what is the greatest threat to christianty toda.Is it the muslim or the enemy within?

[MechaBlade]

Religion is the base for ALL war

Not necessarily true anymore. It's often a money/power thing.

 

[someplace]

Fork in the road

This was a very interesting thread to read and I enjoyed the varied comments.

What struck me from the beginning, and which no one picked up on, was that the threadstarter is in the UK, which has a state religion. Most of the discussion over the previous 9 pages was by those in the US, which has an opposite attitude about government sanctioned/sponsored religion.

Perhaps it is the subject for another thread, but I wonder how much of the blanket premise "Christianity is obviously doomed" was developed through the cultural progression of growing up and living under a state-enforced religion?

 

[Oscuridad]

We'll by those standards than Satan himself is a christian!

Of course he is.

Satan loves god, therefore hell sucks because he is removed from god.

He romanced his "son" in the desert

Basics of the story.

 

[Oscuridad]

He told us not to kill. He can do whatever He pleases and I'm not gonna argue with Him about it.

So when he instructs the faithful to kill unbelievers, how does that fit in?

 

[Oscuridad]

What about when he told Abraham to kill Isaac?

Oh yes, and that.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Actually the idea that Christianity is doomed is probably based not so much on a state based religion as the fact that Europe as a whole are a very secular people. I hate complimenting another nation over our own, but I wish America would catch on to that cus Europe is ages ahead of us in that aspect.

Besides I don't have anything against Europe, the Europeans I've met were all kinda cool. Its just the ones on this board that seem to have a hardon for the destruction of America.

 

[Sean]

This was a very interesting thread to read and I enjoyed the varied comments.

What struck me from the beginning, and which no one picked up on, was that the threadstarter is in the UK, which has a state religion. Most of the discussion over the previous 9 pages was by those in the US, which has an opposite attitude about government sanctioned/sponsored religion.

Perhaps it is the subject for another thread, but I wonder how much of the blanket premise "Christianity is obviously doomed" was developed through the cultural progression of growing up and living under a state-enforced religion?

The CofE is a state religion in name only. And enforced is far too strong a word.

 

[Lavared]

Oh yes, and that.

Per Genesis, God told Abraham to kill Isaac knowing full well that he (God) wasn't going to let him go through with it. It was purely a test of Abraham's faith and commitment to God.

Why the supreme being, creator of the universe, wouldn't simply look into Abraham's heart and know how strong his faith was is beyond my ken. Perhaps the act was not for God but was for Abraham so that he (Abraham) would understand the depth of his own faith.

 

[Sean]

About the only thing I agree with Josef Stalin on is religion.

 

[someplace]

The CofE is a state religion in name only. And enforced is far too strong a word.

Correct me if I have misinformation, but don't schools in England teach religion as a regular part of their curriculum? That is very different from in the States, and most Americans on this forum would go ballistic if this country had an official religion that was taught in all schools to all students. Our president is not also the head of a particular state-ordained and sponsored religion.

There is a difference in outlook between the two cultures on this subject. It is much more about choice in the States. With the exception of a few converted Catholics and evangelicals, most of the Brits I've known or met are as apathetic toward religion as they are toward government.

My point was that this apathy played into the initial statement of this thread. That's all.

 

[someplace]

Per Genesis, God told Abraham to kill Isaac knowing full well that he (God) wasn't going to let him go through with it. It was purely a test of Abraham's faith and commitment to God.

Why the supreme being, creator of the universe, wouldn't simply look into Abraham's heart and know how strong his faith was is beyond my ken. Perhaps the act was not for God but was for Abraham so that he (Abraham) would understand the depth of his own faith.

And to serve as an example for thousands of generations to come.

 

[Sean]

Correct me if I have misinformation, but don't schools in England teach religion as a regular part of their curriculum? That is very different from in the States, and most Americans on this forum would go ballistic if this country had an official religion that was taught in all schools to all students. Our president is not also the head of a particular state-ordained and sponsored religion.

There is a difference in outlook between the two cultures on this subject. It is much more about choice in the States. With the exception of a few converted Catholics and evangelicals, most of the Brits I've known or met are as apathetic toward religion as they are toward government.

My point was that this apathy played into the initial statement of this thread. That's all.

Yes, schools in the Uk teach religion as part of the curriculum. Comparative religion. Even in my Catholic high school, we learned about Islam, Judaism, Hinduism and others.
And Britain is probably the most secular nation on the planet.

 

[Oscuridad]

The New Living Translation. ALL OTHER VERSIONS ARE HERESY!!

Well you seem to have put your finger on one of the central problems, yes.

 

[Oscuridad]

The Holy Bible.

I know there are different versions such as king james, new international, the living Bible, the New king james version.......but the core meaning throughout these Bibles are the same.

Do you have a map of the core similarities?

Because that's not what I heard.

 

[crzydesert]

Do you have a map of the core similarities?

Because that's not what I heard.

What have you heard?

 

[Oscuridad]

the best version is either Greek ( New Testament ) or Hebrew for the Old Testament. Then you can translate it out of the original language for better accuracy.

That is more then most people are capable of, so I would suggest a combination of a few translations. That way you can tell through the similarities in the translations what is often the best translation.

But how many do even that?

How many more think that thier version is the perfected version?

 

[Oscuridad]

Yes, but Abraham had to be prepared to kill. My point is that God says not to kill, but there are exceptions. He says "Thou shall not kill" but it's not exactly set in stone (rimshot).

I also find it distressing that you disagree with some of the rules, but you still believe in them. I'm not sure if that's better or worse than people who pick and choose what they like out of the Bible. I can only hope you haven't stoned any blasphemers yet.


How do you disprove polytheism? I'm curious.

If he did did indeed disprove polytheism, he was just one god shy of disproving monotheism.

Amusing, no?

 

[Oscuridad]

And stoning blasphemers? Is that just Punishment? When is not okay to kill?


I feel the same way about monotheism, but I asked because I think it's impossible to disprove polytheism.

Or anything that exists specifically and explicitly outside of the rules of evidence.

 

[semen4her]

I am the greatest threat.

 

[Oscuridad]

I believe the Bible is for corporal punishment.
Was there any stoning of blasphemers in the New Testament? I don't think there where but I could be wrong. Things changed after Jesus died on the cross.

Then why not throw out the old testament?

It changed things, yes?

 

[Oscuridad]

False assumption, especially from the Roman/Greek theology point of view.


False assumption. Even the Judeo-Christian god gets angry sometimes.



It's leviticus something or another.

Most of the horror show is in Leviticus.

The specific passage is something to the effect of not suffering heretics to live. Their crime being (oviously and explicitly stated) as worse than murder, as KRC said.

 

[Oscuridad]

That's Leviticus which is old, old, old testament.
I thought we were talking about Christians who follow the teachings of Jesus who said not to go around killing people.

Some christians say we have to take the bible as a whole.

And then get uncomfortable when you take them at their word.

 

[Oscuridad]

This was a very interesting thread to read and I enjoyed the varied comments.

What struck me from the beginning, and which no one picked up on, was that the threadstarter is in the UK, which has a state religion. Most of the discussion over the previous 9 pages was by those in the US, which has an opposite attitude about government sanctioned/sponsored religion.

Perhaps it is the subject for another thread, but I wonder how much of the blanket premise "Christianity is obviously doomed" was developed through the cultural progression of growing up and living under a state-enforced religion?

It's also interesting to note that even with a state religion Britian's population enjoys much greater religious diversity than the U.S.
Much of the population not even self-identifying as christians anymore, as it's no longer a requisite for social acceptance (your situation may vary) as it still is here (U.S.).

 

[Oscuridad]

Per Genesis, God told Abraham to kill Isaac knowing full well that he (God) wasn't going to let him go through with it. It was purely a test of Abraham's faith and commitment to God.

Why the supreme being, creator of the universe, wouldn't simply look into Abraham's heart and know how strong his faith was is beyond my ken. Perhaps the act was not for God but was for Abraham so that he (Abraham) would understand the depth of his own faith.

It's not the act of an omniscient god.

An omnipotent god would know what would happen without having to test it.

So if god is omnipotent, he's also a real bastard.

 

[Oscuridad]

And to serve as an example for thousands of generations to come.

To put their beliefs before their children's lives if god says so?

Well I think it's inspired a few interesting cases over time.

Remember, as the faithful you cannot assume your god is kidding.
And if you do, are you truly faithful to the god who so tests you?