Poll: Many Muslims in Mideast, Pakistan have poor view of al Qaeda

[Peregrinator]

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/01/world/asia/rel-muslims-al-qaeda/index.html

The poll by the Pew Research Center's Global Attitudes Project, released Monday, found that a high proportion -- between 71% and 98% -- of Muslims questioned in Egypt, Jordan, Turkey and Lebanon viewed al Qaeda in an unfavorable way.
In Pakistan, where U.S. Navy SEALs killed the al Qaeda leader during a raid on a compound a year ago, 55% of the Muslims surveyed had a negative opinion of the terrorist group, according to the poll. Only 13% had a favorable view.

Link to Pew: http://www.pewglobal.org/2012/04/30/on-anniversary-of-bin-ladens-death-little-backing-of-al-qaeda/

 

[about_average]

Is this surprising?

 

[RoryN]

Is this surprising?

Not to anyone on the GB.

The racist right fringe will ignore this information or dispute it, though.

 

[Peregrinator]

Not to anyone on the GB.

The racist right fringe will ignore this information or dispute it, though.

That's why I posted it, so people could link it at will whenever one of our resident wingfruits says otherwise.

 

[koalabear]

http://vzgrips.com/img/Grip%20Pics/ALL%20FRAG/ETC-FRAG-BG-2_lgNew.jpg​

 

[cjh]

That's why I posted it, so people could link it at will whenever one of our resident wingfruits says otherwise.

when i read criticism about the muslims community--whatever that might be--not being sufficiently vocal in speaking out against muslim terrorists, i think about all the people in the south in the 50s and 60s who didn't stand up and speak loudly against bull connor or roy bryant or byron de la beckwith. although many southerners undoubtedly sympathized with their home-grown terrorists, many if not most were probably horrified by the violence employed in the name of tradition; still, the established south did not stand up and publicly denounce the hate and the crimes.

they should have been more visible and more vocal--shame is important in fighting hatred. and maybe more muslims should shame muslim terrorists. but just as it would be a far stretch to say all southerners approved of emmett till's murder, it's a far stretch to say all muslims approve of al qaeda.

 

[EllieTalbot]

That's why I posted it, so people could link it at will whenever one of our resident wingfruits says otherwise.

Except the poll doesn't actually reflect how middle-eastern Muslims regard jihad-inspired terrorism in general. The provided comparative analysis of results from the last decade show that approval was much higher in 2003. In Jordan, for example, al-Qaeda's 61% approval rating only took a sharp nosedive in 2005, after they set off bombs in Amman. You'd also think that Pakistan's mere 13% approval is a good thing, but 32% is a lot of "no comment."

And in this Pew poll from 2010 on the politics of Islam, you'll see that approval for terrorist groups Hamas and Hezbollah is much higher, and on the upswing in places like Indonesia. And look at the incredible difference it makes on the opinion of Lebanese Muslims on Hezbollah if they're Shia or Sunni:


http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/2010-muslim-01-04.png

There's also this:

http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/2010-muslim-01-03.png

and:

"At least three-quarters of Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan say they would favor making each of the following the law in their countries: stoning people who commit adultery, whippings and cutting off of hands for crimes like theft and robbery and the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion. Majorities of Muslims in Jordan and Nigeria also favor these harsh punishments."

So the poll doesn't actually indicate how many disapprove of terrorism and other violence perpetrated in the name of Islam, or the reasons for their choice.

Ambling Around Abbottabad,
Ellie

 

[VaticanAssassin]

Not to anyone on the GB.

The racist left fringe will ignore this information or dispute it, though.

Except the poll doesn't actually reflect how middle-eastern Muslims regard jihad-inspired terrorism in general. The provided comparative analysis of results from the last decade show that approval was much higher in 2003. In Jordan, for example, al-Qaeda's 61% approval rating only took a sharp nosedive in 2005, after they set off bombs in Amman. You'd also think that Pakistan's mere 13% approval is a good thing, but 32% is a lot of "no comment."

And in this Pew poll from 2010 on the politics of Islam, you'll see that approval for terrorist groups Hamas and Hezbollah is much higher, and on the upswing in places like Indonesia. And look at the incredible difference it makes on the opinion of Lebanese Muslims on Hezbollah if they're Shia or Sunni:


http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/2010-muslim-01-04.png

There's also this:

http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/2010-muslim-01-03.png

and:

"At least three-quarters of Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan say they would favor making each of the following the law in their countries: stoning people who commit adultery, whippings and cutting off of hands for crimes like theft and robbery and the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion. Majorities of Muslims in Jordan and Nigeria also favor these harsh punishments."

So the poll doesn't actually indicate how many disapprove of terrorism and other violence perpetrated in the name of Islam, or the reasons for their choice.

Ambling Around Abbottabad,
Ellie

 

[IndieSnob]

CJH is eloquent, and then the two clowns come in and muck up the show.

 

[cjh]

while we are cherry picking:

Islamic extremism continues to be a serious concern in nations with substantial Muslim populations. Large majorities in five of the six predominantly Muslim nations surveyed as well as in Nigeria, where roughly half of the population is Muslim, say they are very or somewhat concerned about the rise of Islamic extremism around the world. The only outlier is Turkey, where 39% are concerned.

Many are also worried about the rise of Islamic extremism within their own countries.
That is especially the case in Lebanon, where eight-in-ten – including 90% of Christians, 82% of Shia and 67% of Sunnis – express at least some concern. In Nigeria, roughly three-quarters (76%) are concerned about Islamic extremism in their country, including 83% of Muslims and 68% of Christians.

Nearly two-thirds of Pakistanis (65%) express concern about Islamic extremism in their country, but fears have declined since last year, when 79% shared that view. About six-in-ten in Egypt (61%) and Indonesia (59%) and more than four-in-ten in Jordan (44%) and Turkey (43%) are also concerned about extremism in their countries.

http://www.pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

 

[cjh]

CJH is eloquent, and then the two clowns come in and muck up the show.

thank you.

 

[mercury14]

Except the poll doesn't actually reflect how middle-eastern Muslims regard jihad-inspired terrorism in general. The provided comparative analysis of results from the last decade show that approval was much higher in 2003. In Jordan, for example, al-Qaeda's 61% approval rating only took a sharp nosedive in 2005, after they set off bombs in Amman. You'd also think that Pakistan's mere 13% approval is a good thing, but 32% is a lot of "no comment."

And in this Pew poll from 2010 on the politics of Islam, you'll see that approval for terrorist groups Hamas and Hezbollah is much higher, and on the upswing in places like Indonesia. And look at the incredible difference it makes on the opinion of Lebanese Muslims on Hezbollah if they're Shia or Sunni:


http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/2010-muslim-01-04.png

There's also this:

http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2010/12/2010-muslim-01-03.png

and:

"At least three-quarters of Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan say they would favor making each of the following the law in their countries: stoning people who commit adultery, whippings and cutting off of hands for crimes like theft and robbery and the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion. Majorities of Muslims in Jordan and Nigeria also favor these harsh punishments."

So the poll doesn't actually indicate how many disapprove of terrorism and other violence perpetrated in the name of Islam, or the reasons for their choice.

Ambling Around Abbottabad,
Ellie

But there's a difference between these terror groups. Hamas has a militant wing that has a long-time record of committing terrorist acts. But they also won the 2006 elections and no longer call for an end to Israel (they're willing to accept an Israeli state on the 1967 borders). Hamas runs the government, legislates, etc. They bear almost no resemblance to Al Qaeda.

The poor, uneducated people in Palestine support Hamas because they're desperate and religious fundamentalism provides answers. But more educated, wealthy Palestinians support Fatah. And as you can see, Hamas is viewed poorly in the Muslim world outside Palestine, including in Lebanon and Turkey.

 

[EllieTalbot]

while we are cherry picking:



http://www.pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

This is dishonest of you. You neglected to mention that this was the only set of stats in the report that was a result of polling samples of the entire population of those countries, not just Muslims.

Frowning on Falsity,
Ellie

 

[Peregrinator]

Except the poll doesn't actually reflect how middle-eastern Muslims regard jihad-inspired terrorism in general.

So the poll doesn't actually indicate how many disapprove of terrorism and other violence perpetrated in the name of Islam, or the reasons for their choice.

Ambling Around Abbottabad,
Ellie

It doesn't claim to show those things.

 

[cjh]

This is dishonest of you. You neglected to mention that this was the only set of stats in the report that was a result of polling samples of the entire population of those countries, not just Muslims.

Frowning on Falsity,
Ellie

Just following your lead in cherry picking, Ellie.

Self-righteous in Senatobia,
CJH

 

[EllieTalbot]

Just following your lead in cherry picking, Ellie.

Self-righteous in Senatobia,
CJH

You're right, I was totally cherry picking. In a discussion about polls of Muslim sentiment, I stuck to polls of Muslims. :avery:

Anal-retentive in Annapolis,
Ellie

 

[Sean]

I see Gimmick's hatred of Muslioms is showing again.

 

[cjh]

You're right, I was totally cherry picking. In a discussion about polls of Muslim sentiment, I stuck to polls of Muslims. :avery:

Anal-retentive in Annapolis,
Ellie

I relied on the poll you quoted. And I lifted the quote directly, including the language showing the religions of the respondents.

Do you contend that the statistics I quoted about Muslims are wrong? That they report no meaningful statistics about Muslims? Or would you have me edit the content to exclude reference to Christians?

Show me what is misleading in my excerpt. What is not explicitly disclosed?

Falsely outraged in Phonecia,
CJH

 

[about_average]

...you'll see that approval for terrorist groups Hamas and Hezbollah....

did the people replying to the poll label them terrorist groups? That can be a significant factor in the poll. Both groups do a lot of charity work so what were the demographics of the people who took part in the poll?

and:

"At least three-quarters of Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan say they would favor making each of the following the law in their countries: stoning people who commit adultery, whippings and cutting off of hands for crimes like theft and robbery and the death penalty for those who leave the Muslim religion. Majorities of Muslims in Jordan and Nigeria also favor these harsh punishments."

You left out:

Eight-in-ten Muslims in Pakistan say suicide bombing and other acts of violence against civilian targets in order to defend Islam from its enemies are never justified; majorities in Turkey (77%), Indonesia (69%) and Jordan (54%) share this view. Support for suicide bombing has declined considerably over the years. For example, while 74% of Muslims in Lebanon said these violent acts were at least sometimes justified in 2002, just 39% say that is the case now; double-digit declines have also occurred in Jordan, Pakistan, Nigeria and Indonesia.

which is also significant.

The fact they want Islam to take a greater roll in politics isn't surprising. A large percentage of Americans want the US to be more of a theocracy than it is, though they'd never admit that, they'd say they just want Christian "values" to play a greater role.

 

[EllieTalbot]

It doesn't claim to show those things.

Yes, but you're posting it for use in debates about such things, and the info could be spun in a number of different ways.

For example, one could say that the info reflects a peaceful sentiment among Muslims, and that they increasingly do not support violent groups like al-Qaeda.

Or you could use the data to say that they only disapprove of al-Qaeda when it targets fellow Muslims and/or places in their own countries.

Or one could create a huge spin and say that fewer and fewer Muslims supported al-Qaeda as it became less effective at carrying out terrorist attacks.

My point is that the poll itself doesn't provide the "why" of changing Muslim attitudes towards al-Qaeda, and that's the salient question in debates on the topic, especially when their attitudes differ so greatly on other terrorist groups, and on what they consider to be justified applications of violence.

Pondering in Pocatello,
Ellie

 

[KRCummings]

Ken...I mean Ellie sure does hate Muslims.

 

[busybody..]

did the people replying to the poll label them terrorist groups? That can be a significant factor in the poll. Both groups do a lot of charity work so what were the demographics of the people who took part in the poll?

You left out:

Eight-in-ten Muslims in Pakistan say suicide bombing and other acts of violence against civilian targets in order to defend Islam from its enemies are never justified; majorities in Turkey (77%), Indonesia (69%) and Jordan (54%) share this view. Support for suicide bombing has declined considerably over the years. For example, while 74% of Muslims in Lebanon said these violent acts were at least sometimes justified in 2002, just 39% say that is the case now; double-digit declines have also occurred in Jordan, Pakistan, Nigeria and Indonesia.

which is also significant.

The fact they want Islam to take a greater roll in politics isn't surprising. A large percentage of Americans want the US to be more of a theocracy than it is, though they'd never admit that, they'd say they just want Christian "values" to play a greater role.

meaningless

as MOST SUICIDE bombings are by MOOSEFUCKS vs MOOSEFUCKS, of course they say this

further, they dont see anyone that is NOT A MOOSEFUCK as a civilian

but you know that, NIGGER, dont you?

 

[Comshaw]

Yes, but you're posting it for use in debates about such things, and the info could be spun in a number of different ways.

For example, one could say that the info reflects a peaceful sentiment among Muslims, and that they increasingly do not support violent groups like al-Qaeda.

Or you could use the data to say that they only disapprove of al-Qaeda when it targets fellow Muslims and/or places in their own countries.

Or one could create a huge spin and say that fewer and fewer Muslims supported al-Qaeda as it became less effective at carrying out terrorist attacks.

My point is that the poll itself doesn't provide the "why" of changing Muslim attitudes towards al-Qaeda, and that's the salient question in debates on the topic, especially when their attitudes differ so greatly on other terrorist groups, and on what they consider to be justified applications of violence.

Pondering in Pocatello,
Ellie

OH MY GOD!!! PEOPLE DO THAT??? SPIN THINGS TO THEIR OWN ADVANTAGE??? SAY IT AINT SO!!!

Now that's out of the way...are you saying that only this data can be spun? Or that nothing that might be spun should be presented? If that's so, there isn't a piece of datum any were that should be considered because, if you squint your eyes, hold your mouth just so and use the right verbiage anything can be and has been spun.

The best you can hope for is to get someone, anyone to look at the results dispassionately and form an intelligent, cognitive opinion.

And I'll have to adamantly disagree with you on this,"...My point is that the poll itself doesn't provide the "why" of changing Muslim attitudes towards al-Qaeda, and that's the salient question in debates on the topic,...".

I think you missed the mark entirely with that statement. I've never read a debate on this board about why the Muslim attitude is changing, only if it is or isn't. Most on one side scream that it isn't, while many on the other yell back that it is. Mean while no one is actually looking at or considering the information presented.

Aw well, such is life.


Comshaw

 

[semen4her]

Hmmm, I didn't know you were a 'All Muslims are evil' dipshit.

 

[semen4her]

Ken...I mean Ellie sure does hate Muslims.

(S)he's an idiot.

Time proven fact.