FIFA World Cup 2010.

[Songcatcher]

Very enlightening. It's fascinating to hear about other countries and how they nurture National teams. Thanks so much for your insight, Og. I think my question arose due to some media coverage that I've heard here (mostly on BBC World and Sky News) about the age of the players on National teams like England and Italy. When Lauren told me that there was no such thing as city house leagues or regional competitions as extra-curricular activities, I was surprised. Sport (any competitive sport) is a great lesson for children on multiple levels: sport encourages children to do their best, to see things through from start to finish, sport builds character in children even (when they make the team and when they don't), competitive sport is a very good lesson in how to deal with a range of emotions ... winning and losing. I, I think like you, encourage competitive sport, especially amongst young people!

This being said?
Aww, Japan ... you looked good out there, and held it like I knew you could. Paraguay wasn't a better team, they just got lucky on the shootout!

Nah. Germany have never missed a penalty shootout shot, therefore never lost a shootouts since 1982.

We know this.

 

[Pure]

japan out.

it must be heartbreaking for Japan to lose on a single, flawed kick. i kinda wanted them, as representatives of Asia, to proceed.

i'm very ignorant here, but are shootouts with penalty kicks the only approved, last-resort method for resolving ties in soccer?

 

[CharleyH]

The cannon fodder for the winner of Portugal-Spain later today will be Paraguay; Japan lost that opportunity for embarassment by missing the fourth penalty kick in the tie-breaker.

lol -

Tonight a big clincher, probably the biggest game since Portugal met Brazil a few days ago (again, sorry England) I honestly can't say who will win. Bookies across the world favour Spain. Torres has always been a favourite Euro and Premier-league pick for me, but I don't see him doing much. Ronaldo is creative, but never scores much for the National team. Spain plays well in the first half and gets lazy in the second ... Portugal gets a feel for the game in the first half and powers it in the second. Eduardo hasn't conceded a goal in the World Cup up to this point (and only 3 since he took over the Portuguese goal 2 years ago), and Casillas has already allowed 2 in 3 matches. Spain is the current European Champion, but with aggressive playing mid-fielders like Tiago, Meireles and Simão, Spain is in for a run. I live in Portugal, so... FORÇA PORTUGAL!

 

[driphoney]

Have to disagree with you there, sdsioux. It is the most popular sport for school kids; highest participation rates of any sport. I coached for 15 years in Canada, and we always enjoyed top-quality competition in tournaments from Vermont to New Jersey and from Massachusets through Ohio at all levels, from house league to triple-A.

Yep. One morning I was studying in a local McD's with a sports theme (go figure, but it is Texas after all) and Man U was playing Someone on the flatscreen. First, the game held the fascination of a couple of Hispanic men before they went off to work, but then in came the families. I watched three groups of elementary aged kids keep their eyes glued to the screen of that game. Once, I heard a mom go, "Boys, quit watching that game and eat so we can go!"

These kids are all going to grow up soon and be fans.

Which brings me to a slightly different thought. The world yucks it up at the expense of the non-conformist Yanks struggling to do that which the world finds so easy. The World Cup has also been a major connecting point between cultures exclusive of the US. Does the world really want the US getting with the program? If American popular culture, and the economic power it will bring, gets behind round-ball football (soccer), what impact will that have?

 

[CharleyH]

it must be heartbreaking for Japan to lose on a single, flawed kick. i kinda wanted them, as representatives of Asia, to proceed.

i'm very ignorant here, but are shootouts with penalty kicks the only approved, last-resort method for resolving ties in soccer?

Yes, if a game ends in a draw and the tie persists after the 30-minute extra time, the only tie-breaker is the penalty shootout. Some competitions used to have a rematch, but that's not feasible in a World Cup. And in the US there was a variation tried in the 90s - a player would start with the ball from the midfield and would have 5 or 10 seconds to try and score, I think. A long, long time ago, before they came up with the penalty shoot-out, the last-resort method was a simple coin toss.

 

[CharleyH]

Nah. Germany have never missed a penalty shootout shot, therefore never lost a shootouts since 1982.

We know this.

And this has to do with the Paraguay and Japan game, how?

 

[Weird Harold]

it must be heartbreaking for Japan to lose on a single, flawed kick. i kinda wanted them, as representatives of Asia, to proceed.

i'm very ignorant here, but are shootouts with penalty kicks the only approved, last-resort method for resolving ties in soccer?

Not in "soccer" per se, but in this edition of the World Cup it is the prescribed method and is usually the preferred method in the final rounds of FIFA sanctioned tournaments.

In Qualifying rounds, the tie-breaker is a full rematch instead of the two fifteen minutes extra time and penalty kicks as required. ETA: assuming time and facility availability permits, otherwise a coin toss or "lots" as a last tie-breaker.

FIFA dropped "Golden Goal" extra time as the ultimate decider because of controversy and because of fatigue and injury issues; various procedures were used for Golden Goal overtime, but the one used in the 90's World cups was, IIRC, "five minutes rest, ten minutes of play and repeat ad nauseum until somebody scores."

CharleyH, I think the hockey style shoot-out (running start) was a NASL feature and that would make it late 70's to early 80's. I don't recall anyone else using it since.

 

[CharleyH]

Not in "soccer" per se, but in this edition of the World Cup it is the prescribed method and is usually the preferred method in the final rounds of FIFA sanctioned tournaments.

In Qualifying rounds, the tie-breaker is a full rematch instead of the two fifteen minutes extra time and penalty kicks as required. ETA: assuming time and facility availability permits, otherwise a coin toss or "lots" as a last tie-breaker.

FIFA dropped "Golden Goal" extra time as the ultimate decider because of controversy and because of fatigue and injury issues; various procedures were used for Golden Goal overtime, but the one used in the 90's World cups was, IIRC, "five minutes rest, ten minutes of play and repeat ad nauseum until somebody scores."

CharleyH, I think the hockey style shoot-out (running start) was a NASL feature and that would make it late 70's to early 80's. I don't recall anyone else using it since.

I'm pretty sure there are a lot of imprecisions in that post of yours, WH. I can't think of any FIFA qualifying round anywhere in the world where a full rematch is a tie-breaker. There are play-offs, but that's different. FIFA tried two "sudden death" varieties in the late 90s and early 2000s: Golden Goal, i.e. first goal scored in a 30 minute extra time would end the game; and Silver Goal, i.e. if a team was ahead after the first 15 of the 30 minute extra time period, the game would end there. There was never any variation, anywhere in the World, where extra time would just continue indefinitely. And as for the US hockey-style shoot-out, I know for sure that it happened in the early years of MLS, in the mid-90's. If it had already been tried before, that's another story.

Did I mention? GO PORTUGAL ... second half and I know the boys will score and win. FORÇA Portugal!

 

[Weird Harold]

I'm pretty sure there are a lot of imprecisions in that post of yours, WH. I can't think of any FIFA qualifying round anywhere in the world where a full rematch is a tie-breaker.

I don't believe any one has ever played such a match, but it was mentioned as a possible scenario during this world cup's concacaf qualifying as an alternative to a possible "lots" situation to decide who qualifies. I think our difference of opinion here is more on the definition of a "tie-breaker" than what the rules are.

As for other "imprecisions" that's entirely possible as I'm working from memories of a long-time casual interest in soccer tournaments.

 

[CharleyH]

I don't believe any one has ever played such a match, but it was mentioned as a possible scenario during this world cup's concacaf qualifying as an alternative to a possible "lots" situation to decide who qualifies. I think our difference of opinion here is more on the definition of a "tie-breaker" than what the rules are.

That's entirely possible.

ASIDE: DAMN! Spain 1 ...

 

[CharleyH]

DAMN! #%(9! Portugal. lol

 

[Weird Harold]

ASIDE: DAMN! Spain 1 ...

Spain is very good at Keep-A-Way, aren't they

They aren't completly passive, but damn, one goal is NOT an insurmmountable lead for anyone.

 

[Weird Harold]

DAMN! #%(9! Portugal. lol

They made a valiant effort at the end, but it just wasn't enough.

 

[Verdad]

Too bad for Portugal they had to face Spain so soon.

Brazil and Spain in the finals, then, failing major surprises? Argentina kind of baffles me, so one moment it looks to me they won't get past the Germans, and the next I can imagine them beating Spain. Either way, I don't think I like Argentina's style.

In any case, two days of withdrawal to suffer, first.

 

[past_perfect]

The fact is, people who saw the '66 goal talk/ed through their lives about that goal.

People who saw 2010 non-goal will argue about this goal through their lives.


Pros and cons.

That's how I feel.

Well, yeah, sure. On German telly they re-enacted the scene, placing the linesman and the referee where they were standing - they really couldn't see with any degree of certainty that it was a goal. Neuer freely admitted afterwards that he gathered it might have been behind the line, but decided to play on, just in case the referee missed it.
I think it is time to introduce some technology there.

...fell asleep during the first half of Spain vs Portugal (not because of the game). Shit, I was really looking forward to that one.

 

[fieryjen]

Well, yeah, sure. On German telly they re-enacted the scene, placing the linesman and the referee where they were standing - they really couldn't see with any degree of certainty that it was a goal. Neuer freely admitted afterwards that he gathered it might have been behind the line, but decided to play on, just in case the referee missed it.
I think it is time to introduce some technology there.

...fell asleep during the first half of Spain vs Portugal (not because of the game). Shit, I was really looking forward to that one.

Well yeah, I'd say that's pretty much exactly what he should have done, so good for him. It isn't his job to determine whether or not it was a goal, it's the ref's. At the same time, I agree that technology is sorely needed.

 

[CharleyH]

Nah. Germany have never missed a penalty shootout shot, therefore never lost a shootouts since 1982.

We know this.

Enh,Germany, We shall see.

 

[CharleyH]

Spain is very good at Keep-A-Way, aren't they

They aren't completly passive, but damn, one goal is NOT an insurmmountable lead for anyone.

As I said to everyone else ... next world cup I am betting on Canada ... no stress!

 

[Pure]

netherlands hanging by a thread.

equalizing goal. brazil seems too powerful,but the dutch are still in. looks like no europeans will be in the finals.

go dutch!

==

OMG!!!!!!!!!! the dutch have done it. brazil got nasty and disorganized.

 

[Verdad]

Netherlands 2, Brazil 1.

Oops. So much for my predictions.

 

[R. Richard]

Netherlands 2, Brazil 1.

Whoda thunk it???

 

[Verdad]

Whoda thunk it???

Unbelievable how they completely fell apart, eh? On the bright side, at least I didn't bet for real!

 

[R. Richard]

Here's a prediction for you, one you CAN bet on.

Dunga (Dopey) is gone!!!

 

[jomar]

That was insane!

 

[Verdad]

Whew. Tired after watching Uruguay-Ghana. Not a very attractive game, but definitely not lacking in every kind of drama.