When did The Division begin?

[jaF0]

On another thread, someone mentioned the current division in US society going back to one of the Bushes. I'm not so sure. I think that division led to Bush II and escalated from there.

Personally, I would take it back to Johnson. That was where the escalation in SE Asia began sparking all the anti-war protests and sentiment. That led to the Establishment and the Long Haired Hippy Freaks going at each other. I'm not really sure anything in politics has changed much for the better since then.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Not sure exactly where it began, but one thing for sure Fox News and all the Right Wingnuts in the Media are to blame for how bad it is now.

 

[jaF0]

But I believe they're a symptom or a result, not the root.

 

[JawnKarTurr]

Not sure exactly where it began, but one thing for sure Fox News and all the Right Wingnuts in the Media are to blame for how bad it is now.

Yes, whatever caused it liberals aren't responsible in the least...or won't take any responsibility which makes sense.

 

[KUJACK]

Divison?

Division is always there, changing every decade.
Wars, religion, predjudice, tribalism, sexism all divide us

Groucho Marx said
"A politician is an elected official who looks for problems and finding them everywhere enacts laws to make them worse"

 

[jaF0]

Yes, whatever caused it liberals aren't responsible in the least...or won't take any responsibility which makes sense.

That's the kind of unproductive irresponsible blather that has kept and will continue to keep the division alive.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Case in point.

You've had Rush, Hannity and Coulter screaming "liberals" in your ear for 30 years.

Yes, whatever caused it liberals aren't responsible in the least...or won't take any responsibility which makes sense.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Well I guess the root goes back to a general conservative / liberal divide. Late 60s and Vietnam War enflamed it.

But it never would be where it is now were it not for the total propaganda machine of Fox and its minions (started in 1990s as a reaction to Bill Clinton), which is allowed to run amok in this country, spreading lie after lie after lie.

They do nothing but lie. Why last weekend, there was supposed to be an "ANTIFA APOCALYPSE" all over the country. You have people believing Pizzagate, constant fake news, Clinton hysteria 24/7.

It's extreme because no one knows what is true anymore, and I blame Right Wing media 110%.

But I believe they're a symptom or a result, not the root.

 

[capri31]

I say it started with the JFK assassination. The fake news lies started right then, decades before FOX news. All MSM has completely avoided telling the truth about the biggest issues concerning our history, and our lives.

 

[cfuhrer]

That's the kind of unproductive irresponsible blather that has kept and will continue to keep the division alive.

Seriously?

So, this is divisive?

Yes, whatever caused it liberals aren't responsible in the least...or won't take any responsibility which makes sense.

But this isn't?

Not sure exactly where it began, but one thing for sure Fox News and all the Right Wingnuts in the Media are to blame for how bad it is now.

How does that work?
Is it a "two wrongs" thing?

Seriously, I want to know what the difference is.

 

[Hypoxia]

They do nothing but lie. Why last weekend, there was supposed to be an "ANTIFA APOCALYPSE" all over the country.

Oh, but it happened. We just didn't notice because MSM suppressed all news of it. Just like The Rapture -- the Saved have already ascended (when nobody was looking) and we're all Left Behinds without even knowing. Don't you hate when that happens?

You have people believing Pizzagate, constant fake news, Clinton hysteria 24/7.

It's extreme because no one knows what is true anymore, and I blame Right Wing media 110%.

Indeed. The Reagan FCC shitcanning of the Fairness Doctrine unleashed the yammering hounds of hell upon us. They used to shout from street corners. Now they're everywhere. We're doomed.

 

[jaF0]

But it never would be where it is now were it not for the total propaganda machine of Fox and its minions (started in 1990s as a reaction to Bill Clinton), which is allowed to run amok in this country, spreading lie after lie after lie.

I think everybody was almost as surprised by Bubba beating BushDaddy as they were recently. That certainly led to the rise of right wing hate mongers like Lush.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

I don't see a contradiction.

One is mindlessly repeating the demonization of "liberals" and "the left" pushed by Right Wing Hate Machines for 30 years.

The other is saying where that comes from: Fox and its cohorts in Right Wing Media.

The reason it's pushed beyond just having different opinions in a democracy is the unmooring of fact BY the conservative media.

The so-called "divisiveness" of this country can be basically traced to Rush Limbaugh's fat pie hole--passed on to Hannity, and now given a megaphone by the Liar in the White House. Breitbart has picked it up, and morphed it into something even worse.

Seriously?

So, this is divisive?


But this isn't?


How does that work?
Is it a "two wrongs" thing?

Seriously, I want to know what the difference is.

 

[Sean Renaud]

It was always there

 

[coati]

I don't see a contradiction.

One is mindlessly repeating the demonization of "liberals" and "the left" pushed by Right Wing Hate Machines for 30 years.

The other is saying where that comes from: Fox and its cohorts in Right Wing Media.

The reason it's pushed beyond just having different opinions in a democracy is the unmooring of fact BY the conservative media.

The so-called "divisiveness" of this country can be basically traced to Rush Limbaugh's fat pie hole--passed on to Hannity, and now given a megaphone by the Liar in the White House. Breitbart has picked it up, and morphed it into something even worse.

^^^^^This is indeed a succinct summary of the roots of modern divisions in American politics.

Many in the mainstream media are fond of saying, "Well, there is extremism on both sides of aisle." That is a bullshit statement that ignores the explosion in right wing extremism and the redefinition of moderate Democrats (such as Obama) as left wing extremists. I have not seen a major left wing extremist movement in this nation since the 1970s, when Black nationalism and the Weather Underground were active.

How do you know a true extremist? When a major movement starts embracing guns, threatening to use violence to achieve their aims, and continuously vilifies and dehumanizes their perceived opposition, you know you are heading in that direction. Under left wing extremism, cops were routinely called pigs. Under the new widespread right wing extremism, you have the birth of terms like feminazis, lib-tards, etc. We now have a President who regularly invents new hateful and demeaning monikers for perceived opponents.

Carnal Flower has this right-- this is not a situation where "both sides share the blame". Right wing extremism is rampant. Left wing extremism is minimal at this point.

 

[JawnKarTurr]

Case in point.

You've had Rush, Hannity and Coulter screaming "liberals" in your ear for 30 years.

So there is no such thing as a liberal? How do you identify yourself?

 

[JawnKarTurr]

That's the kind of unproductive irresponsible blather that has kept and will continue to keep the division alive.

Yes and being condescending and acting like you're above it all will make people want listen to your side. Like I said no responsibility is taken.

 

[JawnKarTurr]

Well I guess the root goes back to a general conservative / liberal divide. Late 60s and Vietnam War enflamed it.

But it never would be where it is now were it not for the total propaganda machine of Fox and its minions (started in 1990s as a reaction to Bill Clinton), which is allowed to run amok in this country, spreading lie after lie after lie.

They do nothing but lie. Why last weekend, there was supposed to be an "ANTIFA APOCALYPSE" all over the country. You have people believing Pizzagate, constant fake news, Clinton hysteria 24/7.

It's extreme because no one knows what is true anymore, and I blame Right Wing media 110%.

"ANTIFA APOCALYPSE" ....lol That group was threatening something on November 4th that didn't occur. People were reacting to their threats, but I doubt it affected anyone's weekend all that much. Leftists whine about the KKK all the time, but that group hasn't done much at all. Also, leftists have their own crazies and conspiracy theorists.

 

[Vanadorn]

When the Fairness Doctrine Bill was killed in 1987, it pretty much allowed new stations to morph into propaganda stations instead - giving rise to Fox on the Right and CNN on the Left.

One of the many thing Ronnie had a hand in that in hind-sight wasn't a smart idea.

-V

 

[Sugar Baby Wanted]

Obama was the most divisive president ever. Cops vs. thugs, rich vs poor, black vs white; ad nauseum. His strategy was to divide and conquer. When attention is on others, it takes away from him, or his ineptness, more accurately.

Seriously, the MSM is the democrats right arm: 91% negative reporting on Trump for starts.

Can you say the same when the savior was in power?

Most Americans woke up and voted Trump in. They were tired of the broken promises and outgoing democrats becoming wealthy.

It is, indeed, time to drain the swamp.

And, BTW, many establishment republicans are equally guilty.

 

[Hypoxia]

(heywhataboutisms)

Turn off Faux Newz. Step away from your TV. Look through a window. Outside is life and something approaching reality. Immerse yourself in it. Turn off the paranoia -- it's rent you pay for a house you'll never inhabit. You only have so many years. Enjoy them.

Oh, while I'm on rent: Service to our fellow humans is the rent we pay for our place on the Earth.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Never called myself a "liberal" in my life.

And no, there is no such thing as "a liberal." Sorry but they've been feeding you a line of bull.

Newsflash: people who live in NYC and vote D (almost all of them) do not have horns and cloven hooves. They slog to work, the same as everyone else.*

*Except without guns.

So there is no such thing as a liberal? How do you identify yourself?

 

[AnAmericanDarling]

I think it was when George W. was president. He was one of worst and most controversial presidents, and then to have him followed up by Obama, a black man, which the right could not fathom at all. And then we have our present president who is making us all looking like idiots.

 

[BoyNextDoor]

On another thread, someone mentioned the current division in US society going back to one of the Bushes. I'm not so sure. I think that division led to Bush II and escalated from there.

Personally, I would take it back to Johnson. That was where the escalation in SE Asia began sparking all the anti-war protests and sentiment. That led to the Establishment and the Long Haired Hippy Freaks going at each other. I'm not really sure anything in politics has changed much for the better since then.

Jamestown, Virginia, in 1619.

 

[Hypoxia]

Jamestown, Virginia, in 1619.

USA has divided in different ways since then. I mark the recent ultra-polarized divide starting with Reagan's FCC's Fairness Doctrine shitcanning, preceded by Nixon's "Southern Strategy" turning the Gups into a white Xian guy's party, preceded by... material changes to USA.

Pre-WWII, the nation was barely united. Regionalism reigned, dialect islands prominent. Any major city ruled its hinterland as commercial, political, and cultural capital. No interstate highways eased commerce; railroads ruled. A few national radio networks existed, and zillions of independent stations.

The politics weren't like now. GOP and DEM have pretty much flipped. But regional politics mostly trumped the national game.

Changes: The 30's Depression and Dust Bowl forced mass migrations of poor white Southerners westward and Southern blacks north and west. (Cf Woody Guthrie's DO RE MI) WWII made Americans of all ethnicities work and fight and play together.

But material changes post-WWII really DID unite the nation in unforeseen ways. Three or four TV networks beamed into every part of the land -- and it was nationally-beamed images of Southern sheriffs unleashing dogs on blacks trying to vote or speak that eventually forced civil rights laws. Ike's Interstate and Defense Highway System broke the railroads and let outsiders pour into every locale, bringing their products and ideas with them.

What stitched USA together? Fast communications. But that also centralized power: finance and advertising in New York, mass culture in Los Angeles, politics in Washington. (Air conditioning helped too; without AC, DC would be impossible.) And that centralization opened the haves-vs-have-nots divide.

Smart hicks used to head to a regional capitol to improve their lives... until options looked better in NYC or LA or DC. That's where the talent migrated that used to go to New Orleans, St Louis, Kansas City, Louisville, Omaha, Tulsa, Birmingham, Pittsburgh, Detroit.

And post-WWII industries too often kept their same old factories while the rest of the industrial world, recovering from the war's devastation, built newer, more efficient plants. Bye-bye Birmingham, Pittsburgh, Detroit. Your products are cheaper from elsewhere. Bye-bye futures for all who used to work there. Welcome to the left-behinds.

There's the divide: the moving-forwards (in productive coastal states) vs the left-behinds (in unproductive welfare states). Localism has been swamped by the national flood. The left-behinds are ripe targets for the lies unleashed by media deregulation. Watch Faux and listen to Rush if you ain't going nowhere.