Is Obama done?

[sr71plt]

~~~

It's kinda like waking up to another cloudy, rainy cold day when spring is officially here and hearing the fucking wimps on the news, proclaiming the glory of soggy socialism...always ruins my appetite and draws me to strong coffee.

Fucking Liberals behind every garbage can nowadays...


Ami...

Sounds like you woke up on the wrong side of the rock this morning. You might try dragging yourself back in the cave and giving the day another go.

 

[rgraham666]

That, unfortunately, is what Obama has done to this country. He has taken the know-nothing-with-no-experience college kids and and black community and turned them against the rest of the democratic party. Come November, the party in general will not have gotten the candidate they really want (Hillary) and either not bothered to vote or voted McCain, the college kids historically don't vote, the 20% black vote will go to Obama.

John McCain is loving it. He's already begun moving his shit into the Oval Office. Thanks Barak.

The rot started long before this election. About thirty years ago when the neo-conservatives really started to get going. With organizations like NCPAC and communication methods like direct mail, they started to radicalize the right.

They've driven a deep wedge in the country and a lot of cracks have now appeared.

It's only a matter of time before the whole structure crumbles.

Sad.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I don't think Obama is done.

After reading all these threads about him, I think the U.S. is, though.

A house divided against itself cannot stand.

Sad.

Actually, there have been worse times than these, and things came out alright. There was the Civil War and the 1948 election, and the one in 1968. No matter what happens, the USA seems to muddle through.

 

[Moxon4]

And the 1876 election of Rutherford B. Hayes

 

[Boxlicker101]

And the 1876 election of Rutherford B. Hayes

Plus some earlier ones, but I am just referring to the ones in our lifetimes.

 

[Moxon4]

Plus some earlier ones, but I am just referring to the ones in our lifetimes.

The Civil War was in our lifetimes?

 

[Belegon]

The Civil War was in our lifetimes?

Hmmm.... Box does like to refer to himself as a dirty old man, but I don't think he is THAT old...

That dirty? I ain't saying nothing...

 

[Boxlicker101]

The Civil War was in our lifetimes?

No, but the eledtions of 1948 and 1968 were , at least in mine. The 1876 election that you mentioned was not.

 

[amicus]

The rot started long before this election. About thirty years ago when the neo-conservatives really started to get going. With organizations like NCPAC and communication methods like direct mail, they started to radicalize the right.

They've driven a deep wedge in the country and a lot of cracks have now appeared.

It's only a matter of time before the whole structure crumbles.

Sad.

~~~

I seldom take the time to respond to rgraham, as he represents the evangelical left in terms of dogma and preaching to the choir with no sign of rational thought or even a working knowledge of history.

However, the 'wedge' in this nation was driven deep by the Great Society quasi socialist imperatives of John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Baines Johnson, and that is nearly fifty years ago, not thirty.

History seems to escape the rabid left, especially that history that directly confronts their mantra of defeat and anti Americanism that has become so trendy with the cafe' socialists of the past half century.

You conveniently forget the Marshall plan that came to the urgent aid of a battered European continent following the second world war. You bypass the breaking of the Berlin Blockaid imposed by the Soviet Union and the billions of American dollars spent on the defense of Europe as those nations began to recover.

You forget American and SEATO sacrifices in Korea to confront and contain both Russian and Chinese international communism with self stated goals of world domination.

You forget a raped, pillaged and plundered Southeast Asia, as the Japanese in the 1930's subjugated the entire region, the attempts by a weakened France and Germany to confront the onslaught of Communism in the region.

You conveniently forget that American forces singlehandedly preserved Australia and the south pacific islands that Japan had conquered.

Not to mention the thirty plus nation coalition that confronted both the Chinese and Russian communists in Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia, that eventually bankrupted the Soviets and led to the collapse of that graveyard into a stinking mess of corruption.

But it wasn't the anti war shits the drove in the wedge, it was the progressive social left that brought about the abortion law in the Supreme Court. Then acte4d in concert to begin to kill the energy industry and change the very makeup of this nation from independent republic to quasi social democracy, the current scourge of the EU.

Now the utter farce of the post Monica Lewinski left of the Clintonesque boutique form of White House bawdiness, you bring on the left of center old harrigan Hillary as the bearer of the torch? Heh, surely you jest.

Add insult to injury, the far left junior senator of mixed race who is as far left as one can be and still live in the US and you wonder they the democrats are in disarray?

You will not get your socialized medicine, you will find abortion deemed murder by law, you will not get gay rights, you will not get government control of the energy industry, you will not lock up the environment into pristine wilderness to contemplate your jaded navels in.

You will get another eight years of a Republican administration and the complete and utter and one can hope, final, destruction of that evil entity known as the Democratic Party.

Read it and weep fellow travelers, you know it is possible I am accurate.


as always...

Amicus...

 

[sr71plt]

~~~

I seldom take the time to respond to rgraham, as he represents the evangelical left in terms of dogma and preaching to the choir with no sign of rational thought or even a working knowledge of history.

However, the 'wedge' in this nation was driven deep by the Great Society quasi socialist imperatives of John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Baines Johnson, and that is nearly fifty years ago, not thirty.
.

I think Franklin and Eleanor would be a little miffed that you left them out.

 

[Boxlicker101]

~~~

I seldom take the time to respond to rgraham, as he represents the evangelical left in terms of dogma and preaching to the choir with no sign of rational thought or even a working knowledge of history.

However, the 'wedge' in this nation was driven deep by the Great Society quasi socialist imperatives of John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Baines Johnson, and that is nearly fifty years ago, not thirty.

History seems to escape the rabid left, especially that history that directly confronts their mantra of defeat and anti Americanism that has become so trendy with the cafe' socialists of the past half century.

You conveniently forget the Marshall plan that came to the urgent aid of a battered European continent following the second world war. You bypass the breaking of the Berlin Blockaid imposed by the Soviet Union and the billions of American dollars spent on the defense of Europe as those nations began to recover.

You forget American and SEATO sacrifices in Korea to confront and contain both Russian and Chinese international communism with self stated goals of world domination.

You forget a raped, pillaged and plundered Southeast Asia, as the Japanese in the 1930's subjugated the entire region, the attempts by a weakened France and Germany to confront the onslaught of Communism in the region.

You conveniently forget that American forces singlehandedly preserved Australia and the south pacific islands that Japan had conquered.

Not to mention the thirty plus nation coalition that confronted both the Chinese and Russian communists in Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia, that eventually bankrupted the Soviets and led to the collapse of that graveyard into a stinking mess of corruption.

But it wasn't the anti war shits the drove in the wedge, it was the progressive social left that brought about the abortion law in the Supreme Court. Then acte4d in concert to begin to kill the energy industry and change the very makeup of this nation from independent republic to quasi social democracy, the current scourge of the EU.

Now the utter farce of the post Monica Lewinski left of the Clintonesque boutique form of White House bawdiness, you bring on the left of center old harrigan Hillary as the bearer of the torch? Heh, surely you jest.

Add insult to injury, the far left junior senator of mixed race who is as far left as one can be and still live in the US and you wonder they the democrats are in disarray?

You will not get your socialized medicine, you will find abortion deemed murder by law, you will not get gay rights, you will not get government control of the energy industry, you will not lock up the environment into pristine wilderness to contemplate your jaded navels in.

You will get another eight years of a Republican administration and the complete and utter and one can hope, final, destruction of that evil entity known as the Democratic Party.

Read it and weep fellow travelers, you know it is possible I am accurate.


as always...

Amicus...

What did Germany have to do with southeast Asia in the forties and fifties?

I agree that we will not get socialized medicine, but I believe abortion rights will continue. Gay rights will advance, as more and more people realize it is not their business, but they will not advance rapidly enough for some. Hopefully, nuclear power plants will be built. I expect McCain to be elected in November, but he may decline to run for a second term because of health reasons.

The Dems. will continue to exist and will control Congress, at least for the next couple of years.

 

[amicus]

I think Franklin and Eleanor would be a little miffed that you left them out.

~~~

Quite true, sr71, quite true indeed.

So pleased you thought to remind us where the evil and the isolationism really began.

Amicus...

 

[sr71plt]

~~~

Quite true, sr71, quite true indeed.

So pleased you thought to remind us where the evil and the isolationism really began.

Amicus...

Don't mention it. I mean . . . really . . . don't . . .

 

[Boxlicker101]

~~~

Quite true, sr71, quite true indeed.

So pleased you thought to remind us where the evil and the isolationism really began.

Amicus...

Actually, it began with Harding and Coolidge, but FDR did continue it. It was the Harding administration that kept the US out of the League of Nations.

 

[amicus]

What did Germany have to do with southeast Asia in the forties and fifties?

I agree that we will not get socialized medicine, but I believe abortion rights will continue. Gay rights will advance, as more and more people realize it is not their business, but they will not advance rapidly enough for some. Hopefully, nuclear power plants will be built. I expect McCain to be elected in November, but he may decline to run for a second term because of health reasons.

The Dems. will continue to exist and will control Congress, at least for the next couple of years.

~~~

Perhaps, Box, perhaps...I seldom manage to predict the entirety of a change.

Roe v Wade is already under great pressure. I have hopes that another Justice will pass from the scene before the Bush administration is over and that a Judge that respects the constitution will move the court more to the right.

Gay rights have been severely attacked and limited in many States and more will follow, gay marriage is a lost cause.

Nuclear power plants are at least ten years away if approval were granted today and the energy crisis will not wait. I trust the American people will realize the fault of the econut left in restricting energy companies has led to the crisis.

Congress, I just don't know. My research indicates you are probably correct that the left will maintain a majority, but it is not a done deal. Many first term Dems will suffer in this election as the Dem majority failed to achieve a single goal in the two years they have had power.

We shall see what we shall see...shall we not?

Amicus...

 

[sr71plt]

We shall see what we shall see...shall we not?

Yes, indeedy, we shall. And I for one am happy not to blow up like a helium balloon with a lot of crap rhetoric and blot out the sun in the meantime.

 

[amicus]

[QUOTE=Boxlicker101;26585911]Actually, it began with Harding and Coolidge, but FDR did continue it. It was the Harding administration that kept the US out of the League of Nations.[/QUOTE]

~~~

One can almost understand the reluctance of the United States in 1914 to enter into another European conflict so far from home. It seemed, with an ocean between us, we could safely ignore the squabbles of the Europeans.

But American heritage is rooted in the old countries, then and now and that can never be taken lightly.

Appreciate your comments...


amicus...

 

[Carnevil9]

If by socialist you mean anyone to the left of you, then yes.

If by socialist you mean what people who know what the word means would call a socialist, then no.

Well, it's nice to know that SOMEBODY doesn't have me on ignore. Even a liberal pinhead.

But I'm afraid that I must disagree with your assessment. O'Bama is in favor of universal government-mandated health insurance. THAT is socialism, pure and simple. Refute it if you must; I would be glad to hear your rebuttal. Have a nice day........Carney

 

[Misty_Morning]

OK...gonna say it.

There are too many bigots in the country to get Obama or Hillary elected...plain and simple.

I like Obama but I just don't see what he has to offer other than "Hope for Change", great words nothing else.

He's not gonna be elected cuz he's black. There I said it.

There are too many folks in the country that ain't gonna elect a black man to president, least ways not now. Maybe by the next election Obama will gain the experience to back up his words and most of the die hard rascists will have died off.

Hillary ain't gonna be elected cuz she is Hillary and will always be connected to Bill. Fuck that shit. I am glad that the world is beginning to see what type of folks they really are and always have been. PERIOD.


And before you start calling me a racist or a sexist....I'll say it again....if Condi Rice were to run for president...I'd vote for her in a heartbeat. WHY?

CUZ.


Ain't that good enough for you?


Ask the millions of black folks in the US that are supporting Obama. WHY?

Ummmm...Ummmm...Ummm...cuz he's a brother.

Well, guss what. I'd rather vote for the sista!

Amen.

 

[Belegon]

Well, it's nice to know that SOMEBODY doesn't have me on ignore. Even a liberal pinhead.

But I'm afraid that I must disagree with your assessment. O'Bama is in favor of universal government-mandated health insurance. THAT is socialism, pure and simple. Refute it if you must; I would be glad to hear your rebuttal. Have a nice day........Carney

I don't have you on ignore, Carney...

...but you do realize that Liar is basically as neutral as anyone can get in this, right? He doesn't live in the US...

...so blowing him off as "another liberal pinhead" doesn't really fit. He ain't a democrat, bro...

 

[Belegon]

OK...gonna say it.

There are too many bigots in the country to get Obama or Hillary elected...plain and simple.

I like Obama but I just don't see what he has to offer other than "Hope for Change", great words nothing else.

He's not gonna be elected cuz he's black. There I said it.

There are too many folks in the country that ain't gonna elect a black man to president, least ways not now. Maybe by the next election Obama will gain the experience to back up his words and most of the die hard rascists will have died off.

Hillary ain't gonna be elected cuz she is Hillary and will always be connected to Bill. Fuck that shit. I am glad that the world is beginning to see what type of folks they really are and always have been. PERIOD.


And before you start calling me a racist or a sexist....I'll say it again....if Condi Rice were to run for president...I'd vote for her in a heartbeat. WHY?

CUZ.


Ain't that good enough for you?


Ask the millions of black folks in the US that are supporting Obama. WHY?

Ummmm...Ummmm...Ummm...cuz he's a brother.

Well, guss what. I'd rather vote for the sista!

Amen.

Misty, don't think that hasn't occurred to me. But I still think Obama is electable. Hilary's biggest problem is that the people who hate her REALLY REALLY FUCKING HATE her...

...and I am afraid that I see Condi Rice as mostly a political tool. I don't doubt her intelligence, but nothing about her screams that she is a leader rather than a talented follower.

Does Rice deserve her position? Well, I'd say that she has been a hell of a lot better at her cabinet post than a lot of the Shrub's other appointees and she deserves my respect.

But she got that position as a political tool. Shrub: "I just fired the most popular black republican of all time. What can I do to NOT look like an idiotic racist bastard?"

Because if there was one African-American I ever thought was a sure bet for President, it's Colin Powell. I still don't understand why the Republicans have never pushed him to run. Maybe there is a lot I don't know about the man... but my impression of him is overwhelmingly positive.

I can still see some confluence of events where Condi Rice gets McCain's VP nod. Now THAT would be really historic...

 

[sr71plt]

OK...gonna say it.

There are too many bigots in the country to get Obama or Hillary elected...plain and simple.

I like Obama but I just don't see what he has to offer other than "Hope for Change", great words nothing else.

He's not gonna be elected cuz he's black. There I said it.

There are too many folks in the country that ain't gonna elect a black man to president, least ways not now. Maybe by the next election Obama will gain the experience to back up his words and most of the die hard rascists will have died off.

Hillary ain't gonna be elected cuz she is Hillary and will always be connected to Bill. Fuck that shit. I am glad that the world is beginning to see what type of folks they really are and always have been. PERIOD.


And before you start calling me a racist or a sexist....I'll say it again....if Condi Rice were to run for president...I'd vote for her in a heartbeat. WHY?

CUZ.


Ain't that good enough for you?


Ask the millions of black folks in the US that are supporting Obama. WHY?

Ummmm...Ummmm...Ummm...cuz he's a brother.

Well, guss what. I'd rather vote for the sista!

Amen.

You mean all those many, many folks of all colors who have already come out and voted for Obama didn't know he was black? Well, g-o-l-l-y.

 

[Misty_Morning]

Because if there was one African-American I ever thought was a sure bet for President, it's Colin Powell.

I agree whole heartedly with you there. An abosolute true Ameican.


Wave that flag.....wave it wide and high!

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

Who knows why any prez hires any cabinet member, all we can do is speculate, but Condi was a tremendous choice for her job because she is brilliant and devastatingly competent - in my view when a person has demonstrated those qualities speculation on other stuff becomes a bit out of place. I don't disagree that she may not be prez material, because those things don't necessarily add up to leadership ability, and her knowledge and focus has all been foreign policy. I'm agnostic - she'd have to make a case.

Misty, I disagree with you for this reason: There are some people who won't vote for Obama because he is black, and others who will vote for him because he is black. I have spoken to some of them - people who aren't ideologues but still wouldn't consisder for a second supporting a candidate whose voting record and agenda are on the left end of the US political spectrum, but who do want to vote for him for reasons I discussed on the thead about his speech and problem last week.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Who knows why any prez hires any cabinet member, all we can do is speculate, but Condi was a tremendous choice for her job because she is brilliant and devastatingly competent -

Just for curiosity's sake, I'd like to hear one thing that Condi's done that's been successful. Her initiative with Iran was only undertaken after the Council of Elders released their report on Iraq which made her abandon her isolationist go-it-alone policies that had gotten this country in such deep and helpless shit that we had to call in Bush's father's advisers in the first place, and they had to remind her that diplomacy was the only way to save our ass in that misbegotten dumb-fuck war.