Is it non-con if...

[LaRascasse]

One of the parties is stoned out of their mind and not entirely aware where they are or who they are with?

It's not a date-rape or something along those lines. But one of the parties is stoned and the other takes advantage of that, that's all.

 

[slyc_willie]

Probably. Maybe. I guess we'd have to see the story to really make that kind of call.

A lot of it depends on the set-up. If the stoned person as made it known previously that he/she does not want to have sex with the person who later takes advantage of her, then it would probably fall into non-con. If the circumstances are different, then it might just fall into a different category, like EC.

Then again, if the person is stoned in some devious way by the other character, for the purpose of taking advantage of them, then the story could end up in MC.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Its all too complex for my pretty lil head.

I avoid whatever makes Laurel drag out the Ouija board.

 

[NaokoSmith]

Yes it is. Legally that would be non-com and in fact rape. We have recently had a case here in Britain when a footballer and his mate were done for this, although it was alcohol not drugs. If someone is incapable of giving consent, then there was no consent given.

 

[slyc_willie]

Yes it is. Legally that would be non-com and in fact rape. We have recently had a case here in Britain when a footballer and his mate were done for this, although it was alcohol not drugs. If someone is incapable of giving consent, then there was no consent given.

While that's true in the legal definition, when it comes to stories on this site, it may or may not follow through.

Best to just post the story and see where it goes.

 

[sr71plt]

I think Slyc has it right, though. If getting stoned is just part of an intentional process of getting laid too--prior consent--it isn't nonconsent if it happens. Doesn't sound like this is the case here, but the scenario hasn't be fully revealed.

As far as does it have to go in the Nonconsent category, I think that depends on what the dominant elements are in the story.

 

[NaokoSmith]

i think the scenario is that someone takes advantage of someone stoned, which suggests no prior agreement to acts of a secksual nature.

Is it all going to be stream of consciousness non-com? Gosh, I can hardly contain myself!

 

[Handley_Page]

i think the scenario is that someone takes advantage of someone stoned, which suggests no prior agreement to acts of a secksual nature.

Is it all going to be stream of consciousness non-com? Gosh, I can hardly contain myself!

DOWN, Duchess.

 

[Stella_Omega]

One of the parties is stoned out of their mind and not entirely aware where they are or who they are with?

It's not a date-rape or something along those lines. But one of the parties is stoned and the other takes advantage of that, that's all.

Yes, if consent cannot be given it's non con. Asleep, drunk, hypnotised, magic sex pollen...

It's not the kind of non-con people come to the site to read, I imagine?

 

[lovecraft68]

Hate to tell you but you just described date rape. If no consent is or can be given it is non con/rape

The only thing you're sugar coating is there would be no struggle.

 

[sr71plt]

I was waiting for LC to sweep in with his "this is rape" comment. He is, of course, right unless there was a "let's get stoned and you do me while I'm unconscious" agreement up front. It's unlikely there is such an agreement in this story setup.

 

[NaokoSmith]

If this is a small element in a chapter which has a lot of other incidents, would that still have to be put in non-com on this site? I expect there'll be a lot of other goings on in the chapter.

 

[Safe_Bet]

I was waiting for LC to sweep in with his "this is rape" comment. He is, of course, right unless there was a "let's get stoned and you do me while I'm unconscious" agreement up front. It's unlikely there is such an agreement in this story setup.

Yeah... I was waiting for YOU to sweep in with YOUR "know-it-all", pissy, prissiness.

 

[slyc_willie]

If this is a small element in a chapter which has a lot of other incidents, would that still have to be put in non-com on this site? I expect there'll be a lot of other goings on in the chapter.

It depends on the dominant elements in the story. I've had chapters of a series posted in different categories because the action going on met the criteria for those categories. For instance, one chapter was put in Exhibitionism/Voyeurism because the characters were caught having sex outdoors. But the rest of the series was in Erotic Couplings, even though a few elements here and there still took place in semi-public places.

 

[lovecraft68]

I was waiting for LC to sweep in with his "this is rape" comment. He is, of course, right unless there was a "let's get stoned and you do me while I'm unconscious" agreement up front. It's unlikely there is such an agreement in this story setup.

Or maybe they are not totally unconscious and are just screwed up enough for the inhibitions to be down and say, "yeah why not?" That's still taking advantage of in the sense the character knows full well if the girl is straight she would not agree, but if you get that in there it takes away non-consent and just falls under "sleazy"

 

[PennLady]

Hate to tell you but you just described date rape. If no consent is or can be given it is non con/rape

The only thing you're sugar coating is there would be no struggle.

Yes, it is. I believe Laurel has said that the issue in a non-con/reluctance story is that the victim must come around to enjoying the act, to getting some pleasure out of it. I don't know if it's any different if the victim is unconscious.

 

[sr71plt]

That said, it can be done in stories here--just like the illegal incest can be done--and those who don't like it can just not write or read it.

 

[lovecraft68]

That said, it can be done in stories here--just like the illegal incest can be done--and those who don't like it can just not write or read it.

Of course it can. Some writers can be skilled enough to slip it through, but 99% of the time its the fact the stories are not truly screened.

 

[MichaelWest]

Your Mileage May Vary

Well I wrote something similar, one party drugs another, but they drugged themself also. It lowered inhibitions in both parties. I based it on the recreational use of medication a friend does consensually for "rape" play. I merely blurred or removed genuine consent for fiction. I wrote it for her and she was thrilled it was published here.

Frankly I regard it as rape, I put that at the beginning as a disclaimer. I also did not write the actual sex that is implied as imminent because I did not feel having a sex scene would have done anything but glorify the crime. I put notes to Laurel when submitted, it was approved.

 

[sr71plt]

Of course it can. Some writers can be skilled enough to slip it through, but 99% of the time its the fact the stories are not truly screened.

What are you talking about? There's a whole Nonconsent category here. "Slipping it through" isn't an issue.

 

[lovecraft68]

What are you talking about? There's a whole Nonconsent category here. "Slipping it through" isn't an issue.

That's the hypocrisy of the site. As PL stated there does have to be consent and that comes from Laurel as well as the FAQ.

But there is a non consent section.

See how you just made my point?

 

[sr71plt]

That's the hypocrisy of the site. As PL stated there does have to be consent and that comes from Laurel as well as the FAQ.

But there is a non consent section.

See how you just made my point?

And you continue to make a point of your own hypocrisy--going after nonconsent here, which lots of sites permit, while writing and promoting incest, which this is one of the only sites to permit. And you just continue to pretend not to get the hypocrisy of that.

Your "slipping through" post remains an "eh what?"

 

[lovecraft68]

And you continue to make a point of your own hypocrisy--going after nonconsent here, which lots of sites permit, while writing and promoting incest, which this is one of the only sites to permit. And you just continue to pretend not to get the hypocrisy of that.

Your "slipping through" post remains an "eh what?"

Forget about the real world or our opinions.

We're talking what is "legal" here.

Incest is allowed here as long as its 18+ like every other category.

Now walk with me, I promise I'll go slow.

But for non con we have a disclaimer in the FAQ stating the victim at some point needs to enjoy or show consent.

Therefore that is really not non consent is it? No, its not in that instance "reluctance" would be the only name for the category.

But there is a non consent section isn't there?

And how many people post without looking at the rule, especially hidden ones? A lot.

So tell me how many times you have seen this. A writer posts that he has a story rejected. He does not understand why, but apparently it had rape in there someone tells him.

Now he scratches his head and says, but there is a non con section!

Someone states "the rule" to them.

They then say "But I looked and there are tons of these stories!"

Now we get two answers,

One the truth. Laurel happened to be paying attention that day and rejected it or she makes an occasional "example" to keep up the facade she cares.

Second and the one I love "Don't like it leave"

The reason for my "slip between the cracks" remark is by definition here any rape story must have fallen in between the cracks because they are not supposed to be here!

Bullshit of course. They are more than welcome here which I'm fine with, freedom of speech and all, but it would be nice for the site not to talk out of both sides of its mouth and pretend they don't welcome them.

This is the same CYA as the underage rule. Its not illegal and its not the law its the site leery of what type of crowd comes here (pedophiles) with the feds right on there heels

So what type comes here for hardcore rape stories? Hmmm

Trust me the feds have this site flagged as much for those as they do underage. They can;t do anything about it because it is fiction, but they are watching. Big brother always is.

 

[sr71plt]

Naw, I have no interest in taking that walk with you for the 165th time. Just another one of your tiresome bull dog issues--with you up to your neck in hypocrisy.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I was waiting for LC to sweep in with his "this is rape" comment. He is, of course, right unless there was a "let's get stoned and you do me while I'm unconscious" agreement up front. It's unlikely there is such an agreement in this story setup.

yes, although I have read a few stories like this-- and been thinking about a set up in which one person makes a request to be blackmailed, and deliberately provides the material...