The use of the words "slut" and "whore"- what are your thoughts?

[Netzach]

What is a positive, or even neutral, term meaning "promiscuous woman"? The female equivalent of "stud"?

I think that word has actually shifted in meaning. Stud is more analagous to "babe" - a male who elicits desire, rather than a male who has a really notched bedpost.

In a way the appearance of an STD that kills people has leveled a stigma on promiscuity that applies more across-the-board.

Personally I don't find this a good development, but the double in the double standard is affected, IMO.

 

[satindesire]

What is a positive, or even neutral, term meaning "promiscuous woman"? The female equivalent of "stud"?

I've heard women be called "players" plenty around here. It's a gender-neutral term.

"Stud" isn't really used for promiscuous men anymore, that mostly means "hot guy with nice muscles".

ETA: Um, yeah. Netz beat me to it. xD;!

She's right though. It's not remotely safe to be promiscuous anymore, there's so much nasty stuff going around that you gotta practically health screen your dentists these days. So, the term of "whore" and "slut" are gender-neutral negatives against promiscuity.

 

[Kojote]

What is a positive, or even neutral, term meaning "promiscuous woman"? The female equivalent of "stud"?

That's not what I meant.
I don't think we got that far that there are positive words existing apart from adventurous or fun-loving (rather generic).
Maybe flirtatious... But even that doesn't really fit.

 

[JMohegan]

I think that word has actually shifted in meaning. Stud is more analagous to "babe" - a male who elicits desire, rather than a male who has a really notched bedpost.

In a way the appearance of an STD that kills people has leveled a stigma on promiscuity that applies more across-the-board.

Personally I don't find this a good development, but the double in the double standard is affected, IMO.

I've heard women be called "players" plenty around here. It's a gender-neutral term.

"Stud" isn't really used for promiscuous men anymore, that mostly means "hot guy with nice muscles".

ETA: Um, yeah. Netz beat me to it. xD;!

She's right though. It's not remotely safe to be promiscuous anymore, there's so much nasty stuff going around that you gotta practically health screen your dentists these days. So, the term of "whore" and "slut" are gender-neutral negatives against promiscuity.

This is a fascinating semantic development - and I say that with no sarcasm.

*wraps sheet around bedpost.* Carry on.

 

[culloden]

So because "slut" is used everywhere (Brad Majors - asshole! Janet Weiss - SLUT!!)

That is an interesting observation. Back 30 years ago, in NJ and PA, Janet's appearance on the screen netted "Nice tits!" At the same time in Utah, behind the Zion curtain, they were calling Janet "Slut."

 

[satindesire]

It's fascinating how threads evolve...from personal definitions of feminism, to the history of treatment of women, to the changes in definitions of words!

 

[FloggingMolly]

When I was in school, I was often called a slut, even though I wasn't in the slighest sleeping around. It came about because I was always flirty and fairly sexually confident, and often dressed a bit more 'slutty' than others. It didn't bother me.

I am his slut, because in bed, I display that wanton sexual passion (when in the right mood) that is associated with being a slut.

I don't find it humiliating at all, but confirmation that he notices and approves of my desires/reactions. Its alot to do with the context and tone for me. If he called me a slut in a serious, accusatory way, and particularly in public, then we'd have an issue. I can think of far worse things to be called in bed.

 

[infinity706]

You can't reclaim something that was never claimed in the first place. "Queer" used to be neutral, then it became derogatory. It's being reclaimed. "Slut" was never a good thing.

Do you ever use any of them as a term of affection, or is it "you fucking cunt" when somebody spills a drink on you?

It's almost always affectionate unless it's used in a gossipy context, especially considering I pretty much never get mad and yell at people. Of course, I have to be careful with it on the internet, where nonverbal communication is pretty much nonexistant.

 

[Etoile]

That's quite a dichotomy you're setting up there. Promiscuous female *or* person of worth.

You're not the only one, of course. Implicit in the notion that slut and whore are humiliating terms is the notion that female promiscuity is fundamentally wrong. It's so interesting to me that this moral standard holds up, even here.

You don't mean me, right? Because I explicitly said that I don't find anything wrong with a girl enjoying sex and having multiple partners...more power to her, I said. However, the words' negative connotation is - forgive the cross-thread reference - societally-influenced. Just because I recognize that slut and whore are degrading terms doesn't mean I have a problem with the people to whom they are often applied. I think I also mentioned that I don't use the terms much at all, myself.

 

[Ravenwind]

For me, terms like slut and whore *are* degrading... but, they are "reality checks", so to speak. I know what I am, and recognize my own personal weaknesses, and I hate that aspect about myself. However, when I'm called as such by my Husband, it allows me to revel in that side of me, in a way that I become comfortable with myself. I fall prey to that side of me, but in a personally acceptable way: I am not "just any slut", I am "my Husband's slut". It causes me to turn my weakness into a strength.

On the whole, though, I would beat the living daylights out of anyone, other than my Husband, who'd use those terms against me. Especially whore. ...unless the term was "AWP whore", then I'd grin at them and say "Thanks, it wasn't easy", but that's a different story...

 

[LunachickXXX]

When I was in school, I was often called a slut, even though I wasn't in the slighest sleeping around. It came about because I was always flirty and fairly sexually confident, and often dressed a bit more 'slutty' than others. It didn't bother me.

I am his slut, because in bed, I display that wanton sexual passion (when in the right mood) that is associated with being a slut.

I don't find it humiliating at all, but confirmation that he notices and approves of my desires/reactions. Its alot to do with the context and tone for me. If he called me a slut in a serious, accusatory way, and particularly in public, then we'd have an issue. I can think of far worse things to be called in bed.

Agreed! If I hear myself (or any other woman) refered to as a "slut" in a public / RL setting where no RP is going on, I get on the defense. But often, it is completely detached from the woman's sexuality..."Cunt" "Bitch" "Slut" "Whore"...despite their individual meanings, these words are used interchangably. To degrade someone, they attack their sexuality...maybe aiming to hurt them on a deeper, personal level?

But in bed, we create our own context. The meanings of those words slightly changes when you narrow the universe down to you and your partner(s). IMO I think that's part of the fun.

-Luna

 

[Black_Bunny]

Sometimes I actually do think of myself as a slut, not as in actually going around sleeping with many men, but just being promiscuous and thinking slutty things. Before I met my Dominant, I took myself off to a sex counsellor because I felt I couldn't control myself.

I think of myself as needing to be controlled, tamed in a way, like a hungry lion that will eat anything that moves unless her Tamer is there to look after her and sate her.

This all sounds like my Dominant only has to look the other way and I'm off with another man, and of course it's not like that... it's just how I think of myself sometimes. I think, if it weren't for him I truly would be a slut. But because he holds me tightly, he gets the reward of me being a slut only for him.

 

[Kojote]

Sometimes I actually do think of myself as a slut, not as in actually going around sleeping with many men, but just being promiscuous and thinking slutty things. Before I met my Dominant, I took myself off to a sex counsellor because I felt I couldn't control myself.

I think of myself as needing to be controlled, tamed in a way, like a hungry lion that will eat anything that moves unless her Tamer is there to look after her and sate her.

This all sounds like my Dominant only has to look the other way and I'm off with another man, and of course it's not like that... it's just how I think of myself sometimes. I think, if it weren't for him I truly would be a slut. But because he holds me tightly, he gets the reward of me being a slut only for him.

Actually it sounds like he is doing a really good job at fulfilling your desires and needs.
Lucky you!
(And it sounds like he could be counted a lucky one, too.)

 

[Black_Bunny]

Lucky you!
(And it sounds like he could be counted a lucky one, too.)

Right on both counts

 

[Homburg]

I'll pass. Sluts give themselves away freely, whores go with whoever ponies up the cash, I have no desire to imply any submissive of mine is anything but mine to have or to give away as I pleased.

I've long thought "whore" better refers to someone, male or female, that trades sex for gain. The connection between sex, trade, and service is what defines it. Money is just the most obvious method.

Still, I find "slut" and "whore" both to be wildly overused to the point of being cliched, "slut" especially. The only time I use "slut" is after "rope" and only rarely there. It is a joking term, not one used as a pejorative or in a sexual connotation. Given that viv has a tanktop with "ropeslut" blazoned on it for the occasional events we attend, it is a humourous thing.

Otherwise, I will occasionally use "whore" in certain contexts. It is more the implication of shameless wantonness that it implies than actual sex for trade. *shrug* Sometimes a word is right for the moment.

 

[FurryFury]

I dislike these words in general particularly when directed at me because I'm not either a slut or a whore. I work at being a good girl who is intimate only with my mate. I don't like that disregarded or demeaned.

However, used by someone I trust, who I know respects me in just the right tone of voice it can be hot.

Also I use it to describe my cats sometimes. LOL.

 

[Kojote]

Right on both counts

Mind borrowing him out for some lessons?
(For me actually. I'm still a beginner...)

 

[DVS]

Slut and whore? They are only offensive if you think they are. They are just names. In this politically correct world, call some vanilla chick (did I say chick?) a slut of a whore and see if you don't end up in court.

Actually, I don't use either word. Not that I wouldn't or haven't at some time in the past or future...it's just I don't know any sluts or whores at the moment.

 

[laceandcogs]

Slut and whore? They are only offensive if you think they are. They are just names. In this politically correct world, call some vanilla chick (did I say chick?) a slut of a whore and see if you don't end up in court.

Actually, I don't use either word. Not that I wouldn't or haven't at some time in the past or future...it's just I don't know any sluts or whores at the moment.

I think I have to disagree with this one. I've never been able to intellectually support the notion that words only have the power you give them. For example, no matter how much pride I may invest in calling myself a fag, it will never be -enough- to prevent some jackass hick from perpetrating violence on me for the sake of the exact same word. So no, I don't think one can "take it back" when it comes to words designed explicitly to shame and hurt. We can inure ourselves the meanings that others assign to a word we attempt to reclaim, but we cannot control the hate that that same word ignites in another. To pretend that calling ourselves and our friends fags, cunts, whores, and worse sucks the venom out of those words is naive. It also does -nothing- to deconstruct the hate culture surrounding sexually liberated individuals.

I appreciate what all of you have said in this thread, but the idea of taking it back will never fly for me. Much like one cannot be a pimp and a prostitute too, one cannot work effectively to dismantle inappropriate social behaviors while simultaneously employing hate speech, even if our intentions in using those words are much different.

 

[laceandcogs]

That's quite a dichotomy you're setting up there. Promiscuous female *or* person of worth.

You're not the only one, of course. Implicit in the notion that slut and whore are humiliating terms is the notion that female promiscuity is fundamentally wrong. It's so interesting to me that this moral standard holds up, even here.

No dichotomy intended. Promiscuity and worthiness are not mutually exclusive. The use of words designed to humiliate on the basis of promiscuity, AND the kind of respect I want to see in a relationship of Domination... those are mutually exclusive concepts.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

No dichotomy intended. Promiscuity and worthiness are not mutually exclusive. The use of words designed to humiliate on the basis of promiscuity, AND the kind of respect I want to see in a relationship of Domination... those are mutually exclusive concepts.

You keep using those words. I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

http://www.alicia-logic.com/capsimages/pbr_020CircusPerformers.jpg

 

[laceandcogs]

You keep using those words. I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

http://www.alicia-logic.com/capsimages/pbr_020CircusPerformers.jpg

Reference appreciated, meaning not grasped. Which word do you think I misunderstand? It's "no", isn't it? (grins) I get that a lot.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Reference appreciated, meaning not grasped. Which word do you think I misunderstand? It's "no", isn't it? (grins) I get that a lot.

As you wish.

Why is it inconceivable (oh lord I need to see this movie again soon...) that words like slut and whore find a place in a respectful relationship? A lot of people would say that a relationship where one partner beats and binds the other was necessarily a relationship devoid of respect. But of course that's not true, either.

 

[FloggingMolly]

Good point I think.

Also, sometimes I call him 'asshole' or 'moron' if we're kidding around (he does the same, its not just me). Does that mean I truly think he is those things, or just that he's behaving in that manner? Does it mean I don't respect him?

I call my dog 'shit-head' or 'demon dog'. It isn't accurate, but it's a term of affection between us.

Surely the meaning of the dictionary definition of the word becomes less relevant when used to mean something different? Otherwise, all of us using 'Daddy', 'baby', or 'little girl' are being seriously insulting also?

 

[satindesire]

Well, let's look at it from another perspective and maybe this'll help make it make more sense.

A lot of people could never think the word "nigger" wasn't insulting, no matter WHAT context it was used in.

Words have power, words have incredible power. The ability to call up emotions, memories...that's pretty pervasive for something that's nothing more than a social construct as human language.

So, some people aren't going to be able to think the word "slut" or "whore" are okay words to use, no matter what context they're in or what intentions were behind the words.