What is Polyamory by DarkGoddess2478

[darkgoddess2478]

I have gotten a LOT of feedback about my essay I have written entitled "What is Polyamory?" I thought I would post responses to the feedback I have gotten AND allow others to post comments as well.

Here is a link to the essay in question: What is Polyamory by DarkGoddess2478

 

[darkgoddess2478]

response to anonymous in CA

a great essay though a bit one sided
02/13/05 By: Anonymous in CA, USA
i di enjoy this essay quite a bit, though i felt it seemed to revolve around a male centered relationship. I am in a poly marriage with my primary, my husband, and have a scondary relationship with my lover whom i have been with for three years... my husband has been with his lover for approximately the same time, by coincidence only, i asssure you LOL... i think it would be great if you could write an essay exploring the mutiple facets of polyamory and not just on the traditional sense of polygamy. and interesting reference to cite would be the yanamamo tribe of south america which practices an extreme form of polygamy

I will definately research into the yanamamo trible. I really need to buff up a bit on my history and so forth. I really would like to do an essay more on polyamory in the sense that it is today and not as it was in infancy for polygamy/polygyny.

 

[darkgoddess2478]

Regarding Polyamory.
02/13/05 By: Anonymous in California
My question is about how you explain that Polygamy is unfair in Africa where it is practiced? Clearly if you assume that then you do not know how it is practiced there. Men only take on extra wives to support their herd of cattle, Multiple marriages mainly serve the purpose of support, the whole reason they've existed for so long is because in different places at one time or another having more then one wife or husband is advantageous for the surroundings. I'm sorry that Christians have a problem with it, but Polyamory can take a number behind everything else Christianity doesn't like. When it helps a group of people then thats why it is done. In Africa where the Cattlemen practice it, They will take another wife and put her in charge of a number of Cattle, because they cannot support them with just 1 wife. In fact, if she does well enough with her herd, She may even be allowed to take a wife of her own, with her own charge of cattle and they are Hers and only Hers, well theirs(the wife and her wife). The practice of extra wives is completely non-sexual in all instances. The man has no access to the wife of his wife. The wife can even take multiple wives. It only is rational to have more then one spouse when having more then one can guarantee more resources then having only one would. This is either from a lack of them, or high competition for resources. Its rarely approached from an emotional or sexual standpoint, That is what complicates polygamy in other instances. Yes many writers can talk about the subject and explain about love and jealousy, but honestly in situations where its absolutely necessary to have more then one spouse, things like jealousy don't get in the way, because if one doesn't follow the plan then it could make life harder for everyone. Or even cost them their lives.

And thats all I have to say about that.

*nods* That is why this essay was slanted more towards polyamory than polygamy. The polyamory movement in the US has roots in the polygamy of other humans around the world.

I do not remember saying anything about polygamy being wrong, only that many religions see it as being wrong. I am not of their culture, I am not of their people, and I am not of the Christian religion, so I can't point a finger and say that any way is any more right than any other, nor would I ever want to do that.

I know that in a lot of tribes polygamy and polygyny is completely essential to their lives and the wellbeing of the tribes. Without it, the tribes would most likely die out.

 

[darkgoddess2478]

Rationalization of Wants not Needs
02/13/05 By: Anonymous in USA
Interesting article of segments of justifications and some related problems (or perhaps similar to the addage figures never lie but liers can sure figure). It doesn't seem to mention any statistical success or failure rates for those involved or the emotional fallout for children raised in such circumstance of free love, non-defined responsibility and non-commitment in the long term. In a sense, one reasonably expects the inventor to sell the benefits of his or her baby.

If history is an indicator of likely future success then this movement is surely doomed to failure as cited by the author herself.

One understands the interest, as it is a way to address the increasing pressures of stress upon the marital unit and its players. Never before has a female been so finitely required to directly and seperately participate in the responsibility of material shared ownership. This is on top of the responsibilities of loving motherhood and wife. Not understood by many are the additional responsibilities of home management, which are not always fairly shared by the male partner. The material earning stresses felt singularly by the male partner previously are now felt by the female. The burden of all these stresses can cause each partner to seek distractional relief in someone else's emotions. Being now consistantly exterior to the family unit enlarges the working female's exposure to the same temptations caused by constant framiliarity that the male partner has always had to deal with, but now his situation is further compounded by more females in his previously mostly male space. So, the game is on and clearly more complex for each to remain committed to each other and the family unit. Within the new more complex total needs of the new family unit, a weak partner is now more than ever a liability within that marital unit as the emotional and material needs have a lesser margin of error for success as measured today. Is it any real wonder, that the new marital equals find more ligitimit spousal faults that need mending or compromise. Now more than ever the marital unit is or should be known basically as a business element that can fail materialy or emotionally failing care and constant communication.

So the weak and uneducated, as in business, will fall aside or look for the greener pastures which don't really exist in the longterm. This purgatory or holding space you speak of may placate temporarily while learning about life's real consequences and preparing for the longterm. The non-caring weak will float in it forever, wondering why others shun them, the flotsom of life. The weak will justify and fault but never join life as it can be with hard work, knowledge and compromise.

Marriage is clearly not for everyone. One must want to be committed to and for each other through the good and bad times - and to share each with resolution fairly. To fail, repair and resurrect respect. These are the good consequences of mutual honor, trust and respect within the agreed upon responsibilities of the marital contract. Children raised in this environment can see these conditions and are comforted and shaped by them clearly or in the abstract subconsiously.

Enough. I honor your right to advance a thought and to languise in it temporarily while you grow, but feel sad that you feel it's the longterm answer to the compexities of a fullfilling life. (sorry for any spelling errors) Regards.

In a true Poly relationship, all partners are committed to one another. I am married to my husband. He and I put the wellbeing of our child on the top of our priority list. We are completely devoted to one another, regardless of the relationships that he and I might persue outside of our own life together. I do not see how this translates as a non-commitment issue.

One of the most important factors in ANY relationship, monogamous or polyamorous, is communication. One has to be able to talk to their spouse, reason out their problems, difficulties, etc etc without fear of being judged or emotionally and/or verbally abused. This is a difficult thing in any relationship. This communication becomes even more important in a poly relationship with the other people being a complete whole. Those who participate in poly relationships have to be a strong sort of relationship and persons to make it work. Just as many many marriages fail due to incompatabilities, so, too, do dating relationships and poly relationships. All relationships are doomed to failure if you do not have complete and honest communication AND those people have to be compatable individuals. You wouldn't marry someone you couldn't stand... Just as you would not stay in a relationship with them if they were not compatable. Yes, many poly relationships fail... But so, too, do other relationships. It is human nature.

I do have to say that I agree very very much when you said: Marriage is clearly not for everyone. One must want to be committed to and for each other through the good and bad times - and to share each with resolution fairly. To fail, repair and resurrect respect. You hit the nail on the head. Marriage is not for everyone. Monogamous marriage is also not for everyone. You must be completely committed to those that you love and respect. Marriage cannot survive without love, communication and committment. You and your partner must make the decisions together and you must respect each other's wishes. It is a difficult road... but it is well worth it in the end.

Don't feel sad for me. Believe me, my life is very fulfilling. I love my son, my husband, and my lover very much. My husband loves our son and me very very much. If it would have been a viable option for Jane, we would be with her as well. If the poly lifestyle would have been more accepted, I am positive that Jane would be living with us today. We are still close and keep in contact and she still behaves like a second mother to our son. However I do understand that not all of us are meant to live this life.

Thank you for the feedback and expressing your opinion so eloquently. I do appreciate it.

 

[darkgoddess2478]

some seem to confuse polyamory with polygamy
02/12/05 By: Anonymous in usa
to review what some seem to be confusing:

polygamy - one man, multiple women. common in middle east, africa, bits of asia (and anywhere a guy is filthy rich).

polyandry - one woman, multiple men. more common in tough enviornemnts - tundras, deserts, mountains where men have to leave for long periods to forage with high mortality rates.

both are illegal in most western societies, unless it is serial because of divorce. you can have multiple partners in legal commitments, just not at once.

poly amory - many love. this would INCLUDE polygamy, AND polyandry, as well as various types of group marriages combining more than one man with more than one women.

just so you know which is which.

*nods* very well put. Thank you.

 

[darkgoddess2478]

What about the husbands?
02/12/05 By: AP
I very much agree with the emphasis of being faithful over being monogamous. The half of AP writing this is the male half, who due to a psychological quirk is literally incapable of both jealousy and hatred (and while I have sometimes wished I were capable of hate, I have never wanted to be jealous). The female half was in a previous relationship for many years with a man who cheated on her throughout their time together, literally from before the marriage to the very day he died. As a result, right after explaining my beliefs to her, I made this vow: "I will never touch another woman sexually, unless and until you release me from this vow." Much later, I added that another man, while not violating the letter of the vow, would violate the spirit; and the whole point was to engender trust.

However, I do have a question for you. Polygamy as practiced by chauvanistic societies - fundamentalist Islam, parts of Africa, the segment of the Mormon community excommunicated by the Church of Latter Day Saints for continuing to practice polygamy, often with underage girls and against their will - is inherantly unfair to the women. OTOH, polygamy as practiced by free and equal societies is unfair to the MEN. One cock, multiple women to satisfy. Several women to experience PMS. Several women to take sides against the man. Several women to fight over him. If they are not his chattel, then he is outnumbered and at a severe disadvantage in many ways.

What are your feelings towards polyandry - marriage to multiple husbands? Would that not address many of the problems with jealousy, not to mention these other issues? Would that not also negate many of the negative charges made against polyamory?

I believe that a person, regardless of sex, should be allowed to have as many partners as they are compatable with AND their partners are compatable with. Rather this be with polygamy, polygyny, and polyandry- To me it is not the sexes of the people being married, it is the emotional connection that they all share. It is about raising healthy, happy children and having a loving, committed relationship with your husbands and wives.

Granted I know that having more than one spouse is illegal. It is also illegal in many states to be married to a person of the same sex, which I also believe is wrong... Love is love.

Most poly people just want to be open and honest about their feelings and admit that they can be attracted to more than one person and not have that change their feelings for the person they are devoted to. Many people become poly for the right to choose... they may not actively search for another partner, but if it should happen that they may find another partner, they want to have the option open.

As for jealousy... Being jealous is a human emotion. Any time that you have more than one person in a space together, they are going to have friction. Any time you feel that you are being slighted, you will feel jealous, even if you don't realize that you are jealous. Any time that a person you are involved with in involved with another person, jealousy will rear it's ugly head. I would seriously recommend the pamphets about jealousy that are on my personal webpage. They were written by Kathy Labriola, a poly friendly councellor in California. She nails jealousy pretty well on the head.

The negative stereotypes on any kind of deviation from the norm will always happen... Pick a subculture and it has been given a lot of flak and misunderstanding from Goths to the BDSM community, to polyamory. Like jealousy, it is human nature to desire everyone to be the same. No one likes to be unskilled at something. When a person does something different, people of the mainstream belief will try to bring that person "back to the light" by ridiculing their decision and making them feel unimportant or as though they are being "bad" so they will return to the "normal" lifestyle. Also, in every lifestyle, there are good examples... and horribly bad ones. In every different lifestyle that I am part of, there are really awesome people who do good things and take care of their lives and familes and are just damned good people to be around. Then there are the other kinds of people who give us all a bad name. *grins* It is all in the people who choose to partake in the lifestyle. Some people do it just as a way to take advantage of people, which is completely unfortunate...

 

[darkgoddess2478]

I may switch to the message board later...
02/14/05 by AP
Regarding "anonymous" and "anonymous..."

Why is it that the negative comments always come from "anonymous?" Are you so afraid that you can't even display an online ID - nevermind a real name?

I feel that polygamy in Africa is unfair largely because of a practice called "genital mutilation." That's where, in an attempt to ensure that all children will be genetically descended from the male, the incentive to commit adultery is removed. Said incentive being the clitoris. Don't tell me that the women in Africa are being well treated when their introduction to sex is to have someone cut off their clit with a stone knife when they turn 13.

Regarding the other "anonymous" who said that polyamory won't work in the long run. One: you stated that polyamory is free of responsibility. Not true - you've just described a commune from the 60s. "Free love" is not true love, it is merely swinging. Love is when the happiness and welfare of another is essential to your state of mind; a desire to see that other achieve their maximum potential. Whether it's love of spouse, love of country, love of children, love of an ideal, it is all the same. Love requires the assuming of responsibility.

Second, your insinuation that men do not assume their fair share of household duties is both incorrect and offensive. Patti (the P in AP) does much of the cooking, and the majority of the cleaning (which encompases a great deal, as I am not very tidy). But I'm the one who does carpentry and other repairs around the house. I'm the one who does basic maintenance on the car. I'm the one who went down to the basement with the plumber and helped him use his snake while wading ankle deep in sewage. Patti is the one who does the painting. I'm the one who carries furniture around like they were made of styrofoam so she can do so. I cook specialty foods such as sushi and freshly baked bread for her. In our own ways, we each work just as hard, because we love each other.

THANK YOU SO MUCH!! You are a welcome help in the throng of people who seem to attack people of any form of alternative livestyle.

I do believe, now, that genital mutilation is done by doctors in many of the main cities of the country... although the stone knife form is also being done in the rural areas.

The reason why I originally wrote this essay was for two reasons... one, my husband and I were exploring our options after he met Jane. Two, I was in an English class, had an assignment due at the end of the semester, and read about genital mutilation in an essay during class. I first decided to write about genital mutilation, but then decided on polygamy. From there I found polyamory and made my essay about that instead.

Quite an evolution I would say. *grins*

Thank you again for your input. I do appreciate it.

 

[darkgoddess2478]

There is nothing wrong with polygamy.
02/14/05 by Anonymous in Houston, TX
I enjoyed this esssay. There is nothing with polyamory, polygamy, or swinging. Those are all legitimate alternatives to monogamy, which is unnatural. I am a swinger, and I have no problem with this. It works for me.

I don't see what would unfair to either partner about polyamory, as long as it's mutual. That is, no double standard. The male and female are BOTH entitled to other partners. I prefer to have a primary partner, along with occasional partners with whom I use protection. There is nothing irresponsible or less committed about this.

I have to lengthen this message by at least five characters, so I am including this line. *grins*