Who the hell

Let's see how long it takes for the third post to be removed. This time I even removed the part where I point out where Angeline insults me, so perhaps this time it will stay?

butters said:

personally, i don't mind a little clever and imaginative insulting - after all, as poets we should be able to come up with some interesting stuff.

Click to expand...

Fuck, yeah. Heap it on.

There needs to a seperate Poetry Battle forum where people can just go apeshit on one another. Have all flaming topics relocated there and let these fart blossom in all their uncensored glory.

Then, anyone who in chronic fashion derails regular threads by baiting others or being drama llamas about being baited can be Ban Hammered. Keep your BS confined to the Battle forum or GTFO. Release the Kraken on their asses.

Tsotha said:

Let's see how long it takes for the third post to be removed. This time I even removed the part where I point out where Angeline insults me, so perhaps this time it will stay?

Click to expand...

read my sig line, you've made your point. Cocktail?

Magnetron said:

Fuck, yeah. Heap it on.

There needs to a seperate Poetry Battle forum where people can just go apeshit on one another. Have all flaming topics relocated there and let these fart blossom in all their uncensored glory.

Click to expand...

I second this

Magnetron said:

Then, anyone who in chronic fashion derails regular threads by baiting others or being drama llamas about being baited can be Ban Hammered. Keep your BS confined to the Battle forum or GTFO. Release the Kraken on their asses.

Click to expand...

..
Ban Hammered?

Angeline said:

I never said there were not arguments here in the past. There were plenty and lots of different users have been involved over the years. I don't have anything to do with archiving threads though. The only changes I've made since the new forum rules came out have been 1) to remove current posts or threads where people were fighting (as opposed to discussing) and calling each other names and 2) to move a bunch of discussion threads over here. I haven't touched any old threads and often can't find stuff myself.

We are trying to maintain a balance between discussion threads in the Hangout and writing/challenge threads on the main forum. I realize we can't get it 100 percent, but we are aiming for more of a balance. Some people come mainly to write poems and some more to discuss. What is wrong with trying to keep some balance between the forums? The people who come here primarily to write (assuming they do again--all this tension is making a lot of people uncomfortable) can easily access the threads they want. Those who want to do other stuff can click once. It's just a matter of trying to be fair to the most people.

As far as you being "censored," you have only censored yourself. You have never been banned from this site and can post here any time. Every absence of yours has been of your own making, presumably because things here aren't exactly the way you want them. You are not the only one who matters here. Everyone does. I hope you choose to post again and not take things so personally or see things through such an angry filter. You have a lot to give and it seems sad, to me, to make a war out of nothing. That's just my take on it.

And if you recall, I finished up the interview series before we redid the forum rules or moved anything. There was no plot. I'm human, just like you.

Click to expand...

I can handle things directed at me, however Tath had a link that involved a third party (and in real life would have got him killed). And you where there.
Senna, bless his soul does this you don't know poetry about once every two years to a newcomer, and gets gang fucked, sometimes so badly, I step in on his side.
My posts concerning his poem were deleted, if either you or he wish I can describe in detail just exactly what his second poem and mine are doing. Tsotha was right, both where bad, and I can tell you why.
No. I am not the only one that matters, so it shocked me that threads that point out some of the things that I think are amazing and possibly unique to this place get shoved, and unlike most here I spend more time on others work than on mine.
I just chose to do it without flattery.
And I seriously question the right of anyone's claim to knowledge of poetry if they can't see some of the good others are doing.
This should not be about personality cults, anyones. Mine, yours, the Interviewees.

As I said, I spend far more time on others than I do on mine, and I get it from all sections.
Now where are you going with Poetry Feedback and Discussion? I ask because some of my posts where deleted that specifically referred to a poem, as was Tso's, you had the opportunity to step in when Senna did the same thing regarding Tsotath's poem. You also had that opportunity to delete Tath's post.

HarryHill said:

read my sig line, you've made your point. Cocktail?

I second this

..
Ban Hammered?

Click to expand...

Hammer of the Mods smites you into Oblivion.

twelveoone said:

I can handle things directed at me, however Tath had a link that involved a third party (and in real life would have got him killed). And you where there.
Senna, bless his soul does this you don't know poetry about once every two years to a newcomer, and gets gang fucked, sometimes so badly, I step in on his side.
My posts concerning his poem were deleted, if either you or he wish I can describe in detail just exactly what his second poem and mine are doing. Tsotha was right, both where bad, and I can tell you why.
No. I am not the only one that matters, so it shocked me that threads that point out some of the things that I think are amazing and possibly unique to this place get shoved, and unlike most here I spend more time on others work than on mine.
I just chose to do it without flattery.
And I seriously question the right of anyone's claim to knowledge of poetry if they can't see some of the good others are doing.
This should not be about personality cults, anyones. Mine, yours, the Interviewees.

As I said, I spend far more time on others than I do on mine, and I get it from all sections.
Now where are you going with Poetry Feedback and Discussion? I ask because some of my posts where deleted that specifically referred to a poem, as was Tso's, you had the opportunity to step in when Senna did the same thing regarding Tsotath's poem. You also had that opportunity to delete Tath's post.

Click to expand...

I'm not going to argue with you in public about individuals or about things that happened years ago. I don't even know what thread you mean, but you can pm me if you want.

Threads getting moved to the Hangout for the reasons I already mentioned is not the equivalent of getting shoved aside. That's a value judgment on your part. I didn't intend it that way, but you take it that way. And yet if there is no cult of personality here, including me or you, then why should it matter which forum the threads are on?

If I moved stuff that had poetry or discussion in it that you wanted to keep, I do apologize. Maybe I should have read them more carefully but I have been trying to find some balance that will keep the most people happy. Now clearly there are people posting here who are not happy at the moment. But there are also those who don't post because they do not want to get involved in a public brawl. They have opinions, too. Maybe they disagree with this endless arguing and just want to focus on poetry. Maybe we should ignore the people who bug us and just work on our poems and learning. Isn't that what everyone wants?

Magnetron said:

Then, anyone who in chronic fashion derails regular threads by baiting others or being drama llamas about being baited can be Ban Hammered. Keep your BS confined to the Battle forum or GTFO. Release the Kraken on their asses.

Click to expand...

hey, hey, Nostro, apparently you missed that quatrain

Magnetron said:

Hammer of the Mods smites you into Oblivion.

Click to expand...

Hammer meet Anvil Cant touch this

HarryHill said:

Hammer meet Anvil Cant touch this

Click to expand...

I touched it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfUe2B8wjiI

twelveoone said:

hey, hey, Nostro, apparently you missed that quatrain

Click to expand...

I'm the conductor, not a passenger.

Check out my caboose.

Angeline said:

Threads getting moved to the Hangout for the reasons I already mentioned is not the equivalent of getting shoved aside. That's a value judgment on your part. I didn't intend it that way, but you take it that way. And yet if there is no cult of personality here, including me or you, then why should it matter which forum the threads are on?

Click to expand...

Because there is an implied distinction between the forums. People who just want to write get the main forum. Everyone else is dumped in the subforum.

This would be OK, I suppose, if it was just chat threads, what music you're listening to threads, and threads that are all flirtiness. And if it was consistent. But I don't think it is. Consistent. It's generally that way, but it isn't consistent enough.

Angeline said:

If I moved stuff that had poetry or discussion in it that you wanted to keep, I do apologize. Maybe I should have read them more carefully but I have been trying to find some balance that will keep the most people happy. Now clearly there are people posting here who are not happy at the moment. But there are also those who don't post because they do not want to get involved in a public brawl. They have opinions, too. Maybe they disagree with this endless arguing and just want to focus on poetry. Maybe we should ignore the people who bug us and just work on our poems and learning. Isn't that what everyone wants?

Click to expand...

I am mostly not posting now because I haven't had much I wanted to say. But, I have been thinking about starting a couple of threads--one about sonnets, one about commenting on (external writers') poems. I don't want them to end up in the Hangout. If they get moved there, I would ask for them to be removed. Which I know creates a problem for you. And I do sympathize with your problem. But I (sorry) think you've handled it wrong.

If people fight, let them fight. We all can put them on ignore.

We can all be irritating people. And we can all post so much as to overrun the site and make other people unhappy.

I like to think it will all work itself out, eventually.

But, you know, I could be wrong.

For now, I vote with Tsotha.

Angeline said:

If you feel someone is disrespectful, do not interact with them. Mostly the ignore feature does work although you are right, if you want to ignore me, you need to do so mentally. I'm pretty unobtrusive if you try.

Click to expand...

I haven't interacted with Senna Jawa in over three weeks, except for a quick exchange, as I clearly show in the thread you've deleted twice. I invite you to show us where this alleged goading and baiting of Senna Jawa is happening.

Angeline said:

Maybe they disagree with this endless arguing and just want to focus on poetry. Maybe we should ignore the people who bug us and just work on our poems and learning. Isn't that what everyone wants?

Click to expand...

You sure have an interesting way of preventing public brawls and keeping focused on poetry. This latest conflict has been caused by your open accusation. If you need to tell someone something, tell them directly with a PM.

Angeline said:

And remember Tsotha I never named anyone when I said the apparently infamous "goading and baiting." For all you know, I could have been referring to Senna or even myself. You are making some assumptions.

Click to expand...

Indeed. You never named anyone. How peaceful of you to accuse no one and everyone, at once. I wonder who you could possibly be talking about? Maybe it's me. We'll never know.

However, it's not an assumption that you're talking about either 1201, HarryHill or me. We are the only people who have been involved in any conflict with Senna Jawa over the last few months. You're accusing someone of acting in a malicious manner. It's insulting — and it's insulting because it insults someone. And, since you haven't retracted it, I do assume you meant to insult me, since I am one of those who you are perhaps talking about. Either accuse me, or don't.

Me? I was happily minding my own business and ignoring Senna Jawa, for weeks, but unfortunately I cannot ignore a moderator who is out to get me, commiserating with the bully who insulted me first, on multiple occasions, and misrepresenting the issue as if Senna Jawa was suffering some sort of continued harassment.

If "someone" or a group of "someones" is being "mean" to Senna Jawa, I suggest Senna Jawa should try a acting differently; perhaps he should try not insulting others, and not immediately assuming that everyone who disagrees is an idiot.

To you, I say this: well done. You've successfully shielded a bully from the need to change his behavior, giving him a haven from which he can safely and comfortably harass others. I'm sure the forum will benefit tremendously from this setup, moving forward. As for me, I'm done here, as soon as I finish this discussion with you.

You need to channel your frustration and rage into a poem and submit it.

Only then will you be truly free of this Wendigo you carry on your back.

Tsotha said:

I haven't interacted with Senna Jawa in over three weeks, except for a quick exchange, as I clearly show in the thread you've deleted twice. I invite you to show us where this alleged goading and baiting of Senna Jawa is happening.



You sure have an interesting way of preventing public brawls and keeping focused on poetry. This latest conflict has been caused by your open accusation. If you need to tell someone something, tell them directly with a PM.



Indeed. You never named anyone. How peaceful of you to accuse no one and everyone, at once. I wonder who you could possibly be talking about? Maybe it's me. We'll never know.

However, it's not an assumption that you're talking about either 1201, HarryHill or me. We are the only people who have been involved in any conflict with Senna Jawa over the last few months. You're accusing someone of acting in a malicious manner. It's insulting — and it's insulting because it insults someone. And, since you haven't retracted it, I do assume you meant to insult me, since I am one of those who you are perhaps talking about. Either accuse me, or don't.

Me? I was happily minding my own business and ignoring Senna Jawa, for weeks, but unfortunately I cannot ignore a moderator who is out to get me, commiserating with the bully who insulted me first, on multiple occasions, and misrepresenting the issue as if Senna Jawa was suffering some sort of continued harassment.

If "someone" or a group of "someones" is being "mean" to Senna Jawa, I suggest Senna Jawa should try a acting differently; perhaps he should try not insulting others, and not immediately assuming that everyone who disagrees is an idiot.

To you, I say this: well done. You've successfully shielded a bully from the need to change his behavior, giving him a haven from which he can safely and comfortably harass others. I'm sure the forum will benefit tremendously from this setup, moving forward. As for me, I'm done here, as soon as I finish this discussion with you.

Click to expand...

Senna needs no shielding that he cannot do himself. I have had my turn at receiving and returning a whole truckload of insult, offence, defence and general idiocy with The Person and I did put him on ignore for nearly 2 months. I don't keep many real people blocked for much longer than that for I must eventually ask "To what end?"

Soon enough, apologies went all around and as to what prompted the aforementioned regrettable exchange has been long forgotten, at least by me. Life is too fucking short and full of real upset and sorrow to dwell on stubbed sensibilities so I'll simply say it, stop being toxic.

Carrying on this way is poisoning the well we all drink out of and I'll be damned if I won't tell you to get over it. If anyone has a genuine concern or complaint with anyone else on this site IM Laurel and let her handle it. This is not parliament or congress or a court of law. Fairness isn't necessary, compliance to the Literotica guidelines is.

If you don't care for moderation (there are 3 moderators of the PF&D and any one of them could have deleted or moved any post) then head over to the general board and have all of the freedom to post your complaints over there. Of course no one will care on the GB, so I'm left wondering why I even bothered here. Perhaps I care, though. So that may be the difference.

champagne1982 said:

Senna needs no shielding that he cannot do himself. I have had my turn at receiving and returning a whole truckload of insult, offence, defence and general idiocy with The Person and I did put him on ignore for nearly 2 months. I don't keep many real people blocked for much longer than that for I must eventually ask "To what end?"

Soon enough, apologies went all around and as to what prompted the aforementioned regrettable exchange has been long forgotten, at least by me. Life is too fucking short and full of real upset and sorrow to dwell on stubbed sensibilities so I'll simply say it, stop being toxic.

Carrying on this way is poisoning the well we all drink out of and I'll be damned if I won't tell you to get over it. If anyone has a genuine concern or complaint with anyone else on this site IM Laurel and let her handle it. This is not parliament or congress or a court of law. Fairness isn't necessary, compliance to the Literotica guidelines is.

If you don't care for moderation (there are 3 moderators of the PF&D and any one of them could have deleted or moved any post) then head over to the general board and have all of the freedom to post your complaints over there. Of course no one will care on the GB, so I'm left wondering why I even bothered here. Perhaps I care, though. So that may be the difference.

Click to expand...

I'm "toxic" for reacting (three weeks ago) to insults by Senna Jawa, and for (now) feeling insulted by how this issue is being portrayed by Angeline? Very well. I am sorry that you were bothered by this discussion, and I'm not so much an asshat that I won't apologize for it (I do; I apologize for bothering you).

Interestingly, this is the first time you address me, and it's to tell me to leave. If you read the message you quoted, you must know that yes, you're getting your wish. So I don't really understand your message. Thank you for the input, nonetheless.

champagne1982 said:

Senna needs no shielding that he cannot do himself. I have had my turn at receiving and returning a whole truckload of insult, offence, defence and general idiocy with The Person and I did put him on ignore for nearly 2 months. I don't keep many real people blocked for much longer than that for I must eventually ask "To what end?"

Soon enough, apologies went all around and as to what prompted the aforementioned regrettable exchange has been long forgotten, at least by me. Life is too fucking short and full of real upset and sorrow to dwell on stubbed sensibilities so I'll simply say it, stop being toxic.

Carrying on this way is poisoning the well we all drink out of and I'll be damned if I won't tell you to get over it. If anyone has a genuine concern or complaint with anyone else on this site IM Laurel and let her handle it. This is not parliament or congress or a court of law. Fairness isn't necessary, compliance to the Literotica guidelines is.

If you don't care for moderation (there are 3 moderators of the PF&D and any one of them could have deleted or moved any post) then head over to the general board and have all of the freedom to post your complaints over there. Of course no one will care on the GB, so I'm left wondering why I even bothered here. Perhaps I care, though. So that may be the difference.

Click to expand...

the toxicity stems from the drip drip drip of Senna's insults and attitudes, accusations and posturing. why is his toxicity allowed to poison the well from which we all drink and not be challenged? why is the one challenging poor judgement, perceived hypocrisy, and Senna's ugly attitudes the one being asked to leave? there's room here for everyone, as Angeline pointed out.

when those who react to Senna are called out over it, and he appears to be 'shielded', there will inevitably be an overspill of anger. it's all about perceived fairness. Tsotha was here to write, and left more comments than many of the older regulars. i feel it a great shame, and a noticeable loss to the posting quality, that he feels driven away from this site.

with the best will in the world, there might be three mods to this forum but it seems Angeline is left having to do all the moderating. it's a thankless task, time-consuming, and there's not one mod in christendom or any other dom who could get it right all the time.

Tsotha said:

I'm "toxic" for reacting (three weeks ago) to insults by Senna Jawa, and for (now) feeling insulted by how this issue is being portrayed by Angeline? Very well. I am sorry that you were bothered by this discussion, and I'm not so much an asshat that I won't apologize for it (I do; I apologize for bothering you).

Interestingly, this is the first time you address me, and it's to tell me to leave. If you read the message you quoted, you must know that yes, you're getting your wish. So I don't really understand your message. Thank you for the input, nonetheless.

Click to expand...

I hope that you don't leave, Tsotha.
For one thing I like your poetry (what little I know of it), and for the other your sense of justice and your valuable contributions to all discussions.
Quitting now would be like admitting defeat, but having followed the latest discussions in detail I don't think that is the case. I can understand how pissed off you may feel, well, you are not the only one, I'm sure, but you can see that you also have a lot of moral support from many people.
It is only a matter of following forum guidelines and I think we can all follow them and let moderators to moderate according to their prerogative. After all they are only human (meaning: they may be well-meaning but not always infallible in their decisions). I think time will sort this out, but leaving now is like letting the field a more free deserted place where "angels fear to trend".


trend = deliberately misquoted.

......

drinkz said:

I've ran across you in the forums, and had the misfortune of engaging you twice. I will gladly tell you to leave. Now whine about me not engaging you and telling you to leave.

Click to expand...

really?

please point me in the direction where you have offered as much in comments on the writing of others, posted poetry and joined in informal chat that can bind a forum together as Tsotha has.

butters said:

really?

please point me in the direction where you have offered as much in comments on the writing of others, posted poetry and joined in informal chat that can bind a forum together as Tsotha has.

Click to expand...

You're too fast for me, Butters.
I was going also to ask for a more specific directive as to where those two misfortunate occasions may be lying so that I can appreciate better the said misfortune.
And as we have a new thread perhaps they could be aired here:

http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=1016993

pelegrino said:

You're too fast for me, Butters.
I was going also to ask for a more specific directive as to where those two misfortunate occasions may be lying so that I can appreciate better the said misfortune.
And as we have a new thread perhaps they could be aired here:

http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=1016993

Click to expand...

there will always, always be conflicts of personality. and amongst writery types i'm only surprised there aren't more - testament, i guess, to how well most of us are able to function like real people every day

yes! the gripe thread!
get gripey there and our collective wisdom will discuss, enlighten, or throw things

......

drinkz said:

It was actually while (s)he was trolling the personals section. There's one who spams every ad, and I can't help but notice on my way to the playground. I said something and Tsotha immediately came back with a hateful response, almost as if that was an alt that needed protecting.

So... Writing didn't have shit to do with it, genius.

Click to expand...

so... what relevance did this have on the topic in question?

and no, i'm not a genius. my IQ's only 150. sorry

......