Why Do Liberals Defend Islam?

[Ramone45]

I don't understand. They stand against everything liberals stand for. Anti-gay, Anti-woman, Pro-life, etc. A substatial part of the religion has become radicalized and committed the greatest atrocities in history. I really don't hear the same criticism of Islam as I do of Christianity, and I wonder how liberals rationalize this. I was also wondering abou a hypothetical issue. I know that Muslims are required to pray multiple times during the day. I think it is part of their faith and culture. As Muslim communities grow, what if they ask for prayer time accommodations at school. That would seem to be a reasonable request, but we have had a policy against school prayer. Would liberals say that denying Muslims the right to pray represents religious and cultural discrimination?

 

[EternallFantasies]

For the same reasons someone created the religion in the first place.

 

[sr71plt]

For the same reason they support Buddism and Taoism in their fullest extent, Ramone--because being a liberal means not being narrow-minded, mean-spirited, and hate- and ignorance-controlled as you are being.

 

[EternallFantasies]

Rofl.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

well that's an interesting comment.

I don't see it much different from the Hobby Lobby decision which allows employers to deny covering birth control for employees, because it's "against their religion" or clerks who refuse to marry gay couples, and yet that's precisely what the Christian Right is going for.

If the Christians want to impose their freakish beliefs all over the place, why should it only apply to Christians? Why won't Muslims, atheists, Buddhists, and anyone else make the same kind of argument?

The fact is the only religion trying to break down Church and State right now is Christianity. Doesn't seem to occur to them it's opening the door to everyone else.

I don't understand. They stand against everything liberals stand for. Anti-gay, Anti-woman, Pro-life, etc. A substatial part of the religion has become radicalized and committed the greatest atrocities in history. I really don't hear the same criticism of Islam as I do of Christianity, and I wonder how liberals rationalize this. I was also wondering abou a hypothetical issue. I know that Muslims are required to pray multiple times during the day. I think it is part of their faith and culture. As Muslim communities grow, what if they ask for prayer time accommodations at school. That would seem to be a reasonable request, but we have had a policy against school prayer. Would liberals say that denying Muslims the right to pray represents religious and cultural discrimination?

 

[TheWhiteBull]

well that's an interesting comment.

I don't see it much different from the Hobby Lobby decision which allows employers to deny covering birth control for employees, because it's "against their religion" or clerks who refuse to marry gay couples, and yet that's precisely what the Christian Right is going for.

If the Christians want to impose their freakish beliefs all over the place, why should it only apply to Christians? Why won't Muslims, atheists, Buddhists, and anyone else make the same kind of argument?

The fact is the only religion trying to break down Church and State right now is Christianity. Doesn't seem to occur to them it's opening the door to everyone else.

Actually the big difference is that as you pointed out is that the Hobby Lobby decision is an actual case of Christians getting their way while his is just a hypothetical conjecture that probably won't happen.

 

[TheWhiteBull]

For the same reason they support Buddism and Taoism in their fullest extent, Ramone--because being a liberal means not being narrow-minded, mean-spirited, and hate- and ignorance-controlled as you are being.

Curious as to what you mean here by "in their fullest extent" because it sounds suspiciously similar to "in their true form"

 

[Ramone45]

For the same reason they support Buddism and Taoism in their fullest extent, Ramone--because being a liberal means not being narrow-minded, mean-spirited, and hate- and ignorance-controlled as you are being.

I'm simply asking a question. Do you view liberals as open minded to the tenets of Christianity?
And please stop with the name calling and ridiculous accusation, okay? If i were different person, I might point out how easily triggered you are by a simple question or discussion.

 

[sr71plt]

I'm simply asking a question. Do you view liberals as open minded to the tenets of Christianity?
And please stop with the name calling and ridiculous accusation, okay? If i were different person, I might point out how easily triggered you are by a simple question or discussion.

I don't view "liberals" as having one view about anything. That you seem to says loads about you.

You're just trying to be nasty and provocative. Who do you think you're fooling?

 

[Ramone45]

well that's an interesting comment.

I don't see it much different from the Hobby Lobby decision which allows employers to deny covering birth control for employees, because it's "against their religion" or clerks who refuse to marry gay couples, and yet that's precisely what the Christian Right is going for.

If the Christians want to impose their freakish beliefs all over the place, why should it only apply to Christians? Why won't Muslims, atheists, Buddhists, and anyone else make the same kind of argument?

The fact is the only religion trying to break down Church and State right now is Christianity. Doesn't seem to occur to them it's opening the door to everyone else.

Muslim communities in Great Britain and parts of the US have Sharia Courts. I view that as a breakdown of the Church-State Barrier in a way.

 

[someoneyouknow]

If one is not going to defend one religion, you can't defend the others. All have as their base tenet the belief in an unknown, all seeing, omnipotent being who supposedly decides who lives and dies, yet no one can show one shred of evidence such a being exists.

Considering all four major religions are guilty of genocide at one time or another, that all have engaged in terrorist activities, that all have used their religion as an excuse to commit such acts, to say that now, because an infinitesimal portion of one religion has decided to go batshit crazy means we should get rid of it, is disingenuous at best and just as ridiculous as the beliefs of the members of these religions at worst.

How does that saying go?

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came_...

 

[someoneyouknow]

Muslim communities in Great Britain and parts of the US have Sharia Courts. I view that as a breakdown of the Church-State Barrier in a way.

There are Jewish areas of New York and other cities where Jewish law and customs hold sway over state laws.

Further, Republicans in this country are now trying to get rid of the separation of Church and State by allowing churches to get involved in politics while still keeping their tax free status:

http://www.pennlive.com/nation-world/2017/06/gop_bill_would_let_churches_en.html#incart_river_home

 

[Carnal_Flower]

What?

The US Consititution is the law of the land, last time I checked.

If some nutjobs here and there want to set up their own pretend justice somewhere, so what? They can't have any relevance to our ACTUAL laws

Muslim communities in Great Britain and parts of the US have Sharia Courts. I view that as a breakdown of the Church-State Barrier in a way.

 

[TheWhiteBull]

What?

The US Consititution is the law of the land, last time I checked.

If some nutjobs here and there want to set up their own pretend justice somewhere, so what? They can't have any relevance to our ACTUAL laws

Well except that if they do it can make life suck for the vulnerable in that community, i.e. fundamentalist Mormons.

 

[just4friends]

Hmm
"A substatial part of the religion has become radicalized and committed the greatest atrocities in history."

Care to prove that belief? Substantial part?
Political use of Islam to create radicals? Sure! And we keep improving their message!

You have heard of the Spanish Inquisition..Russian Pograms... the Killing Fields... that little Holocaust thingy... never mind the other war atrocities the Germans committed.... but yeah..some nasty atrocities lately! Biggest in Hisory? Grow up!

 

[Ramone45]

Hmm
"A substatial part of the religion has become radicalized and committed the greatest atrocities in history."

Care to prove that belief? Substantial part?
Political use of Islam to create radicals? Sure! And we keep improving their message!

You have heard of the Spanish Inquisition..Russian Pograms... the Killing Fields... that little Holocaust thingy... never mind the other war atrocities the Germans committed.... but yeah..some nasty atrocities lately! Biggest in Hisory? Grow up!

Noted, but they're right up there.

 

[sr71plt]

Noted, but they're right up there.

Perhaps you can show, by proportional numbers, that Muslims (either Muslims in the States or internationally) are more radicalized than fundamentalist Christians in the United States are. Have fun researching that one.

 

[handysr]

For the same reason they support Buddism and Taoism in their fullest extent, Ramone--because being a liberal means not being narrow-minded, mean-spirited, and hate- and ignorance-controlled as you are being.

LMFAO! Except for some inbred rednecks, I've never such hate, bigotry, and violent threats as I've seen from liberals. I hear them spouting about how everyone must think as they do, or they must be beaten into submission, or told they must be "educated" about how to be inclusive.

You're one of the specific people I'm talking about. You and your BFF lovecraft pretend to hate each other, but you equally detest those that don't agree with you.

Bigot.

well that's an interesting comment.

I don't see it much different from the Hobby Lobby decision which allows employers to deny covering birth control for employees, because it's "against their religion" or clerks who refuse to marry gay couples, and yet that's precisely what the Christian Right is going for.

No, fake news. Hobby Lobby did NOT deny birth control. They accepted the birth *prevention* meds, but were against fetus *termination* meds. There's a difference. Read up on it. I've heard from liberals how they want to allow companies to let their beliefs and values shine - as long as it's in support of the LGQTBVZ+ crowd. But a religious group being legally required to pay for a thing that violates their beliefs and values, which is doing more that supporting a cause by flying a fucking rainbow flag, that is following your logic , huh?

Bigot.

I don't view "liberals" as having one view about anything. That you seem to says loads about you.

You're just trying to be nasty and provocative. Who do you think you're fooling?

I'd like you to read the General Board and Politics section. Check out the liberals. See if you can find a theme. No, I'm not saying that 100% of them agree on every topic, it there is a general consensus. Just like every other political offshoot, they agree on ideals, not always on details.

You act nasty and provocative to those who don't share your view.

Look up the word bigot. You can always call yourself one too, you know.

 

[TheWhiteBull]

Perhaps you can show, by proportional numbers, that Muslims (either Muslims in the States or internationally) are more radicalized than fundamentalist Christians in the United States are. Have fun researching that one.

Why would he compare Muslims to fundamentalist Christians. Fundamentalist to fundamentalist sure, or faith as a whole to faith as a whole.

 

[handysr]

Why would he compare Muslims to fundamentalist Christians. Fundamentalist to fundamentalist sure, or faith as a whole to faith as a whole.

He's trying to make people think muslims are no more dangerous than christians.

I mean, Christians killed many people for faith reasons a hundred years ago. And centuries ago they had crusades. That totally equates to how often muslims are killing people in modern times, right?

He is apparently an apologist for terrorists.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Yep, if it's the LAW.

Religious beliefs are private.

There's the U.S. Government, and there's the Church. The Laws of the Government supersede those of the Bible.

That's why we have courts and a rule of LAW based on the constitution.

No, fake news. Hobby Lobby did NOT deny birth control. They accepted the birth *prevention* meds, but were against fetus *termination* meds. There's a difference. Read up on it. I've heard from liberals how they want to allow companies to let their beliefs and values shine - as long as it's in support of the LGQTBVZ+ crowd. But a religious group being legally required to pay for a thing that violates their beliefs and values, which is doing more that supporting a cause by flying a fucking rainbow flag, that is following your logic , huh?

.

 

[handysr]

Yep, if it's the LAW.

Religious beliefs are private.

There's the U.S. Government, and there's the Church. The Laws of the Government supersede those of the Bible.

That's why we have courts and a rule of LAW based on the constitution.

Laws aren't always just, and we see many people across the spectrum fighting for what they believe in.
The religious group got an exemption for one small piece, which liberals are flipping out about.

It's not that Hobby Lobby was/is refusing birth control. They are not paying for their folks to get abortions. There is a difference.

Nobody is pushing to have "society" pay for me to have unlimited condoms. Where is the justice there?

And you have got to be fucking kidding me.. a rule of LAW based on the constitution?!? Have you even seen politics lately? Many of the constitutionally-based freedoms are currently under attack by liberal judges. They don't want freedom, they want power over others that they don't agree with.

 

[phrodeau]

Laws aren't always just, and we see many people across the spectrum fighting for what they believe in.
The religious group got an exemption for one small piece, which liberals are flipping out about.

It's not that Hobby Lobby was/is refusing birth control. They are not paying for their folks to get abortions. There is a difference.

Nobody is pushing to have "society" pay for me to have unlimited condoms. Where is the justice there?

And you have got to be fucking kidding me.. a rule of LAW based on the constitution?!? Have you even seen politics lately? Many of the constitutionally-based freedoms are currently under attack by liberal judges. They don't want freedom, they want power over others that they don't agree with.

Hobby Lobby wanted the right to declare that all birth control is a form of abortion.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Well, if you're going to start saying I don't have to follow US Law because my Bible tells me otherwise, then you're going to have to give that same "freedom" to Islam, Buddhism, whatever else.

And so if the Hobby Lobby people get to impose their religious "beliefs" on their employees, you better start preparing yourself for Sharia.

Laws aren't always just, and we see many people across the spectrum fighting for what they believe in.
The religious group got an exemption for one small piece, which liberals are flipping out about.

It's not that Hobby Lobby was/is refusing birth control. They are not paying for their folks to get abortions. There is a difference.

Nobody is pushing to have "society" pay for me to have unlimited condoms. Where is the justice there?

And you have got to be fucking kidding me.. a rule of LAW based on the constitution?!? Have you even seen politics lately? Many of the constitutionally-based freedoms are currently under attack by liberal judges. They don't want freedom, they want power over others that they don't agree with.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Hmm
"A substatial part of the religion has become radicalized and committed the greatest atrocities in history."

Care to prove that belief? Substantial part?
Political use of Islam to create radicals? Sure! And we keep improving their message!

You have heard of the Spanish Inquisition..Russian Pograms... the Killing Fields... that little Holocaust thingy... never mind the other war atrocities the Germans committed.... but yeah..some nasty atrocities lately! Biggest in Hisory? Grow up!

If you want to go way back in history, what about the millions of Hindus murdered by Muslims in the areas that are now Pakistan, Iran, etc. I don't know if this was the worst ever, because nobody knows how many were killed or enslaved.