What's wrong with the rich getting richer?

[WriterDom]

Ever gone to a poor man and ask him for a job?

Why is it that liberals always complain that all conservatives care about is money, yet their whole focus is about transferring wealth from those who earn it, to those who don't? There will always be a underclass. You could write every poor person a check for 50,000 tomorrow, and in a few years, the majority of them would be back in poverty.

 

[fanzee1]

Ever gone to a poor man and ask him for a job?

Why is it that liberals always complain that all conservatives care about is money, yet their whole focus is about transferring wealth from those who earn it, to those who don't? There will always be a underclass. You could write every poor person a check for 50,000 tomorrow, and in a few years, the majority of them would be back in poverty.

fine then, i say we test your theory and start writing those checks. If you're right, you have nothing to worry about.

 

[Guest]

few year haa they be blowed the hole wad in 3 week fuknut be bying jap car den lowr the shit to pimp der muthas outta cuz the blacks be crack bitches spend in monay on crack an pimp car

 

[fgarvb1]

well...like most people i'm not one of them!

NO, i could have been a rich man by now if that was all i cared for.
i would have had to work for it and exclude all else.

 

[Latinababe]

Nothing wrong with it...but I don't care if I am or not..

 

[Ishmael]

Ever gone to a poor man and ask him for a job?

Why is it that liberals always complain that all conservatives care about is money, yet their whole focus is about transferring wealth from those who earn it, to those who don't? There will always be a underclass. You could write every poor person a check for 50,000 tomorrow, and in a few years, the majority of them would be back in poverty.

Make it an even million and most would still be broke in a year.

The liberals like to yell about the rich, but they seem to neglect to point out that most of the 'rich' today are not the same rich of 10 or 20 years ago. The top 10% is dynamic and changes annually. As it should be in the land of opportunity.

And they never consider the consequences of the redistributionist policies that they love so dearly. Remember some years ago when congress laid a 10% punitive tax on large pleasure boats? "Let's stick it to the rich." Yep, the rich went offshore to buy their boats, the domestic industry went flat and the builders that didn't go out of business laid off most of the workers. The rich stayed rich, and smart, and the working man got the shaft. Not from the rich though, but from the redistribusionists in congress.

Ishmael

 

[riff]

Nothing wrong with the rich getting richer. And Biff did say that the poor will always be with us.

Fuck the poor. Let's put the fucking cash into Swiss bank accounts so that if the dream ends, we can haul ass to Seychelles.

You are being a moron.

 

[Kitte]

My only problem is with the poor getting poorer.

 

[Shy Tall Guy]

Re: Re: What's wrong with the rich getting richer?

fine then, i say we test your theory and start writing those checks. If you're right, you have nothing to worry about.

Too late - the government has been doing it for 4 decades and it has been proven to be just as WriterDom stated.

Besides, it doesn't matter one way or the other - even if every single person who was given money they didn't earn turned their life around and was a success, it doesn't change the facts that they didn't earn the money - they essentially stole it via force by voting in pols that would take money from the rich and give it to the poor.

Taxes are supposed to pay for costs you incur by being part of a society, not for wealth redistribution.

 

[bored1]

Nothing wrong with being rich. The rich provide jobs for many people by owning business, buying expensive items that need to be maintained etc. Arent professional athletes rich?

 

[Shy Tall Guy]

My only problem is with the poor getting poorer.

For the most part the poor do not get poorer. If you look at lifetsyle and income overall, most of the "poor" (especially in developed countries like the US) live better and have more income than they had in the past.

When you hear someone say "the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer" what they are referring to is a percieved increasing gap between the "poor" and the "rich". If the gap is truly there (and there is some debate about whether it is), then what it reflects is that the rich are increasing their income and lifestyle faster than the poor, but the poor are still increasing their income and bettering their lifetsyle.

Some people will argue that this isn't true and point to losses by the poor, but for the most part these are short term blips, and if you look over the decades and centuries, you will see that everyone's income and lifestyle has progressively increased for the better, and as a general trend this will continue.

Lest someone think I am just a rich guy who has no sympathy for the poor, let me riterate what I have said her on Lit. before. My family was itinerant farmers when we came to the Northwest. On the family farm I worked alongside my brothers, my father, my aunt, my uncles and my grandparents. We worked ourselves up from poverty and I knew how people in poverty lived because while we did well I had a lot of friends whose families were struggling.

Each generation earned their own way with a little help from the previous generation, but no one got a "silver spoon". The first 12 years of my adult life I pratty much averaged income under the official poverty level, and I supported a family, went to college and got two degrees on that income. After college it was a struggle for a while, but I gradually did better with some bumps in the road. Now, I find myself unemployed again with an uncertain future.

 

[Cheyenne]

Nothing wrong with the rich getting richer. And Biff did say that the poor will always be with us.

Fuck the poor. Let's put the fucking cash into Swiss bank accounts so that if the dream ends, we can haul ass to Seychelles.

You are being a moron.

I didn't hear him say "fuck the poor." The rich can get richer while helping others at the same time. It isn't mutually exclusive.

 

[LovetoGiveRoses]

Ever gone to a poor man and ask him for a job?

Why is it that liberals always complain that all conservatives care about is money, yet their whole focus is about transferring wealth from those who earn it, to those who don't? There will always be a underclass. You could write every poor person a check for 50,000 tomorrow, and in a few years, the majority of them would be back in poverty.

First, I think that those who earn the money ought be be entitled to it and that our goal should not be to 'redistribute' resources/capital so that everyone "can have some" whether they earn it or not.

The rest of my argument is going to sound liberal though, I hope, a bit logical nonetheless.

Everyone should have a clear opportunity to "have some" based on hard work, innovation, education or other ethical means. I'm advocating equality of "opportunity" and not "results". If you work hard and you want to "gather" wealth, you (everyone) ought to have that opportunity. But people shouldn't be "given" wealth by government fiat (orders).

At the same time the people who choose to work for others need to be able to earn enough to live comfortably. If you have a situation where "you haul 16 tons (of coal) and what to you get? Another day older and deeper in debt" you create a situation where there's instability, likely militancy and danger.

We shouldn't "legislate" a "living" wage, but we should ensure that our "society" and economic infrastructure are such that we are constantly "automating" away low-skilled jobs and creating new jobs that require skills that a machine can't do, thereby creating a situation where "labor" is of sufficient "value" to be able to "offer" a wage high enough for the "laborer" to live comfortably. Another important factor (mentioned above) is that people are constantly shifting employment and "income"....some people start off at a car wash and end up owning the company. They're in "low income" to start with and end up on the upper end of income later.

The current environment of "globalization" makes this more difficult, but still achievable. Education is one of the most significant differentiators as far as earning potential (and for people providing "value" to society" so it's very important that we continue to invest lots of money in education. We need to spend the money so that education improves and the next generations become smarter too. (Not spend money with no effective results as has happened before).

We need to continue to "build" national wealth. What is 'national wealth"...it is the total wealth of the country, including that owned by individuals. The question is how is our "wealth" distributed and by what criteria or structure is this accompished.

The only way to continue to "build" national wealth is to allow the concentration of resources such that decisions can be made on research and development and capital infrastructure investment to allow the continual elimination of low-skilled jobs and creation of skills based jobs. Not all "low-skilled" jobs can be eliminated, but if we can create more "national wealth" then we'll be able to "value" the low skilled jobs remaining with higher wages.

Tax and income redistribution is the antithesis of wealth creation. It is a short term approach to buying votes and destroys wealth (and capital) individually and "nationally" because it is not being used for innovation or investment (for creating a better tomorrow).

Some taxation is needed for national defense, foreign relations and education (and some transportation - we need roads, train tracks and airports). Education is particularly important because we owe everyone a good start. Solid education and acheivement by our entire populace will continue to feed the innovation that we need to continue to "build" national wealth.

I'm not a libertairan like you Dom, but I'm not too far away either. I believe in the constitution and not in the 'constructionalist" version advocated by the social tinkerer.

"And that's all I have to say about that" - Forrest Gump.

 

[miles]

I can't wait for the usual bash the rich posters to come out of the woodwork on this one.

It's the old "they have more than me, so they must have done something bad to get it" bullshit. There are always people who get their wealth by inheritance. But the overwhelming majority accumulated their wealth by being smarter, better educated, having more drive, and above all, working their asses off. These evil doers own businesses which employ people who pay taxes and provide for their families. Isn't that what America is all about? That if you have the drive, talent, and skill, you will succeed?

The fact is that many people lack the drive, talent, and skill necesssary to get what they want. It has nothing to do with race or gender. There are plenty of examples of people who grew up dirt poor becoming highly successful.

Unfortunately the government made up of spineless Rebublicrats is well on its way to widening the gap and perepetuating class warfare. Consider this: 96% of all taxes are collected from the top 50% of wage earners! Someone has to be blind to deny that the burden of taxation is being shifted to a minority of taxpayers.That is a cold fact. Very soon the majority of Ameicans won't be paying taxes.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure this one out. It's a big ass vote buying scam. And it works.

 

[riff]

I didn't hear him say "fuck the poor." The rich can get richer while helping others at the same time. It isn't mutually exclusive.

My dad is rich. And he bitches about the liberals all the time.

But he votes democrat.

And he is a white, southern male.

In spite of all his faults- I love my dad. I sense a man with a heart of solid GOLD- confused- as I am- just trying to find his way.

You make me want to cry.

I have friends who are worth millions. Literally. Really. For some of them, wealth is a problem. For some of them it is not.

Do I make myself clear?

 

[sexy-girl]

Re: Re: What's wrong with the rich getting richer?

Make it an even million and most would still be broke in a year.

i think thats a very naive and mean thing to say


there is something wrong with the rich getting richer when the poor are getting poorer as a result because of the way society is one sided in favour of the rich

 

[miles]

Re: Re: Re: What's wrong with the rich getting richer?

there is something wrong with the rich getting richer when the poor are getting poorer as a result because of the way society is one sided in favour of the rich

Such as?

 

[miles]

My dad is rich. And he bitches about the liberals all the time.

But he votes democrat.

And he is a white, southern male.

In spite of all his faults- I love my dad. I sense a man with a heart of solid GOLD- confused- as I am- just trying to find his way.

You make me want to cry.

I have friends who are worth millions. Literally. Really. For some of them, wealth is a problem. For some of them it is not.

Do I make myself clear?

My answer is no, you didn't make yourself clear.

 

[Guest]

I'm not rich...I worked an average of 60 hours a week last year. I work my ass off and I resent like hell someone taking so much of my money when 50% of the wage earners aren't paying a cent of taxes. I'm taxed at 45-50% (Fed, state and real estate/local) and so many people don't pay taxes at all.

I don't mind paying into education, defense, national security, etc. But I hate paying money to pet congressional projects that serve no value to anyone except buying votes for that congressman. Some of these projects are research into breeding habits of frogs, unneeded road, and unneeded or illogical train systems. Each congressman has a bunch of these projects to create jobs in their home districts and to get votes.

I don't mind paying money for R&D, investment, etc. education was mentioned above. But I hate paying for "free" no-value handouts.

I'd like to see a few more people paying taxes.

 

[riff]

miles.

Then you don't understand me.

And I do not feel up to explaining myself.

My apologies.

(now- go eat some salmon)

I am havind smoked chicken and smoked rainbow trout today.

And I am POOR in America. It's cool. My dad will die. And before he dies, I'll have a brain-damaged older brother who I used to hate (love him now) that I will have to assume guardianship over.

God bless the dead.

 

[miles]

This is the only way to make taxation fair. It will never happen, because it takes power away from politicians and the government.

How fucked up is that? We can't have it because it works.

http://www.fairtax.org/

 

[Guest]

P. S. I'm working so hard to save money for my kids to go to college and to put away some for retirement.

Maybe I'll quit working, enjoy life and then the kids can qualify for scholarships.

 

[Ishmael]

Re: Re: Re: What's wrong with the rich getting richer?

i think thats a very naive and mean thing to say


there is something wrong with the rich getting richer when the poor are getting poorer as a result because of the way society is one sided in favour of the rich

Is it?

It's been proven time and time again with the lottery winners. The poor lottery winners tend to loose most of the money in the first year. Bad choices and investments usually.

When income tax was first instituted some ideas were floated at the time about redistribution. Communism was new and gaining many followers at the time. John D. Rockefeller is credited with saying, "You can take all the money in the world, put it in one pile and divide it equally among the many. In one year I will have all my money back and most of the poor will be poor again." I've seen nothing to prove him wrong yet.

Ishmael


Ishmael

 

[riff]

P. S. I'm working so hard to save money for my kids to go to college and to put away some for retirement.

Maybe I'll quit working, enjoy life and then the kids can qualify for scholarships.

Not a bad idea. But maybe somewhere you can find a middle-ground?

Do what you can. College is great, but not for everyone. This is why I love education.

 

[riff]

This is the only way to make taxation fair. It will never happen, because it takes power away from politicians and the government.

How fucked up is that? We can't have it because it works.

http://www.fairtax.org/

Life is not fair. People can be.