what the heck is this about?

[katt_g]

so...i really did do a search on subspace and try to find information, but holy cow 276 threads came up when i searched. i admit it, my patience ran out around thread number 100.

i am really new to much of this, but i think subspace is probably different for everybody. i get this weird, inside myself kind of reaction. i am relatively unaware of the surroundings but my internal sensations seem huge. not like more painful or anything, just the only thing i can focus on. and i definitely get what i call a little loopy afterward.

i found information on something called subdrop, but i haven't really experienced anything like that psychological/emotional crash. i get pretty euphoric and then pretty tired. recently i experienced a physical response i thought was odd. almost reminiscent of 'day after' experiences years ago with a big night of partying. this lasted almost 2 days though. the oddest part about it was...i just could not get warm. anyone ever heard of anything like that associated with subspace?

 

[BiBunny]

Despite all the woo-woo hype about it, biologically speaking, subspace is just a mild form of shock, your body's response to intense stimuli. It's different for everyone because of the way different people's bodies react to different things. But the cold thing after playing is fairly normal and a common sign of shock.

And, yeah, subdrop happens, too. It's another one of those neat tricks of brain chemistry. Once the endorphins wear off and the release of dopamine slows, it often causes you to feel like shit until your body readjusts. This, too, is something that varies depending on individual brain chemistry.

 

[katt_g]

Despite all the woo-woo hype about it, biologically speaking, subspace is just a mild form of shock, your body's response to intense stimuli. It's different for everyone because of the way different people's bodies react to different things. But the cold thing after playing is fairly normal and a common sign of shock.

And, yeah, subdrop happens, too. It's another one of those neat tricks of brain chemistry. Once the endorphins wear off and the release of dopamine slows, it often causes you to feel like shit until your body readjusts. This, too, is something that varies depending on individual brain chemistry.

shock...well, i should have thought of that.
i just remember thinking it was so weird how cold i was (i don't really live in a cold climate), and since it happened for 2 whole days i didn't really associate it right away. it wasn't until about half way through the second day when i was wondering if i was coming down with something. all of a sudden, the subspace experience dawned on me. it had been so far the most intense situation in which i had participated.

 

[katt_g]

and btw, thanks bibunny for reminding me that i am normal!

 

[BiBunny]

and btw, thanks bibunny for reminding me that i am normal!

No problem. Glad to help.

I think I'm abnormally interested in brain chemistry, for some reason. I've done a lot of reading about it. I think a lot of the things that people sometimes worry about might be alleviated if more folks understood brain chemistry a little better. But, then, I know it's not a terribly interesting subject for most, so I can't say that I blame them too much for not knowing.

 

[Homburg]

I am too. The hormonal rise and fall surrounding sex/play is neat stuff.

 

[Netzach]

No problem. Glad to help.

I think I'm abnormally interested in brain chemistry, for some reason. I've done a lot of reading about it. I think a lot of the things that people sometimes worry about might be alleviated if more folks understood brain chemistry a little better. But, then, I know it's not a terribly interesting subject for most, so I can't say that I blame them too much for not knowing.

This was a good explanation and I wish more people would offer info free of mystical woo woo.

In fact the "sub" part of it is questionable to me. I've heard it asserted that a Dominant cannot possibly go into "subspace", but watch what happens during a really hard massage or workout, or a really intense fuck with said person - most people with functional grey stuff in their skulls can and do experience euphoria, emotional openness, floatiness, drop - at various times and under varying conditions. The main question is whether you seek these experiences from being made to do or beaten with something or under some other conditions.

 

[katt_g]

this is all so interestingto me, too! i would think that, on the other side of the coin, the Dom(me) would have his/her own "space". all parties involved in such an intense physical/emotional/psychological event would surely have responses of some sort in all of those areas. the hormones would be elevated in everyone, though different physical responses might occur because of different hormones.

 

[Homburg]

This was a good explanation and I wish more people would offer info free of mystical woo woo.

There brain chemistry and psychology involved in the attraction to mystic woo-woo.

In fact the "sub" part of it is questionable to me. I've heard it asserted that a Dominant cannot possibly go into "subspace", but watch what happens during a really hard massage or workout, or a really intense fuck with said person - most people with functional grey stuff in their skulls can and do experience euphoria, emotional openness, floatiness, drop - at various times and under varying conditions. The main question is whether you seek these experiences from being made to do or beaten with something or under some other conditions.

Virtually everyone can. You don't see D's going into headspace as often because the physical stimuli is not as intense. They also don't have potassium being released into the bloodstream as a result of impact trauma, etc.

Subspace is talked about more simply because we see it more commonly. The idea that D's are somehow immune is idiotic. Like you said, grey matter means susceptibility to brain chemistry just like anyone else. It's just not likely to be as blatant.

There are days that I feel like my side of the crop is so intensely and overwhelmingly dishonest, both with itself and those on the other end of the crop. And the s side is often willing and culpable in perpetuating the dishonesty. It bothers me.

Humans. We are all humans.

 

[intothewoods]

There brain chemistry and psychology involved in the attraction to mystic woo-woo.



Virtually everyone can. You don't see D's going into headspace as often because the physical stimuli is not as intense. They also don't have potassium being released into the bloodstream as a result of impact trauma, etc.

Subspace is talked about more simply because we see it more commonly. The idea that D's are somehow immune is idiotic. Like you said, grey matter means susceptibility to brain chemistry just like anyone else. It's just not likely to be as blatant.

There are days that I feel like my side of the crop is so intensely and overwhelmingly dishonest, both with itself and those on the other end of the crop. And the s side is often willing and culpable in perpetuating the dishonesty. It bothers me.

Humans. We are all humans.

Dishonest about what?

 

[ZRT]

Dishonest about what?

Yeah, I'm curious about this too.

 

[katt_g]

Dishonest about what?

me too!

 

[katt_g]

I've heard this talked about before.

Please feel free to correct me if i'm wrong, but for the other's sake i'm gonna take a stab at it.

I've seen it talked about before, where some Dominants say that the mantle they assume by being Dominant feels fake. Like they're taking a step beyond the demands of their own ego, putting on a "big mean Dom mask" to sate the desires of the sub, and not being true to themselves by doing so.

i am really interested in hearing more about this!
some of you out there....??

 

[ownedsubgal]

after nearly 10 years in the lifestyle and 9 of those as a slave, i still have absolutely no idea what "subspace" means or entails. for some of us, that is just not what this is all about. *shrug*

 

[Homburg]

I've seen it talked about before, where some Dominants say that the mantle they assume by being Dominant feels fake. Like they're taking a step beyond the demands of their own ego, putting on a "big mean Dom mask" to sate the desires of the sub, and not being true to themselves by doing so.

This is part of it. There just seems to be a culture of myth surrounding so much of what is done, at least for some people, and both sides perpetuate it. Netz touches on it with the idea that D's are somehow immune to subspace, or that there is some inherent difference in capabilities between D and s.

All those stupid little myths that add up to produce unnecessary mystique, or that perpetuate misguided ideas of inherent supremacy, "true" dominance/submission, that there is some difference inherent to those who use the appellation "Master" or "slave" versus "dominant" or "submissive"

It is all just people fucking, with added headgames and props tossed in to hit various buttons. I get off on friction and power, like everybody else that posts here.

 

[Homburg]

after nearly 10 years in the lifestyle and 9 of those as a slave, i still have absolutely no idea what "subspace" means or entails. for some of us, that is just not what this is all about. *shrug*

Some people aren't wired for it. It's wound up in adrenal response.

 

[katt_g]

It is all just people fucking, with added headgames and props tossed in to hit various buttons. I get off on friction and power, like everybody else that posts here.

i will be the first to admit, that for me it is about how it all makes me feel. a spanking is sexual for me.

and i will also admit that i feel naive sometimes when i read about topics such as this. sometimes, i just don't really get the deep psychological or social meanings that some seem to apply. that is not to say that i don't think they are there, just that i don't understand them. but it does make me curious about the claims by many that bdsm (and any or all of its associated 'initials' and roles) is not about sex. any thoughts on this?

 

[intothewoods]

This is part of it. There just seems to be a culture of myth surrounding so much of what is done, at least for some people, and both sides perpetuate it. Netz touches on it with the idea that D's are somehow immune to subspace, or that there is some inherent difference in capabilities between D and s.

All those stupid little myths that add up to produce unnecessary mystique, or that perpetuate misguided ideas of inherent supremacy, "true" dominance/submission, that there is some difference inherent to those who use the appellation "Master" or "slave" versus "dominant" or "submissive"

It is all just people fucking, with added headgames and props tossed in to hit various buttons. I get off on friction and power, like everybody else that posts here.

The mystical talk about D/s is bullshit to me. It boils down to desire and what makes you happy.

 

[Homburg]

. but it does make me curious about the claims by many that bdsm (and any or all of its associated 'initials' and roles) is not about sex. any thoughts on this?

It is both all about sex, and not necessarily about sex. Depends on the practitioner. There are some for whom it is all about service. There's not a squidge of sex involved in their play. I can respect that, and dig it. There's also a LOT of play without sex happening as part of the scene. Again, acknowledged.

My take on it, however, is that it is still "about" sex, even if it does not involve sex. At some level, some fantasy, fetish, or want is being satisfied, and these wants are tied to sex.

So, yes, I was generalising when I said "It is all just people fucking," but hopefully the point was clear enough without need to descend into pedantics.

 

[ZRT]

I've heard this talked about before.

Please feel free to correct me if i'm wrong, but for the other's sake i'm gonna take a stab at it.

I've seen it talked about before, where some Dominants say that the mantle they assume by being Dominant feels fake. Like they're taking a step beyond the demands of their own ego, putting on a "big mean Dom mask" to sate the desires of the sub, and not being true to themselves by doing so.

Funny, because it's pretty much the opposite for me. If anything, when I'm being all rough and brutal and demanding, I feel like I'm that much more true to a key part of myself than I ever am on a day to day basis.

 

[katt_g]

well, it appears that no matter how you slice it, what you call it, or which 'side' you are on...it all boils down to desires and needs. and somewhere tied up (pun intended) in all of that are the physical reactions of the body, which may contribute to the meeting of those needs.

in my mind (and body), there is something akin to addiction associated with practice of D/s and the physical things used in that practice. for me, the pain causes that release of endorphins or that change in hormones which creates the high, meets the need. afterward, there is the resulting opposite change, the drop, which in me is primarily physical. it is that which drives me to seek the next spanking (to simplify).

this is something i have encountered in my relative short time of involvement in bdsm which i never encountered in my previously completely vanilla life. i guess i am just glad that i am not alone in my experiences. even if each is unique, through so many run similar waters.

 

[intothewoods]

Subspace is a physical reaction, the endorphin rush that comes from receiving impact play, but also running or intense exercise, or a massage as someone noted. What drives me nuts is when people say they hit instant subspace when their D whispers x to them or they just see a flogger or something. We can all be like pavlovian dogs at some level, I suppose, but I have a hard time believing that so many s-types are getting endorphin rushes from the mere mention of something or other. Excited? Aroused? Sure. But I don't think that needs to be elevated with a special label.

 

[katt_g]

Subspace is a physical reaction, the endorphin rush that comes from receiving impact play, but also running or intense exercise, or a massage as someone noted. What drives me nuts is when people say they hit instant subspace when their D whispers x to them or they just see a flogger or something. We can all be like pavlovian dogs at some level, I suppose, but I have a hard time believing that so many s-types are getting endorphin rushes from the mere mention of something or other. Excited? Aroused? Sure. But I don't think that needs to be elevated with a special label.

good point! i guess i was just not reaching that same endorphin rush prior to the spankings!

 

[ZRT]

Subspace is a physical reaction, the endorphin rush that comes from receiving impact play, but also running or intense exercise, or a massage as someone noted. What drives me nuts is when people say they hit instant subspace when their D whispers x to them or they just see a flogger or something. We can all be like pavlovian dogs at some level, I suppose, but I have a hard time believing that so many s-types are getting endorphin rushes from the mere mention of something or other. Excited? Aroused? Sure. But I don't think that needs to be elevated with a special label.

Well, I can't speak to 'sub-space' specifically, but I can definitely say that there are very subtle and gentle nudges that will put me into full-bore adrenaline-rush fight or flight mode, so I can definitely see how it could work.

 

[Homburg]

MIS and I were talking about it, and she described it as different levels. There are things I do that put her in subspace, after a fashion, but it is a headspace where she is still somewhat aware of what is going on, and somewhat responsive. Not quite all there, but not quite a ll gone. And then there are the times where she is way far gone. Both are subspace, but perhaps not as far in.