Writing & Depression

[Virtual_Burlesque]

I am sorry that you feel that you feel that way.

I won’t apologise for my sense of humor. My sense of humor is how I maintain a sense of proportion.

Not all people are suicidal because of chemical imbalances. Some people contemplate suicide because of their environment.
Sometimes, the “Goodbye Cruel Work” sign http://www.addis-welt.de/smilie/smilie/wc/1asp050.gif in my bedroom was the only help I could get. Finally, I escaped by leaving home a few months before graduation.


What I wrote was not that far off the mark, either.

I had always enjoyed English, but before I tried to write a letter to my mother, explaining why I left, I never realized how difficult it could be.

If antidepressants work for you that is great. Getting away from my stepfather was all I needed. Life was sometimes a little rough, but a strong sense of humor has got me through so far.

If I sounded unsympathetic, I am sorry, but censuring me for making fun of people who contemplate suicide without giving me a chance to explain myself, was also wrong.

Perhaps a bit of tolerance for people with other problems handled with different means might not be out of place.

 

[minsue]

Perhaps a bit of tolerance for people with other problems handled with different means might not be out of place.

You are right, of course, which is why I apologized. I'll do so again. I'm sorry.

 

[cantdog]

I've never been suicidal, I just get so useless.

I have to imagine what it's like as a matter of degree. Compared to my own difficulties, that is, if you're with me. If so, I am appalled. What I get is certainly bad enough for anyone. I'm glad for you, Box. She must be a gem.

I read your short version of the story, Burly, in another thread about sexual abstinence. Humans are such shits to one another sometimes. I apologize for the whole human race. I hope you can forgive us all, before you die; and I hope in some way to be able to help redeem us. Believe me willing to do anything I can for you.

Whew. I hate this thread, and I'm leaving it now.

cantdog

 

[shereads]

Well, I was suicidal at one point too. The funny thing is though that I never lost my sense of humor. I was able to see how absurd the whole thing was, and how ridiculous it was to even be depressed, but I couldn't do anything about it. You kind of cry for a while, then laugh at yourself, then start crying some more.

For me, my sense of humor is King. More important than sex, more important than truth, more important than religion. There's times when laughing's in bad taste, but there's nothing that should never be laughed at.

--Zoot Q. Mabeuse

Agreed. I tend to assume that laughter is not intended as cruel, but comes out of someone's shared pain or fear, or a need to give comfort, or to break the tension.

Mel Brooks: "Comedy is tragedy plus distance."



~ ~ ~


Actually, VB, it was a little funny.

I knew I was recovering when I could laugh about depression.

 

[shereads]

Zoot? Q?

 

[cantdog]

Big Bad Zoot! We who are in the know use the first name or given monicker, to wit, Zoot.

The Q may be for Qadgop or Queenslander; he hasn't said.



helpfully

cantdog

ps the av with the hip is your very hottest, Ms Eads. It snags my eye and stirs me.

c

 

[shereads]

Big Bad Zoot! We who are in the know use the first name or given monicker, to wit, Zoot.

The Q may be for Qadgop or Queenslander; he hasn't said.



helpfully

cantdog

ps the av with the hip is your very hottest, Ms Eads. It snags my eye and stirs me.

c

Ouch. Sorry about the snagged eye.

 

[cantdog]

...or what's a meta for?

 

[A7inchPhildo]

Statistics from a 1995 issue of Scientific American state that writers and artists are ten times more likely to suffer from depression than other members of the general population, and may be as much as 18 times more likely to commit suicide.

(This is from It Takes A Certain Type to be a Writer)

So does writing make people depressed, or do depressed people tend to write more?

---Zoot

I don't know dr. m,

I have watched and read through this post. I can see the statistics from 1995 ten times, seems kind of high. 18 times more likely to commit suicide.

How did they come up with that?

"911 you are being recorded."
"Uh yeah I am going to jump off the Sears tower!"
"Ok Sir, but first. Can you tell us if you are an artist or a writer?"
"Aaaaaahhhhhhhh! 'SPLAT!"
"Okay, definate artist. Just look at the impression he just made, and a writer would never use that many duplicate letters in a row."
~~~~~~

Here is the thing with me. when I want to escape my life for a while I like to read. When I want to reason things out in my life I like to write. It is my time, and I am very selfish about my time.

Should writing be compared to how people think about life. And that is how they become suicidal?
I have written some pretty depressing sad shit. (LOL not just content wise) and I never once felt depressed. In fact it often makes me feel better about my own life.

Or is it just by chance that many suicide victoms had a long enough time to stop, think about life, and then write down thoughts?

Maybe the stats only reflect the good artist. And thus if if you suck at being an artist they don't apply to you.

I might live on the edge, with no fears of dying whatsoever. Certainly not suicidal or depressed, nor medicated. Then again I don't know I would really call myself a writer. I do it for entertainment purposes. Thinking I just might blow my brains out if I had to watch TV. with the crap that's on today.


Suddenly I sense I am the odd ball in the group. No wonder my sick humor doesn't always go over so well.

Live life like ther is no tomorrow, but be prepared because there is always the chance it will come anyways.

 

[MagicFingers]

Statistics from a 1995 issue of Scientific American state that writers and artists are ten times more likely to suffer from depression than other members of the general population, and may be as much as 18 times more likely to commit suicide.

(This is from It Takes A Certain Type to be a Writer)

So does writing make people depressed, or do depressed people tend to write more?

---Zoot

The latter, for me. I write to keep from going crazy.
Many times in the last few years, I wished I was not alive.
Writing gives me something to do where I can see that some joy is being given to some people. That makes me feel better and gives me something to hold on to - that I can do something worthwhile in some way, even if it's not up to the standards of all the real AUTHORS here!

And if I ever wanted to write suicide notes, yes, notes, I could write them tailor made to each person who led me to that point in my life and with better clarity than before my smut writings!

 

[cantdog]

I know a man whose mother died. We were sympathetic and supportive; he went off out of state to the funeral.

It developed that she'd committed suicide. Nasty turn of events. Coming back from the funeral, his father was shocked to find a U-Haul rental truck with a trailer, and a young couple. They'd bought the house from the bank at auction after the bank had foreclosed. His dad didn't even know there had been any difficulty with the mortgage at all; his wife had always handled the finances.

Over the next few days, it developed she had inherited about twenty thousand and squandered it on clothes and toys. Many dozens of outfits with the tags still on them were hung in closets, never worn even once.

The house payment hadn't been made for a very long time, there were a hundred sixty thousand dollars in credit card debts that they'd found, by the time my friend came back home, in several different cards. She hadn't paid house taxes, she hadn't filed with IRS for six years, and those guys were after his dad.

She had installed another telephone with a different number, one his dad had never known existed. All the creditors had that number, not the family 'phone.

She went to a hotel without telling anyone, wrote dozens of suicide notes to dozens of family members, mailed them, and then suicided. So she was missing, no one knew where she'd gone, and all these hateful letters about what complete thoroughgoing shits everyone was, how their wives were leeches or bitches and deserved to be divorced, how their husbands were molesting their children, just amazing hateful spiteful hurtful notes to everyone she knew.

Eventually the management of the hotel, having seen no activity in the room for a while, investigated and found her decomposing corpse, which was duly identified in a day or so.

More crap about her systematic ruination of the family fortune, such as it was, came out almost hourly for a couple of days after the funeral, and my friend could not guess, of course, how much more of that there could be before it would finally be known what she'd managed to do before her death. Every account emptied, life insurances cashed in with penalties. Everything.

Life is stranger than fiction could ever be. But as you say, you may well want to be able to write many eloquent notes.

cantdog

 

[Randi Grail]

What is an artist and a writer? Is it anyone who has a regular day job, but paints, plays the violin or writes stuff in the spare time? Or is it only those who do it full time to put food on the table?

If it is the latter, then I'm not at all surprised. Because being an artist has got to be the most stressful way to make a living there is. Only a fraction earn enough not to starve, and still everyone puts their soul, ass and undivided energy into what they do. Nobody understands you, everybody asks 'Why don't you get a real job?', the rent is due, paint and canvas costs a fortune, the IRS is after you, and you can be incredibly good at you work, but unless you have made a name for yourself (something that does not need to have anything to do with the stuff you make), you are pretty much never going to be appriciated.

That's enough for a professional, living and breathing their trade, in any business, to give the sleeping pills a long hard look.

 

[rgraham666]

Speaking for myself, writing is one of my best ways to avoid depression.

My brain just spends a lot of time thinking and if I don't have some way of releasing the energy that gets built up from all this activity, it internalises and turns dark, overwhelming my rational self.

That's why I said computer programming is an art on another thread. It allowed me to release that energy. And losing that outlet was a big step on the way down.

Another big factor with writing is feedback. Growing up, the best feedback I could hope for was disapproving silence. Eventually I got to believe that everything I did was wrong. That's not good for your mental health.

Here on Lit, I get lots of positive feedback and even the negative stuff is couched in such a way as to not be damaging to my sense of self.

Thanks to the stories I have here, I can do a lot to improve my mood just by checking my feedback.

Thanks everyone.

 

[CharleyH]

Well, I was suicidal at one point too. The funny thing is though that I never lost my sense of humor. I was able to see how absurd the whole thing was, and how ridiculous it was to even be depressed, but I couldn't do anything about it.

--Zoot Q. Mabeuse

Had a circumstancial experience way back when. I remember saying to my Mother, who stayed on the phone with me for hours at that time, "If I had anything to do it with, I would." I looked around my apartment and laughed. "But beating myself over the head with pots and pans until it happens, isn't all that appealing to me."

I lean toward B, since there are only these two choices, yet there are of course many artists/creators who are not depressive. Writing and artistic pursuits are cathartic processes that help clear the mind, occupy it, or understand the deeper recesses of self, which is why I lean to the latter thought.

Randi asks, "What is it to be a writer or an artist?" In my opinion, it is the moment you can call yourself a writer or an artist with self pride and confidence.

Many people are too afraid to use the words.

 

[cantdog]

Originally posted by CharleyH ..............................................
I lean toward B, since there are only these two choices, yet there are of course many artists/creators who are not depressive. Writing and artistic pursuits are cathartic processes that help clear the mind, occupy it, or understand the deeper recesses of self, which is why I lean to the latter thought.

Randi asks, "What is it to be a writer or an artist?" In my opinion, it is the moment you can call yourself a writer or an artist with self pride and confidence.

Many people are too afraid to use the words.

I knew one visual artist, a painter mostly, great work. I grew up with him; we liked each other.

He went through a lot of very dark times; had some of that right up until his daughter was born. He slaved at day jobs and had no time for the thing he was passionate about.

Then he decided screw it and went to painting full time. He had the time to work on the galleries and make noise. His income tripled that year, and he never has had to do a real job since. Enviable.

cantdog

 

[Guest]

. . .For me, my sense of humor is King. More important than sex, more important than truth, more important than religion. There's times when laughing's in bad taste, but there's nothing that should never be laughed at.

--Zoot Q. Mabeuse

Yes. Humor can help you survive.

And there are times where I find myself thinking, "This is terrible, I shouldn't be making a joke of this!"

Thank God my husband is the same as me. (It upsets my mother sometimes, but it has been necessary for my sanity).

 

[Clare Quilty]

I think there are so many factors at play (biochemical/neurologic/psychiatric, psychological, environmental et cetera) that it is nigh impossible to come to a definitive conclusion as to the nature of the relationship between artistic propensity and mental illness.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Randi asks, "What is it to be a writer or an artist?" In my opinion, it is the moment you can call yourself a writer or an artist with self pride and confidence.

Bingo!!!!!

 

[Dolma Kalem]

. .For me, my sense of humor is King. More important than sex, more important than truth, more important than religion. There's times when laughing's in bad taste, but there's nothing that should never be laughed at.

--Zoot Q. Mabeuse

************

I couldn't agree more Dr.M

A few years ago I had to attend a local hospital for a pre by-pass operation interview with the consultant. We found the appropriate reception area. This area is best compared to an airport departure lounge on a foggy day, it was stuffed full of sh*t scared people. I went to reception with my card, offered it to the lady who pretty much ignored me, eventually she indicated that I should drop it into an 'in tray', which I did.

We eventually found somewhere to sit. As I sat down my name was called. I returned to the reception clerk, who now smiled, Mr ...? I replied yes. Will you please take a seat?

I went back to my wife and sat down.

After a short time I started to laugh, my mind had been working on 'why would you organise that sort of a reception procedure', and the only reasonable conclusion seemed to be to eliminate the serious problem of 'stunt patients'. People who turn up instead of sick people and demonstrate that they really don't need this scary operation at all.

My wife thought it was wierd, but she laughed, and it broke the mood for both of us.

On the issue of depression, it's a terrible condition. Terrible. But it's taught me an immense amount about myself and other people. I know that the 'old me' wouldn't have understood it, and I'm in awe of people who are able to care for depressed people.

Just my two penn'th

 

[Match Made In Heaven]

Statistics from a 1995 issue of Scientific American state that writers and artists are ten times more likely to suffer from depression than other members of the general population, and may be as much as 18 times more likely to commit suicide.

(This is from It Takes A Certain Type to be a Writer)

So does writing make people depressed, or do depressed people tend to write more?

---Zoot

I am a big fan of Dharma and Greg. There's an episode where Lyle Lovett guest stars. He's going through something, so Dharma has him do simple chores like fixing breakfast. She tells greg-

"He's an artist so he lives in his head," doing simple chores gets him out of his head and into his physical body.

I pretty much think this is why writers are more likely to be depressed- but I don't think its exactly one causes the other. Writers and other artists live in there heads, but people who live in there heads are more likely to be artistic and creative and seek this type of career or pasttime.

I would say that seeking a creative outlet is what saves us, but history has proven that idea wrong over and over again. I think artists are more in touch w/ there feelings, they are more sensitive (in emotional and phychic ways) Being able to feel everything so intensly is a double edged sword. It's almost like perpetual puberty. -eek-

Most people need to take some time to get in touch w/ there inner beings, spend a little more time contemplating, analizing, introspecting. Artistic types need to keep there conection to the 'real world' In otherwords, they need to remind themselves to take some time to get out of there head. To stop dwelling and start doing. to interact more w/ others even though it's sometimes difficult.

So I guess, it's both.

And neither.

The key as always, is ballance. Being unballanced- spending to much time in any one realm is unhealthy (although in different ways) I certainly don't think you could cure anyones depression by making them stop writing

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Re: Re: Writing & Depression

"He's an artist so he lives in his head," doing simple chores gets him out of his head and into his physical body.

I pretty much think this is why writers are more likely to be depressed- but I don't think its exactly one causes the other. Writers and other artists live in there heads, but people who live in there heads are more likely to be artistic and creative and seek this type of career or pasttime.

I would say that seeking a creative outlet is what saves us, but history has proven that idea wrong over and over again. I think artists are more in touch w/ there feelings, they are more sensitive (in emotional and phychic ways) Being able to feel everything so intensly is a double edged sword. It's almost like perpetual puberty. -eek-

Most people need to take some time to get in touch w/ there inner beings, spend a little more time contemplating, analizing, introspecting. Artistic types need to keep there conection to the 'real world' In otherwords, they need to remind themselves to take some time to get out of there head. To stop dwelling and start doing. to interact more w/ others even though it's sometimes difficult.

So I guess, it's both.

And neither.

The key as always, is ballance. Being unballanced- spending to much time in any one realm is unhealthy (although in different ways) I certainly don't think you could cure anyones depression by making them stop writing

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Re: Re: Writing & Depression

"He's an artist so he lives in his head," doing simple chores gets him out of his head and into his physical body.

I pretty much think this is why writers are more likely to be depressed- but I don't think its exactly one causes the other. Writers and other artists live in there heads, but people who live in there heads are more likely to be artistic and creative and seek this type of career or pasttime.

I would say that seeking a creative outlet is what saves us, but history has proven that idea wrong over and over again. I think artists are more in touch w/ there feelings, they are more sensitive (in emotional and phychic ways) Being able to feel everything so intensly is a double edged sword. It's almost like perpetual puberty. -eek-

Most people need to take some time to get in touch w/ there inner beings, spend a little more time contemplating, analizing, introspecting. Artistic types need to keep there conection to the 'real world' In otherwords, they need to remind themselves to take some time to get out of there head. To stop dwelling and start doing. to interact more w/ others even though it's sometimes difficult.

So I guess, it's both.

And neither.

The key as always, is ballance. Being unballanced- spending to much time in any one realm is unhealthy (although in different ways) I certainly don't think you could cure anyones depression by making them stop writing

OMG....that's me.

 

[Marsipanne]

I am an anomaly then, I must say. I'm the least depressed person I know. I'm always happy, smiley and not in the least angsty or moody. And I'm definitely a writer, a drawer (sounds silly, but artist sounds pretentious because what I draw isn't 'art') and a pianist (doing Diploma exam soon). So, I certify as the arty type but I'm not depressed at all.

 

[Randi Grail]

Randi asks, "What is it to be a writer or an artist?" In my opinion, it is the moment you can call yourself a writer or an artist with self pride and confidence.

Many people are too afraid to use the words.

And with that definition, the rest of my theory fails.

Being an artist as an outlet of creativity and a source for pride no depression makes, quite the opposite. Trying to make a living of it might be.

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

First off, most of my friends for most of my life have been of that particular edge of society. The intelligent, the artists, the empathetics, and the writers. Witnessing and hearing of suicide attempts from close friends has been far too common for my liking. In fact, after some particularly rough days in the always fun turbulent trauma that is called high school, I lay in the middle of a road used by school vehicles to determine if people would actually stop (not a genuine suicide attempt but could have been. The answer by the way is they won't, but they will turn). From this personal standpoint, here's what I think of depression and writing.

Writers, poets, intellectuals, and artists tend toward both insanity and depression. The latter as a natural result of seeing such a shitstorm around them all the time that they are powerless against because of the Nurse Ratched types in the world and the former as the cure against it. In fact, this is why black humor was invented in the first place. It gives the chronically depressed an outlet to let out a choked half-smile and laugh. Personally and shared by many friends, is a strange appreciation of irony's ability to fuck up lives. Hey, a bitter laugh is often good to delay a particualrly bad hit until something good can happen. (It's a stupid sentiment I know, but it got me through high school alive so...)

Frankly, when I get depressed, I can't write. I can't concentrate on the fantasy worlds and stories because reality is pushing too hard on me. When I'm not depressed, I write pretty well and have a twisted style and approach to things (A look at some of my non-erotic work would reveal this very fast). I don't know if others have this problem or style, but it's my personal terror. I think it boils down to the fact that much of my writing is done for the purpose of escaping reality, of creating false worlds and fake people, and entering into exciting eccentric minds.

Anyway, if there's a point in all that stupid personal backstory crap, it's probably this: The type who would write are generally depressed people and one reason for that may be that through writing one can escape reality and depression without resorting to the er...final resort. Also, the pursuit of insanity as a cure for depression lends itself very well to the artist/writer lifestyle.

Anyway that's just one fellow's personal idea of it all.