Election 2012; Darkness Descends on America Part Three…

[amicus]

Capitalism is might, and might is always right.

You haven't a clue as to what happens in the mines. Keep quiet on the subject.

~~~

No, I think I will not keep quiet on this or any subject I choose to engage.

Das Kapital gave the world the word, 'capitalism' by Karl Marx, the accurate description of our economic system is a free market under law protecting human and property rights.

You haven't a clue about economics, keep quiet on the subject.

amicus

 

[Sean]

~~~

No, I think I will not keep quiet on this or any subject I choose to engage.

Das Kapital gave the world the word, 'capitalism' by Karl Marx, the accurate description of our economic system is a free market under law protecting human and property rights.

You haven't a clue about economics, keep quiet on the subject.

amicus

Capitalism protects human rights? Ever hear of Bhopal?

 

[amicus]

Capitalism protects human rights? Ever hear of Bhopal?

Ever hear of the Love Canal, authorized and licensed by Government ?

We have a free market economy, not a 'capitalist' one, that word was coined by Marx in 'Das Kapital' and does not describe our system of trade and compensation.

But, when the lights go out, and they will, you can hug yourself in the cold and dark and dream of a socialist utopia until your nuggets freeze off.

amicus

 

[Sean Renaud]

When did we get a free market?

 

[amicus]

Always had a free market, chum, but starting with that pissant peasant roosevelt, it went underground and is now called the free black market...oh, damn, there I go being racist again...shame on me!

ami

 

[Sean Renaud]

Always had a free market, chum, but starting with that pissant peasant roosevelt, it went underground and is now called the free black market...oh, damn, there I go being racist again...shame on me!

ami

Fair enough, though most of us have very little experience with the black market or the criminals that run it. Though even the Founding Fathers didn't seem to support a free market.

 

[amicus]

Fair enough, though most of us have very little experience with the black market or the criminals that run it. Though even the Founding Fathers didn't seem to support a free market.

~~~

I think rum running was about as free a market as you will ever find...

One should place statements in context, in this case, in the 1770's King George and his governors made all the decisions to give or take property or enterprise, there was no freedom, none...

A free market is the result of free men with their rights protected. That method of the exchange of goods and services naturally occurs between people who have their rights protected, with law enforcement and a court system in place.

None of that was in place at that time; the startling new concept of liberty, even in the market place required reinventing the wheel so to speak, even the currency was a problem.

Then as now there are those with no respect for the property of others, or rules or laws, or even tradition. That remains true at evey level of society and especially within government as there is no monetary value placed on their endeavors.

The next time we wipe the slate clean and start over with a free society, all you statists will be poking up daisies or migrated elsewhere to enjoy your socialism.

...and my books will be part of how that generation learns about liberty and a free market and that must just frost your nips, eh?

amicus

 

[Sean Renaud]

What frosts my nips is that you spread your ignorance and half-truths. You somehow believe things like King George was snatching up land left and right and there was no freedom under the King. Which. . .wasn't true. The King had limitations set in place by amongst other things the Magna Carta.

You claim there were no protections but courts and patents both outdate the US. Your claim is absurd on it's face.

It ultimately doesn't matter though. You're dream is dead. We won't be wiping the slate clean in any of our lifetimes and your philosophy will die with you. Your books will be forgotten by people who have no need for that particular brand of ignorance. If I have a fear it's that when the real socialists and communists show up they'll get a lot more accomplished than most of us want done because all the people who think like you will have been so thoroughly discredited and driven from public office. You didn't lose in 2012 because you had a bad candidate, you lost because you have a bad message. Repeating everything louder and shriller will not change this.

 

[amicus]

YOu are indeed the true believer eric hoffer wrote about long ago, much like deists, you refuse to see anything beyond your particular god of communal existence.

There were land grants and there were land grants and charters to favored high mucky mucks of near royal blood. Go ahead and spellout for me how land was otherwise distributed in the New World?

Men who demand freedom of action, the liberty or death kind of men, have always been part of society and always will be. You don't understand that aspect of humanity and as I said before I think it may be a gene defieciency that some humans are born without self respect or individual identity.

Why else would otherwise smart and talented people gather together like lemmings and march towards slavery? Don't tell me you don't see it coming, you can't avoid it. The colonists rebelled, in part because of high taxes, good god, compare taxes now to taxes then and we should have revolted the first time I called for a revolution, forty years ago.

In most cases when a country, relatively free, falls into statism, any form of communism, it is usually accompanied by the use of force, as in Russia, German and Italy. England was different, they voted themselves into socialism in the fifities and fhave not yet recover and perhpas never will.

But never in the history of the world has a free nation allowed political machinations devolve their relatively free society into a hive like existence.

You further do not understand people like me, who will take arms against you at some point where basic freedoms are threatened. Just like the Mintuemen and the Virgina riflemen, we will snipe at you from every direction; once it begins you will never sleep in security ever again until you are in prison.

Long ago I had hopes that it would not require arms to regain liberty, now I know for certain it will.

amicus

 

[CHNOPS]

Oh, good, I was afraid the night would go by without a faux-Libertarian pooping out the trendy "Statism" derp again.

 

[mercury14]

You further do not understand people like me, who will take arms against you at some point where basic freedoms are threatened. Just like the Mintuemen and the Virgina riflemen, we will snipe at you from every direction; once it begins you will never sleep in security ever again until you are in prison.

Long ago I had hopes that it would not require arms to regain liberty, now I know for certain it will.

amicus

You love Democracy except when you're outvoted. Then it's an awful thing and you'll bitch and whine and fantasize about shooting people.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Capitalism is might, and might is always right.

You haven't a clue as to what happens in the mines. Keep quiet on the subject.

You worked there how long?

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Not to mention the monopolies of the shipping companies.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Americans are using more gadgets, televisions and air conditioners than ever before. But, oddly, their electricity use is barely growing, posing a daunting challenge for the nation's utilities.

The Energy Information Administration is projecting that electricity use in the U.S. will rise an average of just 0.6% a year for industrial users and 0.7% for households through 2040.

That's a far cry from the middle decades of the past century, when utilities could rely on electricity consumption growing by more than 8% a year. Even after the Arab oil embargo in 1973, the growth in electricity demand averaged 2% to 4% annually. But those days may be long gone.

Enlarge Image

In response to tepid demand, electricity production in the U.S. fell in 2008 and 2009, amid the recession, then ticked up slightly in 2010 before falling again in 2011.

For decades, electricity use was viewed as a barometer of economic growth, but the link has become less clear cut in recent years, partly because of a big push to make major appliances and other products, such as compact fluorescent lightbulbs and high-efficiency motors, that use less electricity.

The erosion of U.S. manufacturing also has contributed to the consumption slowdown. Industrial electricity use, which includes manufacturing, accounts for about a quarter of the nation's total. From 1998 to 2010, the electricity used for manufacturing fell 18% as industrial processes grew more efficient and companies produced fewer goods in the U.S.

The slower pace of growth in electricity use may be helping the environment, since most of the nation's electricity still comes from burning fossil fuels. But it has power companies scrambling to trim spending or redirect capital investment, to improve their profits regardless of consumption patterns.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323689604578217831371436110.html

Goes to the original point.

I wonder too, if we are measuring what regulated companies produce are we ignoring solar and batteries?

So yes, we are more efficient, but we still continue to require more while producing less...

 

[RobDownSouth]

You love Democracy except when you're outvoted. Then it's an awful thing and you'll bitch and whine and fantasize about shooting people.

When he's outvoted, that...That....THAT'S TYRANNY!

 

[CandiCame]

Capitalism is might, and might is always right.

You haven't a clue as to what happens in the mines. Keep quiet on the subject.

Just wanna say how valid that is.

 

[amicus]

More than anything else, the free market is an excellent expression of finesse and nuancel a lovely combination of knowledge, common sense, intuitiion and a feel for the common rights of all men.

Even in teheera you idiots call 'Robber barons', if you ever took the time to read of Stanford and Rockefeller and many more, the men who electrified the cities, the men who built the railroads andt those who took petroleum from being a medicine, to fuel for the entire world, the mines the architecture, the roads and automobiles, giants of industtry they were, peopole who brought this nation onto the worlds stage and you don't have a clue.

The fellow who bragged about knowing of mines and miners, might have had a relative in the holes, but I doubt even that. I am certain I know more of financing and land acquistion and prospecting for product, creating safety lanes and procedures, marketing and tranporting the product, than anyone else on this shitty forum.

That is because I admire and respect the industries that have made America great, prosperous, independent and proud, uintil you pukes came along with your sissy ways.

amicus

 

[mercury14]

More than anything else, the free market is an excellent expression of finesse and nuancel a lovely combination of knowledge, common sense, intuitiion and a feel for the common rights of all men.

Even in teheera you idiots call 'Robber barons', if you ever took the time to read of Stanford and Rockefeller and many more, the men who electrified the cities, the men who built the railroads andt those who took petroleum from being a medicine, to fuel for the entire world, the mines the architecture, the roads and automobiles, giants of industtry they were, peopole who brought this nation onto the worlds stage and you don't have a clue.

The fellow who bragged about knowing of mines and miners, might have had a relative in the holes, but I doubt even that. I am certain I know more of financing and land acquistion and prospecting for product, creating safety lanes and procedures, marketing and tranporting the product, than anyone else on this shitty forum.

That is because I admire and respect the industries that have made America great, prosperous, independent and proud, uintil you pukes came along with your sissy ways.

amicus

... says the man who has been bilking the taxpayers for his medical care for years.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Has anybody denied that the Robber Barons accomplished great things? They are gone however because America decided monopolies were bad.

I love that I'm apparently some kind of legend spoken of for decades.

 

[amicus]

Has anybody denied that the Robber Barons accomplished great things? They are gone however because America decided monopolies were bad.

I love that I'm apparently some kind of legend spoken of for decades.

~~~

You are? I didn't know that, and I seriously doubt it...

the critics of the giants of industry never ever applaud their achievements and accomplishments... but then, you know that...

By definition, monopolies cannot exist in a free market society if the laws of property are protected.

The instant one tries to monoplize the market, someone else will pop up with a better product at a lower price...that be how it works, dummy.

amicus

 

[Sean Renaud]

~~~

You are? I didn't know that, and I seriously doubt it...

the critics of the giants of industry never ever applaud their achievements and accomplishments... but then, you know that...

By definition, monopolies cannot exist in a free market society if the laws of property are protected.

The instant one tries to monoplize the market, someone else will pop up with a better product at a lower price...that be how it works, dummy.

amicus

You yourself called me the True Believer spoken of in legend. I wonder if my people will recognize me, or if like Jesus only some will and most will ignore me.

LOL. Nobody applauds the achievements of the giants of industry? Are you insane? To this day their names are legendary.

Actually a free market society and laws that prevent monopolies are incompatible. You have one or the other never both.

The Giants of Industry are proof that when one tries to monopolise the market nobody else can compete. And they proved it beyond any reasonable shadow of a doubt. If I own all the railroads you aren't knocking me out, if I own all the steel mills, good luck, so on and so forth. That's how it works in the real world.

Hell even in the black market there are only a few really big players.

 

[KingOrfeo]

You further do not understand people like me, who will take arms against you at some point where basic freedoms are threatened.

No, you won't.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

~~~

You are? I didn't know that, and I seriously doubt it...

the critics of the giants of industry never ever applaud their achievements and accomplishments... but then, you know that...

By definition, monopolies cannot exist in a free market society if the laws of property are protected.

The instant one tries to monoplize the market, someone else will pop up with a better product at a lower price...that be how it works, dummy.

amicus

Or people will go to substitute goods.

It requires the cooperation of government to build and maintain a monopoly.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

You yourself called me the True Believer spoken of in legend. I wonder if my people will recognize me, or if like Jesus only some will and most will ignore me.

LOL. Nobody applauds the achievements of the giants of industry? Are you insane? To this day their names are legendary.

Actually a free market society and laws that prevent monopolies are incompatible. You have one or the other never both.

The Giants of Industry are proof that when one tries to monopolise the market nobody else can compete. And they proved it beyond any reasonable shadow of a doubt. If I own all the railroads you aren't knocking me out, if I own all the steel mills, good luck, so on and so forth. That's how it works in the real world.

Hell even in the black market there are only a few really big players.

Not in legend, in Hoffer. You should read The True Believer which Parallels Peikoff, but even better is The Ordeal of Change.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

You are also wrong about the monopolies and giants proving that you could establish and maintain a monopoly.