british or american grammar?

[gotherella]

i have only written one story that has been posted. i have another one that has been edited by a very helpful person, but as there are so many grammar issues i decided to go away for a few months, and learn more of grammar.

the big problem so far has been that i was taught british grammar rules, and as such i have found many things that i was taught in school, are improper when it comes to american english, as this is an international site, i am wondering which form of grammar is correct to use. should i stay with my british grammar or would it be more considerate to learn more of american grammar and spelling to make stories easier to read?

is it ever ok to use colloquialisms within writing. very basic examples being within speech. over here the words owt, and nowt are common terms for anything, and nothing but i have found that many americans have never heard of them. does such language detract from a story?

is it ever ok to write how someone speaks, especially in the case of a first person narrative? on a very basic level i mean for example that it would be very unnatural to write i have to go somewhere. when i speak i would say i've got to go somewhere, but this is not the correct form for american grammar.

i would be grateful for any comments as i am finding my writing has become very stilted due to my uncertainties of language.

 

[DanFS]

An interesting and thought provoking question...

Hi there,

I think as long as you place a disclaimer at the head of your story stating that your story includes local colloquialisms, and perhaps a brief glossary with explanations, you have covered yourself, in terms of bridging the 'understanding gap'.

This would ensure, that those readers without knowledge of Northern England slang would be able to read your piece, and understand it in context.

Hope this helps - just my thinking on this issue.

 

[gotherella]

thankyou very much that would certainly resolve the issue of using colloquial speech, and allow me to stop thinking constantly whether every word i write is readable which certainly would speed up the process a lot.

 

[Weird Harold]

As long as you stick to one set of grammar and spelling rules, you should be fine with whatever you're comfortable with.

There are stories on the site that use American, English, Australian, and Indian dialects of "English;" I personally have little problem with any of them as long as they are consistent. I don't think many others will either -- although a comment in the Notes Field of the submission form that your story uses non-American rules of grammar and spelling will forestall rejection for spelling and grammar issues.

 

[SamScribble]

Just use whatever you are comfortable using. Some of the trolls will grumble - whichever way you lean. But, hopefully, you are not writing for the trolls. Good luck. And have fun.

 

[gotherella]

thankyou that is really helpful. i think that is just what i shall do. i will go back and re edit everything. i have become so caught up in the rights and wrongs i am overlooking the very basic principle that i need to write how i write, and everything else can be sorted out afterwards. hopefully if the content is ok people can overlook the occasional gerund, or even that i put my full stops outside the speech marks lol.

 

[xelliebabex]

i have only written one story that has been posted. i have another one that has been edited by a very helpful person, but as there are so many grammar issues i decided to go away for a few months, and learn more of grammar.

the big problem so far has been that i was taught british grammar rules, and as such i have found many things that i was taught in school, are improper when it comes to american english, as this is an international site, i am wondering which form of grammar is correct to use. should i stay with my british grammar or would it be more considerate to learn more of american grammar and spelling to make stories easier to read?

is it ever ok to use colloquialisms within writing. very basic examples being within speech. over here the words owt, and nowt are common terms for anything, and nothing but i have found that many americans have never heard of them. does such language detract from a story?

is it ever ok to write how someone speaks, especially in the case of a first person narrative? on a very basic level i mean for example that it would be very unnatural to write i have to go somewhere. when i speak i would say i've got to go somewhere, but this is not the correct form for american grammar.

i would be grateful for any comments as i am finding my writing has become very stilted due to my uncertainties of language.

Being Australian we tend to have our own set of informal grammar that gets me in trouble with just about every other English speaking country in the world.

In our school British English is taught and is expected in formal settings and when writing for publications. The trick is that several american spellings and grammatical terms are equally acceptable here now so its a bit of a mishmash when the average Jane/Jack is writing or speaking informally.

As Sam said you will never make everyone happy and there will always be trolls on free sites like this that will just grumble and be rude because they feel it is their right. Write how you want to write and if the story is good it wont matter what form of English you are using or if your grammar is lacking in some way like mine

PS I love colloquialisms in stories, I say go for it!

 

[Handley_Page]

i have only written one story that has been posted. i have another one that has been edited by a very helpful person, but as there are so many grammar issues i decided to go away for a few months, and learn more of grammar.

the big problem so far has been that i was taught british grammar rules, and as such i have found many things that i was taught in school, are improper when it comes to american english, as this is an international site, i am wondering which form of grammar is correct to use. should i stay with my british grammar or would it be more considerate to learn more of american grammar and spelling to make stories easier to read?

is it ever ok to use colloquialisms within writing. very basic examples being within speech. over here the words owt, and nowt are common terms for anything, and nothing but i have found that many americans have never heard of them. does such language detract from a story?

is it ever ok to write how someone speaks, especially in the case of a first person narrative? on a very basic level i mean for example that it would be very unnatural to write i have to go somewhere. when i speak i would say i've got to go somewhere, but this is not the correct form for american grammar.

i would be grateful for any comments as i am finding my writing has become very stilted due to my uncertainties of language.

You should write in your Mother tongue, IMO. The language you use to your mates down the pub, or wherever. If that is English, you write in English complete with Oxford spelling & grammar.

As others have suggested, I find a Note by way of a preamble can clear the path:-

Note.
The story is set in England and the people are English so they speak English English.
Trying to ‘translate’ it for overseas readers is not an easy option.

Some authors go on to say that it's a work of fiction, etc..

Obviously, a certain thought is needed when using colloquialisms. One or two might be OK, particularly if explained, but don't over-do it. It effectively limits the readership.

As a reader, I get Very Annoyed when the author gets all technical about something I wot not of (there was one, well-written, story which featured a lesson in 'technical' Basketball I'm still puzzled over). Similarly assumptions that the rest of the world completely understands American Football are little more than a joke as the story is thus wasted.
If you want to cause some real confusion, write a story about a Cricketer.

So set your spelling checker to UK English and be damned!
Good Luck

 

[stickygirl]

There are a number of classic writers that used heavily accented speech - Hardy, Lawrence and come to that Tom Sawyer. For me it's the difference between having the regional accent hinted at, to help the reader set the scene, as against having it continually shoved in your face.
Surely we write for 'today' for 21st century readers, and you risk excluding some readers by using indecipherable language? As writers we should be painting scenes in the minds of the readers, not lecturing them ( unless it is for illustration purposes ).
Just my own two ha'pennies worth

 

[Handley_Page]

Good point, Sticks.

 

[gotherella]

just really wanted to say thank you so much everyone. i was really so confused but what you are all saying has been so helpful. i will go back and re edit the second part, and the other parts that i have and just go with it i think. i write because i love to write, and i just hope that on the way others might find some of it enjoyable. to know that all i have to do is to make a short list of words for those who do not everyday deal with that amazing yorkshire accent so that they will know what is being said is such a relief. i felt like i was having to rewrite my characters which just felt wrong.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4rZYb9KC4w

Modern Brit speakers.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iw5cN6neql8

A tutorial for American English.

 

[oggbashan]

If you are going to write in British English, as I do, then a note in your profile is helpful.

If you are intending to show regional British language, a few hints of slang/dialect are enough. Don't try to emulate Kipling's use of soldiers' slang in British India - Those stories are difficult to read because he uses the slang throughout and it is very dated. It wasn't even an accurate version of the slang of the time, as many soldiers told Kipling in effective and accurate army slang.

Try to avoid words that have different meanings in British and American such as 'fanny'.

Most readers can cope with British spellings, but can get confused by British words that have no easy American equivalent. They might understand that a character in a story set in London walks down the pavement and not on a sidewalk, but if you just write 'walked down The Strand' you would avoid any confusion.

 

[sr71plt]

I don't think the grammar is different as much as that the punctuation and spelling have some differences. And you seem to be talking about dialect, which isn't really a British/American English divide. Too much isolated dialect no matter what the country of origin is and very few are going to understand it. "Owt" and "nowt" aren't in my Collins (British) dictionary, so it's not really that much of a British/American divide here.

I guess it depends on how large you want your reading audience to be and how well you've steeled yourself against complaints. As has been noted in previous threads on this topic, this is an American English-based site, and Americans tend to be insular, so, yes, noticeably British word usage is going to get complaints from some readers. That's just the way that's going to be.

 

[Ldy_Sea]

I totally agree about the overuse of slang/dialects. It's one thing if I had a character from Brooklyn I would use double negatives when he speaks, and maybe a few words spelled as they are pronounced.

However, when I try to read the Br'er Rabbit tales written in the vernacular of Uncle Remus I get quickly frustrated. Sometimes they're indecipherable.

When using local dialects (In the US we have several dialects/accents/slang/idioms unique to certain parts of each state) just give a taste and only when someone unfamiliar with the word/phrase in question can figure it out from the rest of the conversation. Kinda like on medical shows when they use medical jargon, someone always defines it for the viewers who don't know what it means. One example comes to mind. Nurse tells Doc that patient has SOB...wife says who are you calling a Son of a Bitch. Doc says no it means Shortness of Breath.

On the other hand, don't write speaking parts in a formal tone.

Almost no one says "I am going to the store with my friends, and I will buy everything on the shopping list you gave me."

Sounds way too formal and forced. When I read dialogue like that I think that the writer is inexperienced and it detracts from the story.

Instead write it the way your character would say it.

Gangster "Yo I'ma hittin the store with my dogs biatch. Gimme da list so I can grab the shit you need. Peace out."

Redneck "Hey ma, I is goin' to town with Jim Bob. You be needin' sumthin?"

This will differentiate dialogue from narration and make it a bit easier on the readers to follow the story.

Of course this is just my .02 cents

 

[stickygirl]

Or in regional UK speak ...

"Oi Mum. I'm going to Asda. You want summinck or what?"

 

[oggbashan]

Or in regional UK speak ...

"Oi Mum. I'm going to Asda. You want summinck or what?"

Or:

"James, would you take the Roller and obtain a Fortnum's hamper for the racing tomorrow? Please ensure the Champers is a decent vintage."

"Yes, Your Lordship,".

 

[R. Richard]

"You should write in your Mother tongue, IMO. The language you use to your mates down the pub, or wherever. If that is English, you write in English complete with Oxford spelling & grammar."

Unfortunately, if I write in the tongue of the people that I spent my early years with, I have to use 'motherfucker' in at least every other sentence. That sort of frequency tends to get a bit overwhelming.

 

[Hypoxia]

I no longer remember the language (Martian) I was raised with.

I populate many of my stories with non-Anglophones. I have a standard disclaimer: "For readers' convenience, most non-Anglish-language communications are presented in loose Anglish translation." That would work with Anglish dialects too, yes?

 

[Handley_Page]

I no longer remember the language (Martian) I was raised with.

I populate many of my stories with non-Anglophones. I have a standard disclaimer: "For readers' convenience, most non-Anglish-language communications are presented in loose Anglish translation." That would work with Anglish dialects too, yes?

Rarely.
Some of our dialects are almost impenetrable.
Especially in Parts of Lancs, the Dales and parts of Yorkshire (do not ask me about London; that's real foreign).

 

[stickygirl]

Rarely.
Some of our dialects are almost impenetrable.
Especially in Parts of Lancs, the Dales and parts of Yorkshire (do not ask me about London; that's real foreign).

Prize offered for anyone who can transcribe this
http://youtu.be/Q9db1XPKSk8

 

[Handley_Page]

Prize offered for anyone who can transcribe this
http://youtu.be/Q9db1XPKSk8

I'd need to see that several times.
His rapid delivery causes confusion in my ears, and the tonal quality is not up to much.

 

[NickiC]

One of my stories I am editing is a mix of American English and British but I am very shy to post it because I think my slang is all wrong. I don't want my character to be American but I don't want to jar anyone out of the story. I am adamant he should be English but the language is different. I don't want the Brits to throw rotten vegetables at their screens.

 

[JWren]

One of my stories I am editing is a mix of American English and British but I am very shy to post it because I think my slang is all wrong. I don't want my character to be American but I don't want to jar anyone out of the story. I am adamant he should be English but the language is different. I don't want the Brits to throw rotten vegetables at their screens.

We would never throw vegetables, rotten or otherwise. That habit died with the music hall.

Hi, Nicki