FAWC 5: Line, Please!

[sr71plt]

Oh I figure I'm completely wrong on all of them. Just trying to get the conversation going.

I know that two other guesses were wrong. (But who's counting--and it was a braver try than I could do.)

 

[FAWCker]

Will we read about this trip in the Summer Lovin' contest?

Mmmmaybe . . . .

slyc, I need to shop at the camping stores where you do. When I go camping, all I get is mosquito bites and rock-shaped bruises on my ass. I am clearly doing it wrong.

We've had several tries to get it right. And we still don't have everything.

Travel trailer. Nuff said. I've got a campfire, wifi, wine, a bullfrog singing to me, bathroom, memory foam mattress, heat, AC, and a bald eagle that's flown down the creek twice in the last couple of weeks.

We didn't want to fork out the cash it would take to install a trailer hitch on a Prius and besides, we like having a tent. For us, it's more "right." Everything we take packs into a large duffel I put on the roof. Nice and compact, but we have most of the amenities of home.

I think you hit on "it." Literotica, being what it is, if something can't be physically stopped, some writers are going to do it. This will happen with editing of the stories, I think unless there's a physical way of preventing it from happening.

People will always do what they want to do and find reasons for doing it. When it comes to editing, I don't take the subject all that seriously. This site is as good as an amateur site can get (in most cases), but it's still a site for amateur writers. I don't think the majority of readers are looking for literary perfection.

True, but I think what is being missed is that it's not a question of what was permitted. It is a question of what a writer does to make his/her work stand out above the rest with reader/voter and the criteron the reader has a right to use to give the higher ratings. At least one commenter on the stories assessed at least one story (and maybe others) as the use/integration of the elements being a distinguishing factor. This isn't an illegitimate assessment criteron--and it has nothing to do with what the basic requirements are for entering the exercise. It concerns what that commenter (quote logically) is using to scale and differentiate ratings of the stories.

Really, I think it's a basic consideration of whether you are going to try to be a superlative creative writer or a mediocre "well, I did what was required to do" one--and then expect to be rewarded higher than others for your degree of effort and creativity.

I understand what you're saying. I think it adds an extra dimension to the story if the items were used, and I said so. That at least one person is reading the stories with the eye of looking for how the items were used is an interesting development. I would go as far as to say that the way the line reads almost makes it look as if the stories should be written around them. But no story is lessened in my eye if it wasn't.

 

[Swilly]

Travel trailer. Nuff said. I've got a campfire, wifi, wine, a bullfrog singing to me, bathroom, memory foam mattress, heat, AC, and a bald eagle that's flown down the creek twice in the last couple of weeks.

And smut to read and write.

 

[FAWCker]

Oh, sr, I did catch your supposed "outing" of me. Check post #809.

 

[sr71plt]

Oh, sr, I did catch your supposed "outing" of me. Check post #809.

Yeah, yeah, saw that at the time. Not a flat denial.

 

[sr71plt]

I understand what you're saying. I think it adds an extra dimension to the story if the items were used, and I said so. That at least one person is reading the stories with the eye of looking for how the items were used is an interesting development. I would go as far as to say that the way the line reads almost makes it look as if the stories should be written around them. But no story is lessened in my eye if it wasn't.

I don't really see it as a "development." If you go back to the earlier FAWCs, I think you will see that it's been a standard assessment criterion in every exercise. It just boggles my mind that folks are surprised that the stories would be assessed on the basis of the reader's interpretation of meeting the exercise parameters. (Just boggles my mind.) Why even have the criteria if creative/comprehensive use of the elements isn't a standard for differentiating stories? Just declare a period of "no holds barred/best written whatever" wins.

You wouldn't say that a commenter wasn't operating within their privilege and a logical construct in differentiating the stories this way, would you? That is the point that was being criticized. (And I didn't bring this topic up.)

This is really pretty basic to contests and creative writing.

 

[AMoveableBeast]

Sex Manual: Lynn
Inspiration and Desperation: Swilly (I know you said Kay and Bob, but I'm saying you doubled up.)
Lorelei's Call: PennLady
True Oracle: Saxon_Heart
Mystery Night: slyc_Willie
The Midnight Ball: MST
Transitions:Jagfarlane
Reunion: Blind_Justice
Heirlooms: MST
Cooking it Up: SAAB
An Account for a Bullet: stlgoddessfreya
Bluetooth: SecondCircle
Desperate Times and Measures: TxTallTales
Transitions: pilot
The Games She Plays: pilot
Escape: Aynmair
Mesmerized: sheablue

 

[sr71plt]

Nope and nope. *smile* (Get out those erasers again.) But I agree on a couple of the others.

 

[AMoveableBeast]

Roses and Thorns: jomar

 

[AMoveableBeast]

Empire of the Stars: Seanathon

 

[AMoveableBeast]

A Mile: patientlee

 

[patientlee]

A Mile: patientlee

That's why I like you.

 

[patientlee]

Too much Cab Sauv to guess. Tomorrow's busy, but I'll try to pull my thoughts together then.

 

[AMoveableBeast]

That's why I like you.

Is that all? I thought it was for my horrible French.

 

[sr71plt]

Is that all? I thought it was for my horrible French.

The French were pretty horrible when I lived there too.

 

[JKendallDane]

I'd probably need a couple of more days to read what I'm going to read--which isn't the longer ones because I honor the "short" in "short story" and don't have the time to devote to the long ones.

I can understand that.

After all, dedicating forty-five minutes or so to read someone's five or six page entry would require you to cut back from making fifty or sixty posts each day...half of which tend to be focused either on "look at me" self-aggrandizing or getting into pissing matches that always devolve into you whining, "He started it first."

Just an observation.

 

[sr71plt]

Ah, another happy camper arrives with a snide, unprovoked personal attack. Such pathetic, petty, bitterness.

Are you living under the misimpression that this makes you seem like an adult, J Kendall?

 

[FAWCker]

I don't really see it as a "development." If you go back to the earlier FAWCs, I think you will see that it's been a standard assessment criterion in every exercise. It just boggles my mind that folks are surprised that the stories would be assessed on the basis of the reader's interpretation of meeting the exercise parameters. (Just boggles my mind.) Why even have the criteria if creative/comprehensive use of the elements isn't a standard for differentiating stories? Just declare a period of "no holds barred/best written whatever" wins.

You wouldn't say that a commenter wasn't operating within their privilege and a logical construct in differentiating the stories this way, would you? That is the point that was being criticized. (And I didn't bring this topic up.)

This is really pretty basic to contests and creative writing.

Alright, "development" wasn't the best word choice. I was referring to the appearance of this commenter during this challenge. So maybe "appearance" would have been better to use.

I said earlier that I thought, with the way the sentence read, that it appears as if the items on the table should be part of the story. That someone would read the stories and expect them to be integral doesn't surprise me in the least. I can easily see how the assumption could be made that the items are supposed to be used.

Technically, the way I set up this challenge, they don't even have to be there after the first line. Would doing so detract from the story? Maybe. Maybe not. Depends on the story. Depends on the reader. From my point of view? Sure, I would like to think that I inspired the participants in this FAWC to want to use the items in their story. That points to my own hubris. But I wanted to avoid that as a qualifier for the story because I thought the line itself would be enough of a challenge for a casual competition such as this.

I've already stated that I feel no story that doesn't actually use the items on the table is lessened in my eye. I fully expected that some would not. I've mentioned in some of my critiques that the use of the line in the story seemed "handed in," but that does not mean I am implying the items on the table should have been used. I was referring to the use of the line itself and how it was integrated into the resulting story.

But, to more succinctly answer your question, no, I would not say that a commenter wasn't operating within their privilege and a logical construct in differentiating the stories this way (meaning by the use of the items on the table). Every reader has the right to interpret the stories how they wish, and to judge them how they wish.

 

[FAWCker]

The French were pretty horrible when I lived there too.

Ditto. Few stereotypes ring as true as the ones for the French, I'm afraid.

 

[Aynmair]

Ditto. Few stereotypes ring as true as the ones for the French, I'm afraid.

During my recent travels through France I've found the French much more genial than they were 30 years ago, even Parisians. My French has improved quite a bit, though.

 

[sr71plt]

During my recent travels through France I've found the French much more genial than they were 30 years ago, even Parisians. My French has improved quite a bit, though.

I assumed that was the case. Last time I was there was 1958 (DeGaule coming into power). I still live under the apprehension, though, that I couldn't move around there without speaking French, which I don't. I don't really feel that way about visiting any place else in the world. We're looking into go to the French tennis open, but are only looking at guided tours for that reason.

 

[Aynmair]

I assumed that was the case. Last time I was there was 1958 (DeGaule coming into power). I still live under the apprehension, though, that I couldn't move around there without speaking French, which I don't. I don't really feel that way about visiting any place else in the world. We're looking into go to the French tennis open, but are only looking at guided tours for that reason.

Way more people in France speak English, and are eager to practice it. It used to be even if people spoke English, they'd pretend they didn't - or wouldn't. Really, you don't need to rely on a tour. Unless for other reasons.

 

[JKendallDane]

Prove me wrong then.

Instead of attempting to suck me into one of your keyboard wars, show some respect to your fellow authors that have entered the contest and read the damn stories instead of dedicating so much effort to telling everyone...over and over...that you don't have the time.

It's called common courtesy because there isn't a single person on the forum that believes your time is that limited.

 

[sr71plt]

Technically, the way I set up this challenge, they don't even have to be there after the first line.

Well, technically I'd disagree with you--because the first sentence of a story carries a heavy responsibility for the story as a whole. (Maybe it would have been good to require the sentence to pop up just somewhere in the story--I've seen one commenter note they became put off of reading the stories because it was always there at the beginning).

And beyond that, what "has to happen" for an individual reader's approval is up to the individual reader, isn't it? It's enough for me (since I didn't open this discussion) to see agreement that using this criterion to differentiate the stories by the individual reader is both the reader's privilege and is a logical choice of standard. (And I think a lot of commenters in earlier FAWC exercises used this standard.)

 

[FAWCker]

During my recent travels through France I've found the French much more genial than they were 30 years ago, even Parisians. My French has improved quite a bit, though.

The French are definitely more friendly to those who speak the language at least conversationally. My last trip to France was in late 2001, and while I received some sympathy for being American in light of 9/11, that only went so far.

Way more people in France speak English, and are eager to practice it. It used to be even if people spoke English, they'd pretend they didn't - or wouldn't. Really, you don't need to rely on a tour. Unless for other reasons.

My first wife was half-French (the "good half," she told me ). When we crossed the Channel to France, she would do most of the initial talking, until it became apparent we were English-speakers, and then quite a few French would switch to English. I always got the impression that they saw the language barrier as a quid pro quo; "you speak mine, and I'll speak yours." But that infamous French arrogance -- at least to my impression -- was always there. Condescension is an artform to them, I think.