Hello A/all...although Master and i have enjoyed Literotica for a few months...W/we have, only lately, started using some of its features. Both of U/us have submitted stories and see thousands view while only a hand full vote. W/we would like to see reasons for why others vote or not. Anyone care to share?
Who votes and why or why not?
- Thread starter jewel_GR
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YosemiteSam
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Vote
I vote on every story I read....it only takes a second, and I figgure I owe it to the person who took the time to post it for my enjoyment, and they want the feedback....and i want to give it to them, it might make their next story even better to read.
I vote on every story I read....it only takes a second, and I figgure I owe it to the person who took the time to post it for my enjoyment, and they want the feedback....and i want to give it to them, it might make their next story even better to read.
Jewell_GR
This is a subject that has been hashed and rehashed, but one so dear to my heart and I can't resist wading in one more time. I think that among the reasons people don't vote are the following:
1) They didn't particularly like the story, and may have never even reached the voting button at the end. If the story doesn't capture the reader’s attention, he/she is not motivated to vote.
2) They skimmed the story. It was mildly ineresting but they weren't overwhelmed. They are reluctant to give a low score because the story was OK and reasonably well written, but they didn't like it well enough to give it a high score either.
3) They vote for stories they like (4 or 5), but are reluctant to vote on the ones they don't care for. Some readers including myself are unwilling to downgrade a story just because it's a style or subject matter that doesn't fit their personal (and entirely subjective) taste.
4) They don't think it's important, and have no understanding of how the author is panting to know what they think of his/her story.
5) They lack confidence in their own opinion, and are reluctant to commit themselves. I think this is probably the most common reason people don't vote, but in fairness they may have a point. True, there are some who wouldn't commit themselves on the day of the week. Much more often I think the reader decides, "What the hell! Why ask me? Do I look like a literary critic? Anyway, I am a little embarrassed to be sitting here in the middle of the night reading dirty stories on the net."
I am sure there are other reasons as well. Perhaps we will hear of them on this thread. There are so many variables in this business of counting views and votes, and calculating scores, that I don't think anybody can say for sure what THE factor might be. Probably it is different from reader to reader. I do think, however, the number of votes a story gets is the best measure of its success. We can say with some certainty that it caught the attention of at least that number of people.
However, I have a question of you Jewell. Have you read stories that you didn't vote on? I have a personal reason for asking. I write most of my stories in the BDSM and the Nonconsent categories, in which (from your comment about "my master") you probably read a good deal. Are there any of my stories you haven't voted on? If so, shame on you. Be a good girl and go back and vote right now.
Ray Dario
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I used to vote on more stories than I do now. I based my vote on how well written I thought the story was and I gave out more than a few 1's when I felt the story deserved them.
Then I got involved with the "Author's hangout" forum and "talked" to several new authors about their stories. I realized how easily some new authors egos get bruised. I would hate to be even a small part of the reason a new author quits writing, so now I either do nothing but back click when I encounter a horribly written story, or, if the author has shown a desire for feedback on the boards on in comments preceeding or following the story, I send as positive a "constructive" feedback as I can.
Only when the author requests it do I get really brutal in my feedback. I remember, not so long ago, when I was a new writer and struggled with many of the same problems I see in the new writers here on Lit today. I would rather help those that want help than try to squash their egos.
Today I will not vote a 1. I know someone else will take care of that. I usually don't vote a 4, unless the author has asked for votes, but I do send feedback. I rarely vote a 5. There are very few stories out there that deserve a 5. But when I come across one, I vote and I send feedback to the author.
My way isn't perfect, nor do I recommend others follow it, but it is what I do.
Ray
Then I got involved with the "Author's hangout" forum and "talked" to several new authors about their stories. I realized how easily some new authors egos get bruised. I would hate to be even a small part of the reason a new author quits writing, so now I either do nothing but back click when I encounter a horribly written story, or, if the author has shown a desire for feedback on the boards on in comments preceeding or following the story, I send as positive a "constructive" feedback as I can.
Only when the author requests it do I get really brutal in my feedback. I remember, not so long ago, when I was a new writer and struggled with many of the same problems I see in the new writers here on Lit today. I would rather help those that want help than try to squash their egos.
Today I will not vote a 1. I know someone else will take care of that. I usually don't vote a 4, unless the author has asked for votes, but I do send feedback. I rarely vote a 5. There are very few stories out there that deserve a 5. But when I come across one, I vote and I send feedback to the author.
My way isn't perfect, nor do I recommend others follow it, but it is what I do.
Ray
I never hesitate to vote how I see fit, be it a 1 or a 5. Granted, I've given a great deal more 2's than 1's, and my 5's go to many stories (a tribute to the number of good authors here). I agree with Jig's hypothesis on why readers don't vote. Sometimes a piece is so bland, so conforming and common, that I just sit, wonder what I've been doing for the past five minutes, and hit "back." I trample stories with poor spelling/grammar/punctuation and/or overdone description mercilessly. I also send wild raving feedback to the recipients of 5's. I have toned down the contempt in my 1-2 feedback, but not the rating itself.
Ray Dario
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Quint said:
As someone who stands accused of "Overdone Description" I wonder, why do you equate the use of a few extra words to paint a clearer picture of something as equal to poor spelling/grammer/punctuation?
Is it really so bad to say
"The tall tree with its many thick branches swayed ponderously in the gail force wind that whistled across the yard."
That you would equate it with
"The tell tree blent in the farce wind."
Hmmm, just wondering.
Ray
Yes.
[And yes, I do know that a.) this is highly personal editorial preference, and b.) I do the same damned thing myself at times.]
Knowing when to leave a scene in the mind of the reader is just as basic a part of good writing as knowing how to spell. It may be easier, actually.
[And yes, I do know that a.) this is highly personal editorial preference, and b.) I do the same damned thing myself at times.]
Knowing when to leave a scene in the mind of the reader is just as basic a part of good writing as knowing how to spell. It may be easier, actually.
Ray Dario
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Quint said:
In that case dear sir/madaam, as the case may be, please refrain from reading my stories. They would not please you and your vote might knock the little red "H" off some of them.
In return, I promise not to judge you too harshly, nor to read your stories.
Ray
Synnerman
"Wanderer of Dreams"
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The Jigs scale.
As one of the newest authors here at Lit I too pondered the discrepancy between views and votes.
I sincerely hope reason # 5 is in fact the most common reason for the lack of votes. Any of the others would not flatter an easily bruised ego. Fortunately I am not easily bruised.
Recognizing that I have much to learn I would welcome comments from critics, authors, and readers alike on my submissions. Without honesty I will learn nothing, so feel free to
have at me for better or worse.
I know most authors and critics are also readers but for the purpose of commenting on my submissions it would be nice to differentiate between the three.
As one of the newest authors here at Lit I too pondered the discrepancy between views and votes.
I sincerely hope reason # 5 is in fact the most common reason for the lack of votes. Any of the others would not flatter an easily bruised ego. Fortunately I am not easily bruised.
Recognizing that I have much to learn I would welcome comments from critics, authors, and readers alike on my submissions. Without honesty I will learn nothing, so feel free to
have at me for better or worse.
I know most authors and critics are also readers but for the purpose of commenting on my submissions it would be nice to differentiate between the three.
Is anybody out there?
I had previously thought the hits/votes ratios on my stories were low; but the figures for my most recent submission are disheartening.
The percentages on my first 5 stories were, respectively: 1.9%, 4.9%, 2.6%, 3.5% and 4.9%. The numbers for the most recent story: 4068 'hits,' 17 votes, 0 feedback. Of those 17 votes, I'm pretty sure that 5 were lodged by people with whom I correspondend. That leaves 12 votes out of about 4000 of the general readership who opened the story. 12/4000 = 1 out of 333 = 0.003 or 0.3%.
That means of 333 people opening the story, 332 never ended up voting. Amazing. I'd think that 4000 people randomly moving a cursor on the screen would lodge more votes than that. What gets even more puzzling is that the few votes which were cast were quite favorable.
Now, my writing was never intended for mass popularity (if I wanted that, it appears I should write incest stories). But I always thought there was a segment of the readership that enjoyed something different. I'm starting to wonder if those readers are out there in any significant numbers.
What sort of voting percentages are others getting? Is 0.3% now typical? Anomalous?
This isn't a request for feedback (though, that is always welcomed). In case any are curious, my story link is given below. The title of the most recent is "Pirouette."
I had previously thought the hits/votes ratios on my stories were low; but the figures for my most recent submission are disheartening.
The percentages on my first 5 stories were, respectively: 1.9%, 4.9%, 2.6%, 3.5% and 4.9%. The numbers for the most recent story: 4068 'hits,' 17 votes, 0 feedback. Of those 17 votes, I'm pretty sure that 5 were lodged by people with whom I correspondend. That leaves 12 votes out of about 4000 of the general readership who opened the story. 12/4000 = 1 out of 333 = 0.003 or 0.3%.
That means of 333 people opening the story, 332 never ended up voting. Amazing. I'd think that 4000 people randomly moving a cursor on the screen would lodge more votes than that. What gets even more puzzling is that the few votes which were cast were quite favorable.
Now, my writing was never intended for mass popularity (if I wanted that, it appears I should write incest stories). But I always thought there was a segment of the readership that enjoyed something different. I'm starting to wonder if those readers are out there in any significant numbers.
What sort of voting percentages are others getting? Is 0.3% now typical? Anomalous?
This isn't a request for feedback (though, that is always welcomed). In case any are curious, my story link is given below. The title of the most recent is "Pirouette."
NC,
Without judging your stories, since I haven't read any of them to my knowledge, I find that a high vote-to-view ratio is based mostly upon truly innovative/arousing or truly godawful work. The fuzzy area in between, which elicits an "ehh, that was a decent story. What's next?" tends not to receive many votes per views.
My best ratio is 59:2149, for Creative Construction of Character. I take that to mean that I did a damned fine job of approaching a subject in a fresh, new way. (I'd react the opposite way if I had that amount of views with a low rating, obviously.)
The best advice I can give you is to a.) grow a thick skin to low v2v ratios, but learn from them by b.) trying your best to give every story you write an edge. Plot formulas aren't lethal, as long as you put a fresh spin on it. Say something that stands out. It takes more time, but nothing worthwhile is ever easy.
Without judging your stories, since I haven't read any of them to my knowledge, I find that a high vote-to-view ratio is based mostly upon truly innovative/arousing or truly godawful work. The fuzzy area in between, which elicits an "ehh, that was a decent story. What's next?" tends not to receive many votes per views.
My best ratio is 59:2149, for Creative Construction of Character. I take that to mean that I did a damned fine job of approaching a subject in a fresh, new way. (I'd react the opposite way if I had that amount of views with a low rating, obviously.)
The best advice I can give you is to a.) grow a thick skin to low v2v ratios, but learn from them by b.) trying your best to give every story you write an edge. Plot formulas aren't lethal, as long as you put a fresh spin on it. Say something that stands out. It takes more time, but nothing worthwhile is ever easy.
Axeltheswede
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- Feb 10, 2002
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Voting
I would like to add one additional reason to Jigs list. Many readers surf stories until they find one that looks like it will trip their trigger. They read, choke their chicken, or stir the soup, as gender dictates. Upon successful completion, click File, click Exit.
I will not presume to venture what percentage of readers this scenario applies to. But, it does happen often. Look at the top list of all time reads. Incest stories don't get 100K plus reads because Phd candidates in psych are doing research.
You will get more votes if you ask readers to do it at the end of your story. Look through authors will many story posts. Find a note you like. Paraphrase, or use it on your own story. You will see your vote totals rise. I know that is true from my own experience.
Other authors may accuse me of pandering. I really don't care. I like it when readers vote and send feedback emails.
I would like to add one additional reason to Jigs list. Many readers surf stories until they find one that looks like it will trip their trigger. They read, choke their chicken, or stir the soup, as gender dictates. Upon successful completion, click File, click Exit.
I will not presume to venture what percentage of readers this scenario applies to. But, it does happen often. Look at the top list of all time reads. Incest stories don't get 100K plus reads because Phd candidates in psych are doing research.
You will get more votes if you ask readers to do it at the end of your story. Look through authors will many story posts. Find a note you like. Paraphrase, or use it on your own story. You will see your vote totals rise. I know that is true from my own experience.
Other authors may accuse me of pandering. I really don't care. I like it when readers vote and send feedback emails.
secretdesire
Experienced
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Probably the first dozen or so stories I read I never voted on because I didn't even notice the voting thing at the end. It doesn't exactly stand out. Maybe if the rating numbers had some eye-catching phrase to go along with them more people would vote. For example:
1 = Not even worth a Handjob
up to
5 = Totally fuckable
...or something like that--make it more fun for readers to vote!
I vote on every story I read now, but sometimes I'll begin a story and realize I don't want to read it, so I just click back to pick something else instead of finishing it. In those situations, I don't vote.
1 = Not even worth a Handjob
up to
5 = Totally fuckable
...or something like that--make it more fun for readers to vote!
I vote on every story I read now, but sometimes I'll begin a story and realize I don't want to read it, so I just click back to pick something else instead of finishing it. In those situations, I don't vote.
Axeltheswede has hit the nail on the head-- twice.
(1) Face it guys and gals, our readers aren't looking for literature, they want something to get off on. Having done so, either emotionally or physically, it's time for a cigarette, and voting on your story is the last thing on their minds. The STORY FEEDBACK section of the Bulletin Board is replete with writers begging for feedback. They are wasting their time. Our readers are searching for fantasy sex, and they know perfectly well they won't find it on the BB.
(2) If you want votes and feedback, ask for it at the end of your story. As Alexel says, it may be pandering, but I have learned that a little cajoling, a little reminder that a vote is the price of admission, pays off big time in votes. I'm not gentle about it either. I even cuss at them a bit if they fail to vote.
Secretdesire has a good point too. The reader has sex on his/her mind. Let's give him/her something sexy to respond to. Moreover, I have always thought the 1-5 scale to be too limiting. A 1-10 scale is more flexible. I sometimes don't vote myself because I am torn between grades (4 or a 5?). I personally would find it easier to vote if I could sometimes split the difference, and I have received feedback that echoes that opinion.
(1) Face it guys and gals, our readers aren't looking for literature, they want something to get off on. Having done so, either emotionally or physically, it's time for a cigarette, and voting on your story is the last thing on their minds. The STORY FEEDBACK section of the Bulletin Board is replete with writers begging for feedback. They are wasting their time. Our readers are searching for fantasy sex, and they know perfectly well they won't find it on the BB.
(2) If you want votes and feedback, ask for it at the end of your story. As Alexel says, it may be pandering, but I have learned that a little cajoling, a little reminder that a vote is the price of admission, pays off big time in votes. I'm not gentle about it either. I even cuss at them a bit if they fail to vote.
Secretdesire has a good point too. The reader has sex on his/her mind. Let's give him/her something sexy to respond to. Moreover, I have always thought the 1-5 scale to be too limiting. A 1-10 scale is more flexible. I sometimes don't vote myself because I am torn between grades (4 or a 5?). I personally would find it easier to vote if I could sometimes split the difference, and I have received feedback that echoes that opinion.
Axeltheswede
Literotica Guru
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who votes
Thank you, Jigs. Like a stopped clock, I am right twice a day. The rest of the time, well.
One other quick point. When I put a note about voting at the end of my story posts, I am trying to communicate with readers. At that point they have finished reading the story. I do not wish to rely on their intuition to know voting is important to me. I ask. As Granpappy always said, "He who asks, gets".
Thank you, Jigs. Like a stopped clock, I am right twice a day. The rest of the time, well.
One other quick point. When I put a note about voting at the end of my story posts, I am trying to communicate with readers. At that point they have finished reading the story. I do not wish to rely on their intuition to know voting is important to me. I ask. As Granpappy always said, "He who asks, gets".
ladyphoenix
Really Experienced
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- Jun 5, 2001
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Why Vote?
I vote for every story I read, because I want everyone who reads mine to vote. Sort of a "do unto others" philosophy.
I vote for every story I read, because I want everyone who reads mine to vote. Sort of a "do unto others" philosophy.
Wm_Sexspear
Experienced
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- Mar 24, 2002
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Voting and Views
I have recently sent my thoughts to Laurel re: voting/scoring. They included some of the ideas I've seen here, and more. Especially having a 4.5 vote, there are stories that deserve a red H for originality, or whatever, but I can't bring my self to do a 5 because of slopiness or run on sentences that drove me nuts. I won't vote a 4 and hold them back, so I just don't vote. Enough other folks will hit it hard.
There are several reasons why Views can be inflated.
- It's a long story, reader quits, then comes back later.
- Line drops, reader comes back later.
- Reader cuts and pastes it. Come back later to vote.
- They like the story, reader views it more than once.
- Reader wanted something different TONIGHT, but they come back another day, then finally read it.
Sometimes I cut and paste an interesting plot line so I can edit it to a point where I can read it without being totally distracted. Those author's should hope a vote doesn't accompany that view.
Anyone interested in feedback stories and some discussion of voting thoughts could browse Stupid Human Tricks in Author's Handout.
Larry
I have recently sent my thoughts to Laurel re: voting/scoring. They included some of the ideas I've seen here, and more. Especially having a 4.5 vote, there are stories that deserve a red H for originality, or whatever, but I can't bring my self to do a 5 because of slopiness or run on sentences that drove me nuts. I won't vote a 4 and hold them back, so I just don't vote. Enough other folks will hit it hard.
There are several reasons why Views can be inflated.
- It's a long story, reader quits, then comes back later.
- Line drops, reader comes back later.
- Reader cuts and pastes it. Come back later to vote.
- They like the story, reader views it more than once.
- Reader wanted something different TONIGHT, but they come back another day, then finally read it.
Sometimes I cut and paste an interesting plot line so I can edit it to a point where I can read it without being totally distracted. Those author's should hope a vote doesn't accompany that view.
Anyone interested in feedback stories and some discussion of voting thoughts could browse Stupid Human Tricks in Author's Handout.
Larry
Further thoughts
Appreciate it. That ratio (59/2149) is in the range of my first group of stories. My recent one just plunged way down. I had taken a year off from writing, so I thought maybe the voting process had lost its novelty for the readership.
I've tried to stay novel in my approach; though my most original ideas have garnered the lowest ratings.
Maybe we need a 'click here if you read to the end of this story' button. Even among the authors/posters, I'm seeing lots of comments like "sometimes I can't decide between 4 and 5" and "I don't want to give a low vote just because of (grammar, story category, etc.)" The judgmentalism inherent in voting seems to deter many.
Quint said:
Appreciate it. That ratio (59/2149) is in the range of my first group of stories. My recent one just plunged way down. I had taken a year off from writing, so I thought maybe the voting process had lost its novelty for the readership.
I've tried to stay novel in my approach; though my most original ideas have garnered the lowest ratings.
Maybe we need a 'click here if you read to the end of this story' button. Even among the authors/posters, I'm seeing lots of comments like "sometimes I can't decide between 4 and 5" and "I don't want to give a low vote just because of (grammar, story category, etc.)" The judgmentalism inherent in voting seems to deter many.
