23·Aug·2008 · "Defiant" · Naamplao

[WickedEve]

Here is one I wrote about 10 years ago.

Defiant
by Naamplao


Don’t turn your eyes
when you are talking to me.
I have done nothing wrong
I am not a leper, not soiled,
it is a growth , a parasite
feeding on me, it’s not my fault.

Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low,
I am not ready to share, can’t you see?
I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win...I must win!

This does not mean that I don’t need you,
don’t need to feel your arms around me,
clutching me to your bosom, mewing soft,
meaningless, wonderful expressions
of your caring, I truly need this, but
I cannot ask for it now for I am not ready.

I don’t need your pity! Pity the lost...not me!
For I shall beat this cancer, pummel it
into the ground, dance on its form,
scream a warning to all disease,
that this is MY body, MY life
and I will NOT quietly submit.​

Notes by the author:

As background to this piece, I wrote this shortly after having an operation. I had a non-classic appendix abscess. They did not know what they would find when they operated and the following biopsy revealed a microscopic cancerous tumour which, if it was as little as a millimeter in size, would have limited my life to about 6 months, so I am told.

I was frightened at the time and no one could talk to me...because they did not know how. As I have done many times before, I turned to the one friend that would listen.....my pen.

I have shared this poem with other cancer survivors and have received good feedback from them. I was lucky. I am 10 years cancer-free due to the fact that the tumour attacked a useless organ and was completely removed without spreading. I was lucky but there is not a day that goes by that I do not think about it.

I hope you enjoy the poem and get some insight into what goes through the mind of a person recovering from cancer....at least my mind anyway

 

[WickedEve]

This would be a difficult poem for me to suggest edits. It is an emotional poem and I sure it's a very successful piece when shared with other survivors. I know they must read it and completely understand.

I understand about you not forgetting for even one day. I know I'm a diabetic every day of my life. You'd think after 15 years or more that I'd have one day when I forget. You really don't forget. I'm glad you're a survivor. I hope you continue to share this poem with others.

Okay, having said all that, let's talk poetry. Get rid of the ellipses. I'm guilty of poetry ellipses, too.

 

[Safe_Bet]

Defiant
by Naamplao


Don’t turn your eyes
when you are talking to me.
I have done nothing wrong
I am not a leper, not soiled,
it is a growth , a parasite
feeding on me, it’s not my fault.

Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low,
I am not ready to share, can’t you see?
I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win...I must win!

This does not mean that I don’t need you,
don’t need to feel your arms around me,
clutching me to your bosom, mewing soft,
meaningless, wonderful expressions
of your caring, I truly need this, but
I cannot ask for it now for I am not ready.

I don’t need your pity! Pity the lost...not me!
For I shall beat this cancer, pummel it
into the ground, dance on its form,
scream a warning to all disease,
that this is MY body, MY life
and I will NOT quietly submit.​

There is a lot of stubbornness and directed anger here. I like that a lot.

There is only one part that gave me pause. You have the line:

“with no hope, no plan”

but later in the piece you say:

“Pity the lost...not me!
For I shall beat this cancer, pummel it
into the ground, dance on its form,
scream a warning to all disease,
that this is MY body, MY life
and I will NOT quietly submit”

Seems to contradict a bit. Are you trying to show a progression in attitude? Or am I reading more into it that is there?

 

[unpredictablebijou]

I agree that this may be too personal a piece to do much critique on. your audience is everyone, but obviously cancer survivors are your most specific audience, and if they find it powerful and effective, that means you have a successful piece.

I found the first stanza the most vivid and powerful of all. If you wanted to edit any of it, I might suggest that you make the language a little more direct, less "poetic" in a couple of spots. It would make the defiance and determination more powerful. For example, the line "For I shall beat this cancer" might be adjusted to "I will beat this cancer", just little stuff like that. I notice that you're very direct in the first stanza and that makes it stronger.

blessings
bj

 

[champagne1982]

Hi Naamplao,

This is a very personal, yet accessible poem. I think you could make it stronger just in the way you address your audience.

In S1 L1 consider changing this to something more pointed in your direction.

L1 Don't avoid my eyes,
L2 when you talk to me.​

Here I think the present tense serves you much better.

L3 I do nothing wrong
L4 I'm not a leper, not soiled.
L5 This is a growth, a parasite,
L6 it feeds on me. It's not my fault.​

This creates a stronger and harsher directness toward the reader and makes your opening very powerful.

Prune a lot of the "you" as the poet from the next section. By doing that, you'll grab more empathy from those of us who haven't fought cancer. Right now, this verse sounds a bit on the self-pitying side and with a slight change in direction could be more explanatory of your feelings rather than a telling of them.

I love S3. Clean the extraneous from the meat of the phrases, you use "for" twice in the last line of the strophe, for instance.

The first line of S4 could be tightened up.

Save your pity for the lost. It's not needed here.​

All those other pronouns muddy up your point. You could likely try to rephrase and reword to avoid the pronouns simply because deleting them from your text opens up the meaning and the significance of your poem. It makes it more accessible.

I hope I haven't misinterpreted what you wanted from critique here. Without straight talking I think you'd fall a bit short of your target which, I'm guessing, is the broader world beyond cancer survivors.

I'm glad your voice is still loud and available to give poetry to the rest of us. Keep winning the battle and in so doing, you give us all hope.

 

[Equinoxe]

This is a difficult poem to critique, because it is about such a personal matter and there is no way that it couldn't be powerful and meaningful to people who have experienced cancer, either personally or with a loved one. I hate to suggest changes to a poem that was written ten years ago about events ten years ago (I am quite fond of art reflective of a moment at a moment and to express when you are seriously ill—it seems strange to say, "Well, it could be more powerful this way..."), but obviously, since the poem is here on this board, some comments are desirable.

Minor comments:
A few minor issues of punctuation come to mind, such as the comma in the last line of the first stanza: "feeding on me, it’s not my fault." This, to me, should be a stronger form of punctuation. A colon, semi-colon, dash, or even a period. In line five of stanza three, I do not care for the first comma either: "of your caring, I truly need this, but"—I think I would change it to "of your caring; I truly need this, but". Likewise, I am not so thrilled with the ellipses, either, and I would suggest changing the ellipsis in the last line of the second stanza with a dash. The ellipsis in the first line of the last stanza would be better reworked, perhaps with the whole line (along the lines of champagne's suggestion). Personally, I am not sure about the use of capital letters for emphasis as in the last three lines, but I don't think that's an issue beyond my personal tastes.

Major comments:
I think that the poem could be more powerful in its expression and more universal with a few changes, on the former particularly in the use of rhetorical flourishes and on the latter by the following the suggestion about pronouns.

So, for instance, the second half of stanza two could be changed to more fluidly make use of the parallel phrasing and to maximise the impact of the declaration at the end. We could perhaps change this:

I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win...I must win!​

into something maybe more like this:

I have battles to wage, demons to fight:
no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive—I must win!​

Of course, that changes the general feel of the punctuation throughout the piece and there may be more changes required to smooth out the flow as a result.

 

[naamplao]

This would be a difficult poem for me to suggest edits. It is an emotional poem and I sure it's a very successful piece when shared with other survivors. I know they must read it and completely understand.

I understand about you not forgetting for even one day. I know I'm a diabetic every day of my life. You'd think after 15 years or more that I'd have one day when I forget. You really don't forget. I'm glad you're a survivor. I hope you continue to share this poem with others.

Okay, having said all that, let's talk poetry. Get rid of the ellipses. I'm guilty of poetry ellipses, too.

Perhaps this is a poem that is too personal, but at least it generated some conversation in this otherwise empty forum

This poem is titled "Defiant" but in reality this defiance occurs only in the final verse. There is anger, pleading, love and self-doubt expressed at various points in this piece.

I will address this in other responses but this poem is meant to represent the myriad of emotions that run through the head of someone who is facing his mortality for the first time.

I understand your dislike of using an ellipse. I am bad for doing that but in this case there was a purpose to using it. First I will quote another responder

From Equinoxe

Major comments:
I think that the poem could be more powerful in its expression and more universal with a few changes, on the former particularly in the use of rhetorical flourishes and on the latter by the following the suggestion about pronouns.

So, for instance, the second half of stanza two could be changed to more fluidly make use of the parallel phrasing and to maximise the impact of the declaration at the end. We could perhaps change this:
I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win...I must win!

into something maybe more like this:
I have battles to wage, demons to fight:
no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive—I must win!

Of course, that changes the general feel of the punctuation throughout the piece and there may be more changes required to smooth out the flow as a result.

The use of an ellipse here was supposed to show the writer talking to himself. He is railing at those around him for trying to "cheer him up" with trivial small talk but after this bravado he inwardly shows a vulnerable desperation and acknowledges to himself that he truly is in for a fight for his life.

I think the exclamation point defeats my attempt at an aside here. Perhaps another ellipse is necessary (only half kidding here, Wicked Eve )

Anyway that is the reason for the ellipse.

 

[champagne1982]

The use of an ellipse here was supposed to show the writer talking to himself. He is railing at those around him for trying to "cheer him up" with trivial small talk but after this bravado he inwardly shows a vulnerable desperation and acknowledges to himself that he truly is in for a fight for his life.

I think the exclamation point defeats my attempt at an aside here. Perhaps another ellipse is necessary (only half kidding here, Wicked Eve )

Anyway that is the reason for the ellipse.

As a suggestion, try surrounding your aside with parentheses or maybe format it in italics. It differentiates the sound of the phrase when you separate its look more distinctly from the rest of the piece.

 

[naamplao]

There is a lot of stubbornness and directed anger here. I like that a lot.

There is only one part that gave me pause. You have the line:

“with no hope, no plan”

but later in the piece you say:

“Pity the lost...not me!
For I shall beat this cancer, pummel it
into the ground, dance on its form,
scream a warning to all disease,
that this is MY body, MY life
and I will NOT quietly submit”

Seems to contradict a bit. Are you trying to show a progression in attitude? Or am I reading more into it that is there?

No, you have it correct. When one goes through this experience in real life you are constantly beset with conflicting emotions (at least it was that way for me). There are times when you feel in total control and others when you feel alone and doubt creeps in.

In this piece I try to show a progression from anger to scorn to pleading/self pity ending with defiant resolve.

 

[naamplao]

As a suggestion, try surrounding your aside with parentheses or maybe format it in italics. It differentiates the sound of the phrase when you separate its look more distinctly from the rest of the piece.

I never though of using italics. That is an excellent suggestion, thank you.

A)
Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low.
I am not ready to share, can’t you see?
I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win, I must win...

B)
Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low.
I am not ready to share, can’t you see?
I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win, [I must win.]

C)
Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low.
I am not ready to share, can’t you see?
I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win, I must win!

I think the ellipse does work at the end though as in A) . Sample C) does not work for me at all with an exclamation point and I am not sure if I like the parentheses in sample B).

I changed the comma to a period in line 2 of this verse.

 

[naamplao]

I found the first stanza the most vivid and powerful of all. If you wanted to edit any of it, I might suggest that you make the language a little more direct, less "poetic" in a couple of spots. It would make the defiance and determination more powerful. For example, the line "For I shall beat this cancer" might be adjusted to "I will beat this cancer", just little stuff like that. I notice that you're very direct in the first stanza and that makes it stronger.

Yes I think that "will" in this case makes the resolve stronger. I will change this soon. Thank you

 

[naamplao]

Hi Naamplao,

In S1 L1 consider changing this to something more pointed in your direction.

L1 Don't avoid my eyes,
L2 when you talk to me.​

Here I think the present tense serves you much better.

L3 I do nothing wrong
L4 I'm not a leper, not soiled.
L5 This is a growth, a parasite,
L6 it feeds on me. It's not my fault.​

This creates a stronger and harsher directness toward the reader and makes your opening very powerful.

Hmmmm...I don't agree here. I like the verse as written. "I do nothing wrong" makes it sound that I am not doing anything wrong now. I am referring to the past leading to the present here. Also "it feeds on me" sounds a bit awkward to me.

I do think I could improve the punctuation a bit by putting a period after "wrong". I also made "I am not a leper, not soiled." a separate sentence. As well I put a semi-colon in the last line ( as suggested by Equinoxe) along with an exclamation point. I think it reads better.

Don’t turn your eyes
when you are talking to me.
I have done nothing wrong.
I am not a leper, not soiled.
It is a growth, a parasite
feeding on me; it’s not my fault!

Prune a lot of the "you" as the poet from the next section. By doing that, you'll grab more empathy from those of us who haven't fought cancer. Right now, this verse sounds a bit on the self-pitying side and with a slight change in direction could be more explanatory of your feelings rather than a telling of them.

I am not sure what you mean here. There is only one physical "you" in the verse and it needs to be there. This verse deals with the inability of some to communicate with someone with a serious disease and the frustration of the sick person.

I love S3. Clean the extraneous from the meat of the phrases, you use "for" twice in the last line of the strophe, for instance.

I see what you are saying here. I repeat "don’t need " as well. Perhaps this is better.

This does not mean I don’t need you,
feeling your arms around me,
clutching me to your bosom, mewing soft,
meaningless, wonderful expressions
of your caring. I truly need this, but
I cannot ask now for I am not ready.

The first line of S4 could be tightened up.

Save your pity for the lost. It's not needed here.​

All those other pronouns muddy up your point. You could likely try to rephrase and reword to avoid the pronouns simply because deleting them from your text opens up the meaning and the significance of your poem. It makes it more accessible.

No, I like that line. I would however replace the ellipse with a comma (How did I miss that one, sorry Eve )

I hope I haven't misinterpreted what you wanted from critique here. Without straight talking I think you'd fall a bit short of your target which, I'm guessing, is the broader world beyond cancer survivors.

I'm glad your voice is still loud and available to give poetry to the rest of us. Keep winning the battle and in so doing, you give us all hope.

No, as always I have found the criticisms here to be very good and well intended. I listen to all of the points made and make changes when they appeal to me and my purpose. I always end up with a better poem at the end of this exercise.

This battle is over. I am squeaky clean now. This was an adeno carcinoid tumour. If it had spread at all I would have seen a occurrence within the first 5 years. I had one serious scare during that time but after ten years I am convinced I dodged the bullet. Sometimes I feel I cheated since I did not have to suffer chemo or radiation...everything was removed in the operation.

I have another poem titled "Serious Operation" which describes the cancer operation pre/post in a sometimes funny way. Writing poetry helped me a lot in coping with this situation.

Here are two verses from "Serious Operation"

........

Awake in recovery, sprawled in your bed,
feeling quite groggy and sick in the head.
A motion to rise brings lances of pain,
from incision stapled like tracks of a train.

Nurses give care as you strive to get well,
most are like Nightingale, one seems from Hell.
Dignity striped to the very last shred,
mind becomes dulled as you plow on ahead.


Anyway, Your comments are always welcome.

 

[champagne1982]

I am not sure what you mean here. There is only one physical "you" in the verse and it needs to be there. This verse deals with the inability of some to communicate with someone with a serious disease and the frustration of the sick person. <...>

Anyway, Your comments are always welcome.

I was trying to say that I found the verse self-pitying and a bit whiny. I'm sorry, I hate to be blunt here, because I know the subject is serious illness, I have one, too and the whole scope of S2 is very much a main part of being so sick. So, I get it. I didn't want to offend by calling what you're expressing by those ugly labels.

Writing this poem was therapeudic and as such, the intent becomes a bit more fragile than any other written to describe less life-altering subjects. The you I spoke of in my comment on the verse was the "you" inferred by the "I" and "me" pronouns. The pain and exhaustion you feel/felt is evident in the words, but the experience is less universal because you tell it from your POV without allowing the reader a chance to feel it, too. It's a tell verse and I was asking if you could see a way to make it show more.

I hope you don't feel you need to defend this verse. The topic inside it needs to be a part of the poem. Pain, exhaustion and yes, even crankiness are part of the suffering, I'm hoping you discover a way to make us all know and understand better, without having any reader "shut off" their emotive response because of the tone coming across as a whine.

To emphasize my main point, this isn't an awful verse, at all, as is, I'm just wondering if you can find a way to improve it. If I'm the only one who grabs that feeling from the strophe or especially, if you're happy with it, please ignore the comment. I may be just a bit cranky myself this week. You know, poor sleep, dull aches and feeling sorry for myself...

Thanks for taking the time with the critique I offered. You take input really well and I like how you are comfortable with grabbing the points you find valid and kindly moving past those you don't. I know these sessions always return excellent poetry and am glad to be a part of them.

 

[naamplao]

I was trying to say that I found the verse self-pitying and a bit whiny. I'm sorry, I hate to be blunt here, because I know the subject is serious illness, I have one, too and the whole scope of S2 is very much a main part of being so sick. So, I get it. I didn't want to offend by calling what you're expressing by those ugly labels.

Writing this poem was therapeudic and as such, the intent becomes a bit more fragile than any other written to describe less life-altering subjects. The you I spoke of in my comment on the verse was the "you" inferred by the "I" and "me" pronouns. The pain and exhaustion you feel/felt is evident in the words, but the experience is less universal because you tell it from your POV without allowing the reader a chance to feel it, too. It's a tell verse and I was asking if you could see a way to make it show more.

I hope you don't feel you need to defend this verse. The topic inside it needs to be a part of the poem. Pain, exhaustion and yes, even crankiness are part of the suffering, I'm hoping you discover a way to make us all know and understand better, without having any reader "shut off" their emotive response because of the tone coming across as a whine.

To emphasize my main point, this isn't an awful verse, at all, as is, I'm just wondering if you can find a way to improve it. If I'm the only one who grabs that feeling from the strophe or especially, if you're happy with it, please ignore the comment. I may be just a bit cranky myself this week. You know, poor sleep, dull aches and feeling sorry for myself...

Thanks for taking the time with the critique I offered. You take input really well and I like how you are comfortable with grabbing the points you find valid and kindly moving past those you don't. I know these sessions always return excellent poetry and am glad to be a part of them.

Ahhh, I see what you are saying now. Yes, the verse is as you say. It is a bit like a child throwing a tantrum but I can get like that at times I also think it is a true reflection of someone in the situation that I found myself in.

But I see your point about alienating the reader. I get that way when I see a child whinging about something in a store.

I think it is the third line of that verse that is the culprit.

I am not ready to share, can’t you see?

Without this line the rest of the verse is toned down quite a bit. The "can't you see" is the whine. Part of me wants me to tone it down somehow but the other part says that I would be writing a lie since this was truly how I felt at the time.

I will have to think about that....

[a few hours later]

Ok, I think I have an answer...does this sound better to you?

Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low.
I am not ready to share. Why can’t you see
that I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win, I must win...

I think I am being less of a crank and appealing to the reader rather than being accusative. What do you think of this rewrite?

 

[champagne1982]

Ahhh, I see what you are saying now. Yes, the verse is as you say. It is a bit like a child throwing a tantrum but I can get like that at times I also think it is a true reflection of someone in the situation that I found myself in.

But I see your point about alienating the reader. I get that way when I see a child whinging about something in a store.

I think it is the third line of that verse that is the culprit.

I am not ready to share, can’t you see?

Without this line the rest of the verse is toned down quite a bit. The "can't you see" is the whine. Part of me wants me to tone it down somehow but the other part says that I would be writing a lie since this was truly how I felt at the time.

I will have to think about that....

[a few hours later]

Ok, I think I have an answer...does this sound better to you?

Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low.
I am not ready to share. Why can’t you see
that I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win, I must win...

I think I am being less of a crank and appealing to the reader rather than being accusative. What do you think of this rewrite?

Yes, the rewrite involves the reader in a judgement about the situation rather than on the person, much more effective. I'm glad you understood what I meant. I was really nervous about trying to explain it without being unneccessarily insensitive. Thankyou for being gracious in accepting the critique.

 

[naamplao]

Final version

I would like to thank all of those that gave me a critique (Wicked Eve, champagne1982, unpredictablebijou, Safe_Bet and Equinoxe). I may not have agreed with all that was said but I believe I incorporated at least one suggestion for each of you.

Here is the final version with corrections:

Defiant
by Naamplao


Don’t turn your eyes
when you are talking to me.
I have done nothing wrong.
I am not a leper, not soiled.
It is a growth, a parasite
feeding on me; it’s not my fault!

Please don’t ask me how I’m feeling
when I am looking so low,
I am not ready to share. Why can’t you see
that I have battles to wage, demons to fight
with no hope, no plan, only a dogged
will to survive, to win; I must win...

This does not mean I don’t need you,
feeling your arms around me,
clutching me to your bosom, mewing soft,
meaningless, wonderful expressions
of your caring. I truly need this,
but I cannot ask now; I am not ready.

I don’t need your pity! Pity the lost, not me!
For I will beat this cancer, pummel it
into the ground, dance on its form,
scream a warning to all disease,
that this is MY body, MY life
and I will NOT quietly submit.

 

[Safe_Bet]

I would like to thank all of those that gave me a critique (Wicked Eve, champagne1982, unpredictablebijou, Safe_Bet and Equinoxe). I may not have agreed with all that was said but I believe I incorporated at least one suggestion for each of you.

Here is the final version with corrections:

You kick ass, dude! (yeah, I know - sounds a little butch, but there ya are!)

 

[RaLaWrites]

I'm not an expert at poetry whatsoever, but I liked overall how passionate it was.

I don't think I'm in the position to critique per se, because everyone else has done it beautifully.

Really good poem.