Amateur writers - a possible illustration resource?

[SteelPoint]

That's the core of the whole AI art debate - the existing images the AI was trained on. They belong to the original artists.

No. A road sign, for example, may contain images (a graphic representation of something) but that would be generally be characterised as a sign, not "art".

Copyright in photography always belongs to the photographer, the person with the camera. The "scene" you describe is the set or the studio, but it's the captured image that belongs to the photographer. That's the commodity, not the room it was taken in.

Or... or... might some clever oik at the company which invented the software or the equipment which "enabled" the photographer make some claim on the matter..?

Photography is, and will ever be, a contested "art" form. Because you can hold and point an object and it then takes 500 snaps in 20 seconds, one of which is deemed by the lovies to be "artistic" - that entitles you, having hastily jettisoned the 499, to be considered an artist, does it? Or, for that matter, in any way talented above the common herd..?

Copyright in these matters, it seems to me, really does need to be revisited as a concept by legislatures.

 

[JCSTREET]

You call that a DOODLE? The expression and the tiny bit of colouring you did is better than the AI version, even. Wow. How many hours did you put into that 'doodle' if I may ask?

Concur!

https://www.literotica.com/stories/memberpage.php?uid=346675&page=submissions

 

[ElectricBlue]

Or... or... might some clever oik at the company which invented the software or the equipment which "enabled" the photographer make some claim on the matter..?

Photography is, and will ever be, a contested "art" form. Because you can hold and point an object and it then takes 500 snaps in 20 seconds, one of which is deemed by the lovies to be "artistic" - that entitles you, having hastily jettisoned the 499, to be considered an artist, does it? Or, for that matter, in any way talented above the common herd..?

Copyright in these matters, it seems to me, really does need to be revisited as a concept by legislatures.

They could all be part of the art work (a la Andy Warhol's soup cans, or his Marilyn Monroe posters), or just the selected frame, which might go through further image manipulation, like a Robert Mapplethorpe photograph. But the photographer always owns the final result, and the "art", however it might be expressed, is in that final form.

The other guys made the tools, sure, but your analogy is like saying the guy who sold you the hammer owns part of your house. That doesn't follow.

 

[AchtungNight]

To use my comic book analogy, it’s like that. Take Preacher. Garth Ennis did the writing, Steve Dillon the drawing. They collaborated. They both should share credit for the shared work.

 

[EmilyMiller]

Or... or... might some clever oik at the company which invented the software or the equipment which "enabled" the photographer make some claim on the matter..?

Photography is, and will ever be, a contested "art" form. Because you can hold and point an object and it then takes 500 snaps in 20 seconds, one of which is deemed by the lovies to be "artistic" - that entitles you, having hastily jettisoned the 499, to be considered an artist, does it? Or, for that matter, in any way talented above the common herd..?

Copyright in these matters, it seems to me, really does need to be revisited as a concept by legislatures.

I’m not sure you understand photography that much.

Not being argumentative. I just see the effort and thought and skill that goes into my bf’s documentary or environmental portraiture or landscape photos.

It’s not take 500 random shots and pick the best.

Emily (photography widow, and we’re not even married yet)

 

[lovecraft68]

Am I the only one who feels consistently struck by how much some here tend to overestimate the desire of creative types, in this case visual artists, to 'collaborate' by fulfilling someone else' fantasy?

Especially given how narrow our interests can be in something as broad as eroticism? I've tried keyword searches for specific types of stories and usually don't get very far in one that looks promising before something strikes me as being 'off' about the story relative to my expectations. And that's the rub; my own expectations are pretty narrowly focused on what my desires include. So I'm judging the artists choices by their ability to remain perfectly aligned to my own particular hot buttons. The minute they hit any other they've broken the spell and ruined the mood.

That isn't to say that I hated the work, but almost always come away disappointed. Which really is why I started to try and carve my own stories from the mountains of words that we all share in common. Don't get me started on the anonymous comments based on this same tendency.

So I never look at someone else' story 'prompt' or idea and think, "aahh, finally...an idea worthy of my talents!". Instead, I look at all the things floating around in the soup of pop culture and think, "wouldn't it be hot if....".

I always imagine trying to wade into something that is thrown out and even if it appeals on some level, the prompter is going to be interrupting every other sentence to inject their own opinion of how I've gotten it wrong, relative to their own particular set of hot buttons.

In which case, I've now become a micro-managed, unpaid wordsmith for hire, endlessly revising in order to satisfy someone else's unknowable fantasy, down to the last detail. Absolutely nothing about that sounds appealing. So I look at most things like this, roll my eyes and whisper, "Well...Good luck with THAT" as I click away to something else.

I take the time to publish mainly to see if there's anyone else, (or perhaps a lot of anyone's) who is closely enough aligned to my own particular brand of hot buttons to enjoy what I wrote.

In the same way I have a running file in my head of stories I'll get to 'one day' that feel infinitely more interesting than any story idea someone is offering to 'collaborate' on, provided I do all the work, and am open to taking direction until I get it right, by their standards.

So, in a long-winded way, no, I don't think you'd get a lot of takers. I suspect most who would be initially enticed by any single idea thrown out would quickly sour on the project. Mainly because most people can't really describe what they 'want' and would prefer to navigate by the "know it when I see it" method. Which is tolerable to many who can make a living doing what they love but convinces the rest of us to take up another profession and leave the creative stuff off to the side for our own enjoyment.

(picks up the soapbox and wanders off)

Commissions are a mixed bag as far as the people wanting to pay you to write their idea. Some are very hands off, they give the basics and are happy to see their idea made into a story. Others are like the type you mention who want to micromanage to the point I've given them their deposit back and told them good luck, find someone else.

Whenever I'm on this topic I always mention how often someone reaches out "Do you write commissions?" and I reply. "Depends on the idea, but I won't write anything non consensual" 7 out of 10 times they then reply with an idea that involves non consent.

 

[EmilyMiller]

"Depends on the idea, but I won't write anything non consensual" 7 out of 10 times they then reply with an idea that involves non consent.

I’ve not had anyone ask me to write non-con. That would probably not go well.

But I’ve had quite a few incest requests when it’s not a category I write in (I did one DIL/FIL where both the SIL and MIL had died in the same car crash, but that was Taboo, not incest). I assume that if someone is approaching a writer at my level, they are doing the same with at least nine others and hoping to strike gold with one.

Emily

 

[AchtungNight]

I will do requests but not a story I can’t stomach. My East Enders and Eva Mendes stories came from requests, my Ryan Reynolds tale also. I definitely turn down requests that involve non-consent, underage characters, and micromanaging. I do enough of the latter myself, don’t appreciate it from the audience.

 

[lovecraft68]

I’ve not had anyone ask me to write non-con. That would probably not go well.

But I’ve had quite a few incest requests when it’s not a category I write in (I did one DIL/FIL where both the SIL and MIL had died in the same car crash, but that was Taboo, not incest). I assume that if someone is approaching a writer at my level, they are doing the same with at least nine others and hoping to strike gold with one.

Emily

I agree that the "you're the only one who could write this" is sent off copy and paste to a bunch of authors to see if it sticks with one. Ironically I learned-and to my dismay, I can deliver some hardcore non con. I have no idea why, but I can, and don't like that I can, so I don't 'flex' that unwanted skill. I'd rather bury it.

Incest is not as easy as people think, at least not to do it right, and that readership can tell a poser from someone making a genuine effort who understands the kink.

I mentioned here a few months ago someone pitched me the same dark incest idea multiple times and I kept saying no because to write it I have to put myself in a dark place to do it justice. It was for his wife who raves over my Sibs series and claimed only I could do this right for her. Judging by the way they kept escalating the offer to where I asked if they were serious, they meant it.

Thanks to my wife's health issues, I'm not in a great place and when on his last offer he mentioned his wife was going through cancer as well, I agreed to do it, but told him to send half of his offer to a women's cancer charity. I delivered on the story, and feel I did it justice, and she loved it.

Often times I offer to write the story for less if they'll let me publish a version of it for sale and make money that way. I didn't do that with this one. It shouldn't see the light of day in my eyes. Non con was not involved, but its an unpleasant piece even by my warped standards. But I needed to 'go there' in that moment, so it worked out.

 

[EmilyMiller]

I agree that the "you're the only one who could write this" is sent off copy and paste to a bunch of authors to see if it sticks with one. Ironically I learned-and to my dismay, I can deliver some hardcore non con. I have no idea why, but I can, and don't like that I can, so I don't 'flex' that unwanted skill. I'd rather bury it.

Incest is not as easy as people think, at least not to do it right, and that readership can tell a poser from someone making a genuine effort who understands the kink.

I mentioned here a few months ago someone pitched me the same dark incest idea multiple times and I kept saying no because to write it I have to put myself in a dark place to do it justice. It was for his wife who raves over my Sibs series and claimed only I could do this right for her. Judging by the way they kept escalating the offer to where I asked if they were serious, they meant it.

Thanks to my wife's health issues, I'm not in a great place and when on his last offer he mentioned his wife was going through cancer as well, I agreed to do it, but told him to send half of his offer to a women's cancer charity. I delivered on the story, and feel I did it justice, and she loved it.

Often times I offer to write the story for less if they'll let me publish a version of it for sale and make money that way. I didn't do that with this one. It shouldn't see the light of day in my eyes. Non con was not involved, but its an unpleasant piece even by my warped standards. But I needed to 'go there' in that moment, so it worked out.

I’ve only written stuff like that to work through my own issues. It won’t see the light of day. It is strange what we can be capable of writing. Often the things we hate to read.

I’ve started on a sisterly incest story. No power dynamics there. It’s as much of a “can I do it?” as anything else. Seems to have developed a plot about four orphan girls in the back of beyond who have fallen through the safety net and have to look after each other.

I don’t find it flows to write - so am doing bits in between lighter stories.

Emily

 

[lovecraft68]

I’ve only written stuff like that to work through my own issues. It won’t see the light of day. It is strange what we can be capable of writing. Often the things we hate to read.

I’ve started on a sisterly incest story. No power dynamics there. It’s as much of a “can I do it?” as anything else. Seems to have developed a plot about four orphan girls in the back of beyond who have fallen through the safety net and have to look after each other.

I don’t find it flows to write - so am doing bits in between lighter stories.

Emily

I spent a few years in the system. Not an orphan, just wished I was one, but the group homes, the shitty foster homes, its not a pretty scene.

Good foil to explain how wires could be crossed for an incestuous attraction though. It's basically how the brother and sister in Siblings with Benefits ended up together.

Save that for when you're in a crappy place, it'll flow, and be useful catharsis.

 

[EmilyMiller]

Save that for when you're in a crappy place, it'll flow, and be useful catharsis.

Thats’s a good idea.

Emily

 

[AnnieLit]

This was probably already addressed somewhere in the thread, so if it was, please, point me to the right place, but my question with all this is why bother?

Suppose, you write a story and I am compelled to make a few images that go well with the text. Then what? Where are you going to publish it on Lit? You can't put it under the normal categories because images are not allowed there. And you don't really want to publish it as an "illustrated story" because your story is mostly about words, it's not a comic book. Plus there is a big problem with anything niche: BDSM, fetish, non-con, gay, etc. stories do much better when published for the readers of those categories, not for the general public. And since there is only one "illustrated story" category, it will be the general public reading it.

 

[Tio_Narratore]

About four/five hours. The hair coloring was necessary because the AI simply wouldn't accept the text input that she is supposed to be a blonde.

As I said, I learned how hard it is to make. Next time I commission someone for any kind of art, I won't question their rates anymore.

I used to do archaeological and scientific illustration on the side. Had a colleague once who wanted me to do detailed to-scale ink drawings of nearly 600 artifacts. He offered me $250, and was offended when I laughed at him. Pay what the work is worth.

 

[AnnieLit]

I used to do archaeological and scientific illustration on the side. Had a colleague once who wanted me to do detailed to-scale ink drawings of nearly 600 artifacts. He offered me $250, and was offended when I laughed at him. Pay what the work is worth.

That's about 50 cents an hour, right?

 

[Tio_Narratore]

That's about 50 cents an hour, right?

For publishable scientific illustrations that's about 20 cents an hour. Each artifact required at least two perspectives.

 

[Djmac1031]

I wouldn't dream of asking an artist to draw one of my characters for free. And since this is only a hobby, and I'm a cheap bustard, I'm probably not paying anyone to do it either.

Now if an artist were inspired enough by one of my stories to do some fan art? I'd consider that the highest compliment.

I did receive some fan art inspired by my Jenna series. The guy did it on his computer (not AI) and gave me permission to post them. They're in my Artworks section. He did a great job, really managed to capture Jenna exactly as I described her.