Someone want to explain "Social Justice" to me?

[zipman]

You posted page after page of whacked-out erroneous "Christian" crap and when you get called out on it, you completed reversed your position and ran away.

Lightweight.

I think it's hysterical how both of them know "the truth" and yet they both think the other one is wrong.

 

[eyer]

I perceive biblical "hell" to be finally knowing that the God of the bible lives, in fact, as the loving father he proclaims to be...

...but then never being able to have a relationship with him because I chose not to believe that truth when I was given the chance.

If I didn't believe in God, he and "hell" would matter to me as little as "ufos" do, and I'd participate in discussions about God in direct relation to my belief in him, just as I don't take part in ufo matters because they hold no interest whatsoever to me.

So, I cannot imagine pontificating for more than just a few seconds to a ufo-believer how screwed-up his belief in ufos is...

...unless I truly wasn't sure about my own belief on the subject.

The reason I believe in God is simply because I know of no other HOPE that offers the compassion, the love, the righteousness for which my heart naturally yearns...

...all things which this physical world is truly so bereft of.

I've asked many people if they've ever truly known unconditional love...from anyone: parents, wife, children, etc. (Personally, I believe the closest I've ever come to unconditional love is that of my paternal grandmother, although being her grandson most likely tipped the scale a bit). I know without any doubt that I do not love unconditionally, and I've never met another person who I feel does, either.

Just a couple of days ago I asked a young man who says he believes in God if he's ever known unconditional love, either from another or possessing it himself; he didn't hesitate hardly at all before shaking his head no and, after further questioning to explore the accuracy of his feeling, I believed him.

But we all - I believe - have at some time during our lives experienced the unique event of simple human love - eros - an occurrence so real in this physical world that it can melt the very essence of so many hearts. But the love of God - agape - is written to be so unconditional that humans can only dream of it , can only hope for it while doing time here on earth.

I've tasted the best love this world has to offer and it's always been conditional - a fact that does not bother me so much since I understand the natural entropy of this physical world, anyway. My heart longs for unconditional love, though, as much as my lungs long for breathable air, yet this world cannot give me the former...

...thus my heart and soul are filled with HOPE that there is a God who loves unconditionally.

I truly do not believe that God cares how much anyone preaches the bible, how "good" a life anyone lives, how much anyone goes to church, how much money anyone donates to "worthy" causes...

...it seems to me God's only concern is if one's heart truly yearns for his unconditional love; I sincerely believe that is what "saves" us - or not. And, it is written, only God knows any man's heart.

It is also written that God unconditionally loves us and that he intentionally gives us the free will to choose to freely love him - or not...

Have you ever loved another who doesn't return the feeling to you? Even if you "win" them over somehow, they will never love you of their own free will. What kind of a true relationship is that? One-sided at best, as far as love is concerned, and soulfully damaging at worst.

But what kind of magic happens when two fall heads-over-heels in love with each other by their own free wills? Is there a more magical occurrence in human existence at all? When the admiration and respect for each other is as fresh as that new bloom of human love, is there anything else which comes as close to making humans feel truly alive for a purpose?

Has someone ever professed their love for you, but - for whatever reason - you did not reciprocate at the time? And then, later, you realize that person's love for you is exactly what your heart has been longing for all these years you've been searching without success?

So you backtrack and seek out that missed love again - only to discover that a meaningful relationship with the true love of your entire life is no longer possible at all; that, in fact, there are no other fish in the sea, and you are therefore sentenced to the rest of your life knowing you'll never have the only thing you truly need and want...

...that seems like "hell" to me.

I do not understand at all how the things of this world could've been created from nothing; even using a natural man's logic, that is an impossibility. Human love is one of those things that, although materially impossible to prove, I have no doubt is a some sort of creation nonetheless.

It is written that man is made in God's image, and I've always been able to naturally recognize the vital distinction between the man in the photo booth and the imperfect image which is made of him.

It is also written that God's love is unconditional, so is it possible that imperfect human love is simply an image of his, too?

If there is no God and there is no meaning to our human lifetimes here on earth, I will die and become wormfood just like everyone else and will not be any worse off...

...but if there's even a possibility that there is a God whose unconditional love will grace me with the realization of the unconditional love my heart naturally yearns for, and enables me to finally posses unconditional love to give to someone (anyone, everyone) else that empowers true relationships which have no end...

...you can bet your sweet butt I'm placing all of my HOPE on that horse.

Like I said:

Bad news for me will be a mere bubble pop, while bad news for an unbeliever will be eternity without a relationship with any truth at all.

Al Pacino played the Devil in a movie the name of which I now forget, but he had a picture on his place of business wall which was meant to represent what "hell" was like...

...it was a "live", "interactive" mural of humans all scrunched tightly together, naked, barely able to wiggle, they were so crowed together; the misery of their eternal, so-tight confinement voiced in their wretched moanings of absolute grief knowing the truth which actually existed was forever denied to them because of their unbelief.

David Wilkerson was the real-life preacher who Pat Boone portrayed in The Cross and the Switchblade; Wilkerson was also the founder of Times Square Church and was its senior pastor until he died in a car crash a year or so ago...

...Wilkerson posited that "hell" was simply being stuck with the eternal understanding that the absolute misery one would experience would all be prefaced upon the constant realization that all one had to do to avoid such an unbearable fate was to "just believe".

A picture I imagine of "hell" is one constantly banging his head against the wall with no respite, eternally...

...thanks, but no thanks.

 

[LadyVer]

Interesting, eyer. Reminds me of a play by Sartre.I can relate to a lot of what you said.

 

[eyer]

You posted page after page of whacked-out erroneous "Christian" crap and when you get called out on it, you completed reversed your position and ran away.

Lightweight.

Why don't you do one of your infamous investigations on my words concerning "Christian", "Christians", "Christianity", and "religion"...

...and then come back and report how your take on my position has nothing to do with truth at all.

It's all archived right here on LIT: you don't have to go anywhere else to fabricate your "called out on it" for me...

...like you've so failingly done with jenin and vetteman recently (your total disdain for truth is evidenced in your complete lack of embarrassment for your total lack of substance to charges your insecure ego needs to make to feel even somehow equal to those two).

You can do that...

...can't you, hotdog?


Yeah...

...I didn't think so.

 

[badbabysitter]

eyer loves his God so much, that he has shown his hate for others that love a God different than his


he finds no forgiveness for other people... because only God can forgive... therefore he's free to be a douchebag

he's such a fucking hypocrite.. it astounds me.. no matter how flowery he gets about it

 

[LadyVer]

eyer loves his God so much, that he has shown his hate for others that love a God different than his


he finds no forgiveness for other people... because only God can forgive... therefore he's free to be a douchebag

he's such a fucking hypocrite.. it astounds me.. no matter how flowery he gets about it

There are a lot of people on the gb who say their truth is the only truth, from both the left and right, and if one doesn't agree with them, they feel they have the right to be as venomous as they can. This is par for the gb. I try to stay out of it myself and just have fun. Of course my definition of fun seems to annoy both the left and the right.

 

[badbabysitter]

There are a lot of people on the gb who say their truth is the only truth, from both the left and right, and if one doesn't agree with them, they feel they have the right to be as venomous as they can. This is par for the gb. I try to stay out of it myself and just have fun. Of course my definition of fun seems to annoy both the left and the right.

I don't care about eyer's belief structuure

I bleieve in God too

what pisses me off his how much of a liar , a hypocrite and a coward he is

he put me on iggy because I called him on his hypocrisy concerning his religon and his outright lies about abortion and PlannedParenthood

that brings him to being a coward


for such a man of god, he shows no love or respect for anyone's whose opinion differs from him


Jesus had some interesting things to say about hypocrites.. i think eyer is in for a big surprise in the afterlife

 

[LadyVer]

I don't care about eyer's belief structuure

I bleieve in God too

what pisses me off his how much of a liar , a hypocrite and a coward he is

he put me on iggy because I called him on his hypocrisy concerning his religon and his outright lies about abortion and PlannedParenthood

that brings him to being a coward

for such a man of god, he shows no love or respect for anyone's whose opinion differs from him

Jesus had some interesting things to say about hypocrites.. i think eyer is in for a big surprise in the afterlife

I think for those of us who believe that we're all going to be surprised when our time is up here. It's also too easy to judge and condemn others over a comment made on a gb thread., and this applies to everyone. I can only imagine how many people on the gb have igged. me from both the left and right. Part ofbbeing on the gb.

 

[NeonSubtlety]

Wait. Was "mob rule" not the right answer?

 

[Ishmael]

My oh my, what twists and turns this thread has taken.

It's no surprise to me that the thread has taken on more of an aspect of a theological debate mainly because "social justice" is primarily a theological concept although a few philosophers, such as John Rawls briefly mentioned in this thread, have tried to secularize the notion.

I note with some irony that a few posters that are agnostic at best, practicing atheists at worst, have joined the fray. About the only thing that could top that would be for DCL to jump in and start delivering theological sermons. And even those that are true believers can't quite seem to agree as to what constitutes 'social justice.'

That brings us to the point of having to ask exactly how much influence should a secular nation allow theological philosophy to drive policy? Exactly how seriously should we take the Roman Catholic notion of 'social justice'? A notion being put forth by an institution that proscribes gayness and contraception. Or that of Islam, a religion that on top of the Roman Catholic proscriptions, has a laundry list of how slaves should be treated?

Ishmael

 

[Lancecastor]

That brings us to the point of having to ask exactly how much influence should a secular nation allow theological philosophy to drive policy?
Ishmael

I think you want to get eyer in on this...he has deep insights.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Cone

Wright

Social Justice...

It's the religion of the Plantation House: 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

 

[Ishmael]

I think you want to get eyer in on this...he has deep insights.

I'm holding out for DCL. *chuckle*

Ishmael

 

[PoppingTom]

Exactly how seriously should we take the Roman Catholic notion of 'social justice'?

Is 'Roman Catholic' your new cuss? Like communist, liberal, socialist, guvment advocado?

Hitler once said "If there were no jews, we had to invent them."

 

[cjh]

You cannot avoid the overlap between theology and rights.

Whether inalienable rights flow from God has been debated for centuries.

 

[julybaby04]

So sorry to have been absent from the discussion...***** does tend to go on even as the world's problems are being hashed out on here.

I doubt there is anything that I could say that would make a difference to any of you, so, I will just say.....we have different views on most everything, including social justice.

What is just to one is not necessarily just to another. Therein lies the divide that is evident in this country. Arguing about it on here does no good.

I have my belief in God, which you all know.....I have things I don't agree with...which you know. There are those on here that prefer no boundaries in their life...and that is completely their choice.

There will never be agreement here and arguing, name-calling, insults, etc doesn't make one more "right". Perhaps just agreeing to disagree is best.

 

[mustang200]

In a society where one kid goes to an elite school and the other one has to go to a failed one based on who their parents are is socially unjust in that way.

So, then, you support school choice and vouchers?

 

[LadyVer]

So sorry to have been absent from the discussion...***** does tend to go on even as the world's problems are being hashed out on here.

I doubt there is anything that I could say that would make a difference to any of you, so, I will just say.....we have different views on most everything, including social justice.

What is just to one is not necessarily just to another. Therein lies the divide that is evident in this country. Arguing about it on here does no good.

I have my belief in God, which you all know.....I have things I don't agree with...which you know. There are those on here that prefer no boundaries in their life...and that is completely their choice.

There will never be agreement here and arguing, name-calling, insults, etc doesn't make one more "right". Perhaps just agreeing to disagree is best.

 

[BotanyBoy]

So sorry to have been absent from the discussion...***** does tend to go on even as the world's problems are being hashed out on here.

I doubt there is anything that I could say that would make a difference to any of you, so, I will just say.....we have different views on most everything, including social justice.

What is just to one is not necessarily just to another. Therein lies the divide that is evident in this country. Arguing about it on here does no good.

I have my belief in God, which you all know.....I have things I don't agree with...which you know. There are those on here that prefer no boundaries in their life...and that is completely their choice.

There will never be agreement here and arguing, name-calling, insults, etc doesn't make one more "right". Perhaps just agreeing to disagree is best.

So...you just don't want to admit you love big gov as long as it's shoveling your brand of shit on everyone else, noted.

 

[KingOrfeo]

That brings us to the point of having to ask exactly how much influence should a secular nation allow theological philosophy to drive policy?

That's pretty much ineluctable in such a deeply religious culture. E.g., practically all the important social/political reforms in America from mid-19th-Century Abolitionism through the Progressive Era were rooted in Protestant postmillennialism (the idea that Jesus won't come back until after we here on Earth establish a thousand-year period of social justice -- contrast premillennialism, which is the idea behind any "The End Times Are At Hand!" warning you ever heard). Not that all those reforms were wise -- they included Prohibition -- but, none was for that reason contrary to the letter or spirit of the First Amendment. Citizens' sense of ethics, values, morality, drive all social/political change, and those are things rooted ultimately in religious belief for most.

 

[KingOrfeo]

So, then, you support school choice and vouchers?

Equalization of public-school funding would probably suffice. Why should the 'burbs have better schools than the inner city?

 

[Sean]

Equalization of public-school funding would probably suffice. Why should the 'burbs have better schools than the inner city?

Because people in the burbs are better at working the system.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Equalization of public-school funding would probably suffice. Why should the 'burbs have better schools than the inner city?

Negative, as long as that school does not have to compete for it's student base (and thus funding) we will continue to have shit education. They even figured this out in numerous EU nations....competition, it works.

 

[VaticanAssassin]

My oh my, what twists and turns this thread has taken.

It's no surprise to me that the thread has taken on more of an aspect of a theological debate mainly because "social justice" is primarily a theological concept although a few philosophers, such as John Rawls briefly mentioned in this thread, have tried to secularize the notion.

I note with some irony that a few posters that are agnostic at best, practicing atheists at worst, have joined the fray. About the only thing that could top that would be for DCL to jump in and start delivering theological sermons. And even those that are true believers can't quite seem to agree as to what constitutes 'social justice.'

That brings us to the point of having to ask exactly how much influence should a secular nation allow theological philosophy to drive policy? Exactly how seriously should we take the Roman Catholic notion of 'social justice'? A notion being put forth by an institution that proscribes gayness and contraception. Or that of Islam, a religion that on top of the Roman Catholic proscriptions, has a laundry list of how slaves should be treated?

Ishmael

How the rats get to the end of the maze is always more interesting than the fact that they got there.......

 

[julybaby04]

Equalization of public-school funding would probably suffice. Why should the 'burbs have better schools than the inner city?

Do you think funding is the problem with the schools?