What makes a good cowriter?

[shizzz]

In my opinion I have found that a visual writer is key in a written word based role play, someone who lets you see how they envision what's going on

Second I've learned that a good role player doesn't write their role, they write the role that their cowriter wants.

Those are two things that make a cowriter great in my opinion. What are the thoughts of my fellow Lit lovers?

 

[IvoryTigress]

I kind of have to agree with Vail on this one. As a co-writer, I will gladly work to create a story and a world with a person before the story starts. That way the rules and everything are planned out and the general direction the story can follow is established. So...basically a very good setting and a basic plot line. But I feel that a good co-writer won't change or alter their character just to suit a certain pathway in the story. I actually enjoy when my co-writer goes in a different place than I imagined. It keeps me guessing and forces me to expand my thought process.

 

[Firmhanded_Daddy]

I have to disagree with you here.
A good role-player writes their role. If it happens to be a role that matches well against the one I'm writing, then great.
But for me to say "Hey, you wanna write with me, here's the role you have to take" is really me saying "Hey, I'm kinda too lazy to write a story, so why don't you do half of it for me".
Working out before hand what each of you is looking for should bring out whether or not you are a good match. But being a good role-player does not mean subsuming your will to my own.
(I find that, when I can't allow my partner to write their stuff, I'm working on a bad SRP idea that should really be something I write on my own, or with someone else...but this is not a reflection on my partner's ability)

I'm scared, I don't really know what to do with this...

Whispers

I agree with Vail completely.

Hides like a scarededed bunneh

Ahem

In all seriousness...

If you wanted a certain role done a certain way, write it yourself. Forcing someone to write something just because you want it that way (Unless agreed upon before hand) is a great way to kill a story. Few things piss me off quicker than when someone decides to try and write my part for me. That might be the Dominant in me... or the part that just really has issues with authority, or my stubborn streak, or... well you get the idea.

When I put a story together I keep a certain person in mind for the part usually, and I remember that writing an RP is not the same thing as writing a solo story. The moment you bring in a second set of eyes, a second well of inspiration you no longer have sole creative licence. The story is a living, breathing thing, let it be what it is, and if there is something that you are really wanting to see happen then communicate with your co-author. They are exactly that after all, co-creator of an idea. Telling them what they have to play is as good as trying to pick up a woman by telling them "If I want your opinion I will give it to you"

If you are going to try that line let me know first, I want to set up video cameras.

 

[Faux_Pas]

There's a difference in having a storyline you hope to follow to, certain events you're looking for, and actually scripting out the complete thread: here's what I want you to do, how you should do it, and the way I'd like you to talk- but the character is all yours.


I dont mind following along with a storyplan.
But if my cowriter scripts everything for me, implies my char's every move so I have to do it to make things make sense, I'll drop the thread very quickly.

 

[Miss_Vivi]

Second I've learned that a good role player doesn't write their role, they write the role that their cowriter wants.

Alright.. so here we go, I'm gonna go ahead and get lost in wandering and meandering through the words in this sentence, because I can, and really language means so very much to me.

I keep getting stuck on "wants" in this statement. It's that word that means the most to me.

"What my co-writer wants"

He's right.
Strictly speaking, of course.

I'm not writing the character determined by my co-writer but I am giving them what/whom they want.

Perhaps I am alone in this, but I do tailor certain proclivities of my characters towards my co-writers precisely because it makes that character more wanted, more real to them when they read her (Or him). To be sure, I do react and make that character real for me, and inhabit them when I write them, but to admit that I don't give over to certain wants of those who write with me would be a lie.

Shizz, may have been wrong in his wording. A more apt version would be;

Second, I've learned that a good role player doesn't write their character for just themselves, they inhabit the character that their co-writer desires.

That is truth.

 

[Faux_Pas]

This is only as true as the desires that have been agreed upon.
My point is that theres a dialectic in play. It isn't Person A writing for what Person B wants. Its Person A and Person B coming to an agreement on what they want together, and then playing off each other.
I actually think this sort of thing is a complex dynamic.
A better metaphor is improv theater.

YES
that is exactly how I see writing.
The first rule is never negate an established. Only build.
So if my cowriter establishes something, as much as that "thing" may veer from my vision, I'm now stuck with it.

You need to understand the ideas the other half has first.
No negating.

 

[Annisthyrienne]

When I write for my character, I get into their mind-space. It's kind of hard to do that if someone else is already in there.

Having said that, if what you mean is that you want a co-writer to follow a certain story idea for which their character is integral, then I can see your point. If you're writing the Red Riding Hood story, for example, it's rather expected that the big bad wolf plays opposite of Red. Now as to the individual interpretations of Wolf and Red, that is up to the person playing them.

Another example I suppose: if your role play idea was to be set in a Victorian family, it would not do for the co-writer to come up with a goth-emo wannabee. It doesn't fit the story idea. In that sense I can see what you meant, if indeed you meant it that way.

 

[Veroe]

The difference between writing solo and writing an SRP is the cooperative element.

The minute your cowriter writes her first post its no longer your idea solely, its no longer your direction, its no longer your gameplan. Oh the two of you can follow a general outline, but the moment your cowriter starts writing on it she'll add a nuance all her own to your story idea that you'd never think of writing it solo.

I'm not saying she can't fulfill what you had in mind for the character or the storyline, all I'm saying is that she may do that while doing her own thing.

That's the difference SRP's the good ones, are symbiotic in nature.

 

[shizzz]

Writing with clarity and conciseness in a scholastic sense is on ongoing problem of mine. And I do think that I was not clear in what I meant about them writing their character the way that I want. The thing about fantasy writing is that your character is meant to fulfill the other writers fantasy. Determining and correctly interpreting what they want is the hardest part, of course, while maintaining your own ideas of who your character is.

So many threads due because that need is not met. One writer is far off from writing the way their cowriter wants them to be, and suddenly they are turned off and the thread no longer appeals to them.

That's what I meant by writing your character the way your co writer wants, and of course you can't help but write your character the way you want. That's the tough balance to find. That's what makes a great cowriter, and story, when that common goal is met for both sides

Maybe that's more clear and maybe it's not

Does that mean you all agree about the need of visual descriptiveness? A well painted picture makes for some of the best posts, closely seconded by a post that delves into the emotional and mental motivation that drives the action

 

[Annisthyrienne]

Writing with clarity and conciseness in a scholastic sense is on ongoing problem of mine. And I do think that I was not clear in what I meant about them writing their character the way that I want. The thing about fantasy writing is that your character is meant to fulfill the other writers fantasy. Determining and correctly interpreting what they want is the hardest part, of course, while maintaining your own ideas of who your character is.

So many threads due because that need is not met. One writer is far off from writing the way their cowriter wants them to be, and suddenly they are turned off and the thread no longer appeals to them.

That's what I meant by writing your character the way your co writer wants, and of course you can't help but write your character the way you want. That's the tough balance to find. That's what makes a great cowriter, and story, when that common goal is met for both sides

Maybe that's more clear and maybe it's not

Does that mean you all agree about the need of visual descriptiveness? A well painted picture makes for some of the best posts, closely seconded by a post that delves into the emotional and mental motivation that drives the action

I guess that means I'm always going to be second best. I prefer to explore the emotional content. To me, that is where the enjoyment is. And I confess that I've been told I should include more physical description of my characters. I guess this comes from my real life practice of looking for the personality and not the appearance. Of all the things that make up a person, appearance is the most temporary and trivial. No one's looks will be constant even from one day to the next, sometimes even from one hour to the next.

To address your clarification, I'd like to submit a story situation I had that illustrates that the opposite can also be true. Trying to write what your partner wants can be a turn off and kill the story. In one of my stories, my partner asked me to also write the part of his character's mother, with whom he wanted to have a threesome. (His character, mine, and his mother.) I agreed, thinking much the way you do that I should try to please my partner.

It was one of the least enjoyable experiences I've ever had here on Lit. I could probably have just sucked it up to write the incest scene if that's all it was, but it just got really sick and exaggerated beyond the bounds of the most outlandish fantasy. Shortly after that, my partner was taken by real life concerns for a while, but when he returned he asked me to continue the thread. My desire for it was killed by that scene, so I told him I was not interested. The thing is, the basic story premise was a good one, and I'd still like to do the story, just without the mother orgy scene. Ick!

 

[DarkWarrioress]

Can you even write without a visual? I know I can't. I can describe an emotion without a visual, but a picture always forms or a small video rolls through my head as I read what my co-author writes. I guess that's how I relate to my forming character.

As for writing what my co-writer wants. That depends. If it's my thread idea, I go over with my co-writer what I am generally looking for or if I have no expectations, then together, we'll build things. Characteristics in a persona I want, well, I just quietly hope they hit the mark with that one. In general they do. They get the gist of it just through discussion of the story plot. Sometimes they don't but that's okay too. I can usually shift my perception of the character opposite of mine.

Sometimes, I just get these snippets of scenes I see and just know I want to weave a story around them. In that sense, yes, a co-writer should be accommodating. After all, it's their idea. They're looking for something and hoping you can provide it. However, my expectations end there. I expect them to take their character and make it their own.

I am also open to world building ideas. I'm not usually that good at it but I can fall in with something if my co-writer is making sense and that depends on the genre we're writing in too. I like little twists and turns. Writing with someone opens up a thread idea to so many more possibilities than I could possibly see but always keeping in mind what the originator is basically looking for. So, in that aspect, yes, I will write what they want.

 

[Veroe]

Writing with clarity and conciseness in a scholastic sense is on ongoing problem of mine. And I do think that I was not clear in what I meant about them writing their character the way that I want. The thing about fantasy writing is that your character is meant to fulfill the other writers fantasy. Determining and correctly interpreting what they want is the hardest part, of course, while maintaining your own ideas of who your character is.

So many threads due because that need is not met. One writer is far off from writing the way their cowriter wants them to be, and suddenly they are turned off and the thread no longer appeals to them.

That's what I meant by writing your character the way your co writer wants, and of course you can't help but write your character the way you want. That's the tough balance to find. That's what makes a great cowriter, and story, when that common goal is met for both sides

Maybe that's more clear and maybe it's not

Does that mean you all agree about the need of visual descriptiveness? A well painted picture makes for some of the best posts, closely seconded by a post that delves into the emotional and mental motivation that drives the action

It was clear, Shizz.

That's where the communication bettween you comes to play. I've written with people who hadn't needed any feedback before or after posts, the others we were looking for something specific and we constantly were passing PMs between us.

I think the Communication behind the scenes can be a crucial element, to a SRP.

As for visual descriptiveness, in your sex scenes its very important, in character or story its not so much-I'd say it depends on the style of your cowriter. I sometimes think I should ask my cowriter to describe my characters for me. That way she can tailor what he looks like to their individual tastes of what they find physically attractive in a man. And of course to be fair I'd do the same with their character. How ever there's an risk of getting stuck playing the type of person you don't actually get or like based on what they described to look like. It could skew our performances. So I've never actually done it.

I've heard guys are more visually oriented when it comes to things they find arousing while girls tend to be more conceptual. I don't know if that's true for all guys. But I'd ask all the female writers who write with guys to accomadate that need for visual details as much as they feel the need to, in case it is.

And likewise all the guys who write with girls to remember to emphasize the conceptua elements in their posts, in case if it is true.

Writing is more conceptual already, so I'd say to both try and be as descriptive as all