The responsibility of the writer

[Keroin]

Given the potentially harmful nature of several BDSM activities, I’m curious to know what responsibility, if any, you think that a writer of BDSM fiction has to portray the events of the story realistically?

Is the fictional sky the limit? Can the BDSM fiction writer pen a story about any activity, no matter how harmful in a real life scenario? Where should the line be drawn?

Is it OK to show a dangerous activity or an abusive relationship as long as you portray those actions/people as “bad”? Or is it up to the reader, alone, to pass judgment?

 

[kara24]

Just a really quick initial response! As a first thought without looking too deep, I would say that it is totally up to the reader to make their own judgement. Fantasy and fact are 2 different worlds and the writer is not responsible for anyone who cannot separate the two!

OK now Im gonna go away and think about it some more and probably come up with a totally different response !!

 

[seela]

I believe it is up to the reader. Normal adults should be able to tell apart fact and fiction and I don't believe that everything in this world should be adjusted to the needs of the ones who aren't. I don't think our standard starting point for everything should be, that there could be someone who might take things literally and try out all stupid shit they've read about. It happens, of course, Darwin awards are an amazing proof on that front, but I believe in personal responsibility.

ETA: You did know that Bloved a.k.a. LoveIsAllYouNeed started an identical thread over in Authors' Hangout, which then lead to his first disappearance, right?

 

[Keroin]

I believe it is up to the reader. Normal adults should be able to tell apart fact and fiction and I don't believe that everything in this world should be adjusted to the needs of the ones who aren't. I don't think our standard starting point for everything should be, that there could be someone who might take things literally and try out all stupid shit they've read about. It happens, of course, Darwin awards are an amazing proof on that front, but I believe in personal responsibility.

ETA: You did know that Bloved a.k.a. LoveIsAllYouNeed started an identical thread over in Authors' Hangout, which then lead to his first disappearance, right?

No I did not. I avoid the AH...*shudders*.

I thought I'd put this topic here because it's BDSM specific. Hopefully I won't be run out of town

 

[seela]

I only frequent the BDSM boards myself as well, but Bloved mentioned the thread causing the first deletion of his stories so I looked it up.

 

[Netzach]

Given the potentially harmful nature of several BDSM activities, I’m curious to know what responsibility, if any, you think that a writer of BDSM fiction has to portray the events of the story realistically?

Is the fictional sky the limit? Can the BDSM fiction writer pen a story about any activity, no matter how harmful in a real life scenario? Where should the line be drawn?

Is it OK to show a dangerous activity or an abusive relationship as long as you portray those actions/people as “bad”? Or is it up to the reader, alone, to pass judgment?

Considering what's in the Bible and the scope of its influence, I don't think we are obligated as fiction writers to worry about what people might do.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Well, that's a question that all writers have to ask themselves at some point, be they writing a juvenile adventure story or a war espionage for adults, or a bodice-ripper romance for teenaged girls.

As a BDSM player, I try to give mostly realistic information when i describe actions, and as a watcher of people I try to give my characters more-or-less realistic motivations and reactions.

But as an erotica writer I don't mind exaggerating an effect, or making my characters outrageously orgasmic, and as an erotica reader I sure don't mind reading the over-the-top fantasy stuff. Vampires are my favorite guilty pleasure.

 

[Scotsman69]

As a fairly prolific writer myself, in BDSM and other genres, I believe that an author has a responsibility to her/his readers to be honest. That means try to portray everything realistically and honestly.

Stories may not always be based on biographical experience, but to be convincing they have to be drawn from such experience, or at least from realisable fantasies.

I strive to write in this way, and hope that sometimes I succeed.

 

[fuckmeat]

I don't see how BDSM erotic fiction writers have more of a moral responsibility to portray healthy dynamics than any other art genre aimed at adults does. Movie and TV show makers will happily dramatise the least palatable facets of human nature, mainstream literature does the same and there are no age restrictions on books. The bulk of the responsibility IMV lies with the reader.

In the SRP forum here I write dark, violent, nonconsensual roleplays featuring themes like abduction, rape, forced slavery and so on. The title of the thread often gives readers an idea of what they're in for and I will often put a warning on post 1 informing readers that the thread contains rape, torture or whatever's getting me wet that morning. I consider it responsible that I am writing this stuff in an adult online community where minors are not supposed to see it. It's just fantasy, just as shit like 'lesbian vampire killers' is fantasy.

I know that nonconsent is not part of the BDSM acronym. It's not something many people want to write about and just like actual rape, it's a lot more about power than it is about sex. I like being able to explore extremes in erotica that I would never want or enjoy in real life. Also, if you wander around SRPs, there is some seriously weird shit floating around that makes kinksters look positively dull. People are RPing as 'furries,' werewolves, vampires, cylons, tentacle wielding aliens, sentient plantlife, even fucking pokemon thingamies. If Daniel Radcliffe had any idea what Harry Potter gets up to over there, Literotica would be sued skint in a heartbeat. Nonconsent has fallen quite a way down the weird-shit-O-meter these days.

The nonconsent that I write, there's really no need to spell out that abuse is happening. Other threads dabbling in things like coercion and blackmail have more grey areas but most people can draw their own conclusions. If they can't spot a villain with a twirling moustache when he's beating, humiliating and assraping a character of mine in a back alley, they have about as much hope of identifying abusive assholes in real life. No amount of big flashing neon disclaimer screaming 'This here is some nasty shit!' will change that.

 

[FurryFury]

I agree.

I remember I was writing a SRP with a guy and my character wanted to do something she'd seen on TV as part of her stripper act.

At home I tried to do it and couldn't. Therefore I concluded that she tried and failed. This made my co-writer nervous but I was happy to keep it realistic, at least from my own POV even though it was a fantasy of sorts.

OTOH, my kidnapped series takes place in the late 70's just before talk of aids. That influenced my writing too. You won't find many condoms in those "rooms".

I do have a regular doctor check up scenario that I haven't finished writing and which will also include some BDSM stuff.

Note: This is a non consent secret shamefully turned on by it all fantasy series of stories. I find that conflict very hot which is why I write them. In real BDSM consent is absolutely key to me.

As a fairly prolific writer myself, in BDSM and other genres, I believe that an author has a responsibility to her/his readers to be honest. That means try to portray everything realistically and honestly.

Stories may not always be based on biographical experience, but to be convincing they have to be drawn from such experience, or at least from realisable fantasies.

I strive to write in this way, and hope that sometimes I succeed.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I have one friend who tells me she will not write about anything she hasn't done, or hasn't seen done. This is driving me nuts because she writes a lot about vamps-- and the other day she posted tentacles...

WAAAH! I WANT TENTACLES TOO! *pouts*

Of course the part of "what she has done" is actually the acts themselves, not the scenarios in which the acts take place. I want her to write about sounding, and she just won't. *pouts some more*

 

[BLoved]

I believe it is up to the reader. Normal adults should be able to tell apart fact and fiction and I don't believe that everything in this world should be adjusted to the needs of the ones who aren't. I don't think our standard starting point for everything should be, that there could be someone who might take things literally and try out all stupid shit they've read about. It happens, of course, Darwin awards are an amazing proof on that front, but I believe in personal responsibility.

ETA: You did know that Bloved a.k.a. LoveIsAllYouNeed started an identical thread over in Authors' Hangout, which then lead to his first disappearance, right?

[url="http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=663237]"What man is a man who does not make the world better?"[/url]

 

[chy_girl]

I've not written much that has to do with BDSM but my general rule when writing smut is that it's to be realistic. Boobs get saggy, hair gets caught, orgasm isn't always reached, things get interrupted, people in their 50's do not look 19 years old, not everyone is rail thin... And there are responsibilities when it comes to sex.

The idealized perfect picture that gets painted in story telling is irritating. I want the real life parts, not the barbie doll having sex.

*shrugs*
That's just me though.

 

[FurryFury]

I have one friend who tells me she will not write about anything she hasn't done, or hasn't seen done. This is driving me nuts because she writes a lot about vamps-- and the other day she posted tentacles...

WAAAH! I WANT TENTACLES TOO! *pouts*

Of course the part of "what she has done" is actually the acts themselves, not the scenarios in which the acts take place. I want her to write about sounding, and she just won't. *pouts some more*

I think I want to meet your friend!

 

[FurryFury]

I've not written much that has to do with BDSM but my general rule when writing smut is that it's to be realistic. Boobs get saggy, hair gets caught, orgasm isn't always reached, things get interrupted, people in their 50's do not look 19 years old, not everyone is rail thin... And there are responsibilities when it comes to sex.

The idealized perfect picture that gets painted in story telling is irritating. I want the real life parts, not the barbie doll having sex.

*shrugs*
That's just me though.

I like characters to be imperfect or at least not spend pages talking about how they look so perfect. That is such a big turn off.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

While I write my smut only to please myself, I do want the BDSM scenes to be as real as possible. This means that I do not write about anything I haven't attempted, either as a Top or bottom. My flights of fancy occur with my characters ie: a werewolf Domme, a vampire or two, whatever.

Most of my scenarios are based on real life. That is very important to me. I like to get feedback from people who tell me that I had the feelings or physical part perfect; even if it isn't their type of story. I can't do that without having some experience to base it on. My brain just doesn't work like that.

Thankfully, I do not allow myself to be limited by such things when I am in SRP but stories, they are different. They might be read by someone who has no knowledge of the act described. I need to be as candid and honest about it as possible to feel true to myself.

 

[PhaonsBrother]

OMG, I can't believe this thread is started again. Now that old windbag will rehash his entire thread from Author's Hangout.

The author of marked fiction bears no responsibility for the actions of the reader. The shitbag who wrote the Turner Diaries isn't responsible for the violence of the shitbags who live by the Turner Diaries. In fiction, no description should be taken as if it's coming from a source of authority.

 

[Keroin]

Considering what's in the Bible and the scope of its influence, I don't think we are obligated as fiction writers to worry about what people might do.

LOL. No kidding.

Well, that's a question that all writers have to ask themselves at some point, be they writing a juvenile adventure story or a war espionage for adults, or a bodice-ripper romance for teenaged girls.

As a BDSM player, I try to give mostly realistic information when i describe actions, and as a watcher of people I try to give my characters more-or-less realistic motivations and reactions.

But as an erotica writer I don't mind exaggerating an effect, or making my characters outrageously orgasmic, and as an erotica reader I sure don't mind reading the over-the-top fantasy stuff. Vampires are my favorite guilty pleasure.

I am getting vampire weary with all the vampness around lately, lol.

I don't write much erotica but what I have written definitely slips into the "fantasy" realm. To me, that's the point of erotic fiction, to take us where we can't or shouldn't or won't go.

As a fairly prolific writer myself, in BDSM and other genres, I believe that an author has a responsibility to her/his readers to be honest. That means try to portray everything realistically and honestly.

Stories may not always be based on biographical experience, but to be convincing they have to be drawn from such experience, or at least from realisable fantasies.

I would agree with "honestly" but not so much "realistically". In mainstream fiction, yes, but in erotic fiction, as I mentioned above, part of the thrill is living out fantasies that just don't fly in real life.

I read a very cute erotic short story once about a patron at a five star restaurant who complains about her meal and then ends up in the kitchen where the chef teaches her a lesson in manners, with his kitchen staff watching and cheering him on. Now, obviously this scenario is unrealistic but as fantasy it works very, very well.

I don't see how BDSM erotic fiction writers have more of a moral responsibility to portray healthy dynamics than any other art genre aimed at adults does.

Well, while I agree with you, I think that there are people who feel that somehow erotic fiction is a kind of "how to". I know that I have received comments on some aspects of the stories I've written, pointing out how unhealthy or dangerous something was - obviously with the belief that I was either green-lighting such actions or that some innocent newbie might decided to copy them.

OTOH, my kidnapped series takes place in the late 70's just before talk of aids. That influenced my writing too. You won't find many condoms in those "rooms".

Interesting. I know that none of my stories reference condoms or safe sex.

What do you all think about that? Should all erotic fiction contain safe sex practices?

I have one friend who tells me she will not write about anything she hasn't done, or hasn't seen done. This is driving me nuts because she writes a lot about vamps-- and the other day she posted tentacles...

WAAAH! I WANT TENTACLES TOO! *pouts*

Of course the part of "what she has done" is actually the acts themselves, not the scenarios in which the acts take place. I want her to write about sounding, and she just won't. *pouts some more*

Urgh, this drives me nuts!

I have a friend, mainstream fiction writer, who absolutely cannot write anything she has not had direct experience with or has observed closely. She says she just can't do it.

I've not written much that has to do with BDSM but my general rule when writing smut is that it's to be realistic. Boobs get saggy, hair gets caught, orgasm isn't always reached, things get interrupted, people in their 50's do not look 19 years old, not everyone is rail thin... And there are responsibilities when it comes to sex.

The idealized perfect picture that gets painted in story telling is irritating. I want the real life parts, not the barbie doll having sex.

*shrugs*
That's just me though.

Perfect characters are boring. Flaws, (internal or external), make characters interesting, conflict makes plot interesting. But you can have flaws and conflict and still have very unrealistic smut.

 

[Keroin]

OMG, I can't believe this thread is started again. Now that old windbag will rehash his entire thread from Author's Hangout.

The author of marked fiction bears no responsibility for the actions of the reader. The shitbag who wrote the Turner Diaries isn't responsible for the violence of the shitbags who live by the Turner Diaries. In fiction, no description should be taken as if it's coming from a source of authority.

I started the thread, didn't realize He-whose-name-must-not-be-spoken had started one already.

I encourage everyone to be civil and ignore any inflammatory "shite" that may rear its ugly head.

 

[DVS]

Well, that's a question that all writers have to ask themselves at some point, be they writing a juvenile adventure story or a war espionage for adults, or a bodice-ripper romance for teenaged girls.

As a BDSM player, I try to give mostly realistic information when i describe actions, and as a watcher of people I try to give my characters more-or-less realistic motivations and reactions.

But as an erotica writer I don't mind exaggerating an effect, or making my characters outrageously orgasmic, and as an erotica reader I sure don't mind reading the over-the-top fantasy stuff. Vampires are my favorite guilty pleasure.

I also try to be as realistic as possible, when describing a scene. The more real a story is for the reader, the more they can feel a part of it. I'm sure that's what many readers of erotica are looking for, escapism. It's similar to the Harlequin novels. I try to make scenes visual, so the reader can feel and almost smell what's happening. Many people enjoy sexual fantasy stories that can take them beyond what they feel safe in attempting in their real life.

I do have one story that includes different tasks or actions preformed by a character. Everything included in that story was possible. I made sure they were all tested. I also included a disclaimer before each chapter that mentioned the story was only fiction and to consider the content as anything else could be dangerous.

I don't feel that I'm responsible, if someone thinks the story is true or tries to preform any of the tasks for themselves, but I know there is probably someone out there who believes my characters are real. I just hope they are few and far between and I hope most head the warning I include at the beginning of the chapters.

P.S.
Lit rejected a story I wanted to post in the non-consent category ("A Victim of Subterfuge"). There was too much non-consensual action, I guess. And, when I submitted the first chapters of "My New Boss", I wanted it to go in the BDSM category, but someone decided it should be in the non-consent category because of the bondage in the story.

I had to protest to Laurel that I wanted it moved to the BDSM section, because it was a BDSM story. She countered by telling me it would get more views in the non-consent section and thought I'd get hate messages if it was moved to BDSM. I asked for it to be moved and said I'd accept any hate messages. I got no hate messages. Go figure.

 

[Scotsman69]

'Bloved' has been on my ignore list for some time: the only way to deal with him.

 

[DVS]

I started the thread, didn't realize He-whose-name-must-not-be-spoken had started one already.

I encourage everyone to be civil and ignore any inflammatory "shite" that may rear its ugly head.

What? Did you mention something about your rear? Are there pictures?

 

[Stella_Omega]

I feel that I should spend a day on all fours with a tail plug inserted.

For you know.. accuracy's sake.

Yeah, that's it.

Or maybe a couple of days.

A week?

 

[Keroin]

What? Did you mention something about your rear? Are there pictures?

I feel that I should spend a day on all fours with a tail plug inserted.

For you know.. accuracy's sake.

Yeah, that's it.

Or maybe a couple of days.

A week?

to both of you.

 

[DVS]

A rather large number of people in the BDSM lifestyle live a life according to Gor. This was all started by a number of books. It makes a person wonder, when you write a story.