question about voting blocks.. real? imagined? I'm just asking..

[TxRad]

Laurel, that quote from wasn't from me but from Zeb.

 

[TxRad]

So just how would one go about building one of these "voting blocks" and how would they work?... Numerically speaking of course.

Get about 14 or 15 like minded people together and then nudge the stories you want lower by voting a few 2's or 3's ever so often. With the 5 point scoring system, it doesn't take much. It doesn't even take the whole group, just a few would do it.

 

[sr71plt]

Be very active in this as soon as stories are posted, because readers are influenced by the ratings and comments of those before them. You can get a big bang for your buck by hitting as soon as they leave the gate.

 

[oggbashan]

Be very active in this as soon as stories are posted, because readers are influenced by the ratings and comments of those before them. You can get a big bang for your buck by hitting as soon as they leave the gate.

I don't know about other authors, but I get most of the votes on my latest story when it is on the New list, even if it is a contest entry.

The voting and commenting reduces very quickly once the story drops off the first couple of pages of 'New'.

 

[FantasyXY]

Get about 14 or 15 like minded people together and then nudge the stories you want lower by voting a few 2's or 3's ever so often. With the 5 point scoring system, it doesn't take much. It doesn't even take the whole group, just a few would do it.

So you're saying that these people PM each other and say let's get so and so with a bunch of ones?

Let's say there were five people in a block willing to attack a writer. Then let's assume the writer's story had 300 votes and a score of 4.5. This five person voting block, each casting a single 1 vote, could change the score by a little over .050 points... which just isn't that much. (I know we have seen numerous threads with this topic covered in great detail)

In my mind it would be hard to get that many people together to do something like this very often. However, if a single person had several accounts they could bomb the hell out of a story. Sweeps of course would be able to tag the apparent "group of users" as coming from a single IP address and all of the votes from this user removed.

Of course if a story isn't getting many reads or votes a single pissed off fellow author's one vote can have a much larger effect and appear to be coming from a large group when compared to stories that get murmurous reads and votes.

So I'm not saying voting blocks couldn't exist. I'm just thinking with the sheer numbers needed to really sway a story, they would be very hard to manage without constant member fall out and subsequent exposure on the forum.

 

[sr71plt]

Ah, you think it's just one vote per real person here. That's where your calculations start going off the rails.

But why worry about it at all? If you don't believe in voting blocks, then don't.

 

[lovecraft68]

Be very active in this as soon as stories are posted, because readers are influenced by the ratings and comments of those before them. You can get a big bang for your buck by hitting as soon as they leave the gate.

Also do it very quickly. An H shows up at 10 votes and that little red symbol Will draw readers.

So if you tell your friends your story will be live the next morning they can all five it right away.

 

[lovecraft68]

Ah, you think it's just one vote per real person here. That's where your calculations start going off the rails.

But why worry about it at all? If you don't believe in voting blocks, then don't.

Anyone can vote twice. Once anon once by user handle

So a block of even 10 can dump 20 votes on a story good and bad. That does not include multiple user handles and ip changing or masking tricks.

 

[oggbashan]

Also do it very quickly. An H shows up at 10 votes and that little red symbol Will draw readers.

So if you tell your friends your story will be live the next morning they can all five it right away.

Many stories reach the 10 vote total with a perfect 5.00. Then reality occurs.

 

[lovecraft68]

Many stories reach the 10 vote total with a perfect 5.00. Then reality occurs.

Unless its in LW

 

[Rozalin_0123]

Anyone can vote twice. Once anon once by user handle

So a block of even 10 can dump 20 votes on a story good and bad. That does not include multiple user handles and ip changing or masking tricks.

You do realize how easily noticeable this would be, right? Especially when you're talking about the same group of people doing this multiple times?

It doesn't matter how many alts you make or what computers or devices you use in your house. The IP addresses of each device might vary slightly, usually the forth number in the address (example: 11.22.333.444 vs 11.22.333.445) but the information returned when tracking an IP address all return the same general location, and by general, I mean zip code. This "area" sometimes isn't even where your house is located, but rather where your ISP is located. Your actual address cannot be accessed unless there is suspect illegal activity at which point the authories would STILL have to contact your ISP to get that information.

Essentially, to accomplish what you're saying, 10 people would have to each have two seperate ISPs and each of those ISPs would have to be noticably far away from each other. But then, a pattern would develope of the same IP addresses showing up together after the first time.

 

[FantasyXY]

You do realize how easily noticeable this would be, right? Especially when you're talking about the same group of people doing this multiple times?

It doesn't matter how many alts you make or what computers or devices you use in your house. The IP addresses of each device might vary slightly, usually the forth number in the address (example: 11.22.333.444 vs 11.22.333.445) but the information returned when tracking an IP address all return the same general location, and by general, I mean zip code. This "area" sometimes isn't even where your house is located, but rather where your ISP is located. Your actual address cannot be accessed unless there is suspect illegal activity at which point the authories would STILL have to contact your ISP to get that information.

Essentially, to accomplish what you're saying, 10 people would have to each have two seperate ISPs and each of those ISPs would have to be noticably far away from each other. But then, a pattern would develope of the same IP addresses showing up together after the first time.

^^^^^^
Nailed it!

What's even more... Why not gather a group together and "5 rocket" a story (I would assume that "5 rocketing" is the opposite of "1 bombing").

Wouldn't that at least counteract the group 1 bombs? Hell, maybe all that is going on here too.

Oh, wait. That would get caught up in the sweeps too.

 

[TxRad]

You do realize how easily noticeable this would be, right? Especially when you're talking about the same group of people doing this multiple times?

It doesn't matter how many alts you make or what computers or devices you use in your house. The IP addresses of each device might vary slightly, usually the forth number in the address (example: 11.22.333.444 vs 11.22.333.445) but the information returned when tracking an IP address all return the same general location, and by general, I mean zip code. This "area" sometimes isn't even where your house is located, but rather where your ISP is located. Your actual address cannot be accessed unless there is suspect illegal activity at which point the authories would STILL have to contact your ISP to get that information.

Essentially, to accomplish what you're saying, 10 people would have to each have two seperate ISPs and each of those ISPs would have to be noticably far away from each other. But then, a pattern would develope of the same IP addresses showing up together after the first time.

...TMI...

 

[lovecraft68]

Or the ten people could be in 10 states and vote from home and then from work. ISP's work if the people using them are honest. After that, all bets are off. Now you have at least a 40 vote group.

FantasyXY

They don't use 1's which are swept by general rule. Ok figure that same story with 300 votes and a score of say 4.8 for a contest. Now drop a half dozen 2's for instance on it and see where the story ends up. Or even 2 2's.

Exactly. How scouries was so easily ousted was he was one person from one place(The UK despite his claims) so when people started looking into it, it showed up pretty easy

But-and I mentioned this prior in this thread if you have a group of friends or family around the country it will not be noticeable, especially if as TX mentioned above they give two's or three's...hey three stands for liked it keep writing, its not a bad vote, but it will tank a contest contender pretty easily.

 

[Rozalin_0123]

Or the ten people could be in 10 states and vote from home and then from work. ISP's work if the people using them are honest. After that, all bets are off. Now you have at least a 40 vote group.

FantasyXY

They don't use 1's which are swept by general rule. Ok figure that same story with 300 votes and a score of say 4.8 for a contest. Now drop a half dozen 2's for instance on it and see where the story ends up. Or even 2 2's.

First of all, 10 people voting from home and from work is still 20 votes, not 40. Second of all, not everyone can access the internet from work, especially a website of an adult nature. And lastly, again, IF all those 20 votes went unnoticed, they would be noticed each time thereafter, because the 20 IP addresses would not change.

 

[FantasyXY]

Oh and while were talking conspiracy, let's not forget to account for the shots that came from the grassy knoll.

 

[Nathan_Brazil]

With Apologies to Python

Michael Palin : Hello I am just listening to this record with my wife and our au-pair and I’d like to say how shocked we are that a pleasant collection of Norwegian folk songs should be turned into an excuse for communist propaganda of the shoddiest kind. What’s gone wrong with the world. I can’t even take a bath without 6 or 7 communists jumping in with me. They’re in my shirt cupboard and Breshnev and Kosegan are in the kitchen now eating my wife’s jam. Oh they are cutting off my legs. I can see them peeping out of my wife’s blouse. Why doesn’t Mr Maulding do something about it before it is to late. Ohhhh….God…

 

[sr71plt]

Nailed what? You could manage to vote a whole fistful of times before any sweeping is done. By then other readers will have followed the piper--either in assuming this must be great because so many voting before thought so--or the other end when downvoting someone's story.

Look at the massive number of votes the Web site itself thinks should be swept every time the sweeper goes through. A contest story such as the one I had in the last contest doesn't run under 3.80 in the first, high-profile week and wind up at 4.74 without some serious cheat voting going on.

Methinks some here protest innocence far too much and probably should just shut up and not dig themselves deeper.

No, it's not going to stop--but you could stop being idiots in claiming it's not happening (and with the help of those trying to hide it).

 

[FantasyXY]

First of all, 10 people voting from home and from work is still 20 votes, not 40. Second of all, not everyone can access the internet from work, especially a website of an adult nature. And lastly, again, IF all those 20 votes went unnoticed, they would be noticed each time thereafter, because the 20 IP addresses would not change.

OMG - I could so wreck this whole voting thing if I still worked for an ISP.

All I would need is an access point on a router with a class-B assigned port (these went away with the advent of MPLS), and root level access to a server complex that wasn't being used for anything, with some sort of dynamic DHCP, and a mess of NICs in promiscuous mode, and a little bit of software that can auto traverse and screen scrape, the ability to spoof my way past all the network firewalls, and a boss that had no clue how anything works...

Risking a high paying job at an ISP so I can fuck with a couple of dirty story writers... Yeah, that would be IDEAL!

 

[lovecraft68]

OMG - I could so wreck this whole voting thing if I still worked for an ISP.

All I would need is an access point on a router with a class-B assigned port (these went away with the advent of MPLS), and root level access to a server complex that wasn't being used for anything, with some sort of dynamic DHCP, and a mess of NICs in promiscuous mode, and a little bit of software that can auto traverse and screen scrape, the ability to spoof my way past all the network firewalls, and a boss that had no clue how anything works...

Risking a high paying job at an ISP so I can fuck with a couple of dirty story writers... Yeah, that would be IDEAL!

There's software that can do what you described from your own home. Scouries used it for a long time to pump thousands-yes thousands- of votes into his two lame ass incest stories he is always touting.

IF reject reality pops into this, I know he'll recall the name of it.

 

[FantasyXY]

There's software that can do what you described from your own home. Scouries used it for a long time to pump thousands-yes thousands- of votes into his two lame ass incest stories he is always touting.

IF reject reality pops into this, I know he'll recall the name of it.

To get away with what he did on that level, I always assumed that Scouries must have worked at an ISP.

My point was that even with supposed IP hopping software, the restructuring of the Internet is making this whole thing harder and harder.

 

[TxRad]

To get away with what he did on that level, I always assumed that Scouries must have worked at an ISP.

My point was that even with supposed IP hopping software, the restructuring of the Internet is making this whole thing harder and harder.

...TMI...

 

[lovecraft68]

Two words, if you really know anything. Laptop and large city.

And movement, different coffee shops etc...

 

[TxRad]

And movement, different coffee shops etc...

...TMI...

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Drive around an affluent neighborhood and watch how many unsecure wifi signals you find.