What's your quick-fix solution?

[Recidiva]

I get what you both are saying. But American citizens have had the right to bear arms and hence the gun culture that arose from it. But for us, that isn't the case and the number of crimes involving firearms is low.

I can see how restriction can be a waste of resources, especially if the ratio of police to population is unhealthily low.

Yes, we do have a gun culture, and I grew up in a home with guns.

If you check the crime rates from nation to nation, though, I don't think it is morally better to die from stabbing undefended than it is to shoot an intruder with a gun to protect yourself.

I think the rest of the world is just thinking "Those silly Americans, let's not be like them. We're superior because we can be subdued by a steak knife and think it's the government's job to protect us. We can die after being stabbed to death knowing we made the right choice."

 

[Busybody]

How are Muslims a world problem?

And just for fun, try responding without using any emoticon or image.

Also for fun, back up your facts with links.



Tee Hee

About the List of Terrorist Attacks




This list of terrorist attacks committed by Muslims since 9/11/01 (a rate of about five a day) is incomplete because not all such attacks are picked up by international news sources, even those resulting in multiple loss of life.

These are not incidents of ordinary crime involving nominal Muslims killing for money or vendetta. We only include incidents of deadly violence that are reasonably determined to have been committed out of religious duty - as interpreted by the perpetrator. Islam needs to be a motive, but it need not be the only factor.

We usually list only attacks resulting in loss of life (with a handful of exceptions). In several cases, the deaths are undercounted because deaths from trauma caused by the Islamists may occur in later days, despite the best efforts of medical personnel to keep the victims alive.

We usually don't include incidents related to combat, such as in Iraq and Afghanistan, unless it involves particularly heinous terror tactics, such as suicide bombings or attacks on troops sleeping in their barracks or providing medical care to the local population.

We acknowledge that a handful of incidents on the list may not fit the traditional definition of 'terror attack.' A small portion, for example, are of honor killings - although we usually omit those in which the woman is killed by her husband, since this is often indistinguishable from a crime of passion (barring explicit circumstances). Our stance on honor killings is that the stabbing, shooting or strangling of a woman over "unIslamic" behavior constitutes Islamic terror.

Our counter reflects the number of deadly attacks on our list. This number will be a bit greater than the number of line items, since multiple incidents are sometimes grouped into the same record.

Honor killings and attacks that result in no loss of life are not included in the counter even if they appear on the list.

Unfortunately, this list of Muslim terrorist attacks barely scratches the surface of atrocities committed in the name of Islam occurring world-wide each day. For that reason, we don't tally up the dead and dismembered, except on a weekly and monthly basis.

The incidents are collected each day from public news sources. There is no rumor or word-of-mouth involved. Although every attempt is made to be accurate and consistent, we are not making the claim that this is a scientific product.

Unlike the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), which publishes a tally of alleged "hate crimes" each year without supporting data, we do provide detail of each incident that we claim as a terror attack and make it available for verification.

The point of this list is not to convince anyone that they are in mortal danger or that Muslims are innately dangerous people (they are not, of course). Rather it is to point out that Islam is different. No other religion inspires the sort of terrorism that the "Religion of Peace" produces. It should be acceptable to question and critique the teachings, particularly those that are supremacist in nature.

We also hope that this list offers moral perspective against so-called "Islamophobia" and other complaints from Muslim identity groups that are petty by comparison. Who knows - perhaps one day these groups will decide to take the sort of action expected of those who truly believe that it is wrong to kill in the name of their religion.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

I get what you both are saying. But American citizens have had the right to bear arms and hence the gun culture that arose from it. But for us, that isn't the case and the number of crimes involving firearms is low.

I can see how restriction can be a waste of resources, especially if the ratio of police to population is unhealthily low.

Where a lot of us live, law enforcement response is measured by the half-day.

Plus there are bear, cougar, and other assorted small varmints that are just plain a nuisance if you do not keep their population under control...

 

[gardenia19]

Remove religion from society.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Yes, we do have a gun culture, and I grew up in a home with guns.

If you check the crime rates from nation to nation, though, I don't think it is morally better to die from stabbing undefended than it is to shoot an intruder with a gun to protect yourself.

I think the rest of the world is just thinking "Those silly Americans, let's not be like them. We're superior because we can be subdued by a steak knife and think it's the government's job to protect us. We can die after being stabbed to death knowing we made the right choice."

*chuckle*

Wonder how many of the gang-raped women would have liked to have had a little sumptin'-sumptin' concealed and carried...

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Remove religion from society.

Then where is their hope of something better?

When confronted by government and the brutality of man empowered, were there no God, someone would invent one out of necessity if only to render the illusion of hope, even if in the next life.
A_J, the Atheist

 

[Recidiva]

*chuckle*

Wonder how many of the gang-raped women would have liked to have had a little sumptin'-sumptin' concealed and carried...

Not mine, but pithy:

Gun Control: the theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her own panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Not mine, but pithy:

Gun Control: the theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her own panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

Have a nice day.

 

[Recidiva]

Have a nice day.

You too!

 

[Busybody]

love is in the air

 

[gardenia19]

Then where is their hope of something better?

When confronted by government and the brutality of man empowered, were there no God, someone would invent one out of necessity if only to render the illusion of hope, even if in the next life.
A_J, the Atheist

I don't need a god to hope for something better. When my life is nearing its end I'll be glad to sleep forever. I wonder, without religion would there be so many wars? Would men in religions that put themselves above women still feel superior to women?

That quote is a joke. Why create a god when it's man's interpretation of a religious book that encourages brutality?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Forgive my ignorance, when I hear Tea party, I imagine the Mad Hatter, March Hare and the Dormouse.







[size="-2"]Familiar with the historical Boston Tea Party... ignorant of what the party currently represents.[/size]

In the 1700s the East India Tea Company got its claws into India then conquered America via loans and gifts and bribes to the British Royals and Parliament. In America the Tea Company controlled all commerce and competed directly against its customers. Americans couldnt compete against a monopoly that controlled the money, imports, exports, transportation, etc. So we started smuggling and using Spanish silver for trade. The Tea Company brought in soldiers and the navy to suppress the smuggling, and prevailed upon Parliament to levy taxes to pay for the military. So we went to war to exterminate the Tea Company.

The new Tea Party wants to extinguish the same influence on Congress and the Government.

 

[Recidiva]

I don't need a god to hope for something better. When my life is nearing its end I'll be glad to sleep forever. I wonder, without religion would there be so many wars? Would men in religions that put themselves above women still feel superior to women?

That quote is a joke. Why create a god when it's man's interpretation of a religious book that encourages brutality?

I think eliminating religion would be eliminating all of the work humanity has done throughout history on subjective questions.

There's a lot of good in religion, and a lot of bad, but that's the history of the human race.

The history of religion is showing how thoughts progressed from ignorance to...less ignorance.

The current constructs of religion are undergoing change all the time and watching it evolve is fascinating.

 

[Aphro]

Remove religion from society.

This would be my pick, too.

Then where is their hope of something better?

When confronted by government and the brutality of man empowered, were there no God, someone would invent one out of necessity if only to render the illusion of hope, even if in the next life.
A_J, the Atheist

That's the problem...everyone is operating on the hope that there is "something better" coming along after our toes curl up and we get planted. What exactly, I am not sure...floating in the clouds with Jesus and St. Peter if you are Christian, or banging the 72 virgins if you are Muslim?

(I wonder, what do the Muslim women get...not virgins...maybe just freedom from the oppressive men?)

Maybe if we eliminate the hope of the "something better", people will start actually appreciating this world, and what we have in the here and now, and stop living their lives waiting to die in order to get to the "something better".

 

[Recidiva]

This would be my pick, too.

That's the problem...everyone is operating on the hope that there is "something better" coming along after our toes curl up and we get planted. What exactly, I am not sure...floating in the clouds with Jesus and St. Peter if you are Christian, or banging the 72 virgins if you are Muslim?

(I wonder, what do the Muslim women get...not virgins...maybe just freedom from the oppressive men?)

Maybe if we eliminate the hope of the "something better", people will start actually appreciating this world, and what we have in the here and now, and stop living their lives waiting to die in order to get to the "something better".

People pick on Christianity, but historically it caused a huge shift in human experience and culture in one extraordinarily positive direction.

Before Christianity's influence, infanticide was fairly common as was human sacrifice and blood rituals. The religions existed to serve the Gods only. Human beings were only chess pieces that the Gods used to play their games. The Gods were unreasonable and bloodthirsty and people did horrific things to please the Gods to fend off their wrath.

Christianity introduced the idea that a nebulous God could care about and judge you not just on what you did to honor Him, but could care about the way you treated other people. Thus the need for public service, public compassion and orphanages.

It was a phenomenal shift in perspective.

To toss it away as meaningless is short sighted historically.

 

[Aphro]

I think eliminating religion would be eliminating all of the work humanity has done throughout history on subjective questions.

There's a lot of good in religion, and a lot of bad, but that's the history of the human race.

The history of religion is showing how thoughts progressed from ignorance to...less ignorance.

The current constructs of religion are undergoing change all the time and watching it evolve is fascinating.

I agree that religion can be fascinating from a historical and sociological perspective, but I really cannot agree that religion is helping us progress from ignorance to less ignorance. If anything, I feel that religion helps perpetuate ignorance, keeping the masses in the dark ages.

There are a substantial number of Americans who deny evolution, and think that men and dinosaurs walked the earth side by side because the earth is at most maybe 6,000 years old. Because the Bible says so. In spite of all the scientific evidence that points otherwise. There's even a freaking creationist museum!

 

[Recidiva]

I agree that religion can be fascinating from a historical and sociological perspective, but I really cannot agree that religion is helping us progress from ignorance to less ignorance. If anything, I feel that religion helps perpetuate ignorance, keeping the masses in the dark ages.

There are a substantial number of Americans who deny evolution, and think that men and dinosaurs walked the earth side by side because the earth is at most maybe 6,000 years old. Because the Bible says so. In spite of all the scientific evidence that points otherwise. There's even a freaking creationist museum!

I think you're racking up negatives that are present today, but not giving credit where it's due for the good things that have come from it historically or in contemporary society.

There are also a substantial number of Americans who do think that slavery is bad, that you should love your neighbor and judge not.

 

[subdued_passion]

Yes, we do have a gun culture, and I grew up in a home with guns.

If you check the crime rates from nation to nation, though, I don't think it is morally better to die from stabbing undefended than it is to shoot an intruder with a gun to protect yourself.

I think the rest of the world is just thinking "Those silly Americans, let's not be like them. We're superior because we can be subdued by a steak knife and think it's the government's job to protect us. We can die after being stabbed to death knowing we made the right choice."

Speaking for myself, I don't think someone is silly for wanting to be properly equipped to protect themselves.

Having said that I will express my concern over legalizing it. It calls for a great deal of responsibility on the part of the user and a lot of resources dedicated to regulation.

Right now you have a limited section of society that is carrying guns (I am speaking about countries like India) and some of the bad guys are making or smuggling their guns in.

When gun ownership becomes legal and a right, suddenly all the bad guys are getting guns and all the ordinary folks need to go get guns since the baddies all have them now.

So, now everyone has guns and they all need to be responsible about how and when they use them.

The few gun owners that I've known have at some point shot off parts of their body or their property... these are the guys who cleared the strict laws and checks we currently have in place. I fear for what would happen if everyone has a gun.

 

[Recidiva]

Speaking for myself, I don't think someone is silly for wanting to be properly equipped to protect themselves.

Having said that I will express my concern over legalizing it. It calls for a great deal of responsibility on the part of the user and a lot of resources dedicated to regulation.

Right now you have a limited section of society that is carrying guns (I am speaking about countries like India) and some of the bad guys are making or smuggling their guns in.

When gun ownership becomes legal and a right suddenly all the bad guys are getting guns and all the ordinary folks need to go get guns since the baddies all have them now.

So, now everyone has guns and they all need to be responsible about how and when they use them.

The few gun owners that I've known have at some point shot off parts of their body or their property... these are the guys who cleared the strict laws and checks we currently have in place. I fear for what would happen if everyone has a gun.

We have car school, we have gun school. In America you are not forced to drive or carry a gun. If you wish to do so legally you go through education and testing and you are certified.

You know the outliers because you live in a society that criminalizes it. I live in a society where it's the grownup thing to do to know how to use a tool properly.

For me a gun is like a fire extinguisher. I hope I don't need to use it, but I should have one and I should know how, because crime happens like fire happens.

 

[Aphro]

People pick on Christianity, but historically it caused a huge shift in human experience and culture in one extraordinarily positive direction.

Before Christianity's influence, infanticide was fairly common as was human sacrifice and blood rituals. The religions existed to serve the Gods only. Human beings were only chess pieces that the Gods used to play their games. The Gods were unreasonable and bloodthirsty and people did horrific things to please the Gods to fend off their wrath.

Christianity introduced the idea that a nebulous God could care about and judge you not just on what you did to honor Him, but could care about the way you treated other people. Thus the need for public service, public compassion and orphanages.

It was a phenomenal shift in perspective.

To toss it away as meaningless is short sighted historically.

Christianity helped get rid of bloodthirsty rituals? Holy shit! Are you serious?

 

[subdued_passion]

Where a lot of us live, law enforcement response is measured by the half-day.

Plus there are bear, cougar, and other assorted small varmints that are just plain a nuisance if you do not keep their population under control...

*chuckle*

Wonder how many of the gang-raped women would have liked to have had a little sumptin'-sumptin' concealed and carried...

I can't imagine our women going around carrying a weapon. Sorry, I just can't. I'm considered to be some what of a badasss and as a kid I used to shoot pests (I'd rather not provide specifics) using my dad's rifle (the pellets variety). But I still remember the panic I felt when someone pulled a handgun in front of me.

The recent rape horror story you must've hear would've been the journalist I'm guessin. Her safety measure was to have a male colleague assist her. This is how most women here choose to defend themselves- no self-defense classes, or mace or anything- just make sure you have a guy with you.

 

[Recidiva]

Christianity helped get rid of bloodthirsty rituals? Holy shit! Are you serious?

History. It's really interesting.

Yes. I just listened to a huge podcast on infanticide and how Roman people would just leave their daughters out for exposure on a hillside because raising girls was an unpleasant prospect socially and economically.

Christianity was one of the main influences that created orphanages and dared to judge individuals for how the behaved toward the needy and the weak. That still carries through today and there's a large safety net in a charity sense for the underprivileged due to Christian principles.

 

[Aphro]

I think you're racking up negatives that are present today, but not giving credit where it's due for the good things that have come from it historically or in contemporary society.

There are also a substantial number of Americans who do think that slavery is bad, that you should love your neighbor and judge not.

Well, I should certainly hope that a "substantial number" of Americans think slavery is bad, and that we should love our neighbours...if not then the country is doomed.

The judge not I am not so sure about, if this forum is any indication.

I believe the Bible actually condones slavery.

I am not saying that there are not good people out there who do good work on behalf of religions. Of course there are. However, there are probably an equal number of horrible atrocities that have been committed in the name of God (whichever God you happen to believe in) as there has been good.

Why do we need religion to be good, and be kind and try to help our fellow man? Can we not be decent folks without the promise of heavenly reward? Can we not be kind because it is the right thing to do, not because God told us we must?

 

[Recidiva]

I can't imagine our women going around carrying a weapon. Sorry, I just can't. I'm considered to be some what of a badasss and as a kid I used to shoot pests (I'd rather not provide specifics) using my dad's rifle (the pellets variety). But I still remember the panic I felt when someone pulled a handgun in front of me.

The recent rape horror story you must've hear would've been the journalist I'm guessin. Her safety measure was to have a male colleague assist her. This is how most women here choose to defend themselves- no self-defense classes, or mace or anything- just make sure you have a guy with you.

I can understand this culturally and I appreciate the concern. I'm also aware that in societies where males are the chosen protectors, going it alone as a woman to make a point often draws more negative attention than just going along with the cultural norm.

My dad took me to self-defense classes and explained that I won't always have backup. I need to be responsible for myself and not expect that a man will come to my aid or that the law will always be there. It's also likely that a man with lesser abilities might need my back up and I should be prepared to even any odds and help people in danger and put myself in the line of fire.

I am perfectly capable of killing people with my mind, my hands, my feet or a gun. My go-to weapon would be to outsmart someone, if they get at gun range I would shoot them, and if they gave me a chance up close, I would break their toes and simultaneously shove their nose bits back into their brain.

I am aware that this attitude puts me at more risk for drawing fire. I'm okay with it.

 

[subdued_passion]

Remove religion from society.

I have mixed feelings on this one. On one hand it has been the cause of so many problems throughout history... on the other hand it is a great tool to control the masses.

And a great way of self-policing. I mean, most people are afraid to commit a crime because they fear some supernatural entity that will make them accountable for their actions in the afterlife.


Known fact.. primates are afraid of fire and humans of hell-fires.