Obama Says America is Not a Christian Nation…

[Guest]

The first teaching job my hubby had at a southern Missouri school used to have daily prayers as well.

We were shocked. He was only there a year, and he never complied.

They don't do it now.

Parents finally complained.

 

[Elianna]

Sorry. I guess I just haven't been here is a while. But I sure see a whole bunch of people sticking their tongues out at each other and calling names like two-year-olds (thus diminishing the impact of comments). Not trying to be the politeness police but... since when did some of you start with this?

Ami: your way of pushing atheisim rings the same in my ears as the right-wing Christian fundamentalists. It's not WHAT you believe in, but how manically you try to force your opinion on others that tends to discredit you. Just a flipside to the same coin you loathe, it seems.

 

[Dragonlipz]

Jeez, you KKK guys just won't quit....will ya?

It will be interesting to see how the 200 million Americans who always thought they lived in a Christian nation, take the news.

One indicator may be a week from now, on April 15th, where previously scheduled demonstrations concerning Income Taxes will be held. Perhaps an outpouring will spill over into the religious controversy started by the new President.

He done stepped in doodoo...heh(say that out loud, it sings!)

ami

What religious controversy? Some 'contrived bullshit' that you trolls cooked up......

 

[wmrs2]

Most of the founding fathers were deists, not Christians. You go back and check.

You misunderstand the point. Deism was another type of religion which did not exclude God or Christianity. It makes little or no difference whether these men were deist or not, they believed in God.

 

[cloudy]

You misunderstand the point. Deism was another type of religion which did not exclude God or Christianity. It makes little or no difference whether these men were deist or not, they believed in God.

No, you miss the point: you don't have to be Christian to believe in God.

 

[sr71plt]

You misunderstand the point. Deism was another type of religion which did not exclude God or Christianity. It makes little or no difference whether these men were deist or not, they believed in God.

The thread title specifies a "Christian nation," not a nation under God. Do you believe the divinity of Christ is a fundamental tenant of Christianity? (Better go run and look up "Deism" again--and maybe "Christianity" as well--before you respond to that.)

 

[wmrs2]

Game, set and match.

Ergo, the U.S. is not a Christian nation.

Can you or sweetsubsarahh name one effort by any group since the writing of the Constitution that has sought to establish Christianity as a national religion?

The country is what it is. One thing that can not be denied is the country's Christian heritage. It is there, recorded in history forever and that will never change regardless how many laws are passed to hinder the country's future religious development.

What do you think about passing a law that says we the people can not be religious at all? Would that not be like Red China is today? I will agree that many Americans are working for a Godless society. That is a possibility. Then we would not have to argue over the right to worship, would we?

 

[harrlequin]

Note:

the Wyrm is not being persecuted for it's beliefs.

It is being called for being a revolting asshat.

 

[sr71plt]

Can you or sweetsubsarahh name one effort by any group since the writing of the Constitution that has sought to establish Christianity as a national religion?

The country is what it is. One thing that can not be denied is the country's Christian heritage. It is there, recorded in history forever and that will never change regardless how many laws are passe to hinder the country's future religious development.

What do you think about passing a law that says we the people can not be religious at all? Would that not be like Red China is today? I will agree that many Americans are working for a Godless society. That is a possibility. Then we would not have to argue over the right to worship, would we?

Probably a wise move to move away from discussing Deism.

 

[wmrs2]

No, you miss the point: you don't have to be Christian to believe in God.

I understand that.

 

[wmrs2]

The thread title specifies a "Christian nation," not a nation under God. Do you believe the divinity of Christ is a fundamental tenant of Christianity? (Better go run and look up "Deism" again--and maybe "Christianity" as well--before you respond to that.)

Do you object to me agreeing with Cloudy that you don't have to be a Christian to believe in God?

 

[cloudy]

de⋅ism

1. belief in the existence of a God on the evidence of reason and nature only, with rejection of supernatural revelation (distinguished from theism ).

2. belief in a God who created the world but has since remained indifferent to it.

 

[wmrs2]

Note:

the Wyrm is not being persecuted for it's beliefs.

It is being called for being a revolting asshat.

I saw an interesting post today that suits me.
"I don't carry stress.......I create it" which seems to fit you well also.
Have a nice day.

 

[sr71plt]

Do you object to me agreeing with Cloudy that you don't have to be a Christian to believe in God?

No, why would I?

 

[amicus]

Sorry. I guess I just haven't been here is a while. But I sure see a whole bunch of people sticking their tongues out at each other and calling names like two-year-olds (thus diminishing the impact of comments). Not trying to be the politeness police but... since when did some of you start with this?

Ami: your way of pushing atheisim rings the same in my ears as the right-wing Christian fundamentalists. It's not WHAT you believe in, but how manically you try to force your opinion on others that tends to discredit you. Just a flipside to the same coin you loathe, it seems.[/QUOTE]

~~~

Well...since you dabble your toe to test the water before plunging in; do you have anything but criticism to offer?

Of course you have no comment on the vast majority of this forum, 'pushing', the liberal fascist agenda of abortion, gay rights, sex education for kindergarten kids, love of Euro socialism, anti free market, anti America on thread after thread after thread?

As far as 'pushing' atheism, I doubt any here are of sufficient intelligence to encompass rational atheism, they are all 'believers' of Humanist relativism, they don't have the individual courage to be a real atheist.

Amicus...

 

[sr71plt]

Sorry. I guess I just haven't been here is a while. But I sure see a whole bunch of people sticking their tongues out at each other and calling names like two-year-olds (thus diminishing the impact of comments). Not trying to be the politeness police but... since when did some of you start with this?

Ami: your way of pushing atheisim rings the same in my ears as the right-wing Christian fundamentalists. It's not WHAT you believe in, but how manically you try to force your opinion on others that tends to discredit you. Just a flipside to the same coin you loathe, it seems.[/QUOTE]

~~~

Well...since you dabble your toe to test the water before plunging in; do you have anything but criticism to offer?

Of course you have no comment on the vast majority of this forum, 'pushing', the liberal fascist agenda of abortion, gay rights, sex education for kindergarten kids, love of Euro socialism, anti free market, anti America on thread after thread after thread?

As far as 'pushing' atheism, I doubt any here are of sufficient intelligence to encompass rational atheism, they are all 'believers' of Humanist relativism, they don't have the individual courage to be a real atheist.

Amicus...

Naw, you're just pushing miscellaneous shit to hear yourself pontificate. Intellectually dishonest.

 

[oggbashan]

Amicus,

Do you ever read your own posts before you send them?

"liberal fascist"

Those two words are mutually exclusive and therefore meaningless. You might as well say "Atheist Deist".

Og

 

[Liar]

It will be interesting to see how the 200 million Americans who always thought they lived in a Christian nation, take the news.

There are roughly 300 million US citizens. Are you saying 2/3 of all Americans haven't heard of separation of church and state?

 

[Guest]

Amicus,

Do you ever read your own posts before you send them?

"liberal fascist"

Those two words are mutually exclusive and therefore meaningless. You might as well say "Atheist Deist".

Og

Pretty typical for an amicus post.

 

[Guest]

Can you or sweetsubsarahh name one effort by any group since the writing of the Constitution that has sought to establish Christianity as a national religion?

Sure. Remember, you specified since the writing of the Constitution:

http://candst.tripod.com/nra.htm

The NRA (National Reform Association) and the Christian Amendment

The National Reform Association spearheaded an attempt to amend Christianity into the Constitution using an amazingly effective strategy for the first time: that of circulating many copies of the same petition or memorial and urging people to use them for contacting their legislators...

...Prepared for the occasion, Alexander read the draft of a proposed amendment to the Preamble to the United States Constitution (amendment in brackets):

We, the People of the United States [recognizing the being and attributes of Almighty God, the Divine Authority of the Holy Scriptures, the law of God as the paramount rule, and Jesus, the Messiah, the Savior and Lord of all], in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, provide for the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and to our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America...

The Allegheny convention formally adopted John Alexander's proposed amendment in the form of a memorial to Congress.

NATIONAL REFORM ASSOCIATION

MEMORIAL TO CONGRESS

ALLEGHENY, PENNSYLVANIA, JANUARY 27, 1864

To the Honorable, the Senate and House of Representatives in Congress assembled:

We, citizens of the United States, respectfully ask your honorable bodies to adopt measures for amending the Constitution of the United States, so as to read, in substance, as follows:

We, the people of the United States, humbly acknowledging Almighty God as the source of all authority and power in civil government, the Lord Jesus Christ as the Ruler among the nations, his revealed will as the supreme law of the land, in order to constitute a Christian government, and in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the inalienable rights and the blessings of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness to ourselves, our posterity, and all the people, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.(7)

Senators Charles Sumner, B. Gatz Brown and John Sherman supported the measure.

Is that enough to make the point?

 

[wmrs2]

Amicus,

Do you ever read your own posts before you send them?

"liberal fascist"

Those two words are mutually exclusive and therefore meaningless. You might as well say "Atheist Deist".

Og

Liberal is an adjective here as Amicus uses it; therefore, he is correct in saying "liberal fascist" and Atheist Deist should be Atheistic Deist.
Red Fascist if correct. Black Fascist is correct. Liberal Fascist is correct. But Atheist Deist is incorrect.

Pay more attention to what he is saying because everybody makes mistakes, even the Englishman Ogg.

 

[wmrs2]

There are roughly 300 million US citizens. Are you saying 2/3 of all Americans haven't heard of separation of church and state?

I would venture to say that 2/3 of all Americans disagree with the way liberals define the doctrine of church and state.

 

[wmrs2]

Sure. Remember, you specified since the writing of the Constitution:

http://candst.tripod.com/nra.htm

The NRA (National Reform Association) and the Christian Amendment

The National Reform Association spearheaded an attempt to amend Christianity into the Constitution using an amazingly effective strategy for the first time: that of circulating many copies of the same petition or memorial and urging people to use them for contacting their legislators...

...Prepared for the occasion, Alexander read the draft of a proposed amendment to the Preamble to the United States Constitution (amendment in brackets):

We, the People of the United States [recognizing the being and attributes of Almighty God, the Divine Authority of the Holy Scriptures, the law of God as the paramount rule, and Jesus, the Messiah, the Savior and Lord of all], in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, provide for the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and to our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America...

The Allegheny convention formally adopted John Alexander's proposed amendment in the form of a memorial to Congress.

NATIONAL REFORM ASSOCIATION

MEMORIAL TO CONGRESS

ALLEGHENY, PENNSYLVANIA, JANUARY 27, 1864

To the Honorable, the Senate and House of Representatives in Congress assembled:

We, citizens of the United States, respectfully ask your honorable bodies to adopt measures for amending the Constitution of the United States, so as to read, in substance, as follows:

We, the people of the United States, humbly acknowledging Almighty God as the source of all authority and power in civil government, the Lord Jesus Christ as the Ruler among the nations, his revealed will as the supreme law of the land, in order to constitute a Christian government, and in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the inalienable rights and the blessings of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness to ourselves, our posterity, and all the people, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.(7)

Senators Charles Sumner, B. Gatz Brown and John Sherman supported the measure.

Is that enough to make the point?

No, that does not make the point. I should have said any "serious" group or "strong" support. Does that make my statement better?

 

[Liar]

I would venture to say that 2/3 of all Americans disagree with the way liberals define the doctrine of church and state.

Ok, I'll bite.

Care to elaborate on that?

How do liberals define the doctrine of church and state?

 

[amicus]

OGG, Sweetsubsarahh...you folks really do not wish to be named, identified or otherwise categorized for what you are. You will not state or defend your 'beliefs' and you change your mind more often than you change your panties or hat, in Ogg's case.

Modern left wing 'liberals' usurped the name, "Liberalism", which in today's terms would roughly equate with, "Conseratives", at least here in America, hell, who knows what the Brits do.

They don't like to be called 'left wing', because people, average people, have come to learn what that means. They don't like to be called socialist, although some admitted to being, 'social democrats', some prefer 'progressive liberal' as a title.

So, what is one to accurately refer to these folks as? Not that I care in the least what they might prefer, I just wish, as I always do, to be accurate.

As I have posted the links and the definitions before on this forum, feel free to look up the Wiki definition of Modern Liberal and Fascist and then compare what our, 'usual suspects', advocate.

You will discover that Liberal Fascist is not redundant, nor a misnomer, they are what they are.

They all, each and everyone, know that of course, they just don't like being tagged with the Fascist tag because too many people also know what that means and it brings back the National Socialists (Fascists) of Germany and Italy prior to and during world war two.

As there is no appreciable difference between Fascist, Communist, and Socialist, depends on whether you prefer chocolate, vanilla or strawberry, just different flavors of the same thing: Totalitarianism. The key to understanding any and all, is that they will readily sacrifice the individual for the greater good.

There, my pro bono, educational contribution for this day.

The always amicable.....



Amicus Veritas