Charity has use for 50 Shades

[PennLady]

So I found this...

http://www.salon.com/2012/11/05/charity_to_use_fifty_shades_of_grey_as_toilet_paper/

And well, that's one way to handle things.

 

[sr71plt]

Umm, OK. I would think the paper would be a little rough for that. The women would remember the books longer then they probably are worth.

 

[PennLady]

Umm, OK. I would think the paper would be a little rough for that. The women would remember the books longer then they probably are worth.

Yeah, I had a similar thought. The composting idea seemed better.

 

[lovecraft68]

This could be pretty messy.

The plot was so thin I'm sure their fingers will go right through it.

Otherwise nice to see an organization declaring this thing for it what it really is. The glorification of abuse (I still believe unintentionally, but it is what it is)

Now people can get off my ass for thinking I'm the only one that thinks this.

 

[PennLady]

This could be pretty messy.

The plot was so thin I'm sure their fingers will go right through it.

Otherwise nice to see an organization declaring this thing for it what it really is. The glorification of abuse (I still believe unintentionally, but it is what it is)

Now people can get off my ass for thinking I'm the only one that thinks this.

You're not the only one, and I don't think anyone ever said that. There are lots of things wrong with the book -- although I agree I think it's unintentional -- but that won't stop people from reading and liking them.

 

[lovecraft68]

You're not the only one, and I don't think anyone ever said that. There are lots of things wrong with the book -- although I agree I think it's unintentional -- but that won't stop people from reading and liking them.

Not so much on this forum, and a lot by PM. I seem to have picked up a pair of "stalkers" Its really bizarre because neither have any actual posts, but both have sent me multiple pm's and fairly nasty.

For James I feel certainly unintentional.

I really think she was going for a romanticized d/s relationship. But James is so far off the mark with the mental/emotional aspects of d/s or BDSM that what she ends up with is

A female lead that is a clueless hapless victim, truly the type of naive girl who ends up with the wrong guy

A "dom" who because he was whacked around as a kid now gets off on being mean to women.

She missed the mark by a mile, but through lack of skill rather than any ill intent.


What's strange is as time goes on there has been more negativity coming out about the book, but I'm sure its continuing to sell. I went to a munch a couple of months ago, first one I have been to in quite a while and there were a lot of newbies there.

One of the old timers was reading excerpts from shades as examples of "this is what we are not"

Must be the republicans buying it

 

[Stella_Omega]

I hope they make lots and lots of money for their charity. Maybe they can offer a salary to a female writer who can grab the same attention that James did-- while writing porn with a better message.

Because the answer to the bad message in 50 Shades is not ranting about how bad it is and detailing all the ways-- it's getting more "erotic-thrillers" out there for women, so that there is a percieved choice.

And lovecraft? We've talked about this. James's intention was never to romanticise D/s. It was to give the heroine a battle to win-- to call on the myth that a man can be changed and healed by True Love.

 

[lovecraft68]

I hope they make lots and lots of money for their charity. Maybe they can offer a salary to a female writer who can grab the same attention that James did-- while writing porn with a better message.

Because the answer to the bad message in 50 Shades is not ranting about how bad it is and detailing all the ways-- it's getting more "erotic-thrillers" out there for women, so that there is a percieved choice.

And lovecraft? We've talked about this. James's intention was never to romanticise D/s. It was to give the heroine a battle to win-- to call on the myth that a man can be changed and healed by True Love.

I duly note your point. You see where I said unintentional and no ill intent.

What came out because of her lack of characterization and skill is the scary message that all guys like Gray really mean well, and he did not really change at the end, she was just to naive to see the life time of restraining orders and abuse in her future.

Speaking of erotica with a better message or at least much better storyline and more accurate. Dom of my dreams was a series here that is now doing very well on kindle. Far better than Shades.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Speaking of erotica with a better message or at least much better storyline and more accurate. Dom of my dreams was a series here that is now doing very well on kindle. Far better than Shades.

you mean this one?

I dunno. From the reviews, it sounds like exactly the same trash as fifty shades.

 

[Anjasa]

I wish they hadn't made Christian such a stalker. I really don't think the book would have all that bad of a message if he didn't always know where she was, who she was with, where she lived, etc.

I never read the second one, but apparently he bought out the company she got an internship for? That's really... just appalling.

I really liked his character aside from that - he was fucked up and doing his best to try to deal with it. I can really appreciate that. I can even appreciate his desire to be in control, but conflating that the above is just... creepy and scary.

I wish it had been toned back.

Also holy hell I would have rather read about his relationship with any other woman than Anastasia.

 

[RodenAddison]

50 Shades? You mean the one subtitled "Taming of the Dom"?

 

[lovecraft68]

I wish they hadn't made Christian such a stalker. I really don't think the book would have all that bad of a message if he didn't always know where she was, who she was with, where she lived, etc.

I never read the second one, but apparently he bought out the company she got an internship for? That's really... just appalling.

I really liked his character aside from that - he was fucked up and doing his best to try to deal with it. I can really appreciate that. I can even appreciate his desire to be in control, but conflating that the above is just... creepy and scary.

I wish it had been toned back.

Also holy hell I would have rather read about his relationship with any other woman than Anastasia.

What that really was, was a TPE relationship.

Not that James would know what that was, but that is what it turned out to be.

The difference is in r/l a TPE is a willing exchange, not some sack of shit deliberately trying to own someone.

My daughter's girlfriend mentioned at a party she'd love to meet a Christian Gray. Her mother, who'd also read it (mom/daughter bonding!) told her, no she really didn't.

The older women get it for what it is. The younger or naive women think this POS is the new ideal they should be looking for.

The attraction to the bad boy is not a new concept, but generally the bad boy is not portrayed as perfection personified.

Gray was also a pretty pansy bad boy anyway, if you ask me. Makes the guy from Twilight look tough.

 

[gentledemands]

.......

 

[Stella_Omega]

Gray was also a pretty pansy bad boy anyway, if you ask me. Makes the guy from Twilight look tough.

yeah, what's up with the way women write about guys? As all of you men know, (since you say it so often) women evolved to desire big buff hero type men. But when they write for themselves they don't write guys that way too much. They write kinda normal-sized men, as often as not.

I don't get it.

 

[lovecraft68]

yeah, what's up with the way women write about guys? As all of you men know, (since you say it so often) women evolved to desire big buff hero type men. But when they write for themselves they don't write guys that way too much. They write kinda normal-sized men, as often as not.

I don't get it.

Most women I know like normal sized men especially down there . In reality, most women don;t crave the enormous cock Gray supposedly had, he was also not described as large so all I can think of is Tommy Lee.

Being "bad" has nothing to do with size. I thought Gray was a lame bad boy, he went though life buying every thing, including her.

 

[lovecraft68]

I agree. Seemed to me to be about 5' 8" slender guy with a Napoleon complex.

Crap, I'm only like 5'8"

Not too slender though.

 

[MsQuote]

Ha! Pretty funny!

I thought the Fifty Shades series was a lot of crap. I think there were a lot of things that would have made it better and more plausible and believable. I wish Ana and Christian were older. I wish Ana wasn't a 21-year-old virgin who turns into a submissive nymph overnight. I wish Christian wasn't a 27-year-old self-made billionaire. And that's just for starters.

However, what I like best about the Fifty Shades series is that it opened up women to admit to and be comfortable with their erotic selves.

 

[RodenAddison]

.........

 

[Wyldfire]

Okay my non consentual two cents here. Honestly the biggest ctitics to the fifty shades series are the folks in the life style. Can a book really be called bad if it sells to as many readers as it has? Okay here come the "artists" to bash it and decry all the wrong in it. Know what, you're sour grapes people. Write a "better" book if you know so much. Make more money than the author who wrote fifty shades did. Can't? Why not? Is it that the misbegotten ignorant readers won't get it?

Again, just my non consentual two cents...... And for the trecord, no I haven't read them, but I have a few friends that rave about them....

 

[Stella_Omega]

The books are godawful as far as writing. Godawful as depictions of a lifestyle.

Fantastically good as cheap porn. For the women who got off on them, they were worth every penny.

And that's all that matters when you buy porn.

 

[Wyldfire]

The books are godawful as far as writing. Godawful as depictions of a lifestyle.

Fantastically good as cheap porn. For the women who got off on them, they were worth every penny.

And that's all that matters when you buy porn.

Yep. So why are so many so down on it? If you're in the lifestyle you know better. If you're an English major, you know better. So why make a public
display of whining about it? It made more people happy than unhappy.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Yep. So why are so many so down on it? If you're in the lifestyle you know better. If you're an English major, you know better. So why make a public
display of whining about it? It made more people happy than unhappy.

heh, some men can't stand the idea of some other man making THEIR woman happy. Not even a fictional one.

some people believe that women should be ashamed of themselves for reading cheap porn and enjoying it so much.

Some women feel that this book offers a regressive message and that (other) women will be influenced to set aside feminism on account of how sexy abuse is. (I think we don't have to worry about that one, as this recent election showed)

Some men believe that women should gt off on the same kind of porn that they do, and anything that uses the term "down there" is for weenies. (and I am sure are befuddled because whatever it is that makes the book so sexy to women is invisible to their eyes)

Some people are shocked that this book flew under their NYT book list radar, making ALL OF THOSE SALES before the Times even heard of it.

 

[gentledemands]

heh, some men can't stand the idea of some other man making THEIR woman happy. Not even a fictional one.

some people believe that women should be ashamed of themselves for reading cheap porn and enjoying it so much.

Some women feel that this book offers a regressive message and that (other) women will be influenced to set aside feminism on account of how sexy abuse is. (I think we don't have to worry about that one, as this recent election showed)

Some men believe that women should gt off on the same kind of porn that they do, and anything that uses the term "down there" is for weenies. (and I am sure are befuddled because whatever it is that makes the book so sexy to women is invisible to their eyes)

Some people are shocked that this book flew under their NYT book list radar, making ALL OF THOSE SALES before the Times even heard of it.

It was an amazing exercise in marketing. All three books released within two weeks of each other. The hype carried most of it. I know two guys who bought the three book set for their wives. One of them was thanked... the other is still dealing with the fallout. "This is what you want from me?"

 

[PennLady]

It was an amazing exercise in marketing. All three books released within two weeks of each other. The hype carried most of it. I know two guys who bought the three book set for their wives. One of them was thanked... the other is still dealing with the fallout. "This is what you want from me?"

But the books had been written long before that, and were a huge internet fanfiction sensation. I suppose there was little point in spacing out the releases too much, since the original material was still out there.

For the second gift-giver: oh dear.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Yep. So why are so many so down on it? If you're in the lifestyle you know better. If you're an English major, you know better. So why make a public
display of whining about it? It made more people happy than unhappy.

I'm not entirely on board with the "50 Shades" backlash - I get the impression some of it comes from people who are horrified by the idea of women liking porn.

That said, BDSMers don't always have the option of simply ignoring a badly-written book about BDSM. They may well "know better" themselves (I certainly hope they do!) but they still have to deal with other people's misconceptions.

A few years back I needed to see a therapist about matters relating to my love life. Some of the unconventional aspects came up, and I discovered that she was carrying around a whole heap of assumptions about that stuff: "don't you think this is a symptom of something wrong with you? No, really? Well, let's talk about it some more instead of dealing with the issues you actually needed to address."

Whether it's "you're only gay because you didn't get the right role models as a kid", or "you're only poly because of deep-seated insecurities about relationships", or "you only do BDSM because you've been traumatised", the whole "we can cure you of that" response is REALLY unhelpful, especially when it's coming from friends/family/professionals. It's not that easy to ignore when it hits you at a vulnerable moment.

edit: plus, things like custody disputes.