Post-feminism and BDSM

[00Syd]

Can this also just be a case of something being erection killed via context and training? Like how I imagine MD's feel about medical fetish scenes? In addition to the desire not to find out what happens when you mix contextual stuff, a heavy dose of "omg, boring, btdt."

That makes a lot of sense to me, anyway.

Seb has absolutely no interest in any type of electrical play because he's an electrician. He says that playing with electricity would just be too weird in the sense that he would be mixing business and pleasure.

Luckily, I don't have any interest in electrical play, either.

 

[ownedsubgal]

I've never done any boxing or MA training, but I'm also totally uninterested in punching in a sexual context. This isn't an issue of holding myself back. The urge to make that type of movement, sexually, just isn't there.

When I'm worked up, I'm doing what comes naturally - letting go, if you will. Forcible restraint, flipping, tossing, smacking, pinching, twisting, biting - all of that just sort of comes with the flow. But punching? Never. I'm not sure why, and I'm not sure it matters why. In a sexual context, it's just not what I do.

what about outside of a sexual context (i.e. discipline, call to attention, etc.)?

 

[JMohegan]

what about outside of a sexual context (i.e. discipline, call to attention, etc.)?

If I can't achieve those goals with words, I don't consider myself to have actual control in a relationship.

 

[ZRT]

Can this also just be a case of something being erection killed via context and training? Like how I imagine MD's feel about medical fetish scenes? In addition to the desire not to find out what happens when you mix contextual stuff, a heavy dose of "omg, boring, btdt."

That makes a lot of sense to me, anyway.

Having been in a lot of hospitals and dealt with a reasonable number of medical situations as both a recipient of care and a bystander or responder, I'm exactly that way about medical scenarios. Totally not-sexy in the slightest. Medical clothing elicits a weary sign and a proffered arm for the inevitable needle.

That's also why I could never get into cutting. The moment I see a laceration, or blood in general, my mind kicks over to first aid mode. Aside from the fact that it's just not a kink of mine, it's also something that takes me totally non-sexual in a heartbeat.

So again it's just a matter of tastes, and our experiences will drive us toward some, and away from others.

(I seriously doubt anybody thinks Hommy's a pussy for not smacking his wenches.)

 

[FurryFury]

I consider myself a feminist. I was born in 1960. I appreciate the freedoms we have now due to that struggle.

Since I have that freedom, I can choose to be a stay at home mom who enjoys being controlled in the bedroom. I see no conflict there. I do think the things I'm ashamed of make me hot though. LOL.

Slaps and punches are not okay in my book. They bring back deep childhood trauma.

 

[ownedsubgal]

If I can't achieve those goals with words, I don't consider myself to have actual control in a relationship.

good point and i would tend to agree. but the physical i think adds a nice exclamation point which submissives like myself need. not in order to behave, but in order to maintain the fear and sense of helplessness. obviously, if those aren't your goals, no exclamation point needed.

 

[Homburg]

Can this also just be a case of something being erection killed via context and training? Like how I imagine MD's feel about medical fetish scenes? In addition to the desire not to find out what happens when you mix contextual stuff, a heavy dose of "omg, boring, btdt."

That makes a lot of sense to me, anyway.

Could be. I honestly don't know. I would definitely agree if I was a fighter by avocation. The headspace is definitely contrary to sexiness; that much is definite. Still, there's only a smidgeon of a degree's difference between that headspace and where I go when I'm really into a scene, doing rope seriously, etc. The mindset is very very similar, and I think this may be why the thought of it makes me nervous. When the line is that thin, it's easier to cross.

To an extent though, I'm with JM. Punching just never comes up. It's not an urge I have at all.

--

That's also why I could never get into cutting. The moment I see a laceration, or blood in general, my mind kicks over to first aid mode. Aside from the fact that it's just not a kink of mine, it's also something that takes me totally non-sexual in a heartbeat.

I don't consider cutting a kink of mine, though I've done it. I don't find the cutting to be erotic, but I like the marks it leaves. Same with cell popping and the like.

 

[BiBunny]

Can this also just be a case of something being erection killed via context and training? Like how I imagine MD's feel about medical fetish scenes? In addition to the desire not to find out what happens when you mix contextual stuff, a heavy dose of "omg, boring, btdt."

That makes a lot of sense to me, anyway.

I think this is entirely possible. My Master has been giving himself shots in the ass more than half his life. Even though I absolutely love needle play, he's not going to go there with me. (Dammit.) So I get that itch scratched somewhere else.

For the record, I, too, enjoy being kind of afraid of him.

 

[intothewoods]

Mine isn't interested in punching either. I've mostly had it done by Dommes.

 

[eastern sun]

Since my husband started boxing, his punches have tripled in force.

 

[ownedsubgal]

Since my husband started boxing, his punches have tripled in force.

wow.

 

[00Syd]

Since my husband started boxing, his punches have tripled in force.

wow.

Yeah, wow. Is that good or bad for you?

 

[eastern sun]

I am sure I am not the only woman who has experienced a warring of emotions between the "modern egalitarian woman" persona she has always identified with, and the "submissive slut" persona she revels in being. I expected it. I deal with it.

Anyone else with similar experiences? And philosophically, how do you deal with this warring of emotions?

As a young woman, I spent a great deal of energy asserting myself. I spent most of my time with men and I considered myself their equals in ability and emotional strength. I struggled with the idea that the cooking and the cleaning kept falling into my hands, and sincerely hoped that household labor would be shared equally in any partnership.

Over many years, and in the course of my marriage, I have been transformed. Frequently in the midst and/or as a consequence of warring emotions.

Today, I am my husband's "slave."

Philosophically, I fold this transformation into the path of my spiritual development in which I learned gradually to let go of my need to be in control of everything. As I let go, I discovered a whole realm of human behavior that I had not allowed myself to fully experience.

Philosophically, I began to hear ancient teachings that supported my choices. I began to feel like I was connected to the broad arch of human socialization. I began to identify with the animal that I am and the natural world that I am a part of.

Philosophically, I began to feel akin with the women in my family lineage, and see where I fit into the framework of "femininity" in my maternal line.

I also began to see how all this behavior fits into psychological patterns of abuse and developed a philosophical approach to the therapeutic process that "life" offers.

We humans can rationalize anything. Even genocide.

My mother was the feminist. And I have always been extremely ungrateful for and unappreciative of the tremendous freedoms I have.

 

[eastern sun]

Yeah, wow. Is that good or bad for you?

It's good.

But he checks himself when he punches me. He hits me like I'm "a girl," and always has.

He has always embraced the idea that "guys don't hit girls," and I don't think he sees any conflict between that idea and various kinds of impact play during sex. It helps him keep his cool and control his actions. Hold the force in check, so to speak.

I brought up the increase because I think training in martial arts and boxing does require restraint on the part of the dom. He could really hurt me with less effort than before.

(It's a real issue with my son, who is immature and completely unaware of his own strength and how it's changing. He keeps pushing my daughter around like he used to, and suddenly she's flying across the room.)

 

[jenniferbaby]

Many of my feminist ideals were formed and solidified during my first years of college several years ago. I learned in more detail the atrocities and injustices women have suffered and continue to suffer and something primal in me was incensed and angry and full of rage. (Unfortunately, there was no discussion of BDSM in my women’s studies and philosophy classes. Now I wish there had been, but I understand the practical reasons for why there wasn’t.)

Fast forward a few years to when I discovered how much it turned me on to be called names and told what to do, to when I began to actively search out BDSM porn and take jealous delight in reading accounts of people’s experiences here. I went with these desires, even though they seemingly conflicted with what I thought were the basic rights of being a woman, or rather, a human being.

I guess I figured out that the world was a little more complicated and complex than I originally thought, but discoveries like this never really bothered me and I adapted quickly. I don’t think feminism and BDSM are mutually exclusive. Feminism says women should be free to be who they are. If I choose to be someone’s slave, I can be a feminist slave—heartily enjoying my sexuality as much as any woman should be able to.

 

[culloden]

Many of my feminist ideals were formed and solidified during my first years of college several years ago. I learned in more detail the atrocities and injustices women have suffered and continue to suffer and something primal in me was incensed and angry and full of rage. (Unfortunately, there was no discussion of BDSM in my women’s studies and philosophy classes. Now I wish there had been, but I understand the practical reasons for why there wasn’t.)

Fast forward a few years to when I discovered how much it turned me on to be called names and told what to do, to when I began to actively search out BDSM porn and take jealous delight in reading accounts of people’s experiences here. I went with these desires, even though they seemingly conflicted with what I thought were the basic rights of being a woman, or rather, a human being.

I guess I figured out that the world was a little more complicated and complex than I originally thought, but discoveries like this never really bothered me and I adapted quickly. I don’t think feminism and BDSM are mutually exclusive. Feminism says women should be free to be who they are. If I choose to be someone’s slave, I can be a feminist slave—heartily enjoying my sexuality as much as any woman should be able to.

I tell ya, college really fucks people up. <G>

OK, I'm not entirely kidding. I don't in any way mean to diminish what some women have gone through, and are still going through. But I wonder how many people have taken womens' studies classes where the examples were entirely at odds with their own, first-world, post-modern experiences? Sure, it's important to be aware, but college does not portray a universal experience. Like literature or the movies, it focuses on the extremes.

 

[ataxia.girl]

i'm a lipstick feminist and Daddy knows it.

If he didn't physically dominate me i would never stop laughing and pointing.

 

[ataxia.girl]

this makes me a freak within the BDSM "community." fortunately, i have never claimed to be part of said community. it also makes any brand of feminism smell like sulfuric acid to me...and fortunately, i've never claimed to be a feminist either.

i tend to be a feminist in a more anarchist sense but birth control and hysterectomies and a civilized society full of indoctrinated docile males allows me that luxury.

Its hard to make laws against chick power. The virgin\whore dichotomy is not going to hold us back forever.

We will rule the world!!!

 

[YourCaptor]

i'm a lipstick feminist and Daddy knows it.

If he didn't physically dominate me i would never stop laughing and pointing.

I've had my run ins with those. I really loath those women. Nothing sets of my rage quite like some weak nagging pest, whos skull would be smashed flat on the wall if it wasn't for the invisible "law" protecting her. And they know this.

If they had any character I'd give them the fucking they so desperately need. Unfortunately though I think they are just as weak in the head and don't know what they want.

I wish I could get a court order allowing me to legally smack these girls. Turn the tables.

But no, its like, look at me I'm a cute little porn start and no matter how annoying, moronic, even criminal my words and actions may be, you cant touch me or I'll be the cute little porn star that's crying.

I did smack one over the head once. Managed to shut her up for the rest of the night. Few weeks latter she gave up on me, thank god.

 

[ataxia.girl]

my Daddy just fucks me silly when i run at the mouth.

He told me this morning i could only have an insensitive clod for a Daddy because i would destroy any other man. He rarely even knows i'm on the offensive until i've launched the 3rd wave of attacks. Even then he often just doesn't wake up . That man can sleep through anything. i'm nothing if not incredibly disrespectful. He puts up with it on account i am from a broken home and he doesn't have full custody.

He doesn't hit me really. Occasional spanking which i have to work damn hard for is about all i get in that department and i complain about that a lot.

Even so he still makes sure it hurts to walk the next morning. NOTHING shuts me up like a good fucking. Nothing.

 

[YourCaptor]

my Daddy just fucks me silly when i run at the mouth.

He told me this morning i could only have an insensitive clod for a Daddy because i would destroy any other man. He rarely even knows i'm on the offensive until i've launched the 3rd wave of attacks. Even then he often just doesn't wake up . That man can sleep through anything. i'm nothing if not incredibly disrespectful. He puts up with it on account i am from a broken home and he doesn't have full custody.

He doesn't hit me really. Occasional spanking which i have to work damn hard for is about all i get in that department and i complain about that a lot.

Even so he still makes sure it hurts to walk the next morning. NOTHING shuts me up like a good fucking. Nothing.

Give me that contract and you will be prim and proper.

 

[jenniferbaby]

I tell ya, college really fucks people up. <G>

OK, I'm not entirely kidding. I don't in any way mean to diminish what some women have gone through, and are still going through. But I wonder how many people have taken womens' studies classes where the examples were entirely at odds with their own, first-world, post-modern experiences? Sure, it's important to be aware, but college does not portray a universal experience. Like literature or the movies, it focuses on the extremes.

I think there's a lot of truth to this. There's only so much that can be taught in college classes, so they stick to the most obvious and well-known material. A lot of it I hadn't known, so it was a good experience for me to be exposed to it.

College did provide me with a good introduction to feminism. Since then though, I've reformed it to serve my own personal views about the world.

 

[Aquila1]

I tell ya, college really fucks people up. <G>

OK, I'm not entirely kidding. I don't in any way mean to diminish what some women have gone through, and are still going through. But I wonder how many people have taken womens' studies classes where the examples were entirely at odds with their own, first-world, post-modern experiences? Sure, it's important to be aware, but college does not portray a universal experience. Like literature or the movies, it focuses on the extremes.

uh yep. I lasted maybe 3 weeks into a womens' studies paper before I had to run screaming from the room. That being said, I did retain the reading lists and worked through them steadily through the years - along with many other written points of view that had been conveniently 'overlooked' by the womens' studies teaching department at the university I attended.

Personally, I found the most useful studies I did in this area were within the theology department - some of the courses offered on women, religion, and history were excellent, and were enormously helpful in allowing me to make sense of things (in my own mind, at least)

 

[BiBunny]

I've never been arrested for trying to vote or anything, but I've had enough crap happen to me because I'm a woman to know that what "they're" selling isn't BS. Isn't this like telling black people, "Oh, well, since the Jim Crow laws were abolished, you have nothing to bitch about, and you're all just paranoid fucks"?

God Almighty damn.

 

[culloden]

I've never been arrested for trying to vote or anything, but I've had enough crap happen to me because I'm a woman to know that what "they're" selling isn't BS. Isn't this like telling black people, "Oh, well, since the Jim Crow laws were abolished, you have nothing to bitch about, and you're all just paranoid fucks"?

God Almighty damn.

My point wasn't that everything said in womens' studies classes is BS. There is no doubt that evil things happen to some women. The men who do those things should have their balls fed to them.

Maybe a better approach is to say that social trends tend to pendulum. I'd venture that misogyny was more common and accepted 40 or 50 years ago than today. I've worked with many older men, and often their attitudes toward women appall me. I don't see that very much in people my age (late 40s) and younger. Women's studies classes represent the pendulum swinging the other way, in that they focus on the ugly side. Most people's experience today is probably somewhere in the middle. But why would anyone raise that point in a college class? It's not controversial enough to trigger discussion, and it doesn't do much to raise anyone's consciousness.