The place of others

[Iwroteathing]

Hello Everyone,

This is my first time posting in the forums, although I have lurked reading other posts for a while.

I don't usually put myself out there any more than publishing my stories, I don't reply to emails and I rarely reply to comments (I know, terrible community engagement). Partially because I have bad self-esteem with chronic imposter syndrome, partially time constraints, and partially because nobody in my life knows that I write pretty niche and socially unacceptable erotica, so I'm not used to talking casually about it.

So when one of my stories was a readers choice nominee for 2020 (The DomBox, Fetish Nominee April 2020) it really played on my mind, moreso when its ratings didn't take the plunge I expected from the attention and the downvote fairies that follow. I went from not really caring too much about ratings to fastidiously checking the story's ratings every day. Even if I pretend its not there I have had to accept that I have an ego and that there was a reason to put stories out to the world rather than just keeping them to myself. I have never wanted to put myself in the spotlight but I'm now eager for Iwroteathing to have their day in the sun.

I don't know where I am going with this, honestly this started as a forum post to ask about the 2020 Annual story contest and why voting hasn't started on it yet even though Laurel said voting would begin March 29th. I got hit pretty hard that my story was in the running and has ben downvoted out of the running since the day voting was supposed to start.

But I think what I am trying to wrestle with and what I want to hear others talk about is the place of ego in anonymous writing for an audience. I feel like you cannot be both cautious with how much of your ego is wrapped up in the the approval of others without dulling the sense of accomplishment when you gain a significant achievement. It also feels super hypocritical to take the accolades and ignore the flops, so I am now reduced to refreshing a stats page and posting a stream of consciousness on the forum.

Does anyone with more organised thoughts than mine have thoughts in this area?

 

[TadOverdon]

This is interesting, as your last question is on my mind a lot.

When I signed on to being part of a fictional persona I just discovered that writing is fun entirely for the process, it makes me feel good. I struggled a lot more back when my real identity was explicitly attached to fiction. There's definitely ego attachment, but it's also possible to have emotional detachment from what people might think of "Tad."

I do non-fiction writing as part of my day job. There's definitely pride involved that can be hurt by criticism, but it's of a different order. I've never felt a piece of myself exposed or diminished by a rejected project proposal.

The contradiction therein, if there is one, is that after years of anonymity and occasionally watching a co-author engage elsewhere online I felt the urge to join this forum and talk. And to do that, I wind up inventing another persona, closer to myself but obscured and misdirecting enough to maintain privacy if not guaranteed anonymity (I hope), and beginning to attach emotionally to it as well.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

Doctor Johnson is supposed to have said that nobody but a damned fool ever writes except for money, but his was a different age. Ego is, I suspect, what drives 99% of the writers here.

Given that, it becomes a contest with oneself - I wrote to this level last month; what can I do to improve that? Scores and comments are just a set of yardsticks for that improvement, with the built-in inaccuracy caused by trolls and one-bombings.

I find a look at a story I've recently published and find myself wondering why it's score is what it is, musing over anonymous comments, looking for clues for improvement. That's all fine, I think. The important thing is not to take it too seriously, 'cause if you do that, Laurel reduces your monthly stipend.

 

[SimonDoom]

Most of us, if we're honest with ourselves about it, have our egos wrapped up in the success of our little erotic stories to at least some degree. I do. Here are some of my thoughts on how I manage this issue.

First, I get most of the pleasure from the act of writing and publishing, rather than from the various responses I get. When I hit "submit" I get satisfaction from doing that even before the story has been read by anyone.

Second, I try not to get too obsessed with any one measure of success. In my opinion, the rabbit hole you really do NOT want to go down is getting obsessed with ratings. I see no point in that. That concern seems to stir more anxiety here than anything else. I like getting high scores, when I get them, but I don't fret when I don't. A low score may simply mean you wrote something interesting that didn't quite match the expectations of readers of that category. That's not failure, and it's really, really important to recognize it's not failure.

Third, I try to take criticism constructively. Maybe a low score means that I can write better next time. I think about comments I receive -- especially comments that concern how I handled a character trait or plot point, because I don't want to lose readers by stretching plausibility too far.

Fourth, I try to accentuate the positive. If a story has a low score but lots of readers, I take pleasure in knowing I have lots of readers. If it has a high score, I take pleasure in that. If it has neither, but it got one nice comment, I'll latch on to that. Success can take many forms. Enjoy whichever form you achieve.

The Literotica readership is a large readership, and you cannot please all of it, and you shouldn't try, and you can't let it bother you when you do not please everybody. If your wonderful little gem of a story didn't tickle their fancy, it's their problem, not yours.

 

[AlinaX]

Once upon a time, I wrote and eventually self-published a couple of novels, started a blog, self-published a handful of novelettes and even got a novelette published - yay, a real author at last! - but the sad truth is that my readers were few and the feedback almost non-existent.

I'd been reading Literotica anonymously for years, and in 2014 decided to try writing here as well. So I created my fictional self, author and character, and dived in. It has been great fun, not least because I know my stories are being read and also enjoyed by many people. People favouriting my stories makes me happy, and comments are a delight - even the less than enthusiastic ones.

Basically, I love writing stories, and love that people read them. Sure, it's nice when the scores go high, but that's not my reason to write.

 

[moreandmore]

Once upon a time, I wrote and eventually self-published a couple of novels, started a blog, self-published a handful of novelettes and even got a novelette published - yay, a real author at last! - but the sad truth is that my readers were few and the feedback almost non-existent.

I'd been reading Literotica anonymously for years, and in 2014 decided to try writing here as well. So I created my fictional self, author and character, and dived in. It has been great fun, not least because I know my stories are being read and also enjoyed by many people. People favouriting my stories makes me happy, and comments are a delight - even the less than enthusiastic ones.

Basically, I love writing stories, and love that people read them. Sure, it's nice when the scores go high, but that's not my reason to write.

And you sell yourself short. I've read enough stories to know how special your ability to string together ordinary words in an extraordinary way.

 

[AlphaLyon]

I think of writing as being the adult equivalency to taking my action figures and playing with them for hours, making them do whatever I want to create adventures and stories from nothing. I think it's easy to forget how to "pretend" in our adult lives which are often so preoccupied with restrictive realities.

I wish I could write/play now with the disregard for outside judgement, but I've forgotten how, and often fall into the trap of "will people like my story, and in turn, like me because of it". As adults, we often equate worth and value to what we do and what we produce. It's why the question "What do you do?" is one of the most common questions asked when meeting a new person.

It's this fear of judgement that can hold us back, and is the reason why I have almost a dozen stories now sitting in my personal archive that I haven't submitted because of the personal fear I have of being judged, or worse, ignored.

To the OP, I'm not going to tell you not to feel what you're feeling. The imposter-syndrome, fear of the sophomore-slump, etc. are all valid and legitimate. You will receive a lot of advice from other, more elegant writers with more experience than me, so I will leave that to them. All that I'll say is that you're not alone in feeling what you feel, and I'm glad you posted what you posted because it reminds me that if someone renown/acclaimed can feel this way, then I'm not alone either.

 

[TadOverdon]

I think of writing as being the adult equivalency to taking my action figures and playing with them for hours, making them do whatever I want to create adventures and stories from nothing. I think it's easy to forget how to "pretend" in our adult lives which are often so preoccupied with restrictive realities.

This is really good.

 

[oggbashan]

Basically, I write for myself. I enjoy creating characters and stories for them.

I have no idea where some of them come from but for several of my stories I think I know, and like, the people I have created and the worlds they live in.

Going back decades I can still feel excited about some of my stories (and ho-hum about some others!) and wonder how I made that up. Whether I could write that story now? I'm not sure. Sometimes it is like visiting a past self to re-read an older work.

 

[Omenainen]

...so I am now reduced to refreshing a stats page and posting a stream of consciousness on the forum.

Reduced? That is what I started with, and that is what I’m still doing

Also, no organized thoughts. But congratulations on your success! It’s okay to feel good about your achievements.

 

[JanusGoneAwry]

I find that I often think of my stories as children and my ego is akin to that of a parent. They are born from my imagination and after some diligence are made mature enough to be released out into the world. I want my children to be successful but even if they are not I still love them and I am always striving to be a better parent and to raise better, more successful children.

 

[HeyAll]

At this point, for me, I view this as my contribution to the world of erotica. Something that helps lots of people will enjoy, that's free and harmless.

When I first started writing, it was purely for fun.

But as the views/favs kept rolling in, I started taking it more and more seriously. Which is also part of the fun.

 

[SamScribble]

The first thing that I wrote and sold (about 60 years ago now), I wrote to see if I could do it. It seems that I could. The cheque arrived in the post. And so I kept on doing it. (It also meant that I didn’t have to get a proper job.)

I am sure that there must have been times along the way when I encountered the odd bump in the road. But I don’t think that I ever doubted that I would get to the other end.

One of my first editors used to say that no one can be an author of any stripe unless they can get up in the morning, look in the mirror, and say ‘I believe in me.’ These days I tend to avoid the mirror; but, otherwise, I think Laurie’s observation still holds true.

 

[AlinaX]

I find that I often think of my stories as children and my ego is akin to that of a parent. They are born from my imagination and after some diligence are made mature enough to be released out into the world. I want my children to be successful but even if they are not I still love them and I am always striving to be a better parent and to raise better, more successful children.

Yes. That's a nice way to put it.

And you sell yourself short. I've read enough stories to know how special your ability to string together ordinary words in an extraordinary way.

* blushes *

 

[LAHomedog]

I have a thought on this: I'm retired now, but I use to create and write TV shows for a living. It is one thing to write on another person's show, (feedback can be great or very rough but usually it comes in the writer's room) but the first time it was a show I created and produced the feedback was devastating.

Two years of my life creating it, polishing it, making the rounds to sell it, making it and then it gets tossed into a 14 person focus group that takes a hatchet to your baby. And if you are lucky enough to make it to air the critics go to town in the paper and other media attacking your work and you as a person, and then the ratings come in good and bad.

it's a fucking ego killer. Crushing.

I was lucky. On my first produced show I had an experienced "creative executive" at Disney who was on my show and he told me, "As an artist who puts his art on public display, all you can do is make it the best that you can possible make it and then set it free. People will react however they react. You cannot control that Hopefully, they will love it or like it. Some will not. Some will hate it. You can not allow that to control your creativity. Keep going and be the best you can be.

I share his wisdom for what it is worth. It really helped me and guided me for years.

Good luck with your projects and stories.

 

[lovecraft68]

Ego plays a role, both in the sense of it feeds your ego to know you can write something people will read, and it strokes it when people tell you they lover your story.

I think some ego is a good thing, its like confidence, you need some swag, some 'yeah, I've done it and I'll do it again"

But I also see cases where healthy ego has turned into full on narcissism

I always default to that touchdown analogy act like you've been there before and will be again, too much look at me, and too much buying into your own hype-and "best story evahh!!!!" comments doesn't serve anyone well.

 

[BuckyDuckman]

If you don't put your work out there, are you still a writer? Doesn't matter if you engage with your readers or not beyond posting your story. Posting publically is engagement enough, regardless of how it's received.

I've chatted with so many others who say, "Oh, I have a great idea for a story!" But if they never write it down or never put it out there, who cares? It's not just about ego, it's also about creating. Some of my favorite stories have the lowest scores.

 

[SimonDoom]

I It's not just about ego, it's also about creating. Some of my favorite stories have the lowest scores.

It's about creating, more than anything else. I remember when I wrote my first story and submitted it, four and a half years ago. I had been reading stories and thinking about writing for years and years, and I'd partly written a few, but never finished anything, and never submitted anything, until December 2016. I remember the pleasure of knowing I'd actually, finally done it. And at that point, I had no expectation at all. I had paid no attention to the numbers system. The pleasure had nothing to do with stats or ego-stroking. There's no reason it cannot be the same way now.

 

[Iwroteathing]

Thanks to everyone who replied. I did my usual thing of reading through everyone's thoughts, learning a lot, but not daring to reply myself. My confidence seems to come in waves and I am now in a place just to say thanks to everyone who's been willing to be candid.

Themes of self improvement, what you get from writing, and dealing with criticism were all noticed, I also loved the metaphors of playing with action figures and thinking of pieces of written work as children of your ego.

After hearing everyone else thoughts and the catharsis I felt just from writing about myself did inspire me, weirdly enough I decided to channel the issue of self-confidence into my next story (although I can already see it has deviated significantly from mine and others experiences laid out in this thread).

Basically I think I accidentally created a facsimile of group therapy and reacted by creating a facsimile of art therapy. But I'll admit my thoughts are far less garbled in my work so that seems better for what I want to work through.

Thanks again everyone. I'll try and post on the forums again some time.

 

[jaF0]

I did a four parter based on the mother and daughter of an unnamed family. It seems to have been received fairly well.

Based on that and inspired by a number of Story Idea threads here over past months, I worked into The Morgans. I've done six or seven parts so far over the last couple of weeks. The first is in pending hell. I'll wait to see how that does before I decide whether to submit the rest or not.