Why do they lump BDSM together?

[TwistedJenn]

I've always been curious about this. I'm very much a masochist but I'm not into the "lifestyle"of BDSM. I get kind of irritated sometimes that it's all lumped together.

 

[Primalex]

I've always been curious about this.

And you never tried to Google it?

 

[KoPilot]

What's a BDSM lifestyle anyways?

 

[TwistedJenn]

I know what BDSM stands for I'm just saying that just because I'm a masochist doesn't mean I'm into it all, and it's the same I'm sure for people who are in to D/s as well. I just don't like that it's all lumped together.

 

[GrrlFriday]

At a guess, I'd say it's to do with the history of the subcultures. Much like a Christian couple who do D/s might just keep 'obey' in their vows, and the wife might defer to the husband as the 'head of the household'... you don't necessarily need to say 'masochist' or 'BDSM' to get your point across, if the connotations don't fit you or your lifestyle.

 

[KoPilot]

I don't really see how them being lumped together is anything but an issue of semantics-- nobody pretends that someone who practices just SM is into everything else. People who find themselves within the subculture seem to be pretty well aware that there are an enormous number of different flavors that the acronym encompasses and that there are a ton of sub-sub-cultures that have absolutely nothing in common.

Shrug. It's a complete non-issue to me.

A bigger beef I have is the constant equating "submissive" with "woman".

 

[Loverskitten]

I've never felt people (in the know) lump all aspects of BDSM together, in fact they go out of their way not to.
What I do see often in people lumping any and every kind of kink in with BDSM. Happens here a lot, and that, is annoying.

 

[Primalex]

I know what BDSM stands for I'm just saying that just because I'm a masochist doesn't mean I'm into it all, and it's the same I'm sure for people who are in to D/s as well. I just don't like that it's all lumped together.

Fascinating.


Psssst... you are girl. Want to know what people lump together just because you have tits?

 

[Desiremakesmeweak]

I'm in total agreement with the OP here. The trouble is, some of the components of BDSM are SO FUCKING FAR APART - they shouldn't even be anywhere NEAR each other (people OR ideas).

 

[Primalex]

some of the components of BDSM are SO FUCKING FAR APART - they shouldn't even be anywhere NEAR each other (people OR ideas).

like.... ?

 

[Desiremakesmeweak]

And I mean that I have frankly, very little time for 'subs/tops/dominants/leather.' This is all very artificial, very tacky, very 'plastic,' and very fake. It's about the typical modern fashion of seeking any kind of new sensation. And the noisy self-involved, self-validation of the shallow.

Not that I expect many to agree with me.

Deluded, crazy people who can't relate to most people anyway, hive together under this banner that there is some 'lifestyle' known as BDSM that is a social sub-culture.

 

[Primalex]

And I mean that I have frankly, very little time for 'subs/tops/dominants/leather.' This is all very artificial, very tacky, very 'plastic,' and very fake. It's about the typical modern fashion of seeking any kind of new sensation. And the noisy self-involved, self-validation of the shallow.

Not that I expect many to agree with me.

Deluded, crazy people who can't relate to most people anyway, hive together under this banner that there is some 'lifestyle' known as BDSM that is a social sub-culture.

Any chance for a less crazy-cat-lady-answer?

 

[Paul_Chance]

The term first entered the lexicon in NYC in 1969* and was used on flyers to advertise sex themed parties in the gay community. From there, it made it's way rapidly into the alternative news papers (initially in party ads for the gay and straight communities) and then into the singles ads. By 1971 it had entered the psychiatric journals, mainly in articles dealing with sexual deviance. The general conclusion was the BDSM was deviant behavior (deviating from the norm), but not a psychiatric disorder, since it lacked the component of significantly impairing an individuals ability to function. As members of the community will tell you, it is an amalgamation of multiple terms and was probably placed on those first fliers as BDSM to save space.

*The sub-terms that make up BDSM were all around for years before, but 1969 is the first time the term, as BDSM, shows up in historical documents. The earliest document appears in a series of street photographs published in an alternate, underground, paper that show the fliers in the background.

 

[KoPilot]

And I mean that I have frankly, very little time for 'subs/tops/dominants/leather.' This is all very artificial, very tacky, very 'plastic,' and very fake. It's about the typical modern fashion of seeking any kind of new sensation. And the noisy self-involved, self-validation of the shallow.

Not that I expect many to agree with me.

Deluded, crazy people who can't relate to most people anyway, hive together under this banner that there is some 'lifestyle' known as BDSM that is a social sub-culture.

And what part of kink are you holding up to be hallowed and genuine and completely rational, exactly?

(And if you are "most people", then hell yes I don't care to relate to em. )

 

[l1sha]

My man and I do some kinky things in the privacy of the bedroom, but I'm definitely not part of a BDSM lifestyle or sub-culture either. Sometimes it seems that those who keep their sex lives private are assumed to be "vanilla" when no one actually knows what kind of wild things they're doing in private, and those who gather together or talk publicly about it, consider themselves part of a sub-culture.

 

[Loverskitten]

My man and I do some kinky things in the privacy of the bedroom, but I'm definitely not part of a BDSM lifestyle or sub-culture either. Sometimes it seems that those who keep their sex lives private are assumed to be "vanilla" when no one actually knows what kind of wild things they're doing in private, and those who gather together or talk publicly about it, consider themselves part of a sub-culture.

NEWSFLASH, they don't just gather round and talk, they gather and play.
Also, if you don't care to talk about your kinky wild things, then don't. No biggie. Who cares if people think you're vanilla. Who are you trying to impress?

 

[IrisAlthea]

Splitting it into my kink and everybody elses crazy annoying behaviour, does not make for a very efficient defininition.

 

[Primalex]

My man and I do some kinky things in the privacy of the bedroom, but I'm definitely not part of a BDSM lifestyle or sub-culture either.

Yes, you are.

Sometimes it seems that those who keep their sex lives private are assumed to be "vanilla" when no one actually knows what kind of wild things they're doing in private

NO WAY!!! Really? How unfair.

If you don't talk about your private sex life, people will make assumptions about it, which might be right or wrong. And if you talk about your private sex life, people (like you) will also make assumptions about it, which might be right or wrong.

And of course it works the other way, too. Get some tattoos and the proper outfit and people will instead assume that you are kinky, even if you didn't say a thing.


Girl, how old are you that you still don't know how people are?

 

[Athalia]

The term first entered the lexicon in NYC in 1969* and was used on flyers to advertise sex themed parties in the gay community.

Thanks for the history lesson! I've always wondered about that.

I'm with the original poster. I'm a masochist, but find nothing erotic, for the most part, in giving pain to others, or having them give pain to me. (And I've tried both.) At least, not to the extent of forming a relationship based on that.

I ran across a story on this site that describes my attitude quite well:

http://www.literotica.com/s/helens-night-in

It's about a woman who's into self-torture as a way of being in pain, yet being in control of that pain. I can't say that I ever took it as far as Helen did, but I was certainly part of the way there.

I hasten to add that I have no animosity whatever toward anybody who is into the bondage/dominance/submissive part of the spectrum. It's just not my thing, that's all.

 

[damissita]

Thanks for the history lesson! I've always wondered about that.

I'm with the original poster. I'm a masochist, but find nothing erotic, for the most part, in giving pain to others, or having them give pain to me. (And I've tried both.) At least, not to the extent of forming a relationship based on that.

I ran across a story on this site that describes my attitude quite well:

http://www.literotica.com/s/helens-night-in

It's about a woman who's into self-torture as a way of being in pain, yet being in control of that pain. I can't say that I ever took it as far as Helen did, but I was certainly part of the way there.

I hasten to add that I have no animosity whatever toward anybody who is into the bondage/dominance/submissive part of the spectrum. It's just not my thing, that's all.

I feel like that isn't masochism then, wouldn't it just be self harm?
Which I totally think should be in a different category.

I understand that the definition of masochism is the enjoyment of pain. But I feel like what you are talking about isn't lumped in BDSM at all.
I feel like BDSM is about a partnership or relationship (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong older members, since I've just begun to wet my feet in this area) and what you are doing is all about you going solo. Which is fine. But not a part of BDSM.

 

[KoPilot]

I feel like that isn't masochism then, wouldn't it just be self harm?
Which I totally think should be in a different category.

I understand that the definition of masochism is the enjoyment of pain. But I feel like what you are talking about isn't lumped in BDSM at all.
I feel like BDSM is about a partnership or relationship (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong older members, since I've just begun to wet my feet in this area) and what you are doing is all about you going solo. Which is fine. But not a part of BDSM.

People who are into pain and other associated kinks get their kicks in all sorts of ways-- self-bondage is very well regarded as a legitimate form of bondage. Masochists will commonly go out and get body modifications and emotionally understand those experiences and the resulting mod to be a demonstration of their masochism. A service-oriented person might volunteer to clean up after someone they barely know or aren't even permitted to speak to. And so on.

There is a line there, you're right, but as someone who's done both, that line is wide and blurry, and you're going to just have to trust someone when they say their partner-less play is part of their BDSM.

 

[damissita]

People who are into pain and other associated kinks get their kicks in all sorts of ways-- self-bondage is very well regarded as a legitimate form of bondage. Masochists will commonly go out and get body modifications and emotionally understand those experiences and the resulting mod to be a demonstration of their masochism. A service-oriented person might volunteer to clean up after someone they barely know or aren't even permitted to speak to. And so on.

There is a line there, you're right, but as someone who's done both, that line is wide and blurry, and you're going to just have to trust someone when they say their partner-less play is part of their BDSM.

Ahh okay, thanks!
That's interesting.
I for one can't handle causing pain to myself, it's amplified for some reason. Though I never considered that getting body modifications as a part of that. I recently got dermals in my back and that hurt like bitch. But at the same time I was immensely turned on (so happy the guy didn't look up my skirt) and knowing myself the reason for that is because it was him causing my pain. So maybe its all just mental. How the person views it.
All very stimulating ideas to tickle my brain.

 

[bhndblueyes88]

Masochists will commonly go out and get body modifications and emotionally understand those experiences and the resulting mod to be a demonstration of their masochism. .

I'm not very masochistic in regards to more intense pain, but this here is definitely a component to why I love the process of receiving a tattoo.

 

[Desiremakesmeweak]

Darker sexual and erotic practices that are different to what the average broad socially understood 'usual' sexual behaviours of the, let's say, 'normal' publicly-witnessed, married couple - have been around since at least as far back as written history.

Artemisian cults, Dionysian cults, and a lot of others, Egyptian, Norse - all sorts of peoples/cultures - have written indications of these 'different' erotic and sexual paths.

Look I don't have a problem with people 'gathering and playing.'

I am also aware of occasions... ...where no playing is going on.

I mean I'm actually not trying to separate things into 'genuine' and 'not genuine,' but I will suggest that the OP is really expressing what a few people think, namely that some things are not 'playing.'

Anybody that thinks BDSM - or whatever you accept that it ought to be called (BDSM is good enough for me up to a point) does not attract self-validating and often incredibly self-involved and disturbed people, is just either wilfully blind or stubborn. It is my view - which as I say, I don't expect everyone to share - that the WORLD of BDSM, has attracted too many such, and allowed too many to stay, and far too many to take the central platforms of expression about what 'it' all is about.

Nowadays it's like there is a shopping list, and a 'well-known' and formally categorized set of behaviours and practices, and everyone can get to be pigeonholed once again like every fucking other thing around these days. Where there are bands of experts telling everyone what to think.

I'm not telling you what to think at all.

I will stick my tongue in my cheek though and repeat what Bachmann said recently about how the modern gay lobby is bullying everyone! lol.

Apparently, if I never challenged anything here, gays invented BDSM.

If I never challenged anything here, it would be left for all to suppose that the most daring, outrageous, exotic/erotic, kinked individuals were those with painful tattoos, 'proper' BDSM clothing, and, I suppose, a double major in postmodern French sexual philosophy.

 

[KoPilot]

Hey guess what, sex attracts self-involved and disturbed people. Whoop-dee-doo. Water is wet.