Writers: Sex @ Beginning, Middle, End?

[3113]

The Question: When writing (or reading) erotica, are there spots where the sex can detract from the quality of the story rather than enhance it? For example, is it a good idea to open the story with someone having sex. Like, having the opening sentence be: "I was toying with my girlfriend's nipples...." Or do you think erotica works better if it starts out with the story, like "the first time I saw her she was wearing a hot pink bikini and slowly licking a popsicle..." and leads into the sex?

And what about ending on a sexual moment? For example, a final line of "This, I thought as he took me higher and higher on the climax, is the best relationship of my life..." Or is it better to have the sex and then a coda to end on a kind of "afterglow"? Finishing the story in a non-sexual or only sexually suggestive moment rather than on, say, an orgasm?

Please, don't answer by telling me that every story is different. I know that depending on the story and writer, any of the above may work or not. But we have "rules" for writing that we often offer. Rules which say that "typically" this or that makes for good writing (like "show don't tell") and this or that "typically" makes for not such good writing. What, as erotica experts, would you say are the "typical" rules for placement of sex in a story to create good erotica and why?

Does starting off with sex, for example, make the story sound more amateurish? Or does it make the story more memorable? Etc. I'm interested to know what you think.

 

[LaRocha]

Can't climax in the beginning and make anyone happy. Climaxes belong in middle and end. How do most novel romances go, off the shelf? Is there boning at the end or emotional intimacy well after the sex acts?

 

[litfan10]

The Question: When writing (or reading) erotica, are there spots where the sex can detract from the quality of the story rather than enhance it? For example, is it a good idea to open the story with someone having sex. Like, having the opening sentence be: "I was toying with my girlfriend's nipples...." Or do you think erotica works better if it starts out with the story, like "the first time I saw her she was wearing a hot pink bikini and slowly licking a popsicle..." and leads into the sex?

And what about ending on a sexual moment? For example, a final line of "This, I thought as he took me higher and higher on the climax, is the best relationship of my life..." Or is it better to have the sex and then a coda to end on a kind of "afterglow"? Finishing the story in a non-sexual or only sexually suggestive moment rather than on, say, an orgasm?

Please, don't answer by telling me that every story is different. I know that depending on the story and writer, any of the above may work or not. But we have "rules" for writing that we often offer. Rules which say that "typically" this or that makes for good writing (like "show don't tell") and this or that "typically" makes for not such good writing. What, as erotica experts, would you say are the "typical" rules for placement of sex in a story to create good erotica and why?

Does starting off with sex, for example, make the story sound more amateurish? Or does it make the story more memorable? Etc. I'm interested to know what you think.

Honestly, I think it all depends on what the writer is doing with the sex scene. If the story is all about the fall out of a situation than the sex will be first. If the characters lead into the sex and then react to the experience afterward it's going to be in the middle. If the whole story is leading up to the coupling as the ultimate goal, it's going to be at the end.

A good writer will use any of those placements and make a good story. A bad writer a bad story regardless.

It's all about how the sex is used - glorified sex is pointless, sex integral to the story and characters is meaningful.

 

[TxRad]

Sex in the story is what makes it erotica. Where it is in the story is dictated by the story unless it's just a stroke piece and then the sex is the story.

As for starting a story with a sex scene, one of the good rules is to have a hook in the first sentence/paragraph. What better than sex?

Anyway, other than the above and the show not tell thing, most rules are to be broken more than followed. They just get in the way of telling the story.

I just write it the way I see it. Good characters and good sex go hand and hand. The story will work itself out in the end.

 

[mokkelke]

I just write it the way I see it. Good characters and good sex go hand and hand. The story will work itself out in the end.

That's how I write as well. Sometimes it feels right to let them go at it like sex starved bunnies, sometimes the story asks for a chapter (or 2) of story/character building, action scenes and so on)

 

[TxRad]

That's how I write as well. Sometimes it feels right to let them go at it like sex starved bunnies, sometimes the story asks for a chapter (or 2) of story/character building, action scenes and so on)

I find that when I start a new story, I usually have nothing more than a visual, a couple of lines, and a title to go with. The mental picture dictates where the story starts and how fast it does or does not get to the sex. Since I like characters and sometimes even a plot, most of my sex shows up later in the story but not always.

Like I said, there are no hard and fast rules.

 

[3113]

Honestly, I think it all depends on what the writer is doing with the sex scene.

Sigh. I asked you nicely not to tell me anything like that and you did. Look. We say to erotica writers things like "don't use measurements [aka 36' DD cup] in the story." We say that because we believe that this detracts from story and it's sexiness. We don't say, "it depends on what the writer is doing with the sex scene whether measurements should be put in or not."

We obviously DO have opinions on these things, and I'd very much like to hear some opinions, not "it depends." But if "it depends" really is your firm opinion, then what examples have you of when it worked brilliantly or failed miserably and why? What was the "dependent" thing?

As for starting a story with a sex scene, one of the good rules is to have a hook in the first sentence/paragraph. What better than sex?

I can think of a lot of things better than sex. Like, flirting, drama, tension, characterization even. I've opened up stories that started with, "I licked my girlfriend's nipple" and stopped reading because I don't know who "I" was, and I don't know who the "girlfriend" was, and there were plenty of other stories that would tell me and make me care about who was doing what. Likewise, I've opened up stories that did start in the middle of sex and was somehow captured and found, to my surprise that there was a story there.

I know it can work. What I want to know is why it works when it does work and why it doesn't when it doesn't. Because starting with sex isn't always the best thing. Putting it another way, assuming we're discussing actual stories and not just a free-floating description of a sex act to jerk-off to (nothing wrong with that, but I'm asking about stories), what does the writer need to do to make sure opening with sex is the best opening?

 

[soflabbwlvr]

In my opinion, starting a story with a sex scene generally demonstrates poor writing. I see many authors writing that way, and their justification usually revolves around a desire to immediately hook the reader. I consider that a rather ham handed technique. If the author's only aspiration is to produce a garden variety stroker, then fine, why waste time with plot and character development? But a story should have rising action that builds to a climax. In a way, it is a lot like sex. You can do it more than one time, but you don't start with a cum shot to the face. How about a little foreplay?
Now, I agree that there are no bright line rules, and there are times when the story starts in a sex scene. But those stories should be rare. Relationships don't form that way.
While I'm on the subject, I despise stories that start in the sex scene, then flash back to how the characters hooked up. Have faith in your storytelling, and tell the story before jumping into the climax.

 

[3113]

In my opinion, starting a story with a sex scene generally demonstrates poor writing. I see many authors writing that way, and their justification usually revolves around a desire to immediately hook the reader. I consider that a rather ham handed technique. If the author's only aspiration is to produce a garden variety stroker, then fine, why waste time with plot and character development? But a story should have rising action that builds to a climax. In a way, it is a lot like sex. You can do it more than one time, but you don't start with a cum shot to the face. How about a little foreplay?
Now, I agree that there are no bright line rules, and there are times when the story starts in a sex scene. But those stories should be rare. Relationships don't form that way.
While I'm on the subject, I despise stories that start in the sex scene, then flash back to how the characters hooked up. Have faith in your storytelling, and tell the story before jumping into the climax.

Thank you for having a strong opinion on the subject.

I understand there are no hard/fast rules as there are never any such rules in writing. But there are things that usually work and things that usually don't work. When a writer can make something that usually doesn't work work it's often a one-shot exception. The right thing for the right story never mind how good a writer they are.

So. Okay. What about ending the story on a sex scene?

 

[favoritesgoddess]

I read somewhere that you should never open with a sex scene. I don't know who told me that, though. I find it ham-handed too and very rarely have I read a story where it really worked.

I like to know about the characters and the situation first because to me that's as important as the sex. Erotica (to me, anyway) isn't all just cock-and-pussy.

One thing I personally can't stand in an erotic story is when I do not believe that the characters would be having sex. If the plot is contrived just to set up some fantastic sex scene, be it just two folks or a roomful of people, I have to believe that it could actually happen. I have to know what's going on in the heads of the characters that got them to that point. And if it's ham-handed, I'm not going to finish.

I don't much care where the sex comes into the story, though. That I don't think there could be a rule for. I do think there needs to be a denouement, though. Even if it's just a simple tag line, I like to finish a story wanting to know more about what happens next to these people. I mean, if you take the time to introduce me to these people, bring me into their world, and let me watch while they have sex, it makes sense to me to explore--even in a small way--what happens after the sex is done.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I very often open with a sex scene, or a reference to one, because for me, the way my characters approach sex is a big part of their personalities.

Sometimes it works, sometimes I end up deleting those paragraphs.

I hated the long drawn out romantic angsty style of sex plot for a long time, mostly because the Romance reasons to avoid sex hardly make sense to me and i find them contrived. But I can think of writers who really make me glad I waited.


I do like a little afterglow in my sex stories.

 

[Weird Harold]

The Question: When writing (or reading) erotica, are there spots where the sex can detract from the quality of the story rather than enhance it? ...

Please, don't answer by telling me that every story is different. ...

If you already knew the answer, why ask the question?

What you're asking about is "gratuitous sex" and I see a lot of that in erotic stories posted on the internet -- not just here at Lit -- where stories have a graphic sex scene or three) in every chapter simply because the stories is posted on a site that allows erotic stories. I see the same problem with gratuitous violence in stories -- graphic, gruesome, scenes of violence that do nothing except interrupt the flow of the story.

I don't believe there are any hard and fast rules as to where in a story sex is inappropriate or how much description is too much for any given sex scene. In part that is because it is a stylistic choice but mostly it is because there is no such thing as a story that is just an "erotic story" -- what works for a pure porn stroke story doesn't work for erotic horror or erotic romance stories.

The only hard and fast rule for almost any writing question like this is...

"how does this scene advance the story? Does it serve a purpose in getting my vision across to the reader?"

 

[jomar]

...

I know it can work. What I want to know is why it works when it does work and why it doesn't when it doesn't. Because starting with sex isn't always the best thing. Putting it another way, assuming we're discussing actual stories and not just a free-floating description of a sex act to jerk-off to (nothing wrong with that, but I'm asking about stories), what does the writer need to do to make sure opening with sex is the best opening?

Okay, that's different than your original question I think.

But having won the Pulitzer prize in the sexy writing I can say with authority that the tone of the story is meaningful.

So...first paragraph sex 101
In a romance you dip your toe in...kissing, pressing guilty loins in the Caribbean, then cut to a possibly tense exchange with the husband while making the kids lunch for school.

This is soft intro, alludes/acknowledges passion, foreshadows the conflict to come (haha), blah, blah, blah.

Bottom line it's a tease and the reason it works is because of the fantasy of the dream.

First paragraph sex 102
The hardcore intro. Fast, pumping, fluids, vocals...a tougher sell. For the most part people are going to assume it's porn. So with this kind of intro the cover is important..loving gazes, abstract images, cars on empty roads, etc...

This one works because people are crazy.

 

[sr71plt]

The moment of ejaculation/orgasm can be as good a story opening as any other. A good story is a good story. Taking fresh approaches to the arc of a story can help make it a good story.

Bullshit to anyone who says sex has to be only in a certain part of a story.

And, by the way, a sex act can be in the beginning, middle, AND end, and the story could still be terrific.

A good story is a good story because it's a good story.

 

[3113]

If you already knew the answer, why ask the question?

Because I imagined a forum full of writers might be able to come up with different answers. If you can't, why bother responding?

 

[3113]

Okay, that's different than your original question I think.

But having won the Pulitzer prize in the sexy writing I can say with authority that the tone of the story is meaningful.

So...first paragraph sex 101
In a romance you dip your toe in...kissing, pressing guilty loins in the Caribbean, then cut to a possibly tense exchange with the husband while making the kids lunch for school.

This is soft intro, alludes/acknowledges passion, foreshadows the conflict to come (haha), blah, blah, blah.

Bottom line it's a tease and the reason it works is because of the fantasy of the dream.

First paragraph sex 102
The hardcore intro. Fast, pumping, fluids, vocals...a tougher sell. For the most part people are going to assume it's porn. So with this kind of intro the cover is important..loving gazes, abstract images, cars on empty roads, etc...

This one works because people are crazy.

Okay, that makes sense.

 

[3113]

Bullshit to anyone who says sex has to be only in a certain part of a story.

Let's be clear. I've said a few times now, but no one seems to be noticing. So, one more time with feeling:

I don't expect anyone to say sex has to ONLY be anywhere--and I don't think anyone, so far, has, though some have voiced their preferences, exactly as I asked them to. Nor do I expect there to be any hard/fast rules, in fact, I'm well aware that there are NEVER any hard and fast rules when it comes to writing and I don't quite understand why anyone feels they need to remind me of this. I know any "rule" can be broken and that all writing rules are general and never specific. This is art, not physics.

THAT SAID, since we DO say things like "it's not a good idea to use measurements in erotica" or "I don't think second person makes the best sex stories," I WOULD like to hear some OPINIONS on this topic, as, evidently, we writers do have opinions on what works or, if you like, works well or doesn't work so well most of the time.

If anyone is so strongly of the opinion that they should have no opinion on this because it is too dependent on the story, then they need not post an answer. This is not about "rules" it's simply about thoughts and opinions.

We did away with politics to talk writing. This is a writing question. Talk to me.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Well, let's try this; when the story opens with a sex scene, what would make it work? What would make it fail?

for me, I don't want a lot of sexual detail in that scene, but I do want a lot of character portrait, and maybe a hint as to what's going to go on in the rest of the story.

When there's sex in the middle, I hope it gives me a thumbnail of where the characters are at that point-- successfully navigating their adventure, or maybe not.

When there's sex at the end, I want it to embody the victory over whatever struggle they undertook in the plot. A little bit, at least.

 

[alwayswantedto]

<deleted>

 

[Tx Tall Tales]

For very short stories, you don't have a lot of choice.

I find that in my writing, and in my favorite stories, I usually like some character development, and quite often a 'pursuit' of some kind before we get to the sex. Midway through the story, and then quite often several more times including a big final scene seems to work well.

 

[EmeraldKitten]

Does starting off with sex, for example, make the story sound more amateurish? Or does it make the story more memorable? Etc. I'm interested to know what you think.

If done correctly, sex at the beginning is fine.. I've always tried to stay away from it though, in this platform, because I feel like if they get the sex in the first 5 sentences, they aren't going to finish the story. (which equals no votes, no comments.) I'm not sure I think it makes it amateurish.. I guess as long as it's good sex. (for example, one of my favorite books, Brazen - Susan Johnson , starts with the main male character getting.. persuaded by his harem. )
Same with sex at the end though.. if the story is multiple pages long, how many people are going to read through all the 'story' to get to the sex? (Providing the person reading is just in it for the stroke factor.)

I think readers take the genre into consideration also.. like, if you click on a story in the 'romance' department, I would assume the sex is in a little bit, once they fall in love. *bats eyelashes*. But if it's in the 'erotic couplings' department, I would assume sex happens pretty quickly, because we don't care if we know each other or not.

Okay, I hope that made sense. I haven't had enough coffee yet.

 

[jomar]

Okay, that makes sense.

 

[oggbashan]

Sex can be implied, not necessarily described in detail.

What readers want from a story on Literotica varies greatly. Some just want an explicit portrayal of their specific fantasy and there are authors who write very well for them. Fetish lovers want just their fetish. If they like FF stockings and garter belts then any story without those is unacceptable.

The Loving Wives category is a minefield because whatever you write is likely to annoy one group of readers.

Some like a story with a plot that includes sex. Preferably the sex must be an integral part of the story, not a 'cut and paste sex scene into here'. In some of my stories the sex is almost optional. I could leave the sex out and still have a story. Of course those are not good Literotica stories or even good stories for anywhere. If part of the story is unnecessary, I've written poorly.

My view of the answer to your question is that sex can go anywhere in the story, but if the sex isn't necessary for the story AT THAT POINT, then the story is flawed and should be edited.

Og

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I open one of my stories with graphic sex. The reader thinks my principle character is one of the lovers but she's really a homicide detective reviewing a home-grown DVD for clues to a murder.

So the answer to the question is: Write a fucking story and the sex will take care of itself.

 

[LaRocha]

The moment of ejaculation/orgasm can be as good a story opening as any other. A good story is a good story. Taking fresh approaches to the arc of a story can help make it a good story.

Bullshit to anyone who says sex has to be only in a certain part of a story.

And, by the way, a sex act can be in the beginning, middle, AND end, and the story could still be terrific.

A good story is a good story because it's a good story.

She's talking about a good sex story within the confines of erotica. The whole story should be erotic, but the sex scene, the climax itself is what she's getting at. It's about the one sex scene and its placement, not sex scenes at beginning middle and end of one story. If there's only one sex scene, can it be at the beginning? I can't recall a quality erotic story with just one sex scene at the beginning and then plain old eroticism without another sex scene for the next 2/3rds of the text.

Climactic sex acts belong in the second half of the story, following the western story motif. Introduce character and plot, tension, release. If someone gets shot in the beginning of a mystery in a very brutal and interesting way, the release is actually at the end when the crime is solved in spectacular fashion. If the sex act in a sex story is at the beginning, the rest of the story still has to build tension and release. If the ensuing tension and release aren't in the realm of erotica after the climatic sex scene in the first few passages, then is it still an erotic story?

Short sex stories are the quickest ways to effectually meet the needs of western story motif. 3 Lit pages is all it takes to accomplish everything one needs to in writing the best of sex stories. Page one(do we care about the characters?) page two(now that we care about them are they going to have sex. no, unfortunately it looks like they won't) page three(yes! they're having sex, I'm smiling at their good fortune...oh, I came on my new sweater...)