Bringing a girl to her first orgasm?

[CelticKnotted]

Not all women can orgasm from g-spot stimulation, and some of the ones who can don't feel that emotional 'rush' that you're depending on.

Remember, the clitoris is basically the female penis due to the fact that anatomically speaking, it's the same nerve endings and tissue in the fetus of the male and female babies.

I know that anatomically they have the same origins, but they obviously have developed in very different ways. It is pretty clear simply from the fact that there are two distinct "kinds" of orgasms that the clit is not perfectly analogous to the penis (or maybe it is--I can say that my orgasms are definitely stronger and "deeper" when I am stimulated at the base of the shaft versus the head--and there is some speculation that the g-spot is simply an extension of the clit).

Perhaps not all can physically have g-spot orgasms or their psychological conditioning is so ingrained that they are prevented from having them, but for the most part, I think that women have just developed preferences and sensitivities to particular things due to repetition.

Communication is essential, and she may or may not prefer clitoral stimulation, so you should be direct and -ask- your currently partner where she enjoys being stimulated the most. If she says her clitoris, then you should focus your attention there.

I agree, and I am certainly not advocating disregarding her preferences. It is very valuable and important information. But they only a beginning, not an endpoint. It is also incumbent on us to move beyond and improve the sexual experience, lest we be trapped in a stale experience that does not make available its full potential.

 

[CelticKnotted]

I beg your pardon? wean them off of clitoral stimulation That is honestly the most fucked up thing I've seen you say. I'm willing to take the rest of what you had to offer as a failure to put thoughts and emotions to word in an manner that best defines them on this forum, and I'll give you that, as you stated it over and over again...

LOL, it is remarkable how people latch onto a word like wean and draw up all kinds of negative connotations without actually considering the fact. People talk about weaning all the time. If a woman is excessively dependent on her vibrator for orgasm, any sex therapist will recommend gradual, progressive removal of the crutch. The notion of progressive removal of a crutch in pursuit of greater rewards is not a new concept. Hell, I have been attempting for some time to wean myself off of the orgasm/ejaculation link so as to achieve the mythic multiple male orgasm.

I don't have any agenda other than bringing each other to the highest levels of pleasure and bringing us as close emotionally as possible. Nothing I am doing has ever been communicated as uncomfortable or unpleasurable to her. Indeed she is usually the one trying to jump me, lol.

But wean them off of clitoral stimulation?! That is pompous, uneducated, and ridiculous. What is your bases of argument? Have all 11 of your sexual partners told you in no uncertain terms that they preferred that you wean them off of clitoral stimulation because deep down they didn't like it?

Wean them off of clitoral stimulation That makes no bloody sense. I don't even understand the reasoning of that. You didn't say "I prefer to do this instead" you said "no, I like to take this away" and there is no actual reason short of your limited sexual understanding of how a woman works. And not just a solitary woman, you've lumped all women's sexual desire, drive and function into one ideal from having sex with 11 women. How many women are on this planet?

So...from this response I'm going to go with you didn't actually read my post but instead freaked out and immediately hit the reply button as soon as you saw the word "wean".

I said nothing about disregarding clitoral stimulation or avoiding it entirely. Variety of sensations is always good, and I enjoy giving women clitoral orgasms. Indeed, I try to give a woman a few clitoral orgasms before having sex, as I think it makes g-spot orgasms come easier.

And yes, 11 is no bases for "most women". It is not a majority. You have no control group.

LOL, I'm not conducting a scientific study here. However, I am referencing both my personal experiences and extensive readings on the subject

Good god. I'm not mad at you, I'm just flat out shocked and appalled by that...I don't even have a word for it.

Ok.

I mean really, just as Satin said above me

It would behoove you to follow Satin's example and state your objections rationally, instead of being "shocked and appalled".

Or, for that matter, how is it supposed to empower her emotionally against being molested by another boyfriend who put his sexual agenda above that of their partnership, and above her well being?

Please tell me you did not just equate me to her rapist ex-boyfriend, because if so, the gloves are coming off.

 

[CelticKnotted]

Hmmm. If someone tried to 'wean me off clitorial stimulation' I'd probably punch them in the face.

I've had about two g spot orgasms in my life. Hell, half the time Mr and I have sex, I don't even orgasm.

And you know what? Our emotional bond is as deep and as powerful as ever.

I didn't say that g-spot orgasms are the only means of building an emotional bond. You don't even need sex to build an emotional bond. All I'm saying is that it can help, and in my experience and the reports of others, vaginal orgasms through intercourse do so better than clitoral.

 

[PhilGarlic]

Sex has always come naturally to me, a bit like how some people are natural athletes or natural dancers.

I guess as you are posting for this advice, the above is not in fact correct

 

[goddessoflove]

Hmmm. If someone tried to 'wean me off clitorial stimulation' I'd probably punch them in the face.

I've had about two g spot orgasms in my life. Hell, half the time Mr and I have sex, I don't even orgasm.

And you know what? Our emotional bond is as deep and as powerful as ever.

That sounds alot like me. I don't orgasm through intercourse very often and I am fine with that. I wish men would accept the fact that some of us need clitoral stimuation to cum. I love the feeling of a cock in me etc. but I am not going to stress out if I don't cum.

 

[satindesire]

That sounds alot like me. I don't orgasm through intercourse very often and I am fine with that. I wish men would accept the fact that some of us need clitoral stimuation to cum. I love the feeling of a cock in me etc. but I am not going to stress out if I don't cum.

I'm not really sure why so many men seem to object to clitoral stimulation, as if a penis in the vagina "should be enough" for -all- women to feel pleasure/reach orgasm.

I don't know if it's misogyny, fear, ignorance, jealousy or what, but I've struggled with this in the past and I know other women have too. I wish I could find out -why- this seems to be an issue, but I sincerely doubt any man would be brave enough to step forward and admit the reason behind the reluctance to give clitorally focused women the stimulation they require.

 

[bailadora]

I'm not really sure why so many men seem to object to clitoral stimulation, as if a penis in the vagina "should be enough" for -all- women to feel pleasure/reach orgasm.

I don't know if it's misogyny, fear, ignorance, jealousy or what, but I've struggled with this in the past and I know other women have too. I wish I could find out -why- this seems to be an issue, but I sincerely doubt any man would be brave enough to step forward and admit the reason behind the reluctance to give clitorally focused women the stimulation they require.

'Cause it might take more time than some men are willing to invest? Speaking for myself only, it takes me a looooong ass time to orgasm from clitoral stimulation - even when its just me, myself and I. Some men are willing to put in the time and care and some aren't.

 

[PhilGarlic]

'Cause it might take more time than some men are willing to invest? Speaking for myself only, it takes me a looooong ass time to orgasm from clitoral stimulation - even when its just me, myself and I. Some men are willing to put in the time and care and some aren't.

I think you are right regarding the time to make some women cum from clitoral stimulation, I guess anything from 10 to 20 mins of some good tongue and finger action for my wife, but once there she will then cum quiet easy from a good pounding.
Some of my best work done during those times!

 

[CelticKnotted]

'Cause it might take more time than some men are willing to invest? Speaking for myself only, it takes me a looooong ass time to orgasm from clitoral stimulation - even when its just me, myself and I. Some men are willing to put in the time and care and some aren't.

Maybe for some. Personally, I like to feel a woman cum while I'm inside of her and love watching her while in that state. It is a very beautiful thing to watch something so primal take over her body and mind, even if it just for a moment. It's hard to see that going down on a girl, and fingers (in my opinion) are rarely as effective. I hate getting handjobs. Invariably the girl does not measure up to my own abilities (I have had a good deal more practice). I imagine it is quite similar for a girl. Or maybe I just suck at fingering.

 

[Bandit58]

Maybe for some. Personally, I like to feel a woman cum while I'm inside of her and love watching her while in that state. It is a very beautiful thing to watch something so primal take over her body and mind, even if it just for a moment. It's hard to see that going down on a girl, and fingers (in my opinion) are rarely as effective. I hate getting handjobs. Invariably the girl does not measure up to my own abilities (I have had a good deal more practice). I imagine it is quite similar for a girl. Or maybe I just suck at fingering.

Maybe you do My Dom/Husband is able to give me multiple g spot orgasms with His fingers We don't often have penetrative sex due to erectile difficulties, but when we do (I'm always on top) after the fingers I am able to orgasm from penetration - I can also stimulate my clit while in this position which adds to the pleasure

 

[Firebrain]

Perhaps not all can physically have g-spot orgasms or their psychological conditioning is so ingrained that they are prevented from having them, but for the most part, I think that women have just developed preferences and sensitivities to particular things due to repetition.

Yes, because the act of a penis ramming into a vagina is in no way a regular form of g-spot stimulation...

Seriously. Please take yourself to a mirror, look that guy in the eye and say very slowly: I know nothing about the female orgasm.

Now. Come back, read this thread and start learning.

 

[bailadora]

Maybe for some. Personally, I like to feel a woman cum while I'm inside of her and love watching her while in that state. It is a very beautiful thing to watch something so primal take over her body and mind, even if it just for a moment. It's hard to see that going down on a girl, and fingers (in my opinion) are rarely as effective. I hate getting handjobs. Invariably the girl does not measure up to my own abilities (I have had a good deal more practice). I imagine it is quite similar for a girl. Or maybe I just suck at fingering.

And your point would be what? If a woman needs clitoral stimulation in order to orgasm, it doesn't matter what YOUR preferences are. If she doesn't receive the proper stimulation, she's not going to orgasm. Why is that so difficult for some men to understand?

 

[silverwhisper]

celticknotted quoth:
in my experience and the reports of others, vaginal orgasms through intercourse do so better than clitoral.

i've never heard anyone make such a statement. ever. but since you consider yourself so well informed on the subject, you clearly must aware that the vast majority of women report being incapable of orgasming through vaginal stimulation. the percentage is either 80% or 90%, i forget which.

some women can. but this is absolutely a minority of the female population.

the problem you've been having is that you're suffering from the classic mistake of thinking clitoral orgasms are lesser. are you somehow not understanding all of the women in this thread telling you that you're wrong about that?

ed

 

[CelticKnotted]

And your point would be what? If a woman needs clitoral stimulation in order to orgasm, it doesn't matter what YOUR preferences are. If she doesn't receive the proper stimulation, she's not going to orgasm. Why is that so difficult for some men to understand?

The question was: Why do men prefer orgasm through intercourse vs. orgasm through clitoral stimulation? You hypothesized (in subtle man-hating fashion) that men were too lazy and didn't want to invest in anything other than a couple pumps. I simply said that this was not true (I've personally had sex for over two hours with brief breaks and gone down on a girl for 30 min nonstop) and stated what the more likely reason was. That in combination with the reasons I've stated above.

 

[CelticKnotted]

i've never heard anyone make such a statement. ever. but since you consider yourself so well informed on the subject, you clearly must aware that the vast majority of women report being incapable of orgasming through vaginal stimulation. the percentage is either 80% or 90%, i forget which.

I question the accuracy of those stats, but lets assume they're true for the sake of argument. Those are purely descriptive statistics. They simply say "90% of women have HAD an orgasm through vaginal stimulation. They say nothing about what women are actually capable of. I know men with much more sexual prowess and experience than myself have a nearly 90% success rate in making women orgasm vaginally with time.

I am getting shit left and right from all kind of people on here, but I would the fact that of the 11 women I have slept with I've given all of them orgasms and 8 of them orgasms through intercourse, am I on just an absurdly lucky streak? Isn't it possible I actually do know SOMETHING about the female orgasm? Good Lord.

 

[Firebrain]

I am getting shit left and right from all kind of people on here, but I would the fact that of the 11 women I have slept with I've given all of them orgasms and 8 of them orgasms through intercourse, am I on just an absurdly lucky streak? Isn't it possible I actually do know SOMETHING about the female orgasm? Good Lord.

They said you gave them orgasms. There's no actual way of proving it and as a gender, we can be rather convincing when we want to be.

Go look up the stats on faking, my friend

Even if you did, what that says is that you know something about the orgasms of eleven women. Since our bodies work in strange ways, this means precisely bugger all to the woman you're currently with. We're all new equations. A bunch of women are trying to tell you this...don't you think that says something?

 

[CelticKnotted]

They said you gave them orgasms. There's no actual way of proving it and as a gender, we can be rather convincing when we want to be.

Go look up the stats on faking, my friend

They could be faking, but I always warn them (in a playful but sincere way) before we've even had sex that I don't mind if they orgasm, because I just want to enjoy the experience (I don't always end up orgasming if the moment isn't right), but if fake it I will know it, and we will never have sex again.

There are subtle signs that are difficult to fake, like the speed and rapidity of orgasmic contractions, but it's true that I could probably be fooled by a dedicated woman. Still, I think that the lack of pressure to orgasm and the danger of losing me as a sexual partner would make the risk/reward (and thus the chances) of faking fairly low. But who knows.

Even if you did, what that says is that you know something about the orgasms of eleven women. Since our bodies work in strange ways, this means precisely bugger all to the woman you're currently with. We're all new equations.

That is simply wrong on its face. Yes, people are individuals and as such we are all "different", but that does not mean that there are not common themes and common techniques. If each woman was literally completely different than the next, then there would be literally no way for a person to improve at sex.

This isn't even a debatable issue.

A bunch of women are trying to tell you this...don't you think that says something?

If what you said above were true and each woman is literally a totally "new equation" and nothing can be extrapolated from one woman to another, then their opinions of what works for any woman other than themselves would be just as irrelevant as mine.

 

[Firebrain]

They could be faking, but I always warn them (in a playful but sincere way) before we've even had sex that I don't mind if they orgasm, because I just want to enjoy the experience (I don't always end up orgasming if the moment isn't right), but if fake it I will know it, and we will never have sex again.

There are subtle signs that are difficult to fake, like the speed and rapidity of orgasmic contractions, but it's true that I could probably be fooled by a dedicated woman. Still, I think that the lack of pressure to orgasm and the danger of losing me as a sexual partner would make the risk/reward (and thus the chances) of faking fairly low. But who knows. .

I got this far, and....oh, come on. You're not being serious. Really? Are you? You start out sex by threatening her about faking an orgasm?

No, really, you know nothing. You place that kind of expectation on a girl...well, now it's not surprising to me that you think they all had orgasms

(I fake orgasms awesomely. I can do it so well that I almost fool myself.)

 

[CelticKnotted]

I got this far, and....oh, come on. You're not being serious. Really? Are you? You start out sex by threatening her about faking an orgasm?

No, really, you know nothing. You place that kind of expectation on a girl...well, now it's not surprising to me that you think they all had orgasms

(I fake orgasms awesomely. I can do it so well that I almost fool myself.)

The expectation to...not have an orgasm?

Congratulations for being able fake an orgasm so well...you should take pride in the fact that you've had such outstanding partners, fantastic communication with him, and complete openness that you have had a need to perfect such a skill.

Please, tell me more about what it takes to be good in bed.

 

[Adrraiya]

The expectation to...not have an orgasm?

Congratulations for being able fake an orgasm so well...you should take pride in the fact that you've had such outstanding partners, fantastic communication with him, and complete openness that you have had a need to perfect such a skill.

Please, tell me more about what it takes to be good in bed.

CelticKnotted... okay... I have read the on-going saga of this thread since the last time I posted & I have some things to say

First.... you come off as very arrogant.. in fact, you remind me of the arrogance my 23 year old son somehow manages to exude in most things he says.... there are several things in your many posts (here & other threads) that lead me to that statement... the fact that you come off so arrogant is part of what is causing you to "get shit left & right"...

You mentioned "Mythical Male Multiple Orgasms"... I have been with men who are able... in my 45 years, I have been with less men than you at 25.... but I spend YEARS with each one & thru the processes of developing a deeper relationship & better sex...at least 4 of the 8 have proven that it NO MYTH... and, from every one of them, they will tell you that Kegels are just as important to male orgasm as they are to female orgasm... so you keep working towards it..

Now... as it relates to females, their orgasms (or the faking of orgasm), and the origin of the orgasm -- Please... Please... PLEASE ... take the time to KNOW MORE... not just spout off what you think or what you (in your limited years of experience) think you have seen.....

Clitoral Truth... by Rebecca Chaulker would be a good book for you to buy... share it with your friends & such.. it will answer the biolgical question of things like clit is sorta the penis & such as well as provide you with information that you need... especially if you are going to go into battle on this type of topic


It seems you REFUSE to realize that you have the value of MANY WOMEN attempting to educate you... yet you refuse to listen to what is said to you


I agree with the person who said... you need to open your eyes to the idea that you have much to learn..........

 

[satindesire]

Here's the god's honest truth.

If you have had sex with eleven women, and did not stimulate their clitoris during intercourse, and they did not stimulate their clitoris during intercourse, and they still had an orgasm...there's a HUGE chance at least most of the women you've slept with are faking it.

Why? Because young men don't like to stimulate a woman properly, for whatever reason. And women are embarrassed to admit that the vagina isn't sensitive enough for their pleasure most of the time. Porn is a HUGE factor in this, since clitoral stimulation is minimal or nil and fake orgasms abound.

This is not a slap on you. Most men have NO IDEA how important the clitoris is to a woman's pleasure because of a variety of reasons, but it is. Saying that you're SURE the women you've slept with can orgasm without it is possible, but REALLY HIGHLY UNLIKELY!

I'm not trying to be disrespectful of you, but saying things like you want to 'wean' a girl off clitoral stimulation is really ignorant, because would YOU want to be 'weaned' of penile stimulation during intimacy? If a woman you're with orgasms through clitoral stimulation there is NO NEED to futz with her pleasure. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

There has been a lot of heat in this thread and I've had to leave and calm down before posting more than once, I'll admit. But you've got to understand the majority of people that have posted here have told you the SAME thing, and that really -should- count for something to you. The clitoris IS the female penis, and if you like stimulation to your penis and don't want someone messing around with how you get your pleasure, DON'T DO IT TO SOMEONE ELSE!

 

[Firebrain]

The expectation to...not have an orgasm?

Congratulations for being able fake an orgasm so well...you should take pride in the fact that you've had such outstanding partners, fantastic communication with him, and complete openness that you have had a need to perfect such a skill.

Please, tell me more about what it takes to be good in bed.

There were plenty of people trying to help you -- me included -- before you turned into a cocktard.

I do indeed take pride in the fact that I've slept with some unskilled men at a time where I was unskilled myself. It's called being young, uninformed and insecure.

Fortunately...I admitted that, some of them admitted that, we listened to each other and we learned together.

I'm not sure you understand how awkward a woman might feel telling you that she hadn't orgasmed after sex. If a man brought this up before we started I'd spend the entire session worried about whether I'd do it or not and it'd probably mean that I wouldn't (or it'd take much longer).

 

[CelticKnotted]

...

Hi satin. Did you read my response to your original post?

 

[bailadora]

The question was: Why do men prefer orgasm through intercourse vs. orgasm through clitoral stimulation?

Wrong. Read again:

<snip> but I sincerely doubt any man would be brave enough to step forward and admit the reason behind the reluctance to give clitorally focused women the stimulation they require.

I read that as: If the goal is to bring a woman to orgasm and she tells her partner she needs clitoral stimulation in order for that to happen, why would a man not give her what she needs?

You hypothesized (in subtle man-hating fashion) that men were too lazy and didn't want to invest in anything other than a couple pumps. I simply said that this was not true (I've personally had sex for over two hours with brief breaks and gone down on a girl for 30 min nonstop) and stated what the more likely reason was. That in combination with the reasons I've stated above.

I fail to see where I said ALL men. I said SOME men. And it isn't a hypothesis at all: it's fact. I've had some men flat out tell me that my orgasm was too much effort and they were tired of working so hard for it. Yeah - those relationships didn't last long. Truth is: there are some people who are generous when it comes to sex, and then there are others who are selfish pigs. It's been my experience that loving, long lasting relationships occur when partners pay attention to what their lovers tell them with regard to sexual satisfaction and then give them what they need - despite the fact it might not perfectly align with their own sexual preferences.

Man-hating? Huh - learn something new everyday. Guess someone should inform my husband. Then again, he's an intelligent and intuitive guy and one would think he'd have caught on after 22 years together.

 

[satindesire]

Hi satin. Did you read my response to your original post?

Well, it wasn't my first post to you but we'll roll with it.

Some things I want to impress upon you before we go further.

You said:

I am aware of the importance of the clitoris to orgasm. I typically don't manually stimulate it because I have usually been able to bring a girl to g-spot orgasm successfully and if not, I bring them to orgasm orally.

Women who are capable of both g-spot and clitoral orgasms may or may not have the same sort of satisfaction regarding the kinds of orgasms they have. For some women, clitoral orgasms are not as satisfying. For some women, g-spot orgasms are not as satisfying. Assuming that a g-spot orgasm IS AS SATISFYING as a clitoral orgasm isn't going to work. You need to make sure that's how your partner's orgasms works. Since you have not made it obvious which one she prefers, and since she has had so little experience with reaching orgasm, we have no choice but to think that you actually don't know what she prefers, therefor, it's rather safe to default to clitorally focused orgasms since the majority of women on the planet are like this. Holy breathless sentence batman!

You said:

If this is commonplace among women, I must have slept exclusively with aberrations because none of them have immediately done so. I have stimulated their clits on occasion just for variety (this is what happened last time), but it is not the usual way I do things.

Okay, let's turn this around. Let me say: "If penile stimulated orgasms are commonplace among men, I must have slept exclusively with aberrations because none of them have immediately done do. I have stimulated their penis on occasion just for variety, but it is not the usual way I do thing."

Now, as a man who I'm pretty safely assuming needs some sort of penile stimulation to orgasm, how would that make you feel if I was your lover? That I only stimulated your penis to satisfy you "on occasion for variety"? Again, since this girl you're currently sleeping with has had very little experience with orgasms, she isn't going to be immediately sure of what exactly she needs. And to beat a dead horse some more, it's safe to assume she'll need clitoral stimulation to reach orgasm for maximum sexual satisfaction. To say you don't "usually" do this makes you seem either selfish at worst, or uneducated in the way women's sexuality ACTUALLY works at best.

I honestly am only trying to help you and I'm not trying to attack you or make you feel inadequate, so please bear with me.

You said:

I'm certainly not too embarrassed. It's just that the g-spot orgasm has always been related to me to be the stronger, deeper orgasm, and the one that creates a more powerful emotional bond to the person and the act of intercourse itself. As such, I try to work away from direct clitoral stimulation as the primary source of orgasm.

Now, most women aren't going to be like this. I'm sorry to say, but there's a good chance some of your previous partners were faking. TONS of young women do this all the time, God knows I certainly did and I'm not ashamed to admit that now. However, since your current partner has so little experience with orgasms, you should rely on what you now know as the usual method of stimulation in order to reach sexual satisfaction for most women on the planet, which is stimulation of the clitoris. Defaulting to the g-spot really might not be what she needs. Time and good communication will tell.

Whatever you do, from now on, do NOT try and 'wean' your partners from clitoral stimulation and orgasms. Please. If you don't understand by now how that is a really BAD THING, I couldn't possibly explain it any further. Assuming that -all- women find g-spot orgasms more satisfying isn't a safe assumption because most women don't, and I'm not saying that because I have any sort of weird agenda, I'm just telling you what's true.