Correct way to express numbers

[SydneyBlake]

What would be the correct way to express a football player in text, if all you know him by is his number? Would you write Number 50 or Number Fifty?

Also, do you write out a score? Or is it okay to use numbers?

Edited to add another question: is it a "two thousand-foot drop" or a "two-thousand-foot drop"?

Thanks.

 

[sr71plt]

Arabic numbers there are fine.

It's "two-thousand-foot drop"

 

[Zingiber]

I would be apt to use numbers for both the player and the score.

I searched a bit for play-by-play transcripts and found that announcers are apt to use the player's name in favor of the number, while the briefly tabulated play-by-play accounts use both name and number.

Referees reporting penalties use the number. "Holding... Number 50, offense. Ten yard penalty, down over." There are some amusing penalty calls on YouTube, if it seems relevant.

-Z.

 

[SydneyBlake]

Arabic numbers there are fine.

It's "two-thousand-foot drop"

Thank you. I knew you'd know.

 

[roomfor1more]

It depends on the format you are following and how the number is used. Generally I follow APA format due to its ease of use. Generally, under APA any number that is at least 10 is type out and numbers less than ten is spelled out. This means for 100 it is written as 100 but for the number 2, for example, it is spelled as two.

 

[snoopercharmbrights]

And like anyone else who wants to get his word count up, I write "two thousand foot drop".

 

[SydneyBlake]

It depends on the format you are following and how the number is used. Generally I follow APA format due to its ease of use. Generally, under APA any number that is at least 10 is type out and numbers less than ten is spelled out. This means for 100 it is written as 100 but for the number 2, for example, it is spelled as two.

I'm using the CMS, but couldn't find what I was looking for at the time.

I happened upon the guideline for expressing scores under punctuation and the en dash. (I'd been looking under the guideline for numbers.)

@snoopercharmbrights--I have yet to meet someone who needed to get their word count up. LOL. I'm trying to reduce mine.

 

[sr71plt]

For the number types queried, there's no difference in style between APA and CMS.

 

[AsylumSeeker]

For the number types queried, there's no difference in style between APA and CMS.

Oh gosh! Who the heck are you anywy?

REALLY?

Fuck you and your cunt, because I am convinced you are a she. Let's just leave ir at tnis.

 

[snoopercharmbrights]

... @snoopercharmbrights--I have yet to meet someone who needed to get their word count up. LOL. I'm trying to reduce mine.

You have never freelanced for small town newspapers. They pay by the word, and the b******s even hyphenate "Small-Street" to save the cost of a word.

 

[SydneyBlake]

You have never freelanced for small town newspapers. They pay by the word, and the b******s even hyphenate "Small-Street" to save the cost of a word.

LOL-You-are-right!

 

[mynameisben]

If you are writing about a single drop of ointment applied to somebody's foot in the year two-thousand, then you may correctly write, "a two-thousand foot drop."

 

[snoopercharmbrights]

If you are writing about a single drop of ointment applied to somebody's foot in the year two-thousand, then you may correctly write, "a two-thousand foot drop."

And if you are writing about long line bungee jumping you may correctly write "two thousand-foot drop experiences".

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Arabic numbers there are fine.

It's "two-thousand-foot drop"

As always, you are a complete and arrogant prat.

You waffle about arabic numbers then revert to alphabetic desciptions.

You are a complete shamus that uses this site simply for promoting your commercial interests, gives no support to wannabee writers ( I don't read stories on the site!!) and generally wants to confuse readable, understandable prose with some anally retentive crap you describe as 'commercial'.

A two thousand foot drop needs no hyphens and certainly no arabic or roman numbers.

This is Lit.

 

[sr71plt]

Well, let's see. Let's ask the OP. When you asked the question, Syd, were you interested in how the authorities in publishing handled those issues (which was the response I gave you, interpreting that when you bothered to ask at all--and then asked for the "correct" way when you did--that you didn't want to just wing it), or were you fishing for someone to tell you just do it any way you wanted, because this is just Lit. and because you wanted to invite Elfin just to rag on sr71plt again?

The Arabic numbers for scores and player numbers come under the CMS 16, section 9.13 guidance, "It is occasionally acceptable to depart from the general rule for certain types of quantities that are commonly (or more conveniently) expressed as numerals." (If Elfin would like to do some research and produce examples of game scores and player numbers being written out, I'd like to see see them. )

Number + Noun -- "Hyphenated before the noun, otherwise open" Example "a hundred-meter race"; "a three-inch-high statuette" (CMS 16, section 7.85) (note the written-out numbers in CMS's example)

I didn't just arbitrarily spout off what I preferred here. Syd asked for the "correct" way. So, I looked up what the authorities on publishing said was the correct way. If she didn't want help, she wouldn't have asked for a "correct" way. And if she'd just done it her way on Lit. and hadn't asked for a "correct" way, I wouldn't have said a thing.

(Could Elfin be getting any crazier--or more malicious? And could she be revealing any better just how little she knows about the subject?)

 

[PennLady]

A two thousand foot drop needs no hyphens and certainly no arabic or roman numbers.

This is Lit.

It may be Lit, but that doesn't mean grammar rules don't apply -- for those of us who prefer them. Yes, "a two-thousand-foot drop" should be hyphenated. I learned that so long ago I can't remember not knowing it. Compound adjectives like that get hyphenated, and I'm sure it's in the style guides, as SR71 cited.

When I read stuff like "a two thousand foot drop," I wonder if it's just laziness or if the writer never learned it. This may be Lit, but there are correct ways of writing things.

 

[LettersFromTatyana]

The Arabic numbers for scores and player numbers come under the CMS 16, section 9.13 guidance, "It is occasionally acceptable to depart from the general rule for certain types of quantities that are commonly (or more conveniently) expressed as numerals."

And there you go. I learned something today. Thanks.

 

[sr71plt]

And there you go. I learned something today. Thanks.

The rendering of numbers is one of the dicier functions of editing. (Elfin isn't out of bounds for not knowing all the ups and downs; she's out of bounds for assuming--wrongly--that she does and then pushing that on others and for stepping on her tongue in erroneously castigating those who do know--or at least who look it up.) There are so many exceptions to the "written out" basic guidance in CMS (the publishing authority for the humanics, which includes fiction) that you have to do a lot of checking to get it "right."

Hyphenation follows not far behind in stickiness. As the section I cited points out, most adjective combinations are hyphenated before the noun but not after (e.g., a twelve-foot-long boat/a boat that's twelve feet long). I often get back a plaintive, "but you hyphenated it here but not there." Well, yes, because they occurred in different parts of the sentence. And I didn't make the guidance up--the authorities did.

Beyond that, writers tend to hyphenate lots and lots of noun combinations and prefix combinations that aren't--and Spellcheck is no help in this, as it's not designed to pick those up. For prefix combinations, go to the very start of that combination (say "non") in Webster's, and it will give a long list of whether to hyphenate (usually not) (e.g., nonabrasive, nonabsorbable, etc.). In determining whether to hyphenate a combined noun, go to where it is in the dictionary. If it's run together or hyphenated, or two words, it will be rendered properly in the dictionary. If it isn't shown at all, it's open, two words.

 

[snoopercharmbrights]

What I fail to understand in all these discussions in which we are referred to CMS is by whom, where, and when was it decreed that CMS is the only true source and guide. Did I miss the United Nations adopting that as part of international law?

 

[SydneyBlake]

What I fail to understand in all these discussions in which we are referred to CMS is by whom, where, and when was it decreed that CMS is the only true source and guide. Did I miss the United Nations adopting that as part of international law?

I really don't care "who." I just know it is.

And while the online version has a very good search engine, I am not as adept at asking the correct question when trying to find an answer. So I can either spend time looking, follow my instincts (which could be wrong), or I can ask here. Since I know someone here knows the answer and is generous enough to share that knowledge, I ask. Seems pretty fucking simple to me.

Again, thank you.

 

[estragon]

It may be Lit, but that doesn't mean grammar rules don't apply -- for those of us who prefer them. Yes, "a two-thousand-foot drop" should be hyphenated. I learned that so long ago I can't remember not knowing it. Compound adjectives like that get hyphenated, and I'm sure it's in the style guides, as SR71 cited.

When I read stuff like "a two thousand foot drop," I wonder if it's just laziness or if the writer never learned it. This may be Lit, but there are correct ways of writing things.

SA Penn Lady, you are entirely correct.

 

[PennLady]

What I fail to understand in all these discussions in which we are referred to CMS is by whom, where, and when was it decreed that CMS is the only true source and guide. Did I miss the United Nations adopting that as part of international law?

It is not the "only true source." It is one that has been adopted by many publishers as their standard. My former company, a news organization, used the AP Style Guide (but that was journalism, not fiction). I'm sure there are plenty of other guides out there.

However, as in many industries, one becomes the standard, whether officially or by default. You certainly don't have to abide by the guidelines in it, but no need to get up in arms about it when someone cites it in answering a question.

 

[sr71plt]

It's not the standard for that many publishers in the UK market (although it is for some, e.g., Continuum, a UK publisher I've edited for), so Snooper is saved there. It is, however, the standard for U.S. humanities (which includes fiction--and a lot of nonfiction too) publishing by somewhere close to all of the U.S. publishers. Each publisher has a "but" set of guidelines of their own, but everything is keyed to the Chicago Manual of Style. And the "who" of who has decided is all of them on concert--because their main concern is a standard read for the reader/buyer, not for the author's ego to "do his/her own thing."

It certainly isn't "law" on Literotica, but if a poster asks for the "correct" way to do anything, it's only common sense to give them the best practice response based on the market their material would be published in. Again, that's what was asked on this thread.

(I might add that any editor who whines about using one standard isn't anything close to a trained/experienced editor. Editors--like publishers--want everything as standard as they can get to reduce decisions and inevitable mistakes from tailoring edits. And they aren't wild about having to keep multiple styles in their head. A big part of editing is bringing consistency to the work. They also want to be able to spend more time and effort on the content than the technicals--which benefits the author as well.)

 

[SydneyBlake]

Okay, another numbers question. Would you write "room 10" or "room ten"? As in a hotel room number or office number. Thx.

 

[sr71plt]

Okay, another numbers question. Would you write "room 10" or "room ten"? As in a hotel room number or office number. Thx.

I'd write "room 10," but I probably wouldn't change it if the author consistently wrote "room ten." (Note the word "consistently." There's a lot of things that are in the gray area and will probably be left alone as unimportant author preference as long as they are rendered consistently. Once they are rendered inconcistently, though, the editor is like to take license to zip to the most-used in standard guidance.)

This is in a gray area as opposed to your other question, because some hotels/institutions will write the numbers out on their doors (so, if you know what your specific insitution does, that's the most correct for that reference). I don't recall ever seeing a football jersey with the number written out on the back of it, though.