"True" fiction versus fictional fiction

Sorry for the clunky thread title. I'm curious if anyone has thoughts (or better yet, actual experience) with the following concept:

You write a story. It doesn't have to be a Lit story, but it could be. It is written in first person, with the narrator telling a wild and imaginative tale of some extraordinary experience or other. It could be about sex, or a mystery, or sports, or the supernatural, or whatever. The story has a beginning, a middle, and an end, and you are pretty sure it is a good story.

Then, at the end of the piece, it turns out that the narrator was sitting in a bar and telling a tall tale to some listeners. It never really happened to him. He just made it all up.

Do you think real-life readers of your story would be upset at this ending twist? Would they feel cheated? Would they feel like they'd had the rug pulled out from under them?

On the one hand, nothing has changed. It's still just fiction, made up and written by you, the author, which they knew all along. The little twist at the end doesn't really change the story that they just read in the least.

On the other hand, if they were invested in believing certain capabilities about the (albeit fictional) narrator, and his sexual prowess or skills at catching bad guys or in the sporting arena, or whatever the hell the story was about, then the twist might make them feel as if they'd been duped. It's illogical, sure, but I can imagine it might happen.

So what do you think? How would readers react? Thanks for any thoughts!......Carney

It reminds me of King's A Winter's Tale. The same sort of premise happens in that one as you describe. I thought it was a great twist to the story and didn't detract from it at all.

Wouldn't different readers react differently in an unknowable proportion? Isn't this just another unknowable question?

It would seem to be a legitimate approach to storywriting, so I can't think of any reason not to do it.

I think a lot of people would get it and be fine...but there will surely be some that cry foul. Just the nature of the beast I think.

RoyceConnors said:

It reminds me of King's A Winter's Tale. The same sort of premise happens in that one as you describe. I thought it was a great twist to the story and didn't detract from it at all.

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I was thinking more of "The Usual Suspects." It didn't seem to detract from that one, in fact it seemed more to enhance it.

It's a damned good idea
and it HAS been done.

IT might depend on the ending.

If for instance the character is very likable and it appears he dies, then it turns out to be a story people will be happy and relieved.

Its along the lines of the "it was all a dream" device.

I used that twice with mixed results, one an incest story where the kid woke up(so he really did not have sex with his mom) took some heat, I wouldn't say killed, but some "aw come on"

The second was at the end of SWB where it appears Mark dies then the sister commits suicide then wakes up that went over well because people were thrilled they were alive.

Personally, I think it is a bad idea.

When you consider TV shows and movies that had 'It Was All A Dream Endings', they have not been well received. 1990s sitcom Rosanne is one such example, where it was revealed in the finale that vast amounts of the later series were nothing more than fiction, a novel written by the main character, it left a lot of fans of the show cold.

People become emotionally invested in fiction - be it writing, TV or movies - and feel let down when they find out that the people and events did not actually happen within the scope of the fictional work.

Do whatever the hell feels right to you. Try it. If it tanks, fix it.

Who killed JR? Or was it Bobby? I don't remember which was the dream.

I thought we covered this in another thread? Everything we write is fiction (except for the parts that are straight reporting). We can pretend in the storylines that stuff is really happening -- but it ain't. We can pretend (as in carnie's question) that it's all a lie. We can twist the end so that after what we think are lies are told, someone walks in and verifies the 'truth'. My example in the other recent thread (wherever it was): Guy in bar tells wild stories about fabulous women. He reveals that he's just making stuff up, or is accused of that, and admits lying. Then fabulous women, exactly as described in his boasting, walk in and haul the guy away, stroking him seductively. Truth or lies? Does it matter?

I'm working on a piece where older folks sitting around a campfire are telling stories of sexual adventures in their wild youth. Are they lying? Does it matter? That's part of the story.

"Framing device" + "unreliable narrator".

It can work well as long as the audience feel they've been tricked rather than cheated. If they're wondering how a difficult plot dilemma is going to be resolved, "it was all just a story" feels like a disappointing cop-out. The twist needs as much creativity as the rest of the story.

Hypoxia said:

Guy in bar tells wild stories about fabulous women. He reveals that he's just making stuff up, or is accused of that, and admits lying. Then fabulous women, exactly as described in his boasting, walk in and haul the guy away, stroking him seductively.

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Think that would make for a great story.

It's in the "it was all a dream" arena. Would depend on the context...like if it was revealed the guy was making up stories to keep the bikers at bay, entertaining the DAR convention, is in a coma and the plug gets pulled...I dunno.

Why am I seeing "The most interesting man in the world" as I read this thread.

"I don't often spin yarns, but when I do...."

I drink booze that's worse than recycled piss and tell you to buy it.

The most uninteresting man in the world.


I have seen this used many times in TV and movies. I have read a couple of books where it was used. Didn't put me off at all. In fact I thought is quite funny the first time I saw it used.

But then again, I sometimes suspect and read the end first. When I do read the story, I don't find it any less enjoyable.

How others feel...maybe this should have been a poll.

RetroFan said:

Personally, I think it is a bad idea.

When you consider TV shows and movies that had 'It Was All A Dream Endings', they have not been well received. 1990s sitcom Rosanne is one such example, where it was revealed in the finale that vast amounts of the later series were nothing more than fiction, a novel written by the main character, it left a lot of fans of the show cold.

People become emotionally invested in fiction - be it writing, TV or movies - and feel let down when they find out that the people and events did not actually happen within the scope of the fictional work.

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Annie Wilkes says much the same thing in "Misery", but she makes her point more forcefully...

I think any sort of "it was all a dream" story needs to acknowledge that investment and find some way to work with it, rather than ignoring it. Which usually means planning for that revelation from the start, not just making it up late in the piece when you've run out of ideas.

As an example of that, I saw a film that involves a detective investigating mysterious events at a mental institution. Eventually somebody tells him that he's actually an inmate, and it becomes clear that the events at the start of the film are all part of his fantasy. "Memento" has some similar developments. But in both of those, the idea is to take advantage of the audience's emotional investment and use it to make them empathise with the protagonist.

Years ago I read a book the followed a similar story line as the movie "Red Dawn." Evil commies invade America, with the twist of - American's decide they don't care enough about the government to even notice the difference. Except for a small band of patriots who devise an intricate rebellion plan.

During the actual climax of the story, their plan fails horribly. They're met by Russian tanks and blown off the face of history. All that remains is a detailed journal that spells out a method of resistance . . . a journal that is found by an illiterate hobo who uses the pages for lighting a fire, thus finishing the job of the commies by erasing America's last hope.

I finished that book while waiting to board a plane. I used to leave books behind for other travelers to find and enjoy. In this case? I ripped the book into several sections and threw each section into different trashcans through-out the airport. That's how pissed off I was at the ending of that story!

Yes, I got the author's point, and it has clearly stuck with me through the years, but it was such an unsatisfying story, I wanted to make sure no one else accidentally wasted their time reading the damn thing.

I think the idea is fine. Whether the reader will buy it or not will probably come down to your craft. Do it well, and you'll probably win; do it not-so-well, and you could lose. But, hey, isn't that true of most stories? Good luck.

I think there's a significant difference between "it was just a dream" and "I am, of course, making it all up." I would tend to cringe at the first and laugh at the second.

RetroFan said:

When you consider TV shows and movies that had 'It Was All A Dream Endings', they have not been well received.

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When you look at the reaction to the Dallas episode where Pam finds Bobby in the shower after he had been (supposedly) dead and gone from the show for a year...yeah, that kind of 'jumping the shark' goes over like the proverbial lead balloon.

But the finale for Newhart where Dick Loudon wakes up in bed next to his previous Bob Newhart Show TV series wife, Suzanne Pleshette, and it is revealed that the entire seven year series of Newhart had been a dream, was nothing short of brilliant and is still lauded as one of the best ever last episodes in the history of television.

It can be pulled off, but it's rare.

JKendallDane said:

When you look at the reaction to the Dallas episode where Pam finds Bobby in the shower after he had been (supposedly) dead and gone from the show for a year...yeah, that kind of 'jumping the shark' goes over like the proverbial lead balloon.

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Not really, in commercial terms. What do you remember about the first run of Dallas? JR's shooting and the shower reveal. It's a lot more than most people remember from other programs running at the time. And lasted a long time in memory--long enough to give the new Dallas more than a "hey what?" audience. Dallas itself was a purposeful over-the-top Texas production.

sr71plt said:

Not really, in commercial terms. What do you remember about the first run of Dallas? JR's shooting and the shower reveal. It's a lot more than most people remember from other programs running at the time. And lasted a long time in memory--long enough to give the new Dallas more than a "hey what?" audience. Dallas itself was a purposeful over-the-top Texas production.

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Missing the point. Dallas was a ratings topper from episode 1. The producers had a cast problem and invented a variation on the old trick, 'in one jump he was free.' they rode a series without a main character then continued as normal. It wasn't scripted - just necessitated, and you don't address the OP's question.

Carnevil9 said:

...
Then, at the end of the piece, it turns out that the narrator was sitting in a bar and telling a tall tale to some listeners. It never really happened to him. He just made it all up.

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It is a massive anticlimax... And for what purpose?

I suppose it could work if in a Cinderella-type story: you could then reveal that something told in the story was falsified using a subtle clue in the story teller's world. So in instead of the downfall + bad ending as told by the story teller, what actually happened was a good ending.

The essential difference between "It was all a dream!" and "I made that up!" is that a dream usually doesn't add anything to the story other than erasing what the audience thought happened - effective for revealing psychological truths when used for short portions of a larger story, empty calories when it's the majority of the story. Making it up, though, actually means there's some motivation behind the teller doing it and creates another layer to the story, like Baron Munchhausen or even, in a mix of the two concepts, Walter Mitty.