2012 Survivor Discussion Thread

[CrimsonMaiden]

In case there is a contest next year (and it looks to be a good possibility with a moderator that will be around more often than Lauren and I have been able to be), I am going to go ahead and start the discussion thread. I know there's been a lot of complaining about certain rules, so now is your opportunity to discuss things you'd like to be changed.

 

[BOSTONFICTIONWRITER]

#1. I like the no chapter story rule. Every story should be a new and complete story.

#2. In the same way that we now post immunities, I'd like to see scorecards updated weekly, within a week that the story posted on the main board, otherwise points for that story are lost. The story can be posted with the date that it posted on the board. By posting the date when the story posted, participants can verify the honestly of contestants.

#3. So as to put an end to the limitless 750 random word stories that have no plot and no character development, I'd like to see the minimum story raise from 750 words to 1,500 words.

Now, I realize that Literotica accepts 750 word stories, if that is the argument of the moderators, but Literotica accepts chapter stories, too, where the Survivor contest doesn't. Thereby, my logic is, if we can change Literotica's rules in one instance, why not in another?

#4. I'd like to see the prize monies doubled. As it is with we writers earning much less than a mere penny a word, that is, if we are lucky to win a prize, a larger contest prize would attract more contest participants and earn more stories written for Literotica, especially in those categories where few stories are written.

#5. I'd like to see Literotica give tee-shirts, coffee mugs, hats, and keychains to everyone who enters the Survivor contest.

Finally, as a grand prize, for that one, talented, and prolific writer (me) who enters 365 stories, a story a day, in the Survivor contest and who earns an excess of 50 million hits for all stories combined, I'd like to see Literotica give him or her a new car a VW GTI, a Mini Cooper S, or a Mustang GT, orange with black leather. What do you think? Hello? Is anyone there?

"Seriously. No, I haven't been drinking. Yes, I am crazy to have entered so many Survivor contests and written so many stories (lol)."

Welcome back Crimson. We all missed you. And Happy New Year to you and yours.

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

#1. I like the no chapter story rule. Every story should be a new and complete story.

#2. In the same way that we now post immunities, I'd like to see scorecards updated weekly, within a week that the story posted on the main board, otherwise points for that story are lost. The story can be posted with the date that it posted on the board. By posting the date when the story posted, participants can verify the honestly of contestants.

#3. So as to put an end to the limitless 750 random word stories that have no plot and no character development, I'd like to see the minimum story raise from 750 words to 1,500 words.

Now, I realize that Literotica accepts 750 word stories, if that is the argument of the moderators, but Literotica accepts chapter stories, too, where the Survivor contest doesn't. Thereby, my logic is, if we can change Literotica's rules in one instance, why not in another?

#4. I'd like to see the prize monies doubled. As it is with we writers earning much less than a mere penny a word, that is, if we are lucky to win a prize, a larger contest prize would attract more contest participants and earn more stories written for Literotica, especially in those categories where few stories are written.

#5. I'd like to see Literotica give tee-shirts, coffee mugs, hats, and keychains to everyone who enters the Survivor contest.

Finally, as a grand prize, for that one, talented, and prolific writer (me) who enters 365 stories, a story a day, in the Survivor contest and who earns an excess of 50 million hits for all stories combined, I'd like to see Literotica give him or her a new car a VW GTI, a Mini Cooper S, or a Mustang GT, orange with black leather. What do you think? Hello? Is anyone there?

"Seriously. No, I haven't been drinking. Yes, I am crazy to have entered so many Survivor contests and written so many stories (lol)."

Welcome back Crimson. We all missed you. And Happy New Year to you and yours.

Some of your suggestions are things that have been discussed before and are just not feasible (IE, suggestion #3). As long as the Literotica word limit is 750, that will be the word count minimum for a Survivor story. It would take way too much time to check every single submission for word count. The only reason it was done to the Novels category was because it was felt that category by name and definition requires a longer story. 750 words does not make up a novel or novella. It does however make up a short story.

Nothing in the contest is official until after the Jan. 4 deadline. Again, the scorecard issue is simply for participant's convenience and not for official score keeping (until the deadline). Plus having to check to make sure each and every one is updated every single week is also a time sucker. Unless a moderator does nothing but sit on their butt all day, they are not going to have time to do that.

As to suggestions 4 & 5, that would be up to the site owners. I have no idea what kind of revenue they make or if they would able to do such a thing. I believe that the present prize structure is a good one, but others are free to weigh in on this and we'll see what the majority think.

As for suggestion #1, I figure it will be one of the things that will be discussed the most, so we will see what everyone else thinks. Honestly, I think it's a good idea in theory, but what makes up a chapter is subjective and someone always disagrees with the moderator's judgement so it might just be more trouble than it's worth.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Here are some suggestions I made on another thread. Since there is now an official contest thread for 2012, I am copying it here.

I believe the time is about right for starting to discuss next year's Survivors' Contest, assuming there is to be such a contest. I haven't heard anything about it, but I think we should go on the basis there will be.

The only change I would advocate is clarification of chapters as opposed to a story with a sequel. I believe Crim was too stringent on this in past years. As far as I am concerned, a story should be considered to be standalone if it has a distinct beginning, climactic moment, (such as people cumming) and a distinct ending. If a story is posted about some characters, and meets these requirements, and another story is posted involving the same characters or location, and meets the requirements, but is otherwise not related to the first story, that second story should be considered to be standalone.

I like the requirement of caps, because it requires that authors write in a wide variety of categories in order to score big. In the past, some authors have written sixty or more stories in a single category, and have counted them all. This defeats the purpose of the contest, which is to write a lot of stories and poems in a a lot of different categories.

However, I suggest one exception be made to this rule, and that is on novels. Currently, only three chapters to a novel can be posted for score, and I believe that does a disservice to the readers. I'm sure most readers don't like the idea of a novel being stretched out over several years, which is what happens when only three chapters per year are posted. Therefore, I propose the cap rule be waived in this one category. If an author is going to write a novel with more than three chapters, all of them at least 7,500 words, he or she can post all the chapters in the Novels & Novellas category, but nothing else in the category. In other words, a novel with ten chapters, each 7,500 words long or longer, would be worth 24 points, but there cannot also be a novella posted for score. Of course, an author can still post three 7,500 word novellas, which would be worth ten points.

If anybody else has any suggestions to make, post them as responses. I have no authority to make rules, but I and anybody else can make suggestions.

 

[Sean Renaud]

#1. I like the no chapter story rule. Every story should be a new and complete story.

I hate this rule mostly because it doesn't seem to be enforced in a sane manner. There are dozens of Batman stories and just because there is an order anything with Batgirl comes before anything with Oracle doesn't make them chapters. If this rule was good enough that sequels weren't treated like chapters I'd be fully on board.

#2. In the same way that we now post immunities, I'd like to see scorecards updated weekly, within a week that the story posted on the main board, otherwise points for that story are lost. The story can be posted with the date that it posted on the board. By posting the date when the story posted, participants can verify the honestly of contestants.

Scorecards updated weekly is brutal. We don't all have that kind of time, not to mention sometimes, specifically with contests, may choose not to count a certain story as our contest entry because have two or three but we're shy one incest story.

Honestly I think having to use your immunities right away is kinda silly but meh I've mostly given up on that fight.

#3. So as to put an end to the limitless 750 random word stories that have no plot and no character development, I'd like to see the minimum story raise from 750 words to 1,500 words.

Nope.com. For starters I can fluff 1500 as easily as 750. Actually probably a bit easier since that just means I up the adjective count. It doesn't mean I need to tell more story. 750 is good enough for Lit, it's good enough for Survivor. Besides I'll cut someone if a story turns out to be 1450 wpms.

#4. I'd like to see the prize monies doubled. As it is with we writers earning much less than a mere penny a word, that is, if we are lucky to win a prize, a larger contest prize would attract more contest participants and earn more stories written for Literotica, especially in those categories where few stories are written.

I don't think so. Don't get me wrong I don't mind more money but I don't think it would do anything to get more writers. A "real" writer still makes more with less work and lets face it every year I've been in or observed this contest there has been a winner who is pretty much so far gone in late June that he could coast from there on out and still get a top 3 slot, and that's if second and third hustle up. No real point in upping the prize.

#5. I'd like to see Literotica give tee-shirts, coffee mugs, hats, and keychains to everyone who enters the Survivor contest.

Another not so great idea. The contest routinely has fifty plus entrants and in my experience less than half of them even enter a single story. Even if you narrowed it down to something smaller than that I'm really sold on those little prizes. It might not hurt to have something to separate out all those $25 prizes a bit so that 6th and 15th aren't getting the same thing though.

Finally, as a grand prize, for that one, talented, and prolific writer (me) who enters 365 stories, a story a day, in the Survivor contest and who earns an excess of 50 million hits for all stories combined, I'd like to see Literotica give him or her a new car a VW GTI, a Mini Cooper S, or a Mustang GT, orange with black leather. What do you think? Hello? Is anyone there?

Uh. . .honestly I got nothing.

"Seriously. No, I haven't been drinking. Yes, I am crazy to have entered so many Survivor contests and written so many stories (lol)."

Welcome back Crimson. We all missed you. And Happy New Year to you and yours.

Welcome back Crim. We did in fact miss you and hope you had a good year. Happy Holidays.


In addition I think immunities should be worth the half (rounded up) the points of the category they are being used to cap. It's not like the Survivor Contest has ever in my experience been remotely competitive. You usually have a contest that looks a little like this.

1. God.
2. Bill Gates
3. Steve Jobs
4. Steve Job's stool
5-50th. The worns in Steve Job's stool.

That said if you use an immunity in the current contest and you find yourself in a close fight you have to write (assuming you used it on tier one) 5
stories to make up for that one immunity and that's a bit nuts in a race where each story is worth one point.

You could even make them worth no points UNLESS you finish the entire tier to prevent someone from just collecting immunities year round and placing without writing a single story.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I hate this rule mostly because it doesn't seem to be enforced in a sane manner. There are dozens of Batman stories and just because there is an order anything with Batgirl comes before anything with Oracle doesn't make them chapters. If this rule was good enough that sequels weren't treated like chapters I'd be fully on board.

This will always be a problem, distinguishing between chapters to a single story and sequels to that story. As far as I can see, if a story comes to a conclusion, it should be considered a standalone story, even if there are other stories about the same characters.

That said if you use an immunity in the current contest and you find yourself in a close fight you have to write (assuming you used it on tier one) 5
stories to make up for that one immunity and that's a bit nuts in a race where each story is worth one point.

You could even make them worth no points UNLESS you finish the entire tier to prevent someone from just collecting immunities year round and placing without writing a single story.

The first cap level has three stories or poems and the point total for completing the cap level for one category is five, except in Novels & Novellas. I see the idea of immunities as allowing writers to complete some categories where they don't like to write, for whatever reason. To pay for the privilegin themselves. e of using an immunity, a writer has to finish one cap level in one category.

I don't thinkj we have to worry abiout somebody just using immunities. The odds against being a winner 35 times in a year would be extremely high. I believe the average would be about seven. Besides that, since you need to fill one cap level for every immunity, the maximum that could be used would be 17.

At one time, immunities were worth two points, which I think was a mistake. I believe they should have no value

 

[Sean Renaud]

I forgot about the level caps. I am 100% behind the level caps.

When was the last time that immunities were worth points? Did we have the level cap in place at that time? I ask because I think it's a mistake not to let them be worth points as it's currently set up. Since I might not be explaining this well let me write out a (hypersimplified) version. As it stands.

Person A
Anal: 3 stories=5 points
Incest: 3 stories=5 points
Horror: 3 stories=5 points.
Total: 15

Person B
Anal: 5 stories=7 points
Incest: 5 stories=7 points
Horror: Cap= 0 points.
Total: 14
Person B in this scenario wrote 6 more stories than Person A but ends up down points despite.

I admit I've never seen a Survivor contest come close enough to be really worried about this but it still feels like it goes against the spirit of the game to me.

 

[RedHairedandFriendly]

I will most likely participate this year and will set my own mini-goals, as well as keep my scorecard current, and I'll participate in the immunity drawing. Immunities are great and I benefited from them when I had them, but not to the point that they effected my overall score. I don't really see a need for them, but that's my opinion and if memory serves me right the first year I participated in them, I opted out of using mine because I wanted to write one story in every category. The following year I did use them.

My concern/questions/comments is with the Novel/Novelette category.

I had not participated "whole-heartedly" when the rule was changed (so I'm behind on it) - If I am reading it correctly, I can submit to Novel/Novelette three chapters, each one being at minimum 7500 words. After those three chapters are submitted, no other chapters can be counted?

So I either finish my story in 3 chapter (no matter how many Lit. pages deep it will be) or I submit chapters to finish my story, but don't count them as Survivor entries (which is what I'll probably do), or hold my chapters until next year and submit them for points in the 2013 Survivor contest (which I would so not do).

 

[Sean Renaud]

You guys are aware that you don't need to write chapters for your novel and novella right? You can write three separate 7500 novels. So I don't feel but so bad that the chapter rule doesn't effect you guys the way it does everybody else.

 

[RedHairedandFriendly]

You guys are aware that you don't need to write chapters for your novel and novella right? You can write three separate 7500 novels. So I don't feel but so bad that the chapter rule doesn't effect you guys the way it does everybody else.

Oh, I know I don't have to have chapters in a Novel/novelette. I just know I prefer posting in chapters. I posted Twelve Days of Hrive 'Isia in 6 chapters, purely by choice, had I posted it all as one submission it would have been over 35,000 words and I don't know how many Lit. pages that would have been.

But we'll use that as example:

Ch. 1 - 3 would have been the only ones I could use for Survivor (if all were within the 7500 limit) right?

 

[Boxlicker101]

I will most likely participate this year and will set my own mini-goals, as well as keep my scorecard current, and I'll participate in the immunity drawing. Immunities are great and I benefited from them when I had them, but not to the point that they effected my overall score. I don't really see a need for them, but that's my opinion and if memory serves me right the first year I participated in them, I opted out of using mine because I wanted to write one story in every category. The following year I did use them.

My concern/questions/comments is with the Novel/Novelette category.

I had not participated "whole-heartedly" when the rule was changed (so I'm behind on it) - If I am reading it correctly, I can submit to Novel/Novelette three chapters, each one being at minimum 7500 words. After those three chapters are submitted, no other chapters can be counted?

So I either finish my story in 3 chapter (no matter how many Lit. pages deep it will be) or I submit chapters to finish my story, but don't count them as Survivor entries (which is what I'll probably do), or hold my chapters until next year and submit them for points in the 2013 Survivor contest (which I would so not do).

This is why I am proposing the Novels & Novellas category be exempt from the cap limitation. Most readers would prefer not having their novels stretched out over a period of two or three or more years. Of course, you could submit subsequent chapters without having them count for score, but I don't believe an author should be penalized for wanting to entertain readers as much as possible.

Sean, immunities used to be worth two points, but the author had to write a story or poem in two different categories to use one immunity. The change was put in place at the same time as the change to cap levels.

In this example:

Person A
Anal: 3 stories=5 points
Incest: 3 stories=5 points
Horror: 3 stories=5 points.
Total: 15

Person B
Anal: 5 stories=7 points
Incest: 5 stories=7 points
Horror: Cap= 0 points.
Total: 14
Person B in this scenario wrote 6 more stories than Person A but ends up down points despite.

Person A would have 15 points and Person B would have ten, because two of the Anal stories and two of the Incest stories would be over the cap limit and not counted. Anybody who wants to write stories that don't count anything is welcome to do so. I have some Gay Male stories that are on my score sheet but are not included in the score. So does SHR, but he may not be aware of it yet.

It would be perfectly alright to write three novellas of 7,500 words or more for that category, but that would make the writer subject to the same cap level limitations as exist in other categories. The score for that category would be a total of ten.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Oh, I know I don't have to have chapters in a Novel/novelette. I just know I prefer posting in chapters. I posted Twelve Days of Hrive 'Isia in 6 chapters, purely by choice, had I posted it all as one submission it would have been over 35,000 words and I don't know how many Lit. pages that would have been.

But we'll use that as example:

Ch. 1 - 3 would have been the only ones I could use for Survivor (if all were within the 7500 limit) right?

Yeah. I just don't feel bad about the fact that you can per the rules right now write one 22,500 word story and break it into three parts and somehow you feel bad about it. Since it seems like the main argument here is that you have more chapters there is nothing preventing you from writing multiple chapters or writing shorter stories since 7500 is the minimum. Write three stories.

Sean, immunities used to be worth two points, but the author had to write a story or poem in two different categories to use one immunity. The change was put in place at the same time as the change to cap levels.

In this example:

Person A
Anal: 3 stories=5 points
Incest: 3 stories=5 points
Horror: 3 stories=5 points.
Total: 15

Person B
Anal: 5 stories=7 points
Incest: 5 stories=7 points
Horror: Cap= 0 points.
Total: 14
Person B in this scenario wrote 6 more stories than Person A but ends up down points despite.

Person A would have 15 points and Person B would have ten, because two of the Anal stories and two of the Incest stories would be over the cap limit and not counted. Anybody who wants to write stories that don't count anything is welcome to do so. I have some Gay Male stories that are on my score sheet but are not included in the score. So does SHR, but he may not be aware of it yet.

I made that super simple on purpose. In this hypothetical there are ONLY three categories. I could write up the same thing with the average number of immunities a person gets throughout the year but the same thing happens only multiplied.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Apparently there will be a contest next year, and I have been chosen by Laurel to be a moderator. Crim and Lauren willl also be around, but I expect to do most of the heavy lifting, once I know what will need to be done and how to do it. I will also be helping to wrap up the 2011 contest.

Besides this, I will be an entrant in the 2012 contest, but I want to avoid any hint of impropriety, so I do not expect to be a contender for any of the cash prizes.

Speaking (or writing) of which, I expect the prizes will be the same this year as they have been. I haven't seen anything to the contrary. Other rules still have to be worked out. Foremost among them is the rule about chapters, which has always been a point of contention.

The rule about caps will remain, but what do you think of my suggestion to exempt the Novels & Novellas category from the rule, as long as all the entries are part of the same long story and each part, or chapter, includes at least 7,500 words.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I think the cap should remain on Novels. It's still EASIER to write one enormous story and chop it up into bits than it is to write a bunch of smaller ones. Let me write one 750k story and chop it up and I'll do it in a heartbeat. They are already worth double points.

Congrats on becoming a mod btw.

 

[RedHairedandFriendly]

Congrats Box lickin' fellow.

Okay next question in regards to Novel/Novelettes - I take my story of 35,000 and divide it into 3 chapters, each being approx. 3 1/2 lit. pages long, each well within the 7500 word minimum and that category is capped, until I complete the other categories - correct.

Once I've completed the other categories, I can begin submission of another - entirely different Novel/Novelette and break that into 3 chapters if necessary.

And so on - and so on - and so on.

The reason I seem only concerned with Novel/Novelette at this time is because as I've come back into writing again that seems to be where many of my ideas may end up. My stories are slowly becoming larger pieces as a whole.

My other category concern would be in chain stories, but I'll read up and refresh myself on all rules on all the other categories, prior to bringing any questions to the thread.

 

[BOSTONFICTIONWRITER]

Apparently there will be a contest next year, and I have been chosen by Laurel to be a moderator. Crim and Lauren willl also be around, but I expect to do most of the heavy lifting, once I know what will need to be done and how to do it. I will also be helping to wrap up the 2011 contest.

Besides this, I will be an entrant in the 2012 contest, but I want to avoid any hint of impropriety, so I do not expect to be a contender for any of the cash prizes.

Speaking (or writing) of which, I expect the prizes will be the same this year as they have been. I haven't seen anything to the contrary. Other rules still have to be worked out. Foremost among them is the rule about chapters, which has always been a point of contention.

The rule about caps will remain, but what do you think of my suggestion to exempt the Novels & Novellas category from the rule, as long as all the entries are part of the same long story and each part, or chapter, includes at least 7,500 words.

Box, just between me and you. Come closer to the screen so that no one else will hear. Don't say anything to anyone else, but can you get me a Literotica coffee mug. I know they have them. I've seen Scouries with one.

Also, see if you can dig me up a Literotica sweatshirt, too. I take an XL, unless it runs small, then XXL. I don't want one if it's 50% cotton and 50% polyester. It's got to be 100% cotton, preferrably the heavyweight kind, 18oz. I'm not fussy, I'm just saying that if there's a choice of sweatshirts, I'll put my order in now.

I don't want to appear pushy, but if you can commandeer a Literotica keychain and baseball cap, that would be swell, too.

Laurel gave me all those things, when I won a Green E back in 2007, including a green satin Literotica jacket with my name on it, but she asked for them all back, when I wrote that essay, Green E's Cursed or Blessed.

Oh, congrats on your new assignment. Good luck.

Again, just between you and me, if you can give me a couple of Green E's, I'd appreciate that, too.

Don't worry. I'll take care of you, Buddy with a little holiday cash. The check is in the mail, Box. The check is in the mail.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Congrats Box lickin' fellow.

Okay next question in regards to Novel/Novelettes - I take my story of 35,000 and divide it into 3 chapters, each being approx. 3 1/2 lit. pages long, each well within the 7500 word minimum and that category is capped, until I complete the other categories - correct.

Once I've completed the other categories, I can begin submission of another - entirely different Novel/Novelette and break that into 3 chapters if necessary.

And so on - and so on - and so on.

The reason I seem only concerned with Novel/Novelette at this time is because as I've come back into writing again that seems to be where many of my ideas may end up. My stories are slowly becoming larger pieces as a whole.

My other category concern would be in chain stories, but I'll read up and refresh myself on all rules on all the other categories, prior to bringing any questions to the thread.

What I propose RE: Novels & Novellas is the current rule. What I propose is excluding the category from the cap limitations, which would mean you could break your 35,000 word novel into four chapters, each more than 7,500 words, and post the entire story in one year instead of spreading it out over two years. Or, you could break your 80,000 word novel into ten chapters of 8,000 words each and post it in one year instead of spreading it over three or four years. The reason I sugggest this is that I believe most readers don't like to read a novel over a period of three years. At the same time, that would be the only novel you would be able to post that year.

Of course, if Sean took all year and wrote his 750,000 word GWTW or War and Peace, he could then break it down into 100 chapters and post it, scoring 204 points for the one story. Somehow, I don't expect this to happen.

 

[RedHairedandFriendly]

Hmm... well I do think I'll read through the old rules and go from there. I don't see an issue with the "cap" if all it means is that for me to go into level 2 I have to cap all the other categories first. I can divide my stories into 3 chapters if necessary, or if I want I'll break it into six, cap all other categories, bring the next three in, or if I can't do that than I'll post the others without counting them toward scores until I'm able (which would be after the cap on all level 1) - If I'm understanding things correctly.

Now - if the rules are really able to be changed with the power of this discussion thread, then I would tend to agree with the cap being reconsidered, but not completely and totally disregarded. Perhaps an increase of 5 chapters - I really don't know the answer though. I know how I'll write and participate in Survivor and I know if I screw up my scoring I'll PM Box and have him help me through the process.

One of the things I do have to do is purchase a new mic for any audio pieces I do. What I have now won't cut it, and what I used the first time is long gone.

Also - a quick question in regards to old stories - and this really is an honest question so please no jumping down my throat and calling the Lit. police.

I currently have on my submission page 3 stories that I started and I posted in chapter form. These 3 stories (all different works) are unfinished. My desire is to pull those chapters and rewrite each story until it is finished, then submitting them as one piece. Would these be eligible for Survivor or not? They would be the original only in theory because by starting over, I'm definitely using the same idea, but I won't be using the same text. It's sorta like editing a story, but also it is like starting completely over. Opinions?

 

[LOAnnie2]

RE: Chapters vs Sequels

So I sat out Survivor 2011, only ended up publishing one story anyway so not like I missed out on much compared to normal.

However, due to the every year discussion on chapters vs sequels vs not I'll throw in my 2 cents once more.

I still find the irony as pointed out in the second posting on this thread that the logic of "Literotica allows 750 word stories so we have to as well" while simultaneously allowing "Literotica allows chapter stories so we won't".

I'm going to use a TV show as an example of the argument. In this case, Dr Who.

There are many people out there who do write stories and break them into chapters in the same vein as an episode of a TV show is broken up into segments by commercials. Then there are others who write whole episodes of tv shows as one story, but are building into a bigger arc--hence where the idea of Dr Who comes in. Most seasons, while having the occassional 2-part episode generally have every episode that is in some way stand-alone, they're complete stories in and of themsevles. But at the same time taking these same characters, they're also building toward the bigger arc of the season (or in the case of the show right now there are things from the first episode of Modern Season 5 that have yet to be fully resolved).

I personally think the lit community deserves to have these types of stories. Some people have long story arcs in mind that previous stories help with but you don't need to know them all to catch on. These stories better literotica and unfortunately without allowing these types of stories into survivor, we're getting more of the 8 minute story (think most old school kids cartoons that had 3 different stories in one episode) vs actual quality writing.

So I propose a few ideas: 1) Create a Chapter'd story category in the survivor contest. Sure, for some people they'll take a 3000 word story and break it into 3 1000 word stories for 5 points, but in the end it's only 5 points and there's no reason author's really racing for the top wouldn't do that anyway.

2) Create a rule much like the Novels and Novella's category, allow a limited number of chapters (let's go with 3 again) that can be spread out anywhere among the other categories.

3) The same as #2, but limit chapter stories to only being able to fill the one point scores of a category, allowing non-Novels and Novellas chapter stories to only count for 3 points in the system (instead of 5 or a potential of 9).

 

[RedHairedandFriendly]

I forgot about the chapter thing. So perhaps I need to discuss this too. lol

Taken from the rules post:

Multi-chaptered stories are not eligible for the contest. Each submission needs to be completely original and completely independent. Stories can feature recurring characters, they can contain passing references to each other, but they must be entirely, unequivocally, standalone. The only exceptions allowed to this rule are:

1. the Chain Stories category, which is multi-chaptered by definition; each author will only be entitled to one chapter eligible for Survivor per chain per contest year.
2. the Novels and Novellas category, where submissions can either be standalone stories with 7500 words or more; or chapters of a larger work, as long as each chapter has 7500 words or more.

So with this - I have to make sure I have a completed story for every submission? So my series "Senatorial Secrets" which ran 12 chapters would not be eligible for Survivor because each chapter depends on the other as far as the telling of the story?

Here is my 2006 scoresheet: http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=400263 During this time I don't think the chapters/novel rules were in play.

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

I just kind of skimmed the posts written so far, and one jumped out at me.

LOAnnie2, I actually like the idea of having a separate Survivor category for chapter stories. Personally, I think this would solve some of the issues. The cap rule would still be in effect, so the worry about someone writing a large number of 750 word chapters wouldn't matter. You could only count those stories for points for the chapter category (we do it for Special Contests, so why not?) but they can be in any Literotica category. What do y'all think? I seriously do think we need to do something with the chapter/no-chapter rule. It just doesn't work as it stands now.

Now, I will go back and answer some of the other questions individually.

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

In addition I think immunities should be worth the half (rounded up) the points of the category they are being used to cap. It's not like the Survivor Contest has ever in my experience been remotely competitive. You usually have a contest that looks a little like this.

1. God.
2. Bill Gates
3. Steve Jobs
4. Steve Job's stool
5-50th. The worns in Steve Job's stool.

That said if you use an immunity in the current contest and you find yourself in a close fight you have to write (assuming you used it on tier one) 5
stories to make up for that one immunity and that's a bit nuts in a race where each story is worth one point.

You could even make them worth no points UNLESS you finish the entire tier to prevent someone from just collecting immunities year round and placing without writing a single story.

Immunities were worth points before we put the cap system in place. I can't remember if we took the points at the same time or before. I do think they were worth too many points. Like Box said, the trade off if you didn't want to write in a category was to use an immunity and get no points.

We can revisit the idea of points for immunities, but I personally don't think they should be worth a lot if it's decided to make the worth something.

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

Hmm... well I do think I'll read through the old rules and go from there. I don't see an issue with the "cap" if all it means is that for me to go into level 2 I have to cap all the other categories first. I can divide my stories into 3 chapters if necessary, or if I want I'll break it into six, cap all other categories, bring the next three in, or if I can't do that than I'll post the others without counting them toward scores until I'm able (which would be after the cap on all level 1) - If I'm understanding things correctly.

Now - if the rules are really able to be changed with the power of this discussion thread, then I would tend to agree with the cap being reconsidered, but not completely and totally disregarded. Perhaps an increase of 5 chapters - I really don't know the answer though. I know how I'll write and participate in Survivor and I know if I screw up my scoring I'll PM Box and have him help me through the process.

One of the things I do have to do is purchase a new mic for any audio pieces I do. What I have now won't cut it, and what I used the first time is long gone.

Also - a quick question in regards to old stories - and this really is an honest question so please no jumping down my throat and calling the Lit. police.

I currently have on my submission page 3 stories that I started and I posted in chapter form. These 3 stories (all different works) are unfinished. My desire is to pull those chapters and rewrite each story until it is finished, then submitting them as one piece. Would these be eligible for Survivor or not? They would be the original only in theory because by starting over, I'm definitely using the same idea, but I won't be using the same text. It's sorta like editing a story, but also it is like starting completely over. Opinions?

With the rules as they stand right now, chapters are *not* allowed unless it is in the Novels or Chain story categories. So you can't write a big story and break it down into chapters for any other category (as of now anyway).

Can you tell me why you say increase the cap to 5? That would mean everyone would have to write 5 stories in every category instead of 3 in order to move to cap level two. Just curious as to why you would think about raising it.

As far as the old stories... I think they would pretty much have to be completely different in order to count because the rule is that any stories previously published cannot be counted for points in Survivor.


Box, I think the cap should be left in place for Novels. There is nothing that says the author has to post the story in chapters or even post it in chapters before it's finished for points. It's entirely up to them how they write it. If they want to deprive their audience of the end of the story just because they aren't getting points for it, that's their choice. Plus, getting rid of the cap would give a participant the chance to get more points than in other categories because stories in that category are worth more due to their required length. So someone could write one story for every category to get the three points each and then write nothing else but novels for the rest of the contest and end up with more points but less stories. Increasing the number allowed per cap for that one category might be okay in order to give the author more leeway in finishing a story but I wouldn't do a huge change. That's my opinion on it. What does everyone else think?

 

[RedHairedandFriendly]

I just kind of skimmed the posts written so far, and one jumped out at me.

LOAnnie2, I actually like the idea of having a separate Survivor category for chapter stories. Personally, I think this would solve some of the issues. The cap rule would still be in effect, so the worry about someone writing a large number of 750 word chapters wouldn't matter. You could only count those stories for points for the chapter category (we do it for Special Contests, so why not?) but they can be in any Literotica category. What do y'all think? I seriously do think we need to do something with the chapter/no-chapter rule. It just doesn't work as it stands now.

Now, I will go back and answer some of the other questions individually.

Can you tell me why you say increase the cap to 5? That would mean everyone would have to write 5 stories in every category instead of 3 in order to move to cap level two. Just curious as to why you would think about raising it.

First, thanks very much for clarification on the chapters, as well as on the question in regards to the old story/rewrites. If I do decide to pull the old stories, and rewrite them, I will not count them toward Survivor. It's a big "if" since I've been talking about pulling them for several months now and have yet to do it.


I do like the idea of a Chapter Category - with the Senatorial Secrets example, that story ran 12 chapters and covered 7 different categories - at the time the chapter rule was not in place, so each chapter did fit several categories and was placed/scored in each one.

My apologies for the misunderstanding in my regards to the increase of 5 before the cap. I meant that the increase would be 5 stories(chapters) in Novel/Novelette category only, that way a story could (if it is a really long one) be separated into 5 chapters, not 3. Five chapters could make it so the three chapters are not several Lit. pages long. Also five chapters could allow the writer to submit that work in five pieces (again shorter Lit. pages). All five would fall within the 7500 word minimum.

Granted, as I type this out, it would mean that an author may have to stretch the story to make it meet the three chapters in the first place, now we would be asking them to reach for five before the cap.

Perhaps there is no easy answer except making a "Chapter Category" and using the novel/novelette story there, but each chapter would fall under different genres.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I'm still usure as to what you mean by a "Chapter story category." I assume you do not mean a separate category anywhere except on the Survivors' scoresheet. That would mean the scoresheet would include 36 categories, rather than the present 35, and the story would be chapters, possibly three, all in different Lit. categories, but posted in the same place on the scoresheet.

As in this example: A few years ago, I wrote a story named "Jim's Girlfriend," and it was about a man going into his son's home and finding the son's girl friend in the shower. She and the older man fuck, and that part ends with Jim entering the bedroom where they are. That was classified as the Mature catagory. The next two parts were in Group Sex, but I could have made the final part Anal. I included all the parts in the Survivors' Contest that year, because it was before the rule against chapters. Would this be the sort of thing that would go into the "Chapter Stories" category? The parts were all too short to meet the requirements for Novels & Novellas.

This is not a really drastic change, because only one story of this kind would ever be included on a scoresheet for one year, unless the author finished all 36 first caps.

I have to agree that allowing an unlimited number of novel chapters would not be a good idea, but perhaps the cap could be higher on that one category or on it and chapter stories. .