New Witness to Michael Brown Shooting

[cjh]

Who is*we*? You don't leave your bunker. . What the fuck do *we* know?

Wait.

I thought we were supposed to wait until the facts are in.

I would swear I read that repeatedly.

 

[RjThoughts]

Wait.

I thought we were supposed to wait until the facts are in.

I would swear I read that repeatedly.

the Faux news listeners have all the "facts" they need: he was black, therefore, he was a thug that needed to be killed.

 

[Disgustipated]

Wait.

I thought we were supposed to wait until the facts are in.

I would swear I read that repeatedly.

If I wasn't smarter than them, they'd make my head hurt.

 

[cjh]

the Faux news listeners have all the "facts" they need: he was black, therefore, he was a thug that needed to be killed.

Oh !

It's wait until there are enough facts in that can be spun into my favorite narrative.

Got it!

 

[RjThoughts]

Oh !

It's wait until there are enough facts in that can be spun into my favorite narrative.

Got it!

Bingo!!

 

[RobDownSouth]

Who is*we*? You don't leave your bunker. . What the fuck do *we* know?

Don't be mean.

He leaves his bunker every three weeks or so to make a Cheetos run.

 

[Balladeer08]

So Holder just naturally had to send forty FBI agents to investigate one shooting, and just naturally had to order a third autopsy?

The FBI ALWAYS sends a ton of agents on any case they take an interest in. The FBI likes to pretend that they are SO much better than mere local law enforcement agencies, any of them. The fact is that they have more resources. They'll send 40 agents whose ONLY job is this one investigation. And they can afford to order every lab test or computer simulation that they can think of. Local law enforcement does not have these advantages. Ask the detectives how many cases they have active.

I'm glad the FBI is so equipped and has these resources to put on cases. But I find their snobby attitude more than a bit offensive. Sometimes they assign more agents to a case than the local agency employs total. Of course they are going to get better results.

And they don't have to go to bar fights and roll around in the mud and the blood and the beer.

 

[Balladeer08]

Saw this and thought of this thread (and Toubab)
http://i.imgur.com/8cTg41E.jpg

And ain't that the sad truth?

 

[Balladeer08]

Remember how it all started off with bullshit about how he was shot in the back with his hands up? Well that was proven to be a big lie, and we knoew it was when it was claimed. Now the narrative is he was shot 6 times, so that means the cop disrespected his body. Another says that because he was shot in the head, it's clear he was executed while kneeling. What a bunch of bull, he could have been charging the officer with his head down. The fact is, we still don't know what happened. Cops are trained to shoot to kill, to stop an opponent. We all know that he was probably using a 9mm, which has questionable stopping power against a big enraged man.

Cops are NOT trained to shoot to kill. They are taught to aim for center of mass, and to shoot to stop the action.

If the person in the liquor store strong-arm robbery was Brown, I can't see one or two bullets of any handgun caliber stopping him. Personally, if I had the choice of weapon available, I'd have used an elephant gun. Okay, that may be a bit of an exaggeration. But I'd have surely gone for the 12 gauge if I could have gotten to it fast enough. That guy was huge.

 

[Dream59]

The FBI ALWAYS sends a ton of agents on any case they take an interest in. The FBI likes to pretend that they are SO much better than mere local law enforcement agencies, any of them. The fact is that they have more resources. They'll send 40 agents whose ONLY job is this one investigation. And they can afford to order every lab test or computer simulation that they can think of. Local law enforcement does not have these advantages. Ask the detectives how many cases they have active.

I'm glad the FBI is so equipped and has these resources to put on cases. But I find their snobby attitude more than a bit offensive. Sometimes they assign more agents to a case than the local agency employs total. Of course they are going to get better results.

And they don't have to go to bar fights and roll around in the mud and the blood and the beer.

Actually most FBI agents are not that good as simple investigators. Some are, but many spend too much time in an office or ticket punching. You get an investigator from a larger agency and they will have much more experience than an FBI agent if for no other fact than the cases that the FBI usually investigates take years.

 

[Dream59]

Cops are NOT trained to shoot to kill. They are taught to aim for center of mass, and to shoot to stop the action.

If the person in the liquor store strong-arm robbery was Brown, I can't see one or two bullets of any handgun caliber stopping him. Personally, if I had the choice of weapon available, I'd have used an elephant gun. Okay, that may be a bit of an exaggeration. But I'd have surely gone for the 12 gauge if I could have gotten to it fast enough. That guy was huge.

You are right. Center mass until the subject goes down.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Actually most FBI agents are not that good as simple investigators. Some are, but many spend too much time in an office or ticket punching. You get an investigator from a larger agency and they will have much more experience than an FBI agent if for no other fact than the cases that the FBI usually investigates take years.

I'm tempted to agree with you, but after watching the John Oliver video discussing the Ferguson cops and their county counterparts, I've got zero faith in either of them to conduct an impartial investigation.

Both of those forces seem to enjoy going out of their way to antagonize the local citizens. They both appear to be textbook examples of the increased militarization of police in a post-9/11 environment.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Cops are NOT trained to shoot to kill. They are taught to aim for center of mass, and to shoot to stop the action.

Please don't contradict Vetteman. He's got more experience with firearms than anyone else on the General Board. He's said so numerous times.
:nods:

 

[Balladeer08]

Yes, that is a shout out to the RJs of the thread who are convinced the cop decided to execute himself an innocent black Ute and I wonder why it took him six years to find a Ute to execute...



... since there is no way it could be self-defense and they seem to allow for no middle ground.

Someone want to fill me in on the meaning of Ute in this context? I know the Ute's as an Indian/Native American/Indiginous/whatever the fuck you want to call them tribe from the Utah Colorado area. I assume this is a recent piece of slang I am not hip or cool enough to know.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Except he wasn't shot in the left arm, dummy.

Okay stupid, let's walk through this.

They showed us a picture of all the entry wounds including the arms.

Raise your hands.

See how your arms invert?

They cannot be shot from the angles of the autopsy diagrams...



I know this as a former fighter and a person trained to manipulate joints. He would have had to raise his arms palms backwards.

 

[Balladeer08]

You really do not read carefully. I didn't say I think the cop was in jeopardy. I said I think the cop is in jeopardy.

Okay, it isn't fair bringing past/present/future tense into this. You'll only confuse, frustrate and anger them.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Someone want to fill me in on the meaning of Ute in this context? I know the Ute's as an Indian/Native American/Indiginous/whatever the fuck you want to call them tribe from the Utah Colorado area. I assume this is a recent piece of slang I am not hip or cool enough to know.

My Cousin Vinny...

Did you say Utes?

Yes, your honor, the two Utes...

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Wait.

I thought we were supposed to wait until the facts are in.

I would swear I read that repeatedly.

the Faux news listeners have all the "facts" they need: he was black, therefore, he was a thug that needed to be killed.

OMG!

Talk about ironic humor!

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

If I wasn't smarter than them, they'd make my head hurt.

If I were not...

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Okay, it isn't fair bringing past/present/future tense into this. You'll only confuse, frustrate and anger them.

Them, or Dem?

 

[Balladeer08]

Ah, I see. Well, some people don't seem to realize how seldom these things happen, and how reluctant most cops are to shoot anybody, black, white, or any other color.

That's a good point. Unlike TV and movies, you get involved in shootings, you effectively stop being a cop and wind up riding a desk.

Because if you're in a 2nd shooting, the first one is going to be brought up. And a 3rd? Well, OBVIOUSLY there is a pattern of abuse, because it isn't possible to be involved in 3 justified shootings, there aren't that many over the entire world in a decade, right?

Police departments, like most of American society, are liability driven.

You can have a cop in the most perfect shooting possible, you still should put him behind a desk, because if there is EVER another shooting, even 20 years later in his career, you'll be back defending the first one all over again.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Someone want to fill me in on the meaning of Ute in this context? I know the Ute's as an Indian/Native American/Indiginous/whatever the fuck you want to call them tribe from the Utah Colorado area. I assume this is a recent piece of slang I am not hip or cool enough to know.

AJ has his own language. Like many glibertarians, words have different meanings to him than most other human beings.

For example...

• WAR IS PEACE
• FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
• IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

 

[RobDownSouth]

Okay, it isn't fair bringing past/present/future tense into this. You'll only confuse, frustrate and anger them.

I can assure you, "fairness" is often the furthest thing from Toubab's mind.
:nods:

 

[Dream59]

I'm tempted to agree with you, but after watching the John Oliver video discussing the Ferguson cops and their county counterparts, I've got zero faith in either of them to conduct an impartial investigation.

Both of those forces seem to enjoy going out of their way to antagonize the local citizens. They both appear to be textbook examples of the increased militarization of police in a post-9/11 environment.

To be honest I really have not kept up with most of this. But even granting your points it is not going to mean that the agents are better investigators. The FBI just has unlimited resources compared to a local agency and massive back up by criminalist, which does help them a lot.

 

[RobDownSouth]

To be honest I really have not kept up with most of this. But even granting your points it is not going to mean that the agents are better investigators. The FBI just has unlimited resources compared to a local agency and massive back up by criminalist, which does help them a lot.

I honestly don't want to make a subjective valuation on which dept is "better", but I feel the FBI can be much more impartial about things.