Would it be too much to ask...(political)

[shereads]

for someone to blurt out, the next time anyone refers to Ronald Reagan in reverent tones, "Reagan rewarded hostage-takers in Iran, was both an enabler and an apologist for Saddam Hussein, and either lied to Congress about Iran-Contra or was asleep. He was no hero. He just played one on TV."

Also: how many heroes does McCain get to claim? I counted two (in tonight's debate.) I used to respect the senator, but in recent weeks he's turned into a bottom-feeder.

 

[Huckleman2000]

Given that right-wingers are already shouting "kill him" at the mention of William Ayers, of all people, I think it will take the election of Obama plus the Second Coming of Christ for your wish to ever come true.

sorry for that.

 

[Belegon]

I also am not a fan of Ronnie.

His Presidency has been a beneficiary of massive rewriting of history. Look at the corruption, the number of indictments, the growth of the federal debt.

Yes, the Soviet Union collapsed on his watch. That doesn't mean he was a great President.

 

[sr71plt]

IYes, the Soviet Union collapsed on his watch. That doesn't mean he was a great President.

Or that he caused the collapse.

 

[lucky-E-leven]

If a good bit of kinky pussy is too much to ask these days then surely your requests are off the fucking charts!

Silly bitch. Trix are for kids!

 

[Boxlicker101]

for someone to blurt out, the next time anyone refers to Ronald Reagan in reverent tones, "Reagan rewarded hostage-takers in Iran, was both an enabler and an apologist for Saddam Hussein, and either lied to Congress about Iran-Contra or was asleep. He was no hero. He just played one on TV."

Also: how many heroes does McCain get to claim? I counted two (in tonight's debate.) I used to respect the senator, but in recent weeks he's turned into a bottom-feeder.

Like everybody, he can have as many as he wants. The Democrats celebrate "Jefferson-Jackson day" when they idolize those two former presidents. I also admire both of them, by the way.

 

[OhMissScarlett]

for someone to blurt out, the next time anyone refers to Ronald Reagan in reverent tones, "Reagan rewarded hostage-takers in Iran, was both an enabler and an apologist for Saddam Hussein, and either lied to Congress about Iran-Contra or was asleep. He was no hero. He just played one on TV."

Also: how many heroes does McCain get to claim? I counted two (in tonight's debate.) I used to respect the senator, but in recent weeks he's turned into a bottom-feeder.

Everyone who harks back to the Reagan years as the glory years, apparently had enough to eat back then.

 

[cloudy]

Like everybody, he can have as many as he wants. The Democrats celebrate "Jefferson-Jackson day" when they idolize those two former presidents. I also admire both of them, by the way.

I idolize neither. Jackson was one of the worst offenders when it came to honoring treaties.

Nothing like making sweeping generalizations, is there?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I voted for ANYONE BUT REAGAN every time, so I'm not a Reagan fan.

But as I see it, the wise men decided to control the White House with empty suits, beginning with Gerald Ford. Guys like Ford and Reagan and the Bushmen are professional greeters.

So I cant imagine Reagan knowing shit unless someone called him into the office, spilled the beans, and handed him a speech to read in the Rose Garden. He was an actor with a script. Hell! Reagan (or someone) filled the Supreme Court with very liberal judges...who knew how
liberal Souter, O'Connor, and Kennedy were?

The 80s were good years for America.

 

[shereads]

If a good bit of kinky pussy is too much to ask these days then surely your requests are off the fucking charts!

Silly bitch. Trix are for kids!

A Luckster sighting! You're harder to find than Dick Cheney these days. How are things at the Undisclosed Location?

 

[Selena_Kitt]

The 80s were good years for America.

Yeah, Rick Springfield, big hair, MacGyver, banana clips...

Ahhhh... those were the days.

Oh but there was that pesky Mt. Saint Helen's thing, and the drought of '88, and El Nino... and the Challenger blew up, John Lennon was shot, and the Exxon Valdez spilled a ton of oil in Alaska... and I think you could still see Russia from there!

Of course, we were rolling in the dough, buying up all the Live Aid albums to feed the starving Ethiopians and ignoring the dying Russians in Cherynobyl...

So yeah. Good times.

 

[epiphany65]

I also am not a fan of Ronnie.

His Presidency has been a beneficiary of massive rewriting of history. Look at the corruption, the number of indictments, the growth of the federal debt.

Yes, the Soviet Union collapsed on his watch. That doesn't mean he was a great President.

Or that he caused the collapse.

There are those who give Pope John Paul II as much, or more, credit than Ronnie for the fall of the Soviet Union. Hell, you Blackbird pilots did more than Reagan to win the cold war. Did he put his ass on the line and fly at Mach 3 or higher over Soviet airspace? God bless those who make war -- they're all too old to fight.

 

[shereads]

Some of the less America-centric accounts credit people in the Soviet Union with the disbanding of the Soviet Union. An increasingly educated populace with more exposure to the outside world; Gorbachev's unwillingness to use force to keep satellite nations in line; Boris Yeltsin's Russian nationalism; the Russians themselves, who protested Yeltsin's house arrest by the KGB.

The fact that Ronald Reagan had made an impassioned speech at the Berlin Wall made for great TV when the wall finally came down. Period.

 

[3113]

So yeah. Good times.

[Digging out my off-the-shoulder, Flashdance sweatshirt] Hey! The music was good. I think....

Oh, and the shoes. The 80's had great shoes!

 

[epiphany65]

Some of the less America-centric accounts credit people in the Soviet Union with the disbanding of the Soviet Union. An increasingly educated populace with more exposure to the outside world; Gorbachev's unwillingness to use force to keep satellite nations in line; Boris Yeltsin's Russian nationalism; the Russians themselves, who protested Yeltsin's house arrest by the KGB.

The fact that Ronald Reagan had made an impassioned speech at the Berlin Wall made for great TV when the wall finally came down. Period.

Some people seem to have romantacized Reagan into a John Rambo type who single-handedly wrestled the Soviet bear into submission, but it seems to me that, like you pointed out, there were many extenuating circumstances and people that, all added up, created the conditions for the collapse of The USSR.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

[Digging out my off-the-shoulder, Flashdance sweatshirt] Hey! The music was good. I think....

Oh, and the shoes. The 80's had great shoes!

Oh yeah.

http://img.polyvore.com/cgi/img-set/BQcDAAAAAwoDanBnAAAABC5vdXQKFkxEZzlPQzduM0JHc0FSNnN0N1UxcmcAAAACaWQKAWUAAAAEc2l6ZQ.jpg

"I know you wish you were blind..."

 

[Boxlicker101]

Some people seem to have romantacized Reagan into a John Rambo type who single-handedly wrestled the Soviet bear into submission, but it seems to me that, like you pointed out, there were many extenuating circumstances and people that, all added up, created the conditions for the collapse of The USSR.

Generally speaking, any president who has good things happen during his term gets credit for them, and gets the blame for bad things too. For instance, W is blamed for Katrina and 9-11 and Reagan is credited for the fall of the Soviet Empire. Even so, he probably had more to do with it than any one person, except maybe Pope John Paul II.

 

[rgraham666]

The people most responsible for the fall of The Soviet Union was the Politburo and the Red Army.

 

[Belegon]

Generally speaking, any president who has good things happen during his term gets credit for them, and gets the blame for bad things too. For instance, W is blamed for Katrina and 9-11 and Reagan is credited for the fall of the Soviet Empire. Even so, he probably had more to do with it than any one person, except maybe Pope John Paul II.

Name me one person you know who blames Bush for the event of Hurricane Katrina?

The RESPONSE to Katrina is what Bush gets blamed for and correctly so. Just like you or I would get blamed for our lack of foresight if we were the person who had set those priorities and who had appointed a man whose leadership proved to be an abject failure.

Your final sentence, however, directly addresses the specific point being discussed. In your opinion, Reagan <quote>probably had more to do with it than any one person, except maybe Pope John Paul II.<unquote>

And the sentence structure itself is deceptive. To clarify, what is your opinion? Who had more to do with it? Reagan or the Pope?

Or, do you feel that you do not have enough information to make a valid judgment? If I were queried, that would be my response. I do not know enough to make a definitive judgment on who was the MOST responsible. I DO have enough to say that Reagan was not solely responsible.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

who had appointed a man whose leadership proved to be an abject failure.

This one still boggles my mind. Cronyism at its best...er... worst...

GWB thought a professional horse trainer could run FEMA!? Really?

 

[3113]

Oh yeah.

http://img.polyvore.com/cgi/img-set/BQcDAAAAAwoDanBnAAAABC5vdXQKFkxEZzlPQzduM0JHc0FSNnN0N1UxcmcAAAACaWQKAWUAAAAEc2l6ZQ.jpg

OMG...those pants are back...and the shoes are really good this year....have the 80's returned? Quick! Check the hair cuts!

 

[Just-Legal]

Noooooooooooooooo not the haircuts. I refuse to be subjected to them.

 

[shereads]

Noooooooooooooooo not the haircuts. I refuse to be subjected to them.

Bad hair, bad president, huge shoulder pads. Bad decade.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Name me one person you know who blames Bush for the event of Hurricane Katrina?

The RESPONSE to Katrina is what Bush gets blamed for and correctly so. Just like you or I would get blamed for our lack of foresight if we were the person who had set those priorities and who had appointed a man whose leadership proved to be an abject failure.

Your final sentence, however, directly addresses the specific point being discussed. In your opinion, Reagan <quote>probably had more to do with it than any one person, except maybe Pope John Paul II.<unquote>

And the sentence structure itself is deceptive. To clarify, what is your opinion? Who had more to do with it? Reagan or the Pope?

Or, do you feel that you do not have enough information to make a valid judgment? If I were queried, that would be my response. I do not know enough to make a definitive judgment on who was the MOST responsible. I DO have enough to say that Reagan was not solely responsible.

Most of the devestation and loss of life resulted when the levees gave way, and the federal government (read Bush) is blamed for that. The slow response made it worse. I still say that the mayor of New Orelans and the governor of Louisiana do not deserve the pass they got.

As for the fall of the Soviet empire: If I had to name the person most responsible, it would be Reagan. In a close second place, I would name the pope. In addition to those two men, there was Lech Walensa and besides him, there were tens of millions of Poles and Romanians and Czechs and others from Eastern Europe who contributed their effort.

In addition to them, you have to include all those from decades ago who are sometimes referred to drisively as "Cold Warriors" because they were responsible for keeping the USSR from expanding any more than they did.

I don't see anything wrong with my sentence structure, and I usually take pride in writing clearly. What I said is that Reagan is or was credited with the downfall of the Soviet effort. I am implying that he is probably getting more credit than he deserves. Then I add that, even if he is, he is deserving of a lot of the credit.

 

[impressive]

Most of the devestation and loss of life resulted when the levees gave way, and the federal government (read Bush) is blamed for that. The slow response made it worse. I still say that the mayor of New Orelans and the governor of Louisiana do not deserve the pass they got.

I'd say that anyone in a position to do anything about the warnings given about the stability of the levees is at fault. Ultimately, though, the buck stops at the president's desk.

Even if you concede, however, that the levees would've failed regardless of whether or not those warnings were heeded, the mobilization of relief efforts was a major fuck-up that lies squarely at the feet of FEMA -- and, by extension, the man who appointed its director.