Obama Embarrasses America Again

[unregistered]

 

[bra_man69]

They misunderstood him

 

[oneworldlyguy]

I'll tell you- as a person who has spent a lot of time abroad... people around the world are still pretty excited about Obama- whereas when we had Bush, all people could ask me was "How did you elect such an idiot?"

And I never had a good answer.

 

[renard_ruse]

This is just more political correctness gone haywire. Polish death camps obviously means death camps located in Poland which is simply a factual statement.

I don't enjoy defending Obama, but PC sucks regardless. We shouldn't have to worry about every word that comes out of our mouths because some morons might misinterpret it.

 

[renard_ruse]

I'll tell you- as a person who has spent a lot of time abroad... people around the world are still pretty excited about Obama- whereas when we had Bush, all people could ask me was "How did you elect such an idiot?"

And I never had a good answer.

And foreigners loved Reagan. Times change, who cares.

And who do you talk to, social democrats and people on the left in their respective countries? I think that makes a difference as well. And what part of the world?

 

[phrodeau]

(edited)

How many times has Obama "misspoke?"

Maybe we should do a one-to-one comparison with Bush. That would be good for a laugh.

 

[unregistered]

 

[bra_man69]

Please give us a break, the President who claimed to visit 57 states would surpass all others.

Top this one
Remember the I pod he gave the queen loaded with his books

 

[Ldy_Sea]

Maybe we should do a one-to-one comparison with Bush. That would be good for a laugh.

Now that would be funnier than Dave Barry.

This is just more political correctness gone haywire. Polish death camps obviously means death camps located in Poland which is simply a factual statement.

I don't enjoy defending Obama, but PC sucks regardless. We shouldn't have to worry about every word that comes out of our mouths because some morons might misinterpret it.

Sorry RR I must disagree, diplomacy relies heavily on language and phrasing. Slight differences in word choice and phrasing make a big difference in international politics.

There is a big difference between Polish death camps which implies these camps were run by the Polish government and Nazi death camps in Nazi occupied Poland.

If it was 2 guys at the corner bar talking, the phrasing wouldn't mean shit, but when it's the "leader fo the free world" speaking on behalf of this country it's a huge deal. Whoever wrote that speech needs to be fired, and an apology issued. This is more than just PC run amok, or a left/right issue, it is an insult to the Polish people, especially those who were part of the resistance, and those who activly helped cause the fall of the Iron Curtain.

 

[TexasWife25]

A side by side comparison Bush v Obama would give this thread what it lacks, pazazz.

 

[Ldy_Sea]

Yeah but too many people would say tl;dr

 

[unregistered]

 

[njlauren]

Obama was factually correct, the death camps that have been immortalized were in Poland (Auschwitz, Bergen-Belsen, etc). They weren't run by the Poles obviously, but technically he was correct in that they were located in Poland.


The outcry also has basis in a historical fact, that Poles themselves are uncomfortable talking about the holocaust because while the death camps were a Nazi product, there were shadows in Poland itself, where anti semitism was widespread, not surprisingly considering the Poles are very religious, Roman Catholic and the church itself was not exactly great when it came to anti semitism. One of the most famous incidents of anti semitism fell firmly on the shoulders of the Poles, at a town called Jedwabbne. After the Germans invaded Poland and the collapse of the Polish government, and before the germans could occupy Jedwabbne and other towns, the people of those towns went on an anti semitic pogrom, at Jedwabne I believe 1500 or 1600 Jews were murdered, literally the entire Jewish population of the village, and the same thing happened other places. And while there were brave people in Poland including priests and nuns, who acted to try and save their Jewish citizens, hiding them, helping them escape to the forests where Jews were hiding, priests giving them false baptism papers indicating they were Catholic, people hiding Jewish children pretending they were their own, there also was a lot of indifference and many cases where Poles turned in their Jewish neighbors willingly. After the war, Polish victims of the holocaust who attempted to go home often found violence and more then a few times death from their former neighbors, who among other things blamed them for what the Nazis had done, and some estimates of deaths go in the tens of thousands.

The Poles themselves were victims of the war and they took terrible casualties from both the Nazis and from the Russians as well, proportionally even leaving the jewish victims of the holocaust after it (polish jews were 2 million of the 6 million Jews slaughtered) they took a large percentage hit and deserve acknowledgment of that fact. However, the Poles have also spent the last 67 years denying what the Poles themselves did with their Jewish neighbors, they emphasize the righteous gentiles and such (which they should) but they also have spent that time denying that anti semitism was widespread or that the holocaust in Poland itself wouldn't have been so efficient without the help of a lot of Poles (which was true all over Europe I might add). Because of that, they are quite sensitive for anything that can be construed of blaming the Poles for complicity in what happened to the Jews, their official position was it was all the Nazis, that Poles loved their Jewish neighbors and so forth but were powerless, and that simply isn't true.

 

[Liar]

America must have serious esteem issues if it gets embarrassed by silly nonsense like this. A country comfortable with itself would shrug and move on.

Or wait, maybe I'm not describing America here, merely some of it's less confident citizens...

 

[koalabear]

Obama was factually correct, the death camps that have been immortalized were in Poland (Auschwitz, Bergen-Belsen, etc). They weren't run by the Poles obviously, but technically he was correct in that they were located in Poland.


The outcry also has basis in a historical fact, that Poles themselves are uncomfortable talking about the holocaust because while the death camps were a Nazi product, there were shadows in Poland itself, where anti semitism was widespread, not surprisingly considering the Poles are very religious, Roman Catholic and the church itself was not exactly great when it came to anti semitism. One of the most famous incidents of anti semitism fell firmly on the shoulders of the Poles, at a town called Jedwabbne. After the Germans invaded Poland and the collapse of the Polish government, and before the germans could occupy Jedwabbne and other towns, the people of those towns went on an anti semitic pogrom, at Jedwabne I believe 1500 or 1600 Jews were murdered, literally the entire Jewish population of the village, and the same thing happened other places. And while there were brave people in Poland including priests and nuns, who acted to try and save their Jewish citizens, hiding them, helping them escape to the forests where Jews were hiding, priests giving them false baptism papers indicating they were Catholic, people hiding Jewish children pretending they were their own, there also was a lot of indifference and many cases where Poles turned in their Jewish neighbors willingly. After the war, Polish victims of the holocaust who attempted to go home often found violence and more then a few times death from their former neighbors, who among other things blamed them for what the Nazis had done, and some estimates of deaths go in the tens of thousands.

The Poles themselves were victims of the war and they took terrible casualties from both the Nazis and from the Russians as well, proportionally even leaving the jewish victims of the holocaust after it (polish jews were 2 million of the 6 million Jews slaughtered) they took a large percentage hit and deserve acknowledgment of that fact. However, the Poles have also spent the last 67 years denying what the Poles themselves did with their Jewish neighbors, they emphasize the righteous gentiles and such (which they should) but they also have spent that time denying that anti semitism was widespread or that the holocaust in Poland itself wouldn't have been so efficient without the help of a lot of Poles (which was true all over Europe I might add). Because of that, they are quite sensitive for anything that can be construed of blaming the Poles for complicity in what happened to the Jews, their official position was it was all the Nazis, that Poles loved their Jewish neighbors and so forth but were powerless, and that simply isn't true.

Luckily they were not located in one of our 57 States.

 

[Ldy_Sea]

America must have serious esteem issues if it gets embarrassed by silly nonsense like this. A country comfortable with itself would shrug and move on.

Or wait, maybe I'm not describing America here, merely some of it's less confident citizens...

Silly nonsense to the average person. Serious insults in international politics, which is silly nonsense to the average person.

 

[bra_man69]

Don't forget the 25 movie DVDs he gave to Gordon Brown while Brown gave him an "ornamental pen holder made from the timbers of the Victorian anti-slave ship HMS Gannet and a first edition of the seven-volume biography of Churchill by Sir Martin Gilbert, among other things."

Navy corpse man

 

[off2bed]

"We don’t need another political fight about ending a woman’s right to choose, or getting rid of Planned Parenthood or taking away affordable birth control. We don’t need that. I want women to control their own health choices, just like I want my daughters to have the same economic opportunities as my sons."

He actually said that twice, in different speeches recently. Apparently he thinks he's God.

 

[KRCummings]

I hope loses in November just so you idiots will shut the fuck up about stupid petty bullshit like this.

 

[Liar]

Silly nonsense to the average person. Serious insults in international politics, which is silly nonsense to the average person.

And, apparently, serious insult in partisan domestic political outrage-land. Probany there moreso than in Poland despite the nice tweet collection on Buzzfeed. Them Polskis have had worse things happen to them, and have already gotten their mea culpa. They'll walk it off.

 

[Liar]

"We don’t need another political fight about ending a woman’s right to choose, or getting rid of Planned Parenthood or taking away affordable birth control. We don’t need that. I want women to control their own health choices, just like I want my daughters to have the same economic opportunities as my sons."

He actually said that twice, in different speeches recently. Apparently he thinks he's God.

Or maybe he knows something TMZ doesn't... Yet?

 

[KRCummings]

Wanna know how I know Lit has gone downhill? Not one pollock joke.

 

[miles]

Maybe we should do a one-to-one comparison with Bush. That would be good for a laugh.

Math and current events obviously aren't two of your strengths.

 

[renard_ruse]

Obama was factually correct, the death camps that have been immortalized were in Poland (Auschwitz, Bergen-Belsen, etc). They weren't run by the Poles obviously, but technically he was correct in that they were located in Poland.


The outcry also has basis in a historical fact, that Poles themselves are uncomfortable talking about the holocaust because while the death camps were a Nazi product, there were shadows in Poland itself, where anti semitism was widespread, not surprisingly considering the Poles are very religious, Roman Catholic and the church itself was not exactly great when it came to anti semitism. One of the most famous incidents of anti semitism fell firmly on the shoulders of the Poles, at a town called Jedwabbne. After the Germans invaded Poland and the collapse of the Polish government, and before the germans could occupy Jedwabbne and other towns, the people of those towns went on an anti semitic pogrom, at Jedwabne I believe 1500 or 1600 Jews were murdered, literally the entire Jewish population of the village, and the same thing happened other places. And while there were brave people in Poland including priests and nuns, who acted to try and save their Jewish citizens, hiding them, helping them escape to the forests where Jews were hiding, priests giving them false baptism papers indicating they were Catholic, people hiding Jewish children pretending they were their own, there also was a lot of indifference and many cases where Poles turned in their Jewish neighbors willingly. After the war, Polish victims of the holocaust who attempted to go home often found violence and more then a few times death from their former neighbors, who among other things blamed them for what the Nazis had done, and some estimates of deaths go in the tens of thousands.

The Poles themselves were victims of the war and they took terrible casualties from both the Nazis and from the Russians as well, proportionally even leaving the jewish victims of the holocaust after it (polish jews were 2 million of the 6 million Jews slaughtered) they took a large percentage hit and deserve acknowledgment of that fact. However, the Poles have also spent the last 67 years denying what the Poles themselves did with their Jewish neighbors, they emphasize the righteous gentiles and such (which they should) but they also have spent that time denying that anti semitism was widespread or that the holocaust in Poland itself wouldn't have been so efficient without the help of a lot of Poles (which was true all over Europe I might add). Because of that, they are quite sensitive for anything that can be construed of blaming the Poles for complicity in what happened to the Jews, their official position was it was all the Nazis, that Poles loved their Jewish neighbors and so forth but were powerless, and that simply isn't true.

There were Jews who turned on other Jews. Read about the Warsaw ghetto and Jewish collaborators. So, are Jews guilty of anti-semitism against themselves?

As for your statements about the Church. The Church has protected Jews many times in history. During the Black Death the Pope worked to protect Jews from average people who blamed them for allegedly poisoning the wells and wanted to kill them for it.

As for Poland, there is a long history between Jews and gentiles there and bad blood on both sides. Its more complicated than many realize.

 

[Johnny_Ray_Wilson]

Not a big fan of Obama these days. However, in his defense, I do believe Obama meant "Death camp in Poland" not "Poland Death Camp".

Karwaski was raised a Catholic in a predominantly Jewish environment, and remains a Catholic. Being in a part of Poland not fully incorporated by Nazi Germany, he was one of the very few who consistently made England and the US aware of the situation in Poland (WWII) and thereafter. Karwaski is loyal to his native Poland. A hero to his native land. We should all be so lucky to follow his lead in respects to our own country(s).