it, if it looks like corporate profits will suffer. Plus those who hate the US enough to tear it apart with their hate and racist attitudes are such a tiny (yet vocal) minority that a concerted effort by the government will have them rounded up and taken care of in very short time.

Maybe a short period of local anarchy brought about by homegrown terrorists but another civil war not likely. I would like to think the US has matured somewhat since the 60s. 1860s that is.

Look at how many racist pieces of shit have been executed or sent away for life trying to start a race war. There are a few Charlie Manson wannabees around but not near enough to start a real war except against themselves. Look at the outrage against the Oklahoma bombers. They got whacked by the gov in record time.

America is not a banana republic with army officers having a vested interest in gaining power. The armed forces will defend the constitution.

 

[phrodeau]

Yep, that's completely true. America is a crappy country, and has been for some time.

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Yep, that's completely true. America is a crappy country, and has been for some time.

We're doomed, I fear.

And I fear...we're doomed.






did I mention that we're doomed? And that I fear we are?

Make no mistake. It's coming. And we're doomed.

Yup.

 

[Disgustipated]

I brought up the notion of the occurrence of the US devolving into a true Civil War some years ago. I was panned on the subject then, as I will be now. But one would be foolish to discount the possibility.

Ishmael

LMAO.

Dude, you are a mouth breathing contradiction.

Was it you who was foolish many years ago when you brought up such a ridiculous notion or are we foolish now for laughing at you again?

 

[1sickbastard]

How would the population fracture? Which groups would support which side? What would be the goals of the various factions? What would be the geographic distribution of the various factions? Are any of these various factions receiving extra-national support? If so, what are the motivations and strategic goal of said support?

See, there's a difference between a generalized dissatisfaction among the population, which can lead to a general breakdown in loyalty, and the perceived issue(s) which polarize society to the point of widespread sectarian violence.

And all this has to be underpinned by the central authority being unable or unwilling to not only quell sectarianism, but being unable to support the necessary civil and economic infrastructure on which society as a whole depends.

I think your scenario, as you've described it, would more likely resemble the collapse of the Western Roman Empire than the US Civil Was or the English War of the Roses.

 

[Ishmael]

Not going to happen. The moneyed interests will put a stop to it, if it looks like corporate profits will suffer. Plus those who hate the US enough to tear it apart with their hate and racist attitudes are such a tiny (yet vocal) minority that a concerted effort by the government will have them rounded up and taken care of in very short time.

Maybe a short period of local anarchy brought about by homegrown terrorists but another civil war not likely. I would like to think the US has matured somewhat since the 60s. 1860s that is.

Look at how many racist pieces of shit have been executed or sent away for life trying to start a race war. There are a few Charlie Manson wannabees around but not near enough to start a real war except against themselves. Look at the outrage against the Oklahoma bombers. They got whacked by the gov in record time.

America is not a banana republic with army officers having a vested interest in gaining power. The armed forces will defend the constitution.

This is where you've lost me. The frustrated are male, female, black, white, Asian, Latino, AmerIndian, rich and poor. They're from all walks of life and all backgrounds. Yeah, some fringe groups will join in, they always do. But their agenda isn't going to be the driving force and it's unlikely that they'll survive the aftermath.

You assume far too much.

Ishmael

 

[OjosMojo]

Have to agree with that with the exception that sundering is the only option. There are other alternatives.

Ishmael

Bullcrap.

The foundational political principles this War will evolve from are uncompromisable.

Reality cannot stand one side of a delusional mouth professing inalienable rights, while the other side proclaims man is the deemer of rights.

Reality cannot stand one who purports to champion every individual's natural right to life (let alone liberty and the pursuit of happiness), who also allows for any individual's natural right to life to be intentionally killed simply for convenient choice.

That uncompromisable list, of course, goes on.

The time for détente compromisers like you and your kin has passed. You - like the progressive-lite Republican Party you once enjoined - will be the first to succumb (which is exactly what's politically happening today); your plainer progressive cousins will then be dealt with - we rid ourselves of the traitors among us first.

Your only hope, old man - as it is for all of us - is to get right with who you fantasize yourself greater than before your time is up.

Your secular tea leafs can only hint at the dark days ahead.

I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever.

Thomas Jefferson

 

[Disgustipated]

This is where you've lost me. The frustrated are male, female, black, white, Asian, Latino, AmerIndian, rich and poor. They're from all walks of life and all backgrounds. Yeah, some fringe groups will join in, they always do. But their agenda isn't going to be the driving force and it's unlikely that they'll survive the aftermath.

You assume far too much.

Ishmael

This is getting even better.

You're an out-of-touch old white man living in past on a dust farm who readily claims he knows nothing about pop culture (which, ya know, is actually regular culture). What the fuck do you know how frustrated a rich black women feels besides not a gotdamn thing?

 

[Bert Notorius]

city people don't have a clue. they just want their foo foo coffee. as far as they know, food comes from the grocery store.

 

[Bert Notorius]

This is getting even better.

You're an out-of-touch old white man living in past on a dust farm who readily claims he knows nothing about pop culture (which, ya know, is actually regular culture). What the fuck do you know how frustrated a rich black women feels besides not a gotdamn thing?

pop culture. ha. i knew it all when i was your age too.

 

[Disgustipated]

city people don't have a clue. they just want their foo foo coffee. as far as they know, food comes from the grocery store.

No. It comes from Obama who gets it from the Chinese who he outsources the jobs to.

 

[Disgustipated]

pop culture. ha. i knew it all when i was your age too.

I'm not talking about those newfangled cars you finally don't have to crank, tubby.

 

[Ishmael]

pop culture. ha. i knew it all when i was your age too.

*chuckle*

"I'm in with the in crowd." Which is to say, "I suck up to my peer group."

Ishmael

 

[snugglestruggle]

When you read about a Raimen noodle shortage you know the time is short.

 

[Bert Notorius]

No. It comes from Obama who gets it from the Chinese who he outsources the jobs to.

clinton already gave the farm to the chinese.

 

[Bert Notorius]

I'm not talking about those newfangled cars you finally don't have to crank, tubby.

tuned up the truck sunday. that's: distributor cap, rotor, plugs and wires for those of you in rio linda.

280,000+ miles.

what do you know how to do?

 

[Hard_Rom]

Been thinking about this.

It won't happen because the vast, huge, overwhelming majority of Americans are good, hard working, peaceful and decent folk. The vast quantities of money they donate to third world charities proves that.

When American evangelical Christians stop going to Africa doing missionary work, I will start to worry.

Sometimes I swing my tarring brush around too vigorously and get splatter over others. Sorry.

 

[Hard_Rom]

city people don't have a clue. they just want their foo foo coffee. as far as they know, food comes from the grocery store.

They are also such a huge majority that unless it actually impacts food production negatively, they will get their way.

Some can say country folk are isolated from what is really going on. Maybe to busy scrambling to earn a living off the land but still not really up on some things.

 

[badbabysitter]

The only growing discontent is from old white guys who have been left in the past...


No one's rights are being curtailed, no secret police kidnapping people in the dead of night, no massive censoring of public opinion, no taxation without representation, no religous prosecution


The only time I hear rhetoric about revolt these days it comes from the uneducated right and the geriatric right... neither of which have any gumption, skills or courage to do anything but bitch about minorities , women, muslims, mexicans and homosexuals

 

[snugglestruggle]

They are also such a huge majority that unless it actually impacts food production negatively, they will get their way.

Some can say country folk are isolated from what is really going on. Maybe to busy scrambling to earn a living off the land but still not really up on some things.

The country folk or woods wise crowd will the ones surviving. City folk will turn on each other for a Ritz cracker as soon as the gubberment cant deliver them food or electricity for their vidia games

 

[Ishmael]

The only growing discontent is from old white guys who have been left in the past...


No one's rights are being curtailed, no secret police kidnapping people in the dead of night, no massive censoring of public opinion, no taxation without representation, no religous prosecution


The only time I hear rhetoric about revolt these days it comes from the uneducated right and the geriatric right... neither of which have any gumption, skills or courage to do anything but bitch about minorities , women, muslims, mexicans and homosexuals

That opening statement alone indicates you don't know shit. You consistently interject your own peer groups beliefs and opinions into the tableau that is America. One of my pistol pupils is a 21 year old Latina. She's 'arming up' too. You're buying into the premise that the press is trying to foment.

It just isn't true.

Ishmael