Lilmits of Ravishment and Consent

[gplotvin]

Greetings everyone!

I’m seeking some clarification about the rules regarding story submissions, particularly around themes that approach the boundaries of the guidelines. Specifically:

1. Pheromones, Aphrodisiacs, and Consent
The rules mention that nonconsensual acts are not allowed unless the "victim" derives some thrill or enjoyment. Does this extend to situations where a character is mentally unwilling but physically aroused due to external factors (e.g., pheromones, aphrodisiacs, or magical influence)?

• Would such a scenario count as a violation if the character experiences physical pleasure, including orgasm?
• What about cases where the pleasure is so overwhelming that the recipient becomes delirious or unconscious and can no longer provide enthusiastic consent?

2. Depictions of Physical Harm
The rules mention that some forms of physical harm are allowed in the context of plot or specific themes, but the wording about limits seems to vary:

• Are biting until bleeding or leaving bite marks acceptable?
• Is battery without permanent or serious harm (e.g., bruising, swelling) allowed?
• If I were to write a story about consensual physical abuse of a character with superhuman abilities (e.g., regeneration, elasticity, and invincibility) where they are kneaded, stretched, squashed, inflated or contorted but fully heal afterward (perhaps via magical healing), would that align with the guidelines?

3. Linking to External Content
I couldn’t find a specific rule prohibiting this, but I wanted to confirm to ensure it’s allowed.

• If I create a tamer, rules-abiding version of a story to post on this site, is it acceptable to include a link to the full, uncensored version (hosted elsewhere) either in the description or at the end of the work?

I’m eager to ensure my submissions respect the site’s rules and community standards, so I appreciate any insights or clarifications you can provide.

Thank you in advance for your time and help!

Best regards,
Gregory Olegovich

 

[alohadave]

3. Linking to External Content
I couldn’t find a specific rule prohibiting this, but I wanted to confirm to ensure it’s allowed.

• If I create a tamer, rules-abiding version of a story to post on this site, is it acceptable to include a link to the full, uncensored version (hosted elsewhere) either in the description or at the end of the work?

You can't link to external sites in stories. You also cannot use stories here to lure readers to an external site.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Greetings everyone!

I’m seeking some clarification about the rules regarding story submissions, particularly around themes that approach the boundaries of the guidelines. Specifically:

1. Pheromones, Aphrodisiacs, and Consent
The rules mention that nonconsensual acts are not allowed unless the "victim" derives some thrill or enjoyment. Does this extend to situations where a character is mentally unwilling but physically aroused due to external factors (e.g., pheromones, aphrodisiacs, or magical influence)?

• Would such a scenario count as a violation if the character experiences physical pleasure, including orgasm?
• What about cases where the pleasure is so overwhelming that the recipient becomes delirious or unconscious and can no longer provide enthusiastic consent?

Your ultimate arbiter is Laurel, the site editor. Your first point might pass, your second, probably not.

2. Depictions of Physical Harm
The rules mention that some forms of physical harm are allowed in the context of plot or specific themes, but the wording about limits seems to vary:

• Are biting until bleeding or leaving bite marks acceptable?
• Is battery without permanent or serious harm (e.g., bruising, swelling) allowed?
• If I were to write a story about consensual physical abuse of a character with superhuman abilities (e.g., regeneration, elasticity, and invincibility) where they are kneaded, stretched, squashed, inflated or contorted but fully heal afterward (perhaps via magical healing), would that align with the guidelines?

Sounds gratuitous, so maybe, maybe not. It would most likely depend on how extreme you get.

3. Linking to External Content
I couldn’t find a specific rule prohibiting this, but I wanted to confirm to ensure it’s allowed.

• If I create a tamer, rules-abiding version of a story to post on this site, is it acceptable to include a link to the full, uncensored version (hosted elsewhere) either in the description or at the end of the work?

No. You can't link within a story to any other site.

 

[lovecraft68]

The rules are enforced in such a half assed inconsistent way that my suggestion is to write the story and submit it.

 

[Bamagan]

Greetings everyone!

I’m seeking some clarification about the rules regarding story submissions, particularly around themes that approach the boundaries of the guidelines. Specifically:

1. Pheromones, Aphrodisiacs, and Consent
The rules mention that nonconsensual acts are not allowed unless the "victim" derives some thrill or enjoyment. Does this extend to situations where a character is mentally unwilling but physically aroused due to external factors (e.g., pheromones, aphrodisiacs, or magical influence)?

• Would such a scenario count as a violation if the character experiences physical pleasure, including orgasm?
• What about cases where the pleasure is so overwhelming that the recipient becomes delirious or unconscious and can no longer provide enthusiastic consent?

2. Depictions of Physical Harm
The rules mention that some forms of physical harm are allowed in the context of plot or specific themes, but the wording about limits seems to vary:

• Are biting until bleeding or leaving bite marks acceptable?
• Is battery without permanent or serious harm (e.g., bruising, swelling) allowed?
• If I were to write a story about consensual physical abuse of a character with superhuman abilities (e.g., regeneration, elasticity, and invincibility) where they are kneaded, stretched, squashed, inflated or contorted but fully heal afterward (perhaps via magical healing), would that align with the guidelines?

3. Linking to External Content
I couldn’t find a specific rule prohibiting this, but I wanted to confirm to ensure it’s allowed.

• If I create a tamer, rules-abiding version of a story to post on this site, is it acceptable to include a link to the full, uncensored version (hosted elsewhere) either in the description or at the end of the work?

I’m eager to ensure my submissions respect the site’s rules and community standards, so I appreciate any insights or clarifications you can provide.

Thank you in advance for your time and help!

Best regards,
Gregory Olegovich

Q1: This would likely be allowed, as similar scenarios are common in the Mind Control category and some others.
Q2: The first two are somewhat unlikely to be allowed, but might pass if they are kept pretty mild and aren't a principal focus of any sex or foreplay (by which I mean, for example, if a character happens to get bitten in the throes of passion it may well be fine, but if they're tied up and being chewed on for thrills, it may not). The third is more of a toss-up, as I've seen similar things fly here, but again likely depends on the presentation. There's no clear, bright line we can point you to between sadomasochism and torture porn, at least in terms of what the site considers acceptable content. If your story gets rejected for too much sexual violence they'll probably say so, and you can just edit and resubmit, of course.
Q3: As you've already been told, links to external sites aren't allowed, nor any advertising in the stories themselves. It's usually okay to mention stuff like that on your profile page, or your signature here in the forums.

 

[gunhilltrain]

The rules are enforced in such a half assed inconsistent way that my suggestion is to write the story and submit it.

I wonder why the Non-Consent/Reluctance category exists at all since the acceptable boundaries are impossible to define. (Another site just has "Reluctance.") Lit defines it as "Fantasies of Control." I suppose all fiction, even if based on real events, are fantasies of a sort. I haven't looked, but are there any reluctance stories about straight males?

 

[karina_jayde]

There is an entire Mind Control category here so I would think stuff like magic/pheromones would pass muster. I recommend looking through the top lists of that category for a sampling.

Also do some reading in the NC/R category as well. I don't stray there too much beyond a few reluctance/captivity stories, but I have seen some pretty extreme examples.

I've included biting/bleeding and a little bit of knife play in my stories with no issues. Considering the breadth of vampire content on here I don't think that in particular will get you into trouble with the guidelines.

 

[WCSGarland]

I haven't looked, but are there any reluctance stories about straight males?

I've got a FMC that is tricked into marriage, and when she refuses to allow it being annulled then goes to his house and manipulates him into making her pregnant. Is that along the lines of reluctance stories about straight males?

 

[NuclearFairy]

2. Depictions of Physical Harm

I once read a bdsm where the female character in it quite enjoyed having her tits nailed to a board. That author was a bit too extreme for my tastes so I didn't finish reading their works, but the pain rule seems to have the same thing as the nonconsent; If sex is involved then all parties must enjoy themselves.

I haven't looked, but are there any reluctance stories about straight males?

The first segment of my main work has a scene with the male protag in a nonconsent scenario. It wasn't really written for enjoyment though (although he could not help but receive physical pleasure from the act) and the story is about him trying to escape the bond that was forced onto him through that act so I'm not sure how much it counts for your question.

Also I've ready a few stories where the man was reluctant. The one that comes most readily to mind, although I can't remember the name of it is about a man being stalked by his childhood sweetheart turned vampire who ties him down and teases him until he agrees to have sex with her. He winds up hate fucking what he views as the monster who killed his lost love.

 

[yowser]

I wonder why the Non-Consent/Reluctance category exists at all since the acceptable boundaries are impossible to define. (Another site just has "Reluctance.") Lit defines it as "Fantasies of Control." I suppose all fiction, even if based on real events, are fantasies of a sort. I haven't looked, but are there any reluctance stories about straight males?

I haven't explored but since straight males are as capable of being coerced into unwilling situations as anyone else, the potential is there (although I suspect these represent an extremely small subset of the category as a whole.)

My only Non-con/Reluctance tale involves a straight college guy blackmailed into an uncomfortable scene, so there is at least one.

 

[gunhilltrain]

I once read a bdsm where the female character in it quite enjoyed having her tits nailed to a board. That author was a bit too extreme for my tastes so I didn't finish reading their works, but the pain rule seems to have the same thing as the nonconsent; If sex is involved then all parties must enjoy themselves.

The first segment of my main work has a scene with the male protag in a nonconsent scenario. It wasn't really written for enjoyment though (although he could not help but receive physical pleasure from the act) and the story is about him trying to escape the bond that was forced onto him through that act so I'm not sure how much it counts for your question.

Also I've ready a few stories where the man was reluctant. The one that comes most readily to mind, although I can't remember the name of it is about a man being stalked by his childhood sweetheart turned vampire who ties him down and teases him until he agrees to have sex with her. He winds up hate fucking what he views as the monster who killed his lost love.

Well, having vampires in it changes the equation quite a bit! Adding Nazis is another gambit, as in Seven Beauties (1975). The Commandant, played by Shirley Stoler, was 46 when she played the role and she made some not-to-refused moves on Giancarlo Giannini. I don't know what Stoler was really like, but she is both evil and not conventionally pretty in the film.

I guess I could also mention Gloria Swanson as Norma Desmond, who puts a lot of pressure on the younger Joe Gillis (William Holden) who mostly just goes along with with her to save his own skin.

 

[NuclearFairy]

Well, having vampires in it changes the equation quite a bit! Adding Nazis is another gambit, as in Seven Beauties (1975). The Commandant, played by Shirley Stoler, was 46 when she played the role and she made some not-to-refused moves on Giancarlo Giannini. I don't know what Stoler was really like, but she is both evil and not conventionally pretty in the film.

I guess I could also mention Gloria Swanson as Norma Desmond, who puts a lot of pressure on the younger Joe Gillis (William Holden) who mostly just goes along with with her to save his own skin.

Hmm, yeah most stories that have a reluctant man involve a supernatural element or black mail. Although a few do involve the woman drugging him. Stories where the man is out right raped by a woman are far less common, and not something I've ever enjoyed reading. But then I prefer dominant men and submissive women which while tricky can still be done with reluctance.

 

[gunhilltrain]

I've got a FMC that is tricked into marriage, and when she refuses to allow it being annulled then goes to his house and manipulates him into making her pregnant. Is that along the lines of reluctance stories about straight males?

I mentioned Sunset Boulevard as an example. In this scene, Norma is at the height of her delusions. She doesn't pick up on the fact that Joe is not really interested in her, although I suspect that they are indeed having a sexual relationship by this point. (That couldn't be made explicit in 1950.) He only went to her house in the first place to get away from auto repo men, and he stays because her money and her house offer him some protection. It's clear that he really wants the much younger screenwriter Betty Schafer.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Hmm, yeah most stories that have a reluctant man involve a supernatural element or black mail. Although a few do involve the woman drugging him. Stories where the man is out right raped by a woman are far less common, and not something I've ever enjoyed reading. But then I prefer dominant men and submissive women which while tricky can still be done with reluctance.

It doesn't have to be something overt like blackmail, drugs, or the supernatural. It does likely involved something the woman has, like money or power, that she uses to pressure a younger man who otherwise would bypass her. It could be that she is an employer, a college professor, or something else of that type. Most such plots are set up with an older, more powerful man acting on a younger woman, but I suspect the genders could be reversed. It's probably not talked about too much in our society because it goes against conventional gender roles. However, it certainly could be be used in a story here.

 

[Bramblethorn]

There is an entire Mind Control category here so I would think stuff like magic/pheromones would pass muster. I recommend looking through the top lists of that category for a sampling.

Also do some reading in the NC/R category as well. I don't stray there too much beyond a few reluctance/captivity stories, but I have seen some pretty extreme examples.

This. Reading what's actually being published in these categories is your most reliable way to figure out what's permitted. Focus on recent stories, as the rules have changed a bit over time, and there may be some "grandfathered" stuff in earlier works that wouldn't fly now.

 

[SimonDoom]

I concur with the idea of searching through the two applicable categories for stories with applicable terms and tags. The best guide is the past, although, while I don't read stories in any of the categories, my impression is that stories DO get by the filters, especially older stories, so what passed muster then might not now.

 

[gplotvin]

Wow! Thanks everyone! I couldn't belive that I got so much responces! Again, thank you very much.

 

[NuclearFairy]

It doesn't have to be something overt like blackmail, drugs, or the supernatural. It does likely involved something the woman has, like money or power, that she uses to pressure a younger man who otherwise would bypass her. It could be that she is an employer, a college professor, or something else of that type. Most such plots are set up with an older, more powerful man acting on a younger woman, but I suspect the genders could be reversed. It's probably not talked about too much in our society because it goes against conventional gender roles. However, it certainly could be be used in a story here.

Yes that's true. So yeah reluctant stories of men do exist on this site, but I don't think they're as popular.

 

[bumpercars]

I've written stories along a few of these lines, so I have definitive answers for some of them:

-A character who is unwilling but still aroused is allowed, otherwise the whole NC/R category would collapse.

-A character passing out due to ecstasy is still unconscious, which is not allowed.

-Bites that draw blood are allowed - I wrote an SF/F story called "Bite Marks," in which biting someone after they pleasure you is an orcish cultural practice that a human gets introduced to. It's worth noting that they are both very much into it; it might not be allowed if they weren't.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Yes that's true. So yeah reluctant stories of men do exist on this site, but I don't think they're as popular.

I think the popularity of dominatrixes in our society is one manifestation of this, although it's an artificial one in which the men pay to be subservient to a woman. In the stories I have written about them, the non-consent of the men feels real even though it's not. Some of these are written with Nora as the narrator describing her activities in such a role. She emphasizes the psychological and verbal aspects as being as important as the physical ones.

https://classic.literotica.com/s/college-hooking-memories-ch-02

She is quite articulate about how it works on men:

I became a pretty good dominatrix. I wasn't the black-leather kind. Rather, I would wear my one gray suit or otherwise dress up to some degree. I had some fun with that, and I'd play the stern teacher, school principle, boss, wife, girlfriend, therapist, or whoever else. Sometimes I would suggest the role; sometimes they had a preference.

Unfortunately, I never got around to renting a nun's habit. I'm sure I would have worn that with some of that cool lingerie I mentioned. If the guy had gotten a priest's outfit -- well, forgive me sister, for I have sinned. * Yeah, I bet you have, and now you're going to suffer for it. Better to take my punishment rather than burn in the fires of hell.

Damn, that would have been great. Domination requires creativity, like having the talents of both an actor and a screenwriter.

 

[NuclearFairy]

I think the popularity of dominatrixes in our society is one manifestation of this, although it's an artificial one in which the men pay to be subservient to a woman. In the stories I have written about them, the non-consent of the men feels real even though it's not. Some of these are written with Nora as the narrator describing her activities in such a role. She emphasizes the psychological and verbal aspects as being as important as the physical ones.

https://classic.literotica.com/s/college-hooking-memories-ch-02

She is quite articulate about how it works on men:

I became a pretty good dominatrix. I wasn't the black-leather kind. Rather, I would wear my one gray suit or otherwise dress up to some degree. I had some fun with that, and I'd play the stern teacher, school principle, boss, wife, girlfriend, therapist, or whoever else. Sometimes I would suggest the role; sometimes they had a preference.

Unfortunately, I never got around to renting a nun's habit. I'm sure I would have worn that with some of that cool lingerie I mentioned. If the guy had gotten a priest's outfit -- well, forgive me sister, for I have sinned. * Yeah, I bet you have, and now you're going to suffer for it. Better to take my punishment rather than burn in the fires of hell.

Damn, that would have been great. Domination requires creativity, like having the talents of both an actor and a screenwriter.

I don't read femdom stories so I wouldn't know. But that makes sense.

 

[gunhilltrain]

I don't read femdom stories so I wouldn't know. But that makes sense.

Neither do I; I just made it up. But it seems plausible. Anyway, who says the stories here, femdom or not, are all realistic?

 

[AngelaSaxon]

It doesn't have to be something overt like blackmail, drugs, or the supernatural. It does likely involved something the woman has, like money or power, that she uses to pressure a younger man who otherwise would bypass her. It could be that she is an employer, a college professor, or something else of that type. Most such plots are set up with an older, more powerful man acting on a younger woman, but I suspect the genders could be reversed. It's probably not talked about too much in our society because it goes against conventional gender roles. However, it certainly could be be used in a story here.

The case of Avital Ronell comes to mind.

 

[AngelaSaxon]

I don't read femdom stories so I wouldn't know. But that makes sense.

This is from a Californian alternative newspaper from 1973.

'If the whip is your trip'

 

[gunhilltrain]

This is from a Californian alternative newspaper from 1973.

'If the whip is your trip'

Notable that the Nora I mentioned above has a different, and perhaps somewhat less extreme way of operating. For one thing, her sessions are fairly limited in time, probably less than an hour for the most part. She describes herself this way:

" 'Miss Meara' was the moniker that I would call myself during these events. Maybe it seemed more egalitarian than being called 'Mistress.' It wasn't like I was running their lives as my slaves. I was a professional lady doing the proper actions to get these misbehaving guys into line."

She never had to place an ad in a paper, although she was operating in 1973-74 and again in 1976-77. The first time, she was relying only on word-of-mouth at her campus. The second time, she had a "handler," a female student at another university who vetted her clients first and only gave her gigs that suited her.