Right. So now it's the cow's fault.

[Kev H]

The following story shows even the most primitive cultures have (and most likely have always had) their share of dunderheads and fucked up rationalization.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/WeirdNews/2010/06/11/14351946.html?cid=rssnewsweird news

 

[3113]

The following story shows even the most primitive cultures have (and most likely have always had) their share of dunderheads and fucked up rationalization.

It's the big brown eyes

Sounds to me like the young man was very smart. He knew he'd get in trouble if he said, "I like fucking cows." So, instead he said, "I saw a woman, not a cow!" meaning that magic was involved.

And the rest of the village believed him! But how different is this from a minister who insists that the devil "lured" him into gay sex and a little time at bible camp will turn him hetero again--and all his followers believe him? I have less contempt for the person making up the silly excuses then all those who let them get away with such excuses. And primitive or modern, there seems to be a lot of those who would rather believe ridiculous lies than face the truth.

 

[xssve]

But she had such pretty eyes...

The Goat, an abstract receptacle for sin, is one of the most ancient of the elements of human religion, Jesus is basically a Goat.

The more things are a sin, the bigger the Goat you need.

Why Goats? I dunno, they do have those freaky eyes...

 

[R. Richard]

Why Goats? I dunno, they do have those freaky eyes...

It's the horns, you idiot, the horns.

 

[R. Richard]

There's a story about a man, touring in eastern Europe. The man goes into a bar one night and gets into a conversation with a very sad looking man.
T: Why so sad?
Sad: You see the bar? I built that bar. Do they call me bar builder? No.
Sad: You see the dock out there? I built that dock. Do they call me dock builder? No.
Sad: But you fuck one goat ...

 

[xssve]

You sure it isn't the tongue?

http://files.myopera.com/Chyren/files/goat_tung.jpg

 

[R. Richard]

Absolutely. It's not polite to stick your tongue out at people, especially when you have tin can breath.

 

[voluptuary_manque]

And once the cow was drowned everyone was happy? Weird!

 

[JackLuis]

It might be one of those things, where everyone was relieved to put it behind them. The Cow fucker, became the poor bewitched victim, the Village chief didn't have to castrate his once removed nephew, the Cows owner was paid, the village could all forget it, and the brown eyed cow fed the fish so everybody was happy.

Beats having him tried and sentenced to rehab at the dairy farm, only to fall prey to the same lascivious demon with those big brown eyes, that make you want to ...

 

[Loring2]

Come-on

It's the horns, you idiot, the horns.

Nanny goats don't have horns but you can have gay sex with a billy goat, they have horns unless you're a woman ... aaah this is silly

 

[Loring2]

Great

There's a story about a man, touring in eastern Europe. The man goes into a bar one night and gets into a conversation with a very sad looking man.
T: Why so sad?
Sad: You see the bar? I built that bar. Do they call me bar builder? No.
Sad: You see the dock out there? I built that dock. Do they call me dock builder? No.
Sad: But you fuck one goat ...

One of my favorite jokes of all time ... think of the futility of this.

 

[R. Richard]

Nanny goats don't have horns but you can have gay sex with a billy goat, they have horns unless you're a woman ... aaah this is silly

Goat is the common name for any of eight species of cloven-hoofed, horned mammals closely related to the sheep. The two differ in that the goat's tail is shorter and the hollow horns are long and directed upward, backward, and outward, while those of the sheep are spirally twisted. The male goats have beards, unlike sheep. Male goats also have a characteristic strong odour that is produced particularly during the rutting season. The female goat, or doe, which has smaller horns than the male, is often called a nanny goat. The young are called kids. The male goat is called buck, or, colloquially, billy goat.

 

[TxRad]

The Chicago fire was the cows fault if I remember correctly.

A hot little heifer she was as the story goes, that liked to kick up her heels.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

The goat was probably chosen as the agent for expiation of sins because of its horniness, which is no pun. Goats are a lot more sexually aggressive than sheep and more difficult to tame, so to a nation of sheep-herders (as the ancient Hebrews were), the goat came to personify lust and willfulness. Satan today still wears the horns, beard, and legs of a goat

The ritual of the scape goat is pretty interesting and very old, dating back to the period when Jews still made actual blood sacrifices to Yahweh. There's still some doubt about exactly what it was intended to do, but each year around the Day of Atonement, two goats were selected and red threads tied around their necks. They were led to the edge of a cliff, and a priest pushed one of them to its death ("the goat for Azazel"). If the ritual was successful, the thread on the other goat's neck turned white.

The idea that the worshipers rid themselves of sin in this way is probably not strictly correct, and depends on how we understand the name, "Azazel," which is a tough little Biblical nut to crack. Azazel might be an early Old Testament name for the devil, but the very idea of the devil as the source of all evil is not native to the Old Testament (that would flirt with dualism, which is anathema to Jews). Azazel might also be a fallen angel who tempts men to sin. There are accounts that he taught men to make war and women to use makeup.

If Azazel is a tempter, then the scapegoat ritual isn't so much a way to get rid of one's sins as it is a way of bribing him to leave you alone in the coming year. It might seem like a minor point, but as with so much in theology, it has big implications. Jews believe that the only way you can free yourself from sin is through God's mercy, not by passing it on to a surrogate and having it pay in your stead. That's a very Christian idea, and in fact is the very basis of Christ's mission on earth.

In any case, if the cow didn't want to get raped, it should have been wearing a bra

 

[ishtat]

.

(that would flirt with dualism, which is anathema to Jews).

It is anathema now Doc but it's important to remember that the priesthood was complaining bitterly about the common people's worship of other Gods in Deuteronomy (628 BC Josiah's reign) and even in the 5th century BC after the return from Exile, Nehemiah and Ezra still had problems with the people worshipping other(foreign)gods. Female godheads being especially frowned upon.

The traditions we are talking about have their roots in the early bronze age and earlier when there is plenty of evidence of dualism among NW Semitic people including the Jews.

I'm pressed for time now but later I'll come back to this thread on the most famous scape goat story, the story of Isaac and orthodox, (academically orthodox) literary analysis of the story.

 

[3113]

so to a nation of sheep-herders (as the ancient Hebrews were), the goat came to personify lust and willfulness. Satan today still wears the horns, beard, and legs of a goat

It's a little more than the fact that sheep herders weren't all that fond of goats. Let us remember they do have weird eyes and that, to the superstitious, this would make them suspect. As well, let's remember that the Greeks had Pan, god of lust and such, and he had goat hooves and horns.

The Jews didn't much like their tribal members worshiping any other gods (hey, it's right there in Commandment #1, right? The jealous god). A lot of Biblical stories are simply "My god's greater than your!" Take Cain and Abel. The shepherd (Abel) wins out over the farmer (Cain) in a sacrifice contest. Hebrew tribes were sheep herders--meanwhile, the Egyptians were farmers. So the story told to Hebrew children is, the farmers aren't as well liked by god as us sheepherders and they're not real trustworthy either. And look at Moses--Pharaoh's magicians toss down staffs that turn to snakes, Moses tosses down his which turns into a bigger snake that eats theirs. Talk about a pissing contest. And remember Pharaoh is Egypt's god on earth. Every plague is a smack down of the Egyptian god by the Hebrew god ("nah-nah-nah!" ). The golden calf story is also smacking down tof Egypt's worship (and worship in a lot of other places come to that) of a sacred cow.

The Jews had a running propaganda machine that worked to dismiss other gods and promote the Hebrew god--who they kept insisting was the biggest, baddest god on the block, making them, that god's chosen worshipers, ultra-special. The dislike of goats might well have been linked to this, in particular run-ins Jews had with the Greeks (who got into some nasty fights with Jews--remember the Maccabees?), and their worship of a goat-god.

The devil with horns and hooves came much later, of course, but that was Christianity taking that propaganda machine to the next level. Not only were other gods verboten, they were demons, their worshipers to be killed and they to be converted. The worship of the goat-footed nature god (Pan or similar to Pan) was pretty common by the time--and included cults of Bacchus engaged in wild parties. Hard to fight the party god unless you get serious about it. The Christians began an aggressive campaign against him. In places where goats were less common he was Herne the hunter, horned like a stag. So the horned god with hooves = Devil.

Ain't religion fun!